>> announcer: "this week" with george stephanopoulos starts right now. the president plays defense despite his tough talk. >> there's plenty of time to do some dastardly things. it's easy to start. >> after that massive attack on saudi oil facilities, the president dials back on iran choosing sanctions over military action for now. could that further destabilize the region, invite more attacks from iran? and -- >> i had conversations with many leaders. they're always appropriate. >> "the wall street journal" reporting president trump pressured the ukrainian president to investigate joe biden's son. >> he's using the abuse of power and every element of the presidency to try to do something to smear me.

>> did trump push for foreign interference to get an edge over a campaign rival? will the white house release full details of that conversation? how will congress respond? secretary of state mike pompeo joins us live. plus, trump's former defense secretary, jim mattis. remembering cokie roberts. >> she was unafraid of bishop or political figure and she delighted in letting both know that fact. >> trailblazer, mother, friend. our round table celebrates her life and legacy. sam donaldson and george will return to remember our colleague. >> announcer: from abc news, it's "this week." here now co-anchor martha raddatz. good morning. welcome to "this week." a place that was a professional home for our cokie roberts for more than 30 years. throughout the morning we'll be celebrating our colleaguan here

washington at st. matthew's cathedral on saturday. hundreds gathering to remember her life, her legacy and her love of family. since her very first show as an anchor on this program in 1996 cokie promised to bring you the news each sunday morning. we'll start with that. we begin with the rising tensions between iran and the u.s. the administration is pointing the finger at iran holding it responsible for the attack on saudi oil facilities last week, the secretary of state calling it an act of war. president trump's response has run the gamut saying the u.s. was locked and loaded sunday. then swinging to talk to a peaceful resolution on thursday. here's what he said friday in the oval office. >> i think it shows far more strength to do it the way we're doing it, whether it's now or three weeks. doesn't make any difference.

the strong person's approach and the thing that does show strength would be showing a little bit of restraint. >> so far the only concrete steps trump has taken are to impose more sanctions and deploy a modest number of troops and air defense systems to saudi arabia. where do we go from here? do trump's varied responses keep iran guessing or invite further escalation from iran? let's bring in secretary of state mike pompeo. welcome back to "this week." >> martha, great to be with you. thank you. >> mr. secretary, the pentagon announced friday in response to attacks on the saudi oil facilities, the u.s. will be sending more air defense to saudi. the president also announcing more sanctions. what kind of message does that send to iran, a nation you say conducted an act of war? >> martha, we have 40 years of terror from this nation. they conducted an attack on oil fields, one of the largest

attacks on the global energy supply in history. president trump's strategy that we laid out two years ago is working. we are well on our way to forcing the iranian regime to ultimately make the decision to become a normal nation. that's all we ever asked. the president made a couple decisions on friday. we tightened sanctions on the regime. that put the revolutionary regime in a difficult position. the iranian people applaud that. they understand that their leaders are taking them in a direction not good for their country. >> we then announced we're going to move some additional forces. the secretary of defense talked about that thursday. each of those is aimed as deterrents. we want a peaceful resolution. that's our objective. we have hope the work we've done to keep the straights open and the additional defense systems and capabilities we put put put region will achieve that.

>> mr. secretary, the saudis have over one dozen patriot missile batteries, yet the cruise missiles got through. what does sending more air defense over there do? >> it will improve. it's about value and density. martha, you know this story well. it will improve the capabilities for them. we're going to strengthen all the capabilities there. it will make it more difficult -- i'm glad you acknowledge this was an iranian attack with land attack cruise missiles. it was an agent of war by a state. i'm here in new york. we'll be at the u.n. talking about it. we hope the united nations will take a strong position. it was designed for this specific thing. i know the iranian people want a peaceful resolution and an iranian regime not engaged in terror and mayhem. >> you say the plan is working. the stated purpose of the maximum pressure campaign is to reduce iran's maligned activity

and prevent them from getting nuclear weapons through tough economic sanctions. let me just go through this. since you pulled out of the nuclear deal there have been attacks on oil tankers, shooting down a sophisticated drone, that cost more than million, the attack on the saudi oil fields, we closed the consulate and reduced our diplomatic core by 50% and iran is breaking the jcpoa limits on enrichment and storage. isn't this campaign having the opposite effect you hoped for? >> martha, some of the facts you have there aren't right. you started the clock at the wrong moment. we took over when the previous administration handed this regime this revolutionary zealous regime, $150 billion. they created the wealth and resources for them to do that. >> you said some of the facts were wrong. what's --

