>> shannon: i'm shannon breen. a new round of papers found in the president's home and the u.s. hits the debt limit again. >> if they want to play a game of chicken, we'll play a game of chicken. >> we've played these game befores. >> shannon: the treasury department buying time with extraordinary measures as republicans bicker with the white house. >> the president has been clear on this. it should not be used as a political weapon. >> shannon: swing district, moderate republicans are calling for the president to drop the take it or leave it approach and come to the table. we'll sit down for a bipartisan conversation with two co-chairs from the problem solvers caucus.

republican brian fitzpatrick and democrat josh godhimer join me on how to find consensus on the debt limit, immigration and more. then -- thousands of pro-life advocates come to the nation's capital for the first march for life since the supreme court overturned roe v. wade. we'll look at the legal state of play now that abortion laws are up to the states. and sit down for a conversation with prominent voices from both sides. and eight months after the unprecedented leak of a draft supreme court ruling, there are still no answers from the high court about the leaker. >> the only way you're going to stop this in the future is find out who did it and hold them accountable. >> shannon: we'll ask our sunday panel if we will ever find out who did it. all right now on fox news sunday.

hello from fox news in washington. breaking overnight, at least ten people are dead, another ten injured after a mass shooting near los angeles. it happened late last night at a dance club in monterrey park, califo california. authorities say they believe the shooter is male and at this time it appears that person is not in custody. no word yet on a motive. deputies say they are reviewing security video in that area. monterrey park is about ten miles east of los angeles. we'll keep you updated on any developments. also breaking this morning the justice department seized more classified documents from the president's private residence just this week. the news comes as president biden prepares to speak in person with house speaker kevin mccarthy to discuss the new congress, a range of challenges there, where they disagree. that, of course, includes the debt limit. congress is facing a deadline to strike a deal or risk a financial crisis as the treasury department steps in to avoid a government default. in a moment, we will chat with

two moderate lawmakers brian fitzpatrick of pennsylvania, and democratic congressman josh gottmimer of new jersey. they are trying to press their way into the most polarized policy debates and find solutions. let's turn to lucas tomlinson where there are multiple developing stories. hello, lucas. >> reporter: the president is facing renewed criticism after more classified documents were found in his wilmington, delaware, home. the fbi conducted the search. the president also facing a debt ceiling fight amid reports his top aide is leaving. white house chief of staff ron clane could step down in the coming weeks. the biggest administration departure since president biden took office two years ago. the move was expected. clane has been at biden's side his first twot years and through his supreme court confirmation. but also through major controversies, like the disastrous u.s. departure from afghanistan.

clane may be best known for helping the president pass massive spending bills like the $1.9 trillion covid relief plan, the $1 trillion infrastructure bill and the inflation reduction act. critics say the spending helped accelerate the current inflation crisis and added to the national debt. in 2000, the debt was just over $5 trillion. it's climbed to over $31 trillion today. it's money already spent and now the u.s. is over its borrowing limit which could put the nation's credit rating at risk. >> to threaten default, economic catastrophe, nobody, democrat or republican, should do that no matter how much they believe in their agenda. >> reporter: republicans say they want spending cuts if they're going to raise the debt limit higher. the white house says raise the limit period. no negotiations. >> it is a basic responsibility that congress has to deal with the debt ceiling. >> reporter: president biden plans to huddle with top

democratic leaders at the white house tuesday. he also plans to host kevin mccarthy, their first meeting since mccarthy became house speaker. mccarthy responding, president biden, i accept your invitation to sit down and discuss a responsible debt ceiling increase to address irresponsible government spending. a white house official spinning this differently, calling it a, quote, general meeting, not a negotiation. all this while the president faces continued discussions over his handling of classified documents. the new house majority leader tells fox -- >> the rules of justice should apply to everybody equally. in a case like this, it's one more example that they're not being applied equally to democrats as they are to republicans. >> reporter: now two democratic senators joe manchin and tim cane, are also calling for a full investigation. they're both up for re-election in 2024. shannon? >> shannon: lucas tomlinson, thank you very much. joining us now co-chairs of the house problem solvers caucus

democratic congressman of new jersey josh gothimer and from pennsylvania, congressman fitzpatrick. welcome back. >> thanks for having us. >> shannon: headlines overnight are not the ones the white house wants to see. yet another discovery of classified material at the president's wilmington home. jonathan turley, well known to our audience and legal professional, a professioner in constitutional scholar, tweets this. with the latest discovery, there's no real question that the biden documents were grossly mishandled. there only remains who was responsible? however the discovery of documents at yet another location used by the president is crushing for his defense team. he says he's done everything right, he has no regrets. should he, at this point? >> i think we've seen the justice department is conducting an on going investigation. that's the proper process here. you want to get to the bottom of these things, which is why they were at his home yesterday in full cooperation.

