[captioning made possible by democracy now!] ♪ amy: from pacifica, this is democracy now! donald j trump is calling for a total and complete shutdown of muslims entering the united states until our country's representatives can figure out what the hell is going on. amy: a month after republican presidential front runner donald onmp called for a ban muslims coming to the united states, a muslim woman is aaring -- is kicked out of donald trump rally for a silent

protest. we will speak to rose hamid and her immigration attorney, marty rosenbluth. they were both wearing a yellow star. the new york police department agreed to a landmark settlement to protect muslims from discrimination after the nypd was caught spying on mosques, student groups. the delta 5 go on trial. >> i met a lot of politicians along the way who said, i hear what you are saying, but there is nothing i can do. i feel powerless. that led me to go in front of a train and stop it. activists gomate on trial for blocking a mile-long oil train. the presiding judge will allow the defendants to argue their actions were necessary because of the threat of climate change.

all that and more coming up. ♪ amy: welcome to democracy now!, democracynow.org, the war and peace report. i'm amy goodman. the mexican government has begun the process of expediting joaquin "el chapo" guzman to the united states, after he was recaptured in mexico friday. he managed to escape through drains and tunnels before mexican forces nabbed him in a raid. he is now held in a maximum security prison -- the same one he escaped from through tunnel dug in his cell. he previously escaped from prison in a laundry cart in 2001. mexico refused to honor extradition before his last escape. in an interview published by

"rolling stone," sean penn said he interviewed guzman for seven hours several months ago. >> it is a reality that drugs destroy. unfortunately, as i said, where i grew up, there was no other way and there still isn't a way to survive or work in our economy to make a living. amy: in the end, five people have been killed and 10 others wounded after a projectile hit a hospitalithout borders in yemen. teresa sancristoval of doctors without borders spoke out after the attack. teresa: this is not the first time we have seen these attacks.

this is the third time we have been attacked. we are not the only hospital that they have fit. -- hit. there were many other hospitals that have been hit. deprivedation is noun of medical assistance -- now deprived of medical assistance. seven yemeni damagedlinics have been or destroyed since the u.s.-backed saudi coalition begin bombing in march. doctors without borders regularly provides all warring parties with hospital's gps coordinates. the united states has sent a b-52 bomber on a low flight over south korea in a show of force following news korea -- north tests last week. north korean leader kim jong-il

and said the test was launched --kim jong-un was launched said the test was launched in response to western imperialists. catalonian parliament has elected a new pro-independence leader. the new leader is expected to begin building an independent army, a central bank, and judiciary. the move comes after elections left spain with a deeply divided parliament last month. the new push for independence could pressure the socialist party to form a new coalition conservative party. authorities are investigating a fire at the human rights group b'tselem in israel. the ngl has been targeted in a recent israeli government crackdown over funding sources

from a bod -- abroad. this is said, if discovered to be an arson attack, it must be viewed in the context of the smear campaign against us. an arab citizen of israel has been killed. turkish officials say they killed 32 kurds they identified as militants in the southeast. the news comes as a turkish human rights group says 162 civilians have been killed since august. meanwhile, turkish journalists marked a working day by rallying to demand the release of a jailed reporter. one turkish reporter was among those who gathered in ankara. people's right to learn the truth is prevented.

unfortunately, turk goes through these dark days from time to time. i want to believe we will rise above these events. more than 30 journalists are in jail because they wrote the truth. i'm very saddened today. minister hasoreign published an op-ed in the "new york times." the move comes after saudi arabia beheaded a shiite cleric as part of the mass execution of 47 people. iranian protesters torched heart of the saudi embassy in tehran. saudi arabia and its allies broke ties with iran. the iranian foreign minister writes, "the saudi leadership must make a choice -- they can continue supporting extremists or they can all caps to play a constructive role in regional stability."