>> martha, it's important your viewers understand during the jcpoa ,not after president trump made the correct decision to withdraw, but during the jcpoa there were dozens of missile attacks into saudi arabia iran. there were assassination campaigns conducted in europe. >> i'm aware of that mr. secretary. since you pulled out of the jcpoa you're disputing the fact that they bombed an oil field, or that the consulate was closed? >> no, ma'am. clearly they bombed that oil field. we're working to extinguish their capability. we've seen it. we've seen hezbollah struggle with resources. we watched internal decision making over whether they should arm their armed forces. they're having to -- remember, martha, we only had these tough sanctions on since may. we're at the start of the sanctions campaign, not the middle or end. the iranian economy will shrink by somewhere on the order of 10% to 15% this year.

the regime knows their people won't stand for this. the iranian people understand bringing back dead iranians from syria and iraq is not going to sit well with the iranian people. that's who we support. that's our mission. >> secretary pompeo, president trump has had some very strong words, very strong tweets about iran. let's go to one of them. to the president never, ever threaten the united states again or you will suffer consequences the likes of which few throughout history have ever suffered before. we are no longer a country that will stand for your demented words of violence. be cautious. that was a year before iran shot down the $130 million drone. the consequences of that were that the u.s. launched a cyber attack and placed sanctions. senator lindsey graham said he believes iran saw this as a sign of weakness by the u.s. why do you think the economic sanctions is sufficient to deter

iran in the future? >> president trump and i both want to give diplomacy every opportunity to succeed. i think the whole world knows, when that fails, when it's the case we no longer believe that we convinced the iranian regime to behave in a way -- behave like a normal nation, i think the whole world knows, including iranian regime, of american military might. >> are you confident we can avoid war? iran doesn't seem confident. >> we think so. we iran began as an anti-semitic, anti-american nation. we're taking this on in a serious way. we're working diligently to see that it has a diplomatic outcome. if we're unsuccessful and if iran continues to strike out

in this way, president trump will make the decisions necessary to achieve our objectives. >> i want to turn to the whistleblower complaint, mr. secretary, the complaint about a phone call to a foreign leader. the inspector general, that's where the complaint was launched. it's alleged president trump pressed the president of ukraine eight times to work with rudy giuliani to investigate joe biden's son. what do you know about those conversations? >> you just gave me a report about a -- a whistleblower complaint, none of which i've seen. i can tell you about this administration's policies with ukraine. the previous administration was begged by the ukrainian people to deliver defensive arms so they could protect themselves from vladimir putin and russia and they gave them blankets. this administration took seriously the responsibility to help the ukrainians defend

themselves. we woe we worked on that. we want a good relationship with ukraine. >> let me read something. let me ask you something. the ukrainian's said they discussed investigation of cases which inhibited the interaction between ukraine and the u.s.a. the president tweeted it was a perfectly fine and respectful conversation. do you think it's, quote, perfectly fine to ask a leader to investigate a political opponent? >> i saw a statement from the ukrainian foreign minister said there was no pressure applied in the conversation. i do think if vice president biden behaved inappropriately, if he was protecting his son and intervened in a way that was corrupt, i think we need to get to the bottom of it. i hope that we will. i hope if vice president biden engaged in behavior inappropriate -- >> we've seen no evidence of that.

>> american cannot -- >> i want to go back to the question. >> america cannot have our elections interfered with. if there was that kind of activity engaged in by vice president biden, we need to know. >> there's no evidence of that. if the conversation was perfectly fine as president trump said, why not release the transcript to the public? >> the white house will have to answer that. we don't release transcripts. it's a rare case. those are private conversations between world leaders. it wouldn't be appropriate to do so except under the most extreme circumstances. there's no evidence that would be appropriate. >> thanks so much for joining us this morning, secretary pompeo. >> thank you, martha. when we come back james mattis weighs in and we remember our colleague and friend cokie roberts. with our power house round table. plus the return of sam donaldson and george will. we'll be right back.