i think that's what you need to do here. the white house needs to cooperate with the justice department. that's what they've been doing for months. that's in stark comparison to the other investigation of classified documents with former president trump. i think as long as the white house does what it should do, which is cooperate fully so we can get to the bottom of this, thraes the appropriate process. of course, in a broader sense, we should understand in any white house, whether the last white house or this one, how any documents would ever get out. the key is to make sure that never happens. >> shannon: also in contrast is the fact that there have been on going negotiations with this justice department, with the biden white house and legal team. there was an agreement for them to be there together friday during this search, but what we found is leading to more questions than answers. andy mccarthy, former federal prosecutor, tweeted this. it's not six classified documents. awkwardly worded statement by biden team, ie, spin is favorable to biden as possible. six items consisting of documents with classified markings and we don't know what

they meant by item. box, envelope or how many classified documents in each item. so there is a special counsel, investigation already always way. house oversight already said it's going to investigate. congressman fitzpatrick, any word you have that they are going to look like they are politicizing it? >> i don't believe so, shannon. two things are true. number one, classified documents can never be taken out ever. that's number one. number two, we need equal application of the law. that's what we're going to make sure that we ensure. we're going to do a deep dive into the circumstances surrounding the prior administration and the current administration, both dealing with classified documents. making sure the law is applied equally across the board. that's what the american people are demanding. >> shannon: so the wall street journal reported on conversations between the two team, the biden side, the d convalescent -- the biden side.

they had agreed to let the biden team handle it. washington post also has this. the white house was hoping to keep this quiet. the white house was hoping for a speedy inquiry, planning to disclose this matter only after justice issued its all clear, but the approach would end up prompting accusations that the biden team had purposely kept the public in the dark. we know all of this started before the midterms. do you get the perception that some people have that there are differences in the way the doj handles republican and democrat cases? >> i mean, there's a huge difference from the fact if you look at the last administration, the trump administration. there was a refusal to cooperate for nearly a year. right? there was obstruction. you needed subpoenas. president trump didn't come forward and offer up his documents. he was keeping them locked up. this administration, i believe, has cooperated in a constructive way from the beginning.

they didn't take months. they didn't stall. the president wasn't trying to hold up these documents as trophies. so it's a huge difference. but the bottom line is this. brian is exactly right. we need to have a full cooperation investigation. we need to get to the bottom of what happened, why and when, to understand everything. and in a broader sense, to make sure no white house, no administration is able to handle classified documents this way and take them out of the white house from a classified setting. i think we should get to the bottom of both. i think we should run a reasonable process. that's what's happening right now. >> shannon: you as members of congress may have more of a hand of that in the coming weeks and months. andy mccarthy speaking out on this saying after the white house has said there are no logs there, this is the personal home. in the past they said the president does work from there. there are questions about whether there are logs of visitors or people who would have been there. andy mccarthy writes, i'm confident if the agency, secret service, believed it was in the interest of the president's security that the information

would be produced for the bureau would be produced at warp speed. we've got at least one source saying to us the secret service is prepared to come forward with some information about visitors there but congress is going to have to act. congressman fitzpatrick, will you do that? >> we will, shannon. there's multiple ways to gather evidence an conduct investigations. visitors log would be very helpful. if that doesn't exist, you go to other forms of evidence. physical survey against, witness interviews. there's a whole host of ways to collect evidence. i have no doubt that certainly we're going to make sure of this, that the bureau does their job investigating this case. again, they got to apply the law equally. that's very very important for people in america to have faith and confidence in our justice system. it's a system i have worked in. it's very important for me that they do things the right way so that the american public has confidence in it. that requires equal application of the law, consistent standards on investigations. that's what we're going to make sure happens. >> shannon: okay. you all are trying to make sure something else happen, which is