in poland, thousands of people rallied to protest a crackdown on press freedom. a new law allows the treasury minister to appoint and fire the heads of public television and radio broadcasters. protesters said democracy is at stake. >> we are meeting because media freedom is in danger and so was democracy. media is an important safety tool. if media cannot monitor those in power, public opinion will not know what they are doing. amy: in the german city of cologne, six pakistanis and a syrian have been violently attacked on new year's eve. german police say that focused morley on north african suspects after hundreds of women -- mainly on north african suspects after hundreds of women were attacked. throughright movement

bottles and firecrackers at police. in other news from germany, more than 200 members of a german boys choir led by the brother of former pope benedict were abused over a. of -- over a period of four decades. every third member of the choir suffered some sort of physical abuse including at least 40 cases of sexual violence. the pope's brother is believed to have known about the abuse. seven people were arrested after they disrupted traffic for more than an hour outside an hour outside and immigration customs and enforcement office in new york city. the action was held to protest the raids on people who sought asylum in the united states. the activists locked themselves to each other using pvc pipes to block traffic, forcing police to cut them out of the pipes with electric saws.

i'm from mexico. i crossed the border when i was four years old. i'm here because i believe that every child that crosses the border should get political asylum. , tryinguld be in school to get an education. they should be trying to have a better future. i want to see nafta out of our communities. the whole military complexes what is destroying countries like mexico and causing people to free across the border. amy: a muslim woman and a jewish man were kicked out of a trump rally on friday after silently protesting the republican front .unner's islam of phobic views speaking in rock hill views -- rock hill, south carolina, he began repeating his claims of

keeping muslims out of the united states. at that point, rose hamid and inty rosenbluth stood up silent protest. we will speak with them after headlines. in washington state, five climate activists go on trial for tying themselves to a oil train.o block a they demanded a halt of shipments of fossil fuels through the northwest. the presiding judge will allow the defendants to argue their actions were necessary because of the threat of climate change. we will speak withne of the activists in seattle. in baltimore, jury selection begins for the second police officer to go on trial for the death of freddie gray. severed due to0% fatal injuries while in police custody last april. faces the of the van

most serious charges. the first officer, william porter, saw his case and in a mistrial. he faces a retrial in june. a police sergeant has been hit with departmental disciplinary charges after the death of eric garner in 2014. garner died when he was pulled to the ground in a choke hold. garner was accused of selling loose cigarettes. a grand jury failed to indict the officer responsible for the fatal chokehold, but the african-american officer who failed to supervise the officers in garner's death has been stripped of her gun and badge. a year and a half later, the only people indicted are people of color. a year and a half later, this is the only answer the new york has to offer the garner family.

not one of the eight killer cops that was on my dad's back was charged for anything. this underscores the fundamental problem in this country. this is why we can't reform our way out of this. this is why we can't train our way out of this. it doesn't matter about more black police officers. it doesn't matter about black police chiefs. all the way up to the president, it still doesn't matter. amy: erica garner is joining a rally to coincide with the court date for the young man who filmed the fatal chokehold of eric garner that went viral. he has been arrested multiple times after he says police targeted him and his family for releasing the video. erica garner refers to him as the only man charged in my dad's death. billionaire hedge fund investor steven cohen has avoided paying

any fines after decades of probes into accusations of insider trading. accused him of ignoring clear signs that should have caused a reasonable hedge fund manager to investigate insider trading by his and -- his employee. under the deal with regulators, managingbarred from money for just two years. the pop legend david bowie has died at the age of 69. known for his gender bending style, he died sunday after a battle with cancer. his last album came out friday on his 69th birthday. those are some of the headlines. -- this isb bang democracy now!, democracynow.org, the war and peace report. i'm amy goodman.

and a white man were kicked out of a donald trump rally. trump began repeating his calls to ban muslims from entering the u.s. and said syrian are probably tied to islamic state. at that point, rose hamid and marty rosenbluth stood up in silent protest. both wore yellow badges with the word "muslim" and intentional reference to the badges jews were forced to wear under the nazis. rose was also wearing a job --hijab. they were escorted out of the room as thousands of people cheered. trump then resumed his speech. >> we have a problem. we have a problem and it is going to be solved. we have to understand the problem. we have to know the problem. before we do anything stupid, we have to know what we are doing. we do have a real problem.