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international commerce. that w secretary general james mattis testifying before congress on the threat posed by iran. general mattis is the author of a new book called "call sign chaos" learning to lead. general mattis joins us now. secretary mattis, i know you're hesitant to talk about the trump minut administration and current events, but you have dealt with iran for decades. we know they want sanctions lifted. what do you think iran is thinking at this point? >> well, iran, martha, is continuing to do what they've done for nearly four decades now. that is be a destabilizing influence as they promote their brand of how they want the middle east to go, their brand of how they want to lead the middle east into this fervor that gives the regime its bona fides.

they want to look like the leader. they're trying to craft the foreign policy that pushes others around. it's the same thing they've been doing for many, many years. not the iranian people, but the iranian regime. >> these attacks have increased significantly in the past few months. why? >> well, the iranians in terms of leading right now feel they're under pressure. they are under pressure. they're going to react the way they've always reacted. just a few years ago they put together a plan to murder the saudi arabian ambassador to washington, d.c. less than two miles away from the white house. this is the way this regime conducts its policies. they attacks our embassies. they attacked other people's diplomats. they murdered the former prime minister of lebanon.

this is their modis operandi. there's nothing new here. >> in your book you mentioned two instances where you felt the united states didn't respond forcefully enough. there was an attack in 2012 after an iranian fighter jet tried to attack a u.s. drone. here's what you wrote about the drone attack. i wanted calculated actions to restrain the regime so it couldn't thrust us into war. once again the iranians were not held to account. i anticipate they'll feel emboldened to challenge us more. do you feel they're emboldened to challenge us more? >> i think anyone looking at this situation judges that martha. this is not something that should be simply an american administration policy.

you see other nations, as secretary pompeo mentioned, come in to help on the freedom of navigation patrols. this is a situation when you need your allies and partners. when you need them, you have to build trust that we have a coherent strategy. we have to persuade our allies to be with us. this is a situation whose best possible outcome will come from a coalition of nations that wants to stabilize the middle east. that has to be our goal., to stabilize this situation as soon as possible. >> are you concerned with the u.s. withdrawal from the nuclear deal, which the europeans did not want, could complicate those efforts to work with them to counter iran's aggression? >> what we have to do is we have to play the ball where it lies right now. we need to work with our allies, come up with a clear political end state which we're trying to achieve.

i think that's pretty easy to articulate. we want an iran that doesn't destabilize the middle east, doesn't attack its neighbors. doesn't try to kill diplomats. they're pretty basic principals and then we work together economically, diplomatically. in the defense area as well to neuter what iran is trying to do, the mischief they're trying to create. >> do you believe there should be a military response to what just happened? >> i'm outside the area of responsibility, a position of responsibility. i'm always reluctant not knowing the full story to give advice like that, ma that. we want to use every diplomatic and economic means. secretary pompeo made clear he's in new york city to orchestrate that as we try to stop the destabilizing behavior, but at

the same time to get a longer term of stability there in the region. the world needs this. the world's economy needs this. certainly the people in that region don't need iran to be continuing this kind of behavior. >> secretary mattis, i want to turn to something else, that's the whistleblower investigation. president trump said i hope they can put out that conversation. should a president be asking foreign leaders to investigate political opponents? >> martha, this is not something i have any background on. i don't know anything more than what i read in the news. apparently no one has seen the complaint. i really prefer to talk about things i know more about. >> let me turn to leadership. that's what your book is about, leadership and your life and your position in the marine corp. what does it take to be a good

leader? >> the most important thing that you have to have to be a good leader, is you have to have the ability to build trust. that starts with listening. i'll put it in george washington's words. listening, learning, helping and leading. you start by understanding what others face and you figure out a way to help them. as you do that, by helping them you create the position from which your leadership will be listened to and acted upon. it's a rather old formula, a dry formula. it worked for george washington when he was leading the revolutionary army and i think it works today. >> one of the ways you end your book is by saying what concerns you most is not external adversaries, it's our