that we don't default on our credit ratings. you're negotiating and talking about the debt ceiling in a deal that could possibly come together. the white house says no negotiations at all. we know that's not practical given some of the demands of house gop members that spending cuts and other things be included in order to get their vote. edward lawrence at fox business has been reporting, congressman fitzpatrick. you've been working on something that would be a debt to gdp ratio. if you hit a certain number, automatic cuts kick in. can you give us any sense of what would be the ratio? how do you decide whose programs automatically get cut in that scenario? >> yeah. well, first thing that has to happen, shannon. speaker mccarthy has made several overtures to the white house. he wants to sit down and work a reasonable solution out. i hope the white house accepts his offer. fact, it was white house that offered speaker mccarthy the opportunity to come in. i hope that happens. >> shannon: they say there is not going to be a negotiation

over the debt ceiling. >> that's a problem. that's a problem. that's not leadership. when you have a divided government. four vote republican margin in the house, one vote democratic margin in the senate, divided chambers, you have to negotiate. that's what the american people elected us to do, to work this out. so nobody should be taking the position that we're not going to negotiate. that's very irresponsible. pertaining to your question, one thing we're just going to offer up as a possible bridge building solution is to go right at the 1917 law itself that established the debt limit. it established it as a number, numerical dollar amount, which doesn't make citizens. we think more practically speaking it should be a debt to gdp ratio. 2008, our debt to gdp was about 40%. 2018 it was about 70%. it's now at 125%. that's not sustainable. when you have a child that has a spending problem, you do two things. you pay their bills, and take away their credit card. you don't do one, you do both. that's what has to happen here.

so what we're going to propose is whatever negotiated amount we can agree on on a debt to gdp ratio and have a cure period there after. if that cure does not happen, certain budgetary reforms automatically kick in on the discretionary side. we're still putting the meat on those bones. me and josh are going to work through our proposed solution. but the first thing that's got to happen, shannon, the president has to sit down with speaker mccarthy. speaker mccarthy offered to negotiate in good faith. >> shannon: the washington post is quoting a senior democrat in congress that said he had a conversation with ron clane, who may be leaving. he essentially said, no holds barred ppl there will be no negotiation. you have to make it look like we're the responsible ones and republicans are essentially irresponsible, trying to kill entitlements, those kinds of things. congressman, can you work with that f that is the strategy, if that is the theory? how do you move the ball at all? >> i have had conversations with the white house just this weekend. i'm optimistic that they will

sit down as this white house always has. that's why we were able to accomplish so much in a bipartisan way last congress. it takes constructive conversation. there's things reasonable on the table and there are things that are unreasonable. gutting social security and medicare is on the unreasonable side. >> shannon: which the speaker said is not on the table. just to be clear, the speaker has said that that's a talking point and that republicans are not going to do that. >> by the way, that's great. 'cause i don't think it should be on the table. things like 30% sales tax should not be on the table. but there are plenty of things that should be. brian and i and the problem solvers caucus are having discussions. the white house, you see kevin mccarthy and the president will be sitting down, if speaker and the president, will be sitting down. i think that's a good thing. what we can't do is put the full faith in the credit of united states of america at risk. we can't put people's 401k's at risk. we need to have these constructive conversations. make sure we raise the debt limit responsibly so people can have faith in our country and

currency. and we can also talk about our fiscal health and do that in a responsible way. i think we need to do both. i'm optimistic that everyone will sit down. we'll work this out. because we have no other choice. we have to work this out. >> shannon: congressman fitzpatrick, with that in mind and the potential departure of ron clane, do you think his departure changes the way that you are able to work with this administration? >> i don't think so. again, we're gonna let our speaker take the lead on this with his negotiations and then josh and i are going to offer our solution that hopefully can be constructive. i don't believe it's going to affect our relationship with the white house, shannon. we've had a constructive relationship with them. that's our job, no matter what party we're, from to do our part to make government work. we've worked well with a lot of people over there. i expect that to continue. >> shannon: the american people wish you well in trying to find solutions at the most treacherous problems we have now. congressman, thank you very much for joining us. >> we'll get it done. >> you bet. >> shannon: up next the

president's downplaying concerns about how he handled classified materials from years ago as yet another batch is found at his wilmington home. a special counsel is ramping up to investigate. we're gonna bring in our sunday group to discuss this all next. mass general brigham -- in boston, where biotech innovates daily at harvard medical school-- and the physicians doing the world-changing research are the ones providing care. ♪ there's only one mass general brigham. >> tech: cracked windshield? make it easy and schedule with safelite, because you can track us and see exactly when we'll be there. >> woman: i have a few more minutes. let's go! >> tech vo: that's service that fits your schedule. go to safelite.com. >> singers: ♪ safelite repair, safelite replace. ♪