there is such a level of hatred that you can't even believe it. there is a deep-seated hatred. we have to find out, where is it coming from and what can we do about it? people have to help us. amy: friday's incident comes a month after he called for banning muslims from the united states after the attacks in san bernardino. the recently emerged al qaeda affiliate, al-shabaab, has comments in as training video. writing on facebook, former u.s. labor secretary robert reich urged people to follow hamid and

rosenbluth's lead. he said that all of us have the right to stand in silent protest against the closest we have come to a fascist candidate for president. for more, we are joined by rose hamid and marty --marty rosenbluth, the pair kicked out of donald trump's rally on friday. rose hamid, thanks a much for joining us from charlotte. on you describe the scene friday? where were you sitting? can you describe the people who were sitting around you and then what happened? rose: i was sitting directly behind trump several rows up. i was originally sitting with some other folks who originally planned to protest. later on, some seats opened up further down, so i moved down and marty joined me there.

the people i had a chance to talk with before the people who had planned to protest were nice people. they were trump supporters. one of my recognizing that is a muslim woman, i would the only muslim who people who supported trump had ever met. my belief is that when you talk to people one-on-one, they are decent people and people want to connect with others. it was a pleasant little chitchat conversation. amy: then what happened? arriveden, when trump and he was starting to talk about the syrian refugees, we put on the yellow badges.

marty gave me one of the badges to put on. we put on the badges. we were sitting for a while with them on. when he started to ramp up his discussion, that is when -- or when he started talking about the problem those people, those kind of things -- we chose that time to stand up. -- explainu stood up what happened next. rose: we were just kind of standing there for a while and nothing was happening. then somebody from behind started yelling trump, trump, trump. everybody started to stand up. i have not seen the full video. people were standing and i was thinking, no one is going to notice us. then, all of a sudden, i noticed the security folks came up and told us we had to leave. amy: what were the people saying around you?

these were people you had been chatting with. did: the people around me not say anything negative to me. this is a point i really want to be made clear. there was a woman who was in front to me, who i had not had a chance to talk to earlier -- she grabbed my hand and said, i'm so sorry for this as i was being let out. that tells me that when you are close to someone, when you have an opportunity to connect with someone, those are the kind of connections that exist. that is what america is, as opposed to the people who were just shouting and jeering as i was being let out of the stairs. say, do youeone have a bomb or you have a bomb? rose: yeah, the guy with the white shirt on the you can see, he was a big guy. he could play santa claus with a beard. when he started yelling at me,

do you have a bomb, did you bring a bomb with you? i said, no. did you bring a bomb with you? i was trying to make contact with those people in the hopes of getting them to see. they are yelling at a person who is not demonstrating hate or animosity toward them. further up, there is a man in a going, boo, wes don't want you here, we don't need you people. i looked him in the face and i said, you don't even know me, why would you be saying things like this? as we were going up, other people were saying things that it could not quite here. a lot of it was boo, get out of here, we don't want you here. amy: i wanted to turn to marty. rose hamid has gotten a lot of attention. a woman in a hijab with that t-shirt that said "salam, i come

in peace." stand upou decide to in silent protest and explain what happened to you? marty: sure. there were eight of us altogether who were wearing the stars. our message is really clear. trump's type of hate speech is very dangerous and the type of and angernd -- fear and hostility he is stirring up needs to be addressed and needs to be stopped. amy: talk about the yellow star, the badge that you were wearing. and what it means. marty: sure. idea from a muslim woman at a demonstration in ight-pointedore an e star that simply said "muslim" on it. it resonated with me, as a jew, that these are really similar to the type of yellow stars and

pink triangles and other things that the nazis forced people to wear during the holocaust. when trump called for muslims to be put into a database, for muslims to be identified, to ban all muslims, he is singling out of peopleentire group based on the actions of a few individuals. we came up with the idea of making these yellow stars. some say muslim, some say human, some say stop islamophobia. people can print them out and wear them and use them how they want to to protest this type of hate speech. amy: the king of denmark also wore the star in solidarity. i want to turn to more comments of republican presidential hopeful donald trump, who called for a total and complete shutdown of the entry of muslims into the united states. >> donald j trump is calling for

a total and complete shutdown of muslim centering the united states until our country's representatives can figure while -- out what the hell is going on. [cheers and applause] you have no choice. we have no choice. on: trump later doubled down his call for a total and complete ban on muslims and to ring, despite condemnation from around the world and within his own party. in an interview, he defended his proposal by comparing it to the detention of japanese, germans, and italians under fdr during world war ii. >> what i'm doing is no different than what fdr -- fdr's solutions for germans, italians, japanese -- >> you are for internment camps?