divisiveness. what do you do about that? >> i think we have to look at it as a problem in our society, a democracy cannot work without compromise. we're going to have to learn to listen to one another and really understand, learn from one another. accept the fact that once in a while people we disagree with might be right. when an election is over, when we're done dividing ourselves and going into the voting booths, once the election is decided, let's get back together and start governing. we owe our children and the next generation a lot better than what we're doing today in terms of solving our nation's problems. >> secretary mattis, it's great to see you. have a great weekend. >> thanks, martha. up next the round table takes on the fall-out for the 2020 race over president trump and what he discussed with ukraine's new president. plus sam donaldson and george will remember cokie roberts. we'll be right back. and george will remember cokie roberts. we'll be right back. maria ramirez!

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the round table is all here ready to go. all week long you can get the latest on politicsit news alerts on the abc news app. we'll be right back.

in the 1960s the ladder of opportunity in journalism was closed to her and other women. she wrote six nationally best selling books.

yet, after we were married and moved to new york, she was told repeatedly by various editors we do not hire women to be writers. >> steve roberts delivering the eulogy for his wife cokie roberts. i'm happy to be joined by friends and colleagues here at our round table which says a lot about that ladder today. donna brazile, a fox news contributor and former dnc chair. like cokie a proud louisiana native. karen tumulty, a political columnist for the "washington post". mara liasson, she worked side by side with cokie and our karen travers, cokie mentored her here

at abc. we'll get to our thoughts on cokie in a little bit. we'll start with the news just as cokie would have wanted us to do. karen tumulty, i want to start with you. i want to pick up on iran. you heard what secretary pompeo said. the president's maximum pressure campaign seems to be having the opposite effect of what they wanted it to do despite what secretary pompeo says. the question is, can the president let iran get away with this attack. >> i think that is one of the things a lot of other countries are going to be wondering at the u.n. general assembly. the president's messaging has been so inconsistent. talking about peaceful solutions. i think that he's confusing a lot of people in this country, but also a lot of other countries around the world. >> mara, the president doesn't appear to know how he wants to respond, but he has two things in mind.

he doesn't want to disrupt the economy certainly and he doesn't want to go to war for someone who said they would get us out of wars. i would add to that he doesn't want to look weak. all of that is pretty hard to juggle. >> you can't do all those things at once. his critics say he talks loudly and carries a small twig. the president wants the benefits of looking tough. now this is real life. he created a maximum pressure campaign to put the screws to iran. what did he think would happen? he says he's locked and loaded. he said he doesn't want war. he sends a couple hundred troops to saudi arabia. the message to iran is, hey, you got away from this. >> karen travers you do a lot of radio two-ways. what are they asking you about this? are they tuned in? >> there was a big difference monday to friday. monday after the president's locked and loaded tweet, there were a lot of concerns that a military strike was eminent and a lot of questions about what

the u.s. interest was here. what is the national security interest that's at stake? as the president dialed back and talked about wanting a peaceful solution, the question i heard most was a credibility question. why should we believe the trump administration when they say iran absolutely did this, and why should we believe the trump administration that the strategy they'll pursue is correct? the president questions his own intelligence agencies. the president has mislead on issues big and small, including the hurricane dorian map. that was referenced a lot this week. >> they haven't presented any evidence. >> that's correct. the question has become why should we trust them. >> karen, i want to turn to the whisleblower complaint and how that's playing out. the president said i hope they put this conversation out. how big a problem do you see this for the president? >> the president has been tweeting about this for three days.

he's been tweeting about it. his strategy seems to be deflect and distract. he said he had a beautifully, perfectly fine conversation. he said he didn't say anything wrong, but if he did, it doesn't matter anyway. we heard this strategy from the president before. he's calling it a witch hunt. he's trying to muddy the waters in such a way that, if you're a supporter of the president, you don't think it's a big deal. it's the latest thing the democrats and the media are going to make a big deal out of. don't support the president, you think this is it. >> donna, this has got to be personal for you. you had your emails hacked in 2016 by the russians. when you look at this, what do you say? >> i say never again. we should not allow the president of the united states to put his political interests above the interests of our national security. once again, the president is diverting attention now saying that the investigation should be on joe biden when we've known for months the president