>> i think you're gonna find there's nothing there. i have no regrets. i'm following what the lawyers have told me they want me to do. that's exactly what we're doing. there's no there there. thank you. >> shannon: president biden brushing off concerns after weeks of questions about how he handled the discovery and disclosure of classified documents from his time in the obama administration. now we understand maybe as far back to his senate career. white house correspondent franchesca chamber, marie harf, former chief of staff to mitch mcconnell, josh holmes and fox news analyst raymond royo. if only there was something to discuss today. okay. so he says there's no there there, but apparently there's another batch of there there. given this discovery, the fifth batch on friday, as doj and fbi agents were there.

jonathan turley writes this about the personal's statements. he shrugged off the matter like finding a borrowed hammer in his garage. since the standard is gross mishandling of classified evidence, the last thing you want to do is give a grossly mishandling answer. >> i think he's got deep regrets, right? especially coming outs so forcefully saying this whole thing is over, you're not gonna find anything more, we're done here with only a handful of documents and nothing to see here. every day, seems like everywhere he's had a cup of coffee he's got documents behind him. now doj is finding all this. i think the biggest issue as we turn forward with it is the access piece to it, right? we know what the mar a lago raid, were all in one room and the access was fairly limited. it's in his garage, right? in certain office space. we don't know who has access to this stuff. i think that's the biggest question going forward. >> shannon: your times opinion

piece said, oh, biden, what have you done. it's hard to show the level of exasperation with him for squandering a huge political advantage and for muddying what may have been the best chance to conflict mr. trump on federal charges. marie? >> the reason we know there were more documents found is that biden's personal attorneys invited the department of justice in to look for them. a couple were found, i think six last night. so they are fully cooperating. the biden team will tell you, we are fully cooperating, we are inviting them in. that is in stark contrast to donald trump, who repeatedly lied to the federal government. he claimed they were his. he claimed he declassified them. we have no idea who had access to them at mar a lago. we know there have been security concerns there. would i prefer not to be talking about this on fox news sunday as a democrat? of course i would. but i think attend of the day the distinction of how the biden team has handled them. inviting doj in, fully cooperating, letting them look into whatever they can, compared to the trump team which is at

every single turn really pushed back, even lied to the fbi and to the archives. i think at the end of the day that distinction will be quite clear to people. >> shannon: raymond, some people point to the distinction and the reporting in the washington post and wall street journal that there were conversations with the biden team an doj, oh, no, we're gonna let you investigate it. those conversations make people at least have the perception that there is a different standard. >> there seems to be a different standard here. because, look, you have private and personal lawyers going in and looking and discovering these caches. did they have security clearance? which we don't have full clarity on yet. shannon, years ago i remember seeing dean martin. he'd walk out on stage and say, how did all these people get in my room? that's joe biden every time he finds a document. how did this document get here? well, it didn't walk in. you placed it there or someone near you did. we need to know why and how. when you look at the penn biden

center, that first discovery is particularly disturbing because the classified documents were mingled in among personal files. they were even in envelopes marked personal files. why? who put them there? and when you overlay the timetable of the documents discovered and what was happening in joe biden's life, they do track with the hunter barisma deal, the iran nuke deal, the chinese natural gas deal that we've discovered, or has come to light, via's hunter's lap top. tons of questions that need exploration here. but i'm not quite certain, shannon, we've discovered the last biden classified document just yet. >> shannon: and we have been told that we think this is it. they think they're wrapped up. it blew up your story and deadline last night when there was another discovery. >> and house oversight republicans are trying to get their hands on the documents that were found. we don't know exactly what is in those documents yet. they gave the white house this week to answer questions about

this. they say they've heard crickets so far from the white house, despite the public responses. meanwhile, white house administration officials telling me they're still deciding how they want to respond to these request for communication. as far as president biden goes, the revelation that some of those documents included documents, we don't know how many, dating bac the u.s. senate, is at odds with the statements from the white house that he has handled the classified information in an appropriate manner and takes it very seriously, so to speak, bringing new scrutiny on that. >> shannon: it does. it puts the headline backes on the document situation. other than what is the strategy on the debt ceiling as to saying the republicans are crazy and they're going to crash the kphreu. the hill has this headline. gop risks overplaying their hand on the debt ceiling. they're pressing for big spending cuts but there's a real chance the gop could end up blamed for cascading negative effects if the u.s. even approaches a scenario where it defaults on its financial obligation. how much danger for them there?