>> this is a president highly respected by all. he did the same thing. it was far worse. he was talking about the germans because we are at war. we are now at war. amy: marty, do you have -- you have donald trump saying that when he is calling for is similar to the internment of japanese americans in world war ii, which the u.s. government has apologized for and also paid reparations for. think he'san, i correct, but it is one of the ,lackest marks on u.s. history where people who were united states citizens, just because they happened to be japanese, were incarcerated. the fact that he is using this as a model and think that is a good idea is really indicative of the problem with what he is saying. the thing that shocked me the trumpfter being in three

rallies is the reaction of the crowd. like rose was saying, people seemed really nice, but the more he speaks and the more he goes on ranting and raving, you can actually see the hate and the fear grow in people's eyes. amy: marty, you are joining us from chapel hill. rose, you are joining us from charlotte. next month marks the first anniversary of the chapel hill shootings, winfrey muslim students were killed by a gunman who posted anti-religious messages on facebook. sisters andwere two one of their husband. police said the killings resulted from a dispute over a parking space. but their father describes the killings as a hate crime. he also accused the media of propagating anti-muslim sentiment.

>> my daughters were the scarf. that is not a single week they don't share with us their fear of walking down the streets because of what the media is saying about us. media all the time. inflammatory media all the time. they dwell on it day and night. we are sad, distraught, angry, we feel we are treated unjustly. this is uncalled for. from the police folks that each one of these children had a bullet in the head. it is execution style, it is a hate crime. our children spoke about that they were uncomfortable with

their neighbor. he came to their apartment more than once threatening and despising and talking down to them. two victims'the father. rose hamid, you knew this family and your children did. rose: my children knew them, i did not. when i told my daughter about it, she could not believe that such a thing had happened. it is hate speech that does this kind of stuff. it is people in power who empower people to do things from their lowest base. it is not how we are supposed to -- it is not how god made us. god did not make us to be murderous, hateful people. he made us to be loving people. when people in power give devil-inspired

behavior, then that makes people feel like if seller and so is saying that, it must be ok for me to feel this way and for me to do these things. hate speech is a really problematic thing. i was told that there is a petition in england to prevent trump from coming to the u.k. because there are laws against hate speechthere. i found that to be rather interesting. this whole thing about hate speech is really the focus of the protest we were there for. amy: after you and marty were taken out, donald trump said there is such a level of hatred you cannot believe it. there is a deep-seated hatred. we have to find out where it is coming from and what we can do about it. he was not talking about you being taken out. has he apologized?

the council on american muslim relationships has called for him to apologize. i'm not calling for an apology. this is not about me. this is about him changing the way that he speaks. he has a responsibility, as somebody who is trying to be the president of this country, he has a responsibility to set the tone for how we are supposed to interact. -- beforee crowd up even going in, before he came in, his organizers said, "mr. trump respects the first amendment almost as much as the second amendment." "those who want to speak are free to speak outside." that set the tone for the whole thing. here is a really interesting fact. i've been interviewed by people around the world. , americans asking me

hate muslims -- i'm like no, no, no, not all americans hate muslims. now i'm in the position of having to defend america and say, what you saw on that video is not representative of what my america is. that is not what it is. here i have gone into the rally as an american, also knowing that i was a visible -- would be visible as a muslim, i went in without representation and wanting to do the right thing and be as respectful as possible without causing a disturbance, but also using my first amendment right, my freedom of speech, by standing against this hateful rhetoric. now, i find myself having to defend america against the things -- the video that is being shown around the world. problematic asbe