directed his personal attorney, mr. giuliani, to figure out if there was something there and now the president is attacking the whistleblower, attacking the intelligence agencies. he's doing all this when he can simply say congress should do their job. congress should allow the whistleblower to come forward and we should see the entire transcript. >> karen, if he puts the call out, does that end it? >> no. >> depending on what it says. >> it depends on what it says. this is qualitatively different from everything we talked about in the 2016 election. this is a sitting president using the powers of his office and, if what has been reported is true about this conversation, i mean, he is not -- >> credible and urgent found the ig. >> he's inviting a foreign power to collude. it's all different from any of these controversies we've seen before. >> is it a way for the trump

administration to talk about joe biden? you saw secrto joe biden. >> sure. it could be the 2020 version of birtherism. oh, joe biden did something bad in the ukraine. the ukrainians investigated this and said there's no evidence of any wrong doing. my question is today he says he wants the transcript released. does he really want that? or is that yes i'll release my tax returns and i'll talk to bob mueller? we don't know. if it's released, it's simpler for people to understand. it's one conversation. there's a formal whistleblower complaint through the system. it's not a leaker. >> we don't know for sure that whistleblower complaint was about ukraine. >> right, or about this conversation only. we don't know. these are small numbers or pieces of evidence congress is trying to get their hands on. it involves the president talking to a foreign country and

not benefitting from some vague scheme of vladimir putin. >> karen, i want to turn to you for the 2020 race which we'ret . the des moines register poll shows elizabeth warren taking over joe biden, a 7-point jump. she seems to have all the momentum. >> she does. i think it's striking to see all the candidates' efforts, the race is steady except for warren with that jump. also, joe biden dropping several points. there was a number that was interesting. two thirds of likely democratic caucus goers say they haven't made up their minds yet. it's very early. there's a lot of time for that to change. certainly that boost is fitting the narrative for elizabeth warren. she's on the rise right now. >> donna, what do you see? >> the race is coming into sharper focus. anything can change over the next few months. the other story is that cory booker has signalled to his supporters if he's unable to

raise $1.7 million over the next five or six days he's out. est have the field. >> karen, warren and bernie sanders have been trying to turn the table on joe biden. take a listen to warren this week. >> there's a lot at stake in this election. i know people are scared. we can't choose a candidate we don't believe in just because we're too scared to do anything else. >> can warren and sanders make that case against biden effectively? >> if you look at the iowa poll numbers the percentage that say they're open to warren's message is absolutely enormous. she has something i would rather have than a lead in the polls. she has the steady, steady gains.

we're over 120 days until the caucuses. it tends to break away. what she's finding is that voters in the democratic caucuses ay openr messe. >> i think what we're seeing if it ends up being a warren/biden race, we'll see a clear ideological contrast. not only do you see warren's claims of biden's electability, you see biden pushing back on her policies, how she's going to pay for it. you'll see a clearer contrast. >> karen, i want to take a look at how the president is doing. "the new york times," they write mr. trump has made clear he wants to accomplish something big, but seems stymied. he has remained on the sidelines as divisive issues are debated and is treading water for fear of how things play. does he need to accomplish something else with his re-election pitch? >> he needs to accomplish it or

talk about it in a way that convinces his supporters. the economy is the center piece of his re-election message, but there are troubling signs there. polls are showing that voters are starting to give him more criticism than praise. on doing something big -- it's why the administration is trying to rush money to build something of a border wall, just anything so he can say i built that. it's why you see these conversations over the past couple weeks about gun measures despite the fact there's no indication that the president is on board with what his administration is shopping. he told supporters at a fundraiser in california behind closed doors he's a strong supporter of the second amendment and that's what he's going to stick to. >> put 2020 aside for a minute so we can reflect on our wonderful colleague, cokie roberts. donna, i want to start with you. louisiana women. >> when i first met cokie, i was 21. i got up here to washington, d.c.

cokie found out i was working for gillis long. she said you're from new orleans? i was born in new orleans. i said yes, but the line was too long to work for your mom. she said i'll shorten it. the next month i was in lindy boggs' office. she was an amazing woman. she pulled the ladder down for young women like myself, but she kept it down. she kept pushing me. she had a drive like no one else. this is the crawfish corn bread dressing. on the back is cokie's handwriting. women's leadership forum, national archives. cokie constantly pushed us to be our better selves. she's on my wau along with maya angelou, coretta scott king.