>> i think everybody has to get on the same page from the very beginning. there is going to be a negotiation, right? you've got democrats basically at this point saying we're going to have a clean debt ceiling. that's about it. there's zero chance that that happens. there's going to be a discussion between speaker mccarthy and the administration. i assume the senate will be part of that discussion. it's not unprecedented. i remember sitting there in 2011 when we were doing this with joe biden with the budget control act. this is something that has lot of history, lot of precedent. what u.s. republicans need to do is figure out what ignites them to get to question. that's the other piece that has to happen. it's not a negotiable outcome. the outcome has to be there. but they've got to get as far down the road on the conservative side with spending cuts and the like to get that together. >> shannon: we know ron clane is for the hard ball plan on this. that's the line the administration continues to hold. do you think his departure will change the way the white house operates in these kinds of nonnegotiation negotiations? >> look, i don't think their

strategy is going to change necessarily. republicans in congress voted three times to raise the debt ceiling under president trump. not demanding any of the kinds of spending cuts they're demanding now. republicans find fiscal usa tearty generally when a democrat is in the white house. the case ron clane will tell you is that under president biden record unemployment, 11 million jobs created, record numbers of small business applications being put in in the last two years. contrast that with republicans taking over congress. the first thing they tkorb cut medicare and social security, default on our obligations, get our credit rating downgraded. if you take those two messages to the american people, they're gonna come out on the winning end of that policy wise economically but also politically. >> shannon: there's the political and optics side of that. very quickly before we go i want to get your comment on the fact that the supreme court has been investigating for quite sometime the may leak last year. we have no answer about who it is. >> and the question is why don't we have those answers?

i mean, the fbi should have been brought in, shannon. as you know, the investigator here was the marshal of the court. they don't have the investigation power to seize records and to obligate some of those clerks who have already left. as you were talking about earlier this morning, many of these clerks have already left. their tenure ended, they moved on. we didn't get testimony for some of them and records for some of them. so i don't think we'll ever know who this leaker is. too much time has passed. but we should know. these justices and their families, they are very worried and the threats have not stopped since that. >> shannon: demonstrations do continue at many of their homes on a weekly basis. you'll kick us off next time. up next, march for life returned to washington this week celebrating the end of roe v. wade. but legal battles continue to sprawl across the states and the debate over access to abortion. we sit down with prominent voices from the pro choice and pro life movements here together

for a conversation on one of the nation's most contentious issues. we'll be right back. cole hauser is an award winning actor. beyond his impressive career, he is a proud supporter of the tunnel to towers foundation. i was able to spend some time with cole and his family to reflect on those who have sacrificed so much to defend our freedom. you know, as i started to be more and more successful, i was like, how can i help? but when i heard of the tunnel to towers and i met brandon in idaho and his family, i was like, wow. there's actually a charity where we know where the money's going to go. you saw all the stuff we put in these homes? i was i was blown away. why should americans help tunnel to towers foundation? i mean, is there any better organization to help the people that has fought for this country and freedoms that we have? and you're going to join us on that mission. thank you. hey, i'm cole. hauser. i want you to join me in supporting our nation's heroes and their families. it's only $11 a month.

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>> shannon: in 197 3 the supreme court ruled in roe v. wade that

the right to privacy implied in the 14th amendment meant women had a right to abortion. that kicked off one of the most hard fought political and legal battles of the past half century. then last summer, after a leaked ruling indicated it would, the high court did indeed overturn roe. instead of settling the issue, it shifted the battle to new fronts. we will sit down with two of the most prominent advocates in the pro life and pro choice movements to discuss the new paradigm. but first a look at the surge in advocacy on both sides seven months after tend of roe. it was nearly a party atmosphere outside the supreme court friday as pro life demonstrators marched their 50th march for life. >> this year is different. we have overturned roe v. wade with the mississippi dogs case. >> shannon: the march started in the 1970s as a protest against roe v. wade. this year it had a victory lap feel, as marchers celebrated the

end of roe. >> we just won a huge case in the supreme court. that's incredible. >> did you ever think that you would see this day, where roe is no longer law of the land? >> it's incredible. we hoped. we prayed. there's always hope. i think nobody could believe it. >> i believe the culture is moving in our direction. >> what's been really cool for me is to see we're not the only ones. there's so many people here. people are coming with so much joy and hope. >> even as it celebrates seven months since roe was overturned, the legal rules around abortion are more unsettled than ever. now the abortion question is up to states. >> this is a day that those in the pro life movement have worked for for over 40 years. >> reporter: about a dozen states banned most or all abortions immediately. many saying those bans saved lives. but many states did the reverse, passing laws to ensure women had greater abortion access.