an american muslim in both camp's. amy: how did you come up with the idea of the t-shirt that said "i come in peace." rose: my son has a t-shirt printing business and we were talking about -- i assumed i would get one picture in a newspaper somewhere with the t-shirt on. i thought, whatever i wear, i need to make sure i'm sending a message that is representative of my faith and of my purpose for being there. he helped me come up with that. we came up with that design and it is something that is on his -- it is one of the t-shirts in his business. i wore that one in the hopes of that that message out is what i came there for. i came there to be peaceful. amy: i want to thank you both

for being with us. rose hamid and marty rosenbluth silently protested donald trump's speech in rock hill, south carolina and were kicked out. marty rosenbluth speaking to us from raleigh and rose hamid speaking to us from charlotte. when we come back, a record settlement in new york. between the aclu and the new york city police department around surveillance of muslims. we go out west to seattle, washington. activists going on trial and what does it have to do with climate change? ♪ [music break]

bowie.lackstar" by david

died yesterday. he was 69 years old. this is democracy now!, democracynow.org, the war and peace report. i'm amy goodman. we turn to a record settlement that has taken place in new york. today, we are going to talk to hina shamsi, the director of the american civil liberties union. in a major legal, an will oversee the new york police department's counterterrorism activity. two lawsuits challenge the nypd of spying on muslims in religious centers. settlement restores some of the outsidoversight that was eliminated during the september 11 attacks.

>> what the nypd wanted to do to my organization clearly laid it out in a secret document -- they wanted to recruit a confidential informant to sit on my board. they were going into our restaurants and acting as clients in our organization. to have someone who'd be a deciding figure on my it creates psychological warfare in our community. i supposed to know if the nypd was successful in that community is in a position right now where how to we know if the guy praying next to me in the mosque? for those people who know arabs, we love to talk about politics.

our families came to the united states so we could practice their religion freely. now the nypd wants to know what our sentiment is, people probably don't want to share their sentiment. when i was in college, i wanted my events to be as political as possible. i wanted to figure out how to make them controversial. our students can't do that. they think things might happen to them. amy: that is the director of the eric bake -- arabic american association speaking at 2013. we are joined by hina shamsi, the director of the american civil liberties union's director -- union.

hina: thank you for having me. we think this is a landmark settlement. it comes into related lawsuits. for the first time, there are much-needed reforms that have been put in place to prevent discriminatory unjustified surveillance of american muslims. this is a set of terms that is designed to do just that. comes in our lawsuit, which was a constitutional challenge. this is to do with the devastating harm that resulted -- our lawsuit was motivated by the concerns of our clients and communities and allies about fear and stigma that was in the

community. there is also a second, long-standing lawsuit which was filed back in 1971 that challenged unconstitutional surveillance of political activists. in 1985, the court in that case issued a consent decree. there was a set of rules that regulate how the nypd may investigate or conduct surveillance of religious and political activities. on thursday, among the changes that we announced were new reforms to strengthen safeguards in those guidelines -- and the appointment of a civilian representative with the power and obligation to ensure that the nypd is following up. amy: explain what you feel are the most important changes. hina: for the first time, the nypd is agreeing to a robust

antidiscrimination policy. investigations in which religion , race, or ethnicity plays a substantial motivating factor would be barred. safeguards against some of the things that were most problematic for communities , the use of undercover's and informants and open-ended investigations. under covers and informants may only be used if the information cannot be obtained in less intrusive ways. presumptively, there are time limits on investigations. before, there were none. now, the nypd is also going to account for the impact on religious and political activities of these kinds of intrusive methods. i will add one more thing. for preliminary investigations, the nypd needs to have a factual

basis of the possibility of criminal activity. no hunch or bias. i think one of the key aspects of this is the civilian representative. for a couple of different reasons. strong language, strong safeguards are always necessary, but so is external oversight. , the civiliant representative is appointed by the mayor, not by the nypd, which allows impacted communities and community members to be able to advocate with the mayor. we tried to build this in, so that they could advocate for the strongest possible person for the position. the position must continue for five years and hopefully after. there must be 90 days notice if the mayor seeks to abolish this position. impacted communities can advocate in light of that.