she was a great mentor and a wonderful friend. >> karen, you texted me right away after cokie's passing and said when you struggled through cancer she planted herself in your room. >> yeah. i think that what people -- what her listeners and viewers could sense about cokie was very genuine with her. i was not one of her closest friends, but i can tell you -- i mean, to look up in my hospital room after cancer surgery and there is cokie holding a big arm load of reading material and a big fresh load of gossip for me which i needed just as badly at that time. >> as did she. >> she loved her gossip. >> the thing about cokie was -- again, she was so generous in sharing her insights. she had such a deep understanding and respect for the institution of washington which isn't very fashionable these days. she knew the back story of everything. >> karen, i want to turn to you. you have known cokie since you were an intern here. look at you now. >> yes.

>> she's always been so proud. when i read your remembrances of hi. i thought how did cokie ever find the time to do so much for all of us. >> we all said this. she must have had more hours in a day than we all.ith you in th hospital, to do her work, to do all this. our twins were born prematurely. they spent three months in the nicu. our friends were signing up for bringing food. cokie signed up to give us food. she made it homemade, louisiana of course. she have dropped it off on our front porch with a text that said there's foot on the front porch, plus wine. our friends saw the sign-up sheet. they said is that the cokie roberts bringing you food.

i said it was. it wasn't just the work. it was the life, amazing mentor and role model she was outside this building. >> she slept very few hours.idl. she was one of those people who slept very few hours and didn't need it. i became a reporter at national public radio because of cokie roberts. i was a newscaster. i wanted to be a reporter. she by some miracle decided i should be her number two in congress when she was the congressional correspondent. i got to work under her, learn how to do it. she gave me an amazing education. we would go into the majority leader's office in the morning for the pen and pad gaggle and she would drill him because i'm sure she knew him since they were both in diapers. then i trailed behind her in the bowels of the capital. then she would talk to the workers in the cafeteria and treated them with the exact same respect and dignity. >> she had such a moral clarity. >> yes.

>> about everything.us would.sae will return with their reflections on cokie. we're back in just 60 seconds. urn with her reflections on cokie. we're back in just 60 seconds.

what is your definition of womanizing, sam? >> it's not mine. the accusations were made against you. >> what is your definition of the term? >> i don't know. i simply say to you. if you -- >> well, all right. cokie, do you have a definition. >> most women know it when they see it senator. >> a classic moment from one of cokie's earliest appearances on "this week." that was back in 1989. she was a fixture on "this week" with david brinkley joining sam donaldson and george will questioning the powerful and debating the news. in 1996 she became co-anchor of this program. sam and george are standing by to reflect on cokie.

first a look back at her time here at "this week." >> announcer: from abc news, "this week" with cokie roberts, sam donaldson. >> reporter: it was 1996. cokie reports, the new co-anchor of "this week." >> new set, new program. a lot of familiar faces. >> reporter: the featured guest that morning, then senate majority leader republican trent lott. >> are you going to sit back and wait and see what comes in your direction? >> we haven't even been sworn in. >> reporter: one of hundreds of interviews on this program. >> on the tax pledge, would you take it again? >> reporter: prominent public figures. >> mr. trump, the only person we've elected that haven't held other officers won wars. george washington, dwight

eisenhow eisenhower. why would we take your seriously running for president? >> reporter: and first ladies. >> as a mother of a son who i am extremely fond of, it must be an odd notion seeing your little boy running for president. >> it is. you're interviewing the wrong person. i think he's close to perfect. >> reporter: through it all bringing her signature wit to sunday morning. >> all the surveys say december is the most stressful month. >> i don't know why it's stressful for men. this is a month that women do all the cooking and all the shopping. go ahead and be stressed if you want to. >> okay. >> reporter: a steady force, sometimes corralling a feisty round table. >> now that we've done politics, religion and sex, we'll end. >> reporter: our compass all these years later. >> can the president learn from his mistakes? >> we haven't seen that in the past.