>> california, oregon and washington are building the west coast office to protect patients' access. >> reporter: voters also weighed in as midterm ballots saw a record number of abortion questions. in kansas voters turned out in huge numbers rejecting a law that would have banned access. the margin 59% to 41%. >> overwhelming majority of kansans believe that a woman's right to make private medical decisions should rest with her and not with politicians. >> reporter: fund-raising for both sides exploded after kansas, with statewide races seen as critical. a wisconsin judicial race is getting headlines now because an existing but unenforced abortion ban from 1849 could reach the state's highest court. the biden administration ramped up federal protections with an executive order preemptively pushing back on limits to obtaining federally approved abortion medication. or on women traveling to states where abortion is legal. and the legal battles continue

to unfold. south carolina's state supreme court struck down a six week abortion ban in early january. pro choice advocates are pressing congress to pass the original roe precedent into law. >> i believe congress should codify roe once and for all. >> reporter: by contrast, some congressional republicans want a federal ban. >> if republicans get their way with a national ban, i'll veto it. >> reporter: the president warned before the mid terms the end of roe would cost republicans politically. >> you're gonna hear women roar and it will be consequential. >> reporter: fox news voter analysis found 62% favored a national law guaranteeing access to abortion. 38% opposed. this year's rally was different than marches in the past going instead between the u.s. capitol and the supreme court as organizers say they're shifting their focus from the legal battle at the high court to the political one over on capitol hill. but marchers also acknowledge a

federal ban may never happen. in the mean time their movement is under pressure to help mothers and children after pregnancy. something they say they've been doing for decades and have ramped up in the wake of the end of roe. >> there will be children that come into this world that these women don't feel prepared for or it doesn't fit in their life. what do you say to them post roe? >> we definitely have to step up our game with the whole adoption system and then supporting women who are in these situations where they don't have the money or the resources to have these children. we can't tell the world that we want women to have children and then not give them the resources. >> shannon: joining me now president of the constitutional accountability center. penny nance of concerned women for america. thank you both for coming today. i think it's fair to say you are united in the dignity of women and caring about them in a moment they may not have foreseen coming into their lives. thank you for coming to see this. some say this is just the

beginning, getting rid of roe. this is what the president said this week about the supreme court overturning roe. he said never before has the court taken away a right so fundamental to americans. in doing so it put the health and lives of women across the nation at risk. so opponents of your work, including the president say, you're actually hurting women by this work. >> let's remember the pro life movement has always been led by women. starting with susan b. anthony and elizabeth stanton, who in the paper the revolution called it sadly child murder. you had women like alice paul who said abortion is the ultimate exploitation of women. concerned women for america have worked to protect women and their children from the very beginning. we have marched to the capitol. we have gone and advocated for our position. we've gone to the state capitols

and women have gotten elected to advocate for this position. we believe in the dignity and human life. there are two people, two lives at stake in this question. we want to love them both. there was a poll that just came down that said 90% of people want to protect the babies and their mothers. people recognize this is a lot. roe wasn't settled because people knew in their hearts there was a baby at stake. >> shannon: so now we have all these state fights. we have different things we talked about. the administration has taken steps to make sure women have more access. the fda allows abortion pills through the mail but this headline that retail pharmacies from corner drug stores to mayor chains like cvs will be allowed to offer abortion pills under a regulatory change made by the fda. available through the mail. there's no prohibition on women traveling across state lines. so is there a problem with access in 2023? >> yes, there is a problem with access for sure. there was actually a problem with access even when roe was on

the book. what we're seeing here are millions and millions of americans, particularly women, woken up after roe was overturned to this idea that many had taken for granted that a decision so fundamental, so personal, so life changing such as whether to terminate a pregnancy or to carry a pregnancy to term was now not going to be their own decision. that instead it could be made by politicians and not be made by the person themselves with their family, with their doctor, their god, but instead could be determined by their state legislatures or their governors. that's why we've seen this wave of activism where people are saying in states not just super liberal states. we're also talking kentucky, kansas, you know, states where, through ballot initiatives, people are saying, we want to ensure reproductive care access. we want to make sure that

reproductive care, including abortion, is still available. and it is up to the person themselves to determine whether or not to terminate a pregnancy. >> shannon: both of you have mentioned the fact that this did go to the stateds and there were ballot initiatives. there were different places we covered and talked about, how people voted on this. i remember, penny, talking to you in 2016 when president trump got into the primary. lot of