amy: i want to turn to imam deen shareef, who was speaking in 2012 after discovering his mosque was under nypd surveillance. imam deen shareef: we are muslims, we are americans, and we go about our daily lives trying to establish the best kind of contribution we can make to the american society. for us to find out that we are now under suspicion with respect to some criminal activity without any explanation as to what the provocation was, what the motivation is, what are the people that they are looking for -- it is very disturbing for us to find this out. and then to find out that the nypd actually took photographs of our mothers, our children, and those individuals that come into our businesses -- it has created an atmosphere where there is an undue suspicion that has been cast upon the entire muslim community. amy: that is imam deen shareef in 2012. hina: that, i think, reflects so

much of what motivated this lawsuit. clients describe religious leaders who are afraid of counseling their congregants for fear that they might be informants. recordingss the city their sermons for fear that what they say might be misconstrued by law enforcement. disruption in the relationships between communities and the police to whom they should be able to look for protection. community members described being fearful of engaging with the police on common day-to-day orues like reporting crime reporting domestic violence. i think much of this is also laid out in a report called mapping muslims by our cocounsel. i think part of what was

devastating to listen to was community leaders who would describe a generation of youth growing up fearful of their law enforcement, fearful of exercising their constitutionally protected rights to worship, to speak, and to associate. that is not what our country is and that is not what our city is . i think it is a very good thing that the nypd has committed to reforms and safeguards that can start once approved by the court, as we hope, to repair some of the damage and help ensure that this does not happen again. amy: i wanted to turn to a piece by viva stahl. she said that a new york police department officer pretended to convert to islam and assumes the role of a brooklyn college student at the islamic society

in new york city as part of a covert operation to spy on muslims. yearsficer spent four earning the trust of muslim students at the college, as part of an nypd operation to spy on muslims. with that be stopped in this situation? hina: we think that there are now more constraints that have been placed on this. -- someuation came up of my cocounsel raised it in the of whether that was justified. i think there were aspects of that that were explained as being linked to ongoing investigations. concerns about overuse or misuse of under covers and informants. there are a couple of aspects of want to bring up. all of the provisions need to be read together as a whole. thelook to see whether

use of under covers and informants in the use of lengthy investigations would be justified or would be prevented under the new guidelines going forward. amy: finally, i wanted to turn to another issue. today marks the 14th anniversary of the opening of the u.s. military prison at guantánamo. 107 prisoners are still there. many have been cleared for over a decade to leave. is among thelients men being held. last year, a book collecting his diary writings became a surprise bestseller. your thoughts today and what is happening to him. shame of national guantánamo's existence continues 14 years later. this is a shame that threatens

more than ever to mar president obama's legacy as he leaves office and the potential that he leaves office without closing guantánamo. there are many men unjustly continuing to be held at guantánamo. my client's story is symbolizing an aspect of it. he was picked up after he voluntarily turned himself in. he has sought every opportunity to show that he is unjustly detained and should be released. he has done that through the court, as well as by seeking a periodic review board. it could clear him by determining that his ongoing detention is unjustified. we are really at a point where the president can and should direct the department of defense to stop putting up roadblocks.

the department of defense has been putting up roadblocks. the justice department could choose not to contest cases in which detention authorities -- detention is unjustified or is no longer justified. we can bring the numbers down this year. the president is already indicated the numbers will be brought down this year. we need to move forward to close the base. is existence of guantánamo about the principle that it represents, the principal of the united states continuing to hold people without charging or trial. until that is put to an end, we are not going to be able to return fully to the family of nations with the rule of law, as we proclaim it to be. amy: hina shamsi, i want to thank you for being with us. this is democracy now! when we come back from break, we had west to seattle, washington to a trial of climate justice

activists. ♪ [music break]

yesterday bowie died at the age of 69. "space odyssey." this is democracy now!, democracynow.org, the war and peace report. i'm amy goodman. we turn now to washington state. the trial of five climate justice activists get underway. the group known as the delta 5 tie themselves to a structure they had erected over railroad tracks directly in front of a mile-long oil train. abby brockway sat near the top of the structure, 18 feet above the tracks, while the other four were locked to the legs of the tripod. this is abby brockway speaking on a cell phone during coverage of the action by the local fox

affiliate. >> we need to take more steps to get this done. we are running out of time. i'm so done. i've tried so hard. this is just the second step. i don't know what the third step is. i would like to talk to the governor. i would like to talk to the people who care. we want people to come and meet us. we are desperate and we want to be heard. this is our march. amy: the protesters, the members of rising tide seattle, called on washington governor jay inslee to reject new projects with fossil fuels in the state. the action shutdown work at the rail yard, which is a staging ground for coal trains. for more, we go to seattle, where we are joined by abby brockway.