>> reporter: still contributing to this program whenever possible. her last appearance a month ago, health issues not stopping her from telling it like she saw it. >> it's not mental illness that causes nine people to die in 30 seconds. it's a high-gauge weapon. >> reporter: above all putting family first. her husband steve by her side for more than 50 years. mother to her two children lee and rebecca and her six grandchildren, all celebrating marriage, friendship, life and love together. an inspiration to her viewers and to those of us lucky enough to call her a colleague and a friend. sam donaldson and george will join me now. gentlemen, it's great to see you and have you back here. sam, i want to start with you. you watched that. what are your reflections there?

>> martha, i just watched four bright women on the round table. when cokie joined us she said it was like going into the lion's den. david brinkley, george will and sam donaldson. she tamed us and changed the business. she helped bring women, as you know, i just heard your panelists say that, into full power, not just full power, but we're now the endangered gender, george. >> i think you got nothing to worry about, sam. i think cokie would say that as well. george, what are your thoughts? >> it's been well said the past is another country. cokie was from another washington. washington before tribalism swallowed civility. washington before constant hysteria was taken as a sign of sophistication. she lived here long enough and she had known enough people on

both sides of the aisle to see many things. she had an emotional equilibrium that gave her a credibility in a town of constant hysteria. >> she was constant with that emotional equilibrium and that moral clarity. sam, think back on some of the great anecdotes. i know you have so many and the moments you shared with cokie we didn't see. >> everyone has been playing a clip of cokie's great ability to puncture a pomposity. >> that's a great way to say it. >> in 1989 john tower was nominated to be secretary of defense. he had a lot of enemies in the senate. they were saying he was drinking too much. he came to the show and started out by saying i won't touch a drop of alcohol, but there were

other things they said. i said senator they say you're a womanizer. no, sam, what's a womanizer? i started stumbling around. every woman i ever knew was watching the program and i didn't want to define it. cokie roberts spoke up very gently and said senator, i know one when i see one. john tower went like this. just one of the moments where she used a stiletto, not a hammer and did it. >> george? >> when the clinton administration was having trouble finding an ambassador for the vatican acceptable by the vatican, they came to lindy boggs and said would you do it? she said i'm -- she was in retirement. she was in her 80s. she was happy and reluctant to do it. her daughter cokie, said, mom, do it. being an ambassador to the vatican is two things you love to do, go to mass and go to

parties. >> could i say one more? >> please. >> cokie was a very moral person. not all washington is that way. she had very high standards. she applied those standards to both the democratic and the republican party and their members. there was a time during the monica lewinsky affair with president clinton, the president had confessed to the grand jury that there had been nine occasions when there was a sex act. that's what most people thought. another problem he said earlier under oath to a federal judge that he had no sexual relationships with monica lewinsky. okay. how do we square this? the campaign was oral sex is not sex. a very distinguished lawyer tried to make the case on our program, that that was not sex in the meaning of sexual intercourse, all that.

i stumbled around. maybe you stumbled around if you recall it. it came to cokie. she simply looked at this very fine lawyer, a man doing his job, and said do you think your wife would buy that? >> right to the point. >> that poor man's face blanked. >> george, we have about 15 seconds here. what do we take from cokie going forward? >> it was possible before and it shall come again this kind of person who will typify washington. not the washington with a snarl on its face, but washington with her incandescent smile. >> she lives on. >> she certainly does live on in all of us. thanks to both of you. >> martha, thank you. >> as we leave you today, we wanted to let cokie do the honors. with her farewell message here on her last co-anchoring of "this week" with sam in 2002. >> sam, 15 years ago when i sat down in this studio with you and

george and david, you were looking for a skirt, as you recall. i never expected i would still be here today. it's been 15 fascinating years. we've been to interesting places, interviewed fascinating people, seen a lot of history. the most rewarding part has been the people we worked with, the staff, the crew in the studio, the control room, the make-up room, but most of all working with you, sam. i'm not going to miss the 5:00 a.m. alarm, but i will miss being with you on sunday mondays. >> louie, it's the kocontinuati of a beautiful friendship. >> george stephanopoulos will be in this spot next week. we wish him all the best. until next week, that's "this week."

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