she and four codefendants go on trial today. in an unprecedented move, the presiding judge will allow them theirue that there -- actions were necessary because of the threat of climate change. we are also joined by tim dechristopher. we welcome you both to democracy now! abby, talk about the significance of what is happening today and the judge enter a climate justice defense. abby: yes, we are thrilled that we are able to argue the necessity defense. we definitely found that it is necessary to do this. this is our last chance to actually argue this. earlier on this week, we were denied the defense and the judge

made his decision reversed on thursday. we are going to move forward with a weeklong trial and talk about why we had to be in the the yard trespassing in rail yard. did talk about what you over a year ago. exactly what you and the four other defendants did and why you chose this place as the site for the protest. abby: we erected a tripod and i climbed to the top and locked down. we did this with petitions in hand, insisting that the governor take action. we have been addressing this fossil fuel corridor that has developed in washington state and all along the west coast. it is time to -- i actually was listening to the clip again of me talking -- it just reminded me that after attending hearing after hearing with these 20

different proposed fossil fuel projects that keep being proposed for the last several years, we have these two-minute hearings where you get to talk and i never felt heard in these hearings. i, along with thousands of other people, are turning out to these hearings and producing great quality comments and the department of ecology should be , we are hearing these people. protect theigned to people, but they are not doing their job. industry and just rubberstamp these fossil fuel projects. amy: the train you were trying to stop was a mile-long? abby: yes. it was a unit train headed to a refinery. amy: tim dechristopher, talk about the significance of the

necessity defense and why you are involved with this, the client is the -- climate disobedience center that you just set up. tim: the first reason that we are out here in seattle this week is to support abby and the rest of her codefendants. we strongly believe that when activists put themselves on the line and take real risks on behalf of our whole movement, they deserve to be supported. we are here to get their back, first and foremost, but also because we see this case is really significant, in terms of the broader public narrative around climate change. this is the first time that defendants who have taken civil disobedience action will be able to present a full defense including climate scientists and oil explosion experts, as well as sharing all their own testimony about why they were driven to take this action, why the government's response to

climate change is not adequate, why citizens are called to take action in this way on their own. jurorse six, random that a regular people selected for jury duty make their own decision of whether or not this kind of action is justified. to me, that involvement of the jury is really critical. a fully informed and empowered jury is the only difference between actual justice and mirror legalism. amy: can you talk about why this train is referred to as a bomb train? tim: yeah. there have been an increase of oil trains all over this country , particularly those that are carrying back end oil from north dakota and montana, which is more explosive than other kinds of oil. it has more methane in it.

we have seen a lot more of the catastrophic disasters, particularly the lac-megantic explosion, that i know motivated abby and that she can speak to more about. amy: in our last minute, talk about this and what you are most concerned about. why you are willing to go to jail. abby: yeah, like tim said, the lac-megantic explosion really struck me and the dangers that were happening in 2013. a year later, i heard about this was fired forthat -- he wasting checking some breaks and the brakes -- he was fired for delaying that. the third thing that happened was right by my daughter's school, and oil tanker car derailed a mile from my daughter's school and that was the straw that broke my back.

i could not do it anymore. one mile from my daughter's school. québecc-megantic in killed 47 people in 2013 when the train exploded and derailed. yes. seeing this same situation happen so close to my daughter's school was something that made me decide to sign up for action can't and learn to klein -- camp and learn to climb. three of us decided that we were going to join with two others and erect a tripod to stop a train because we absolutely felt that this was the literal thing we had to do -- to put ourselves in front of a train to say, "we will not take this anymore." amy: i want to thank you both for being with us. abby brockway and tim dechristopher. we will post an interview online with tim dechristopher about the

oregon standoff. oregon standoff.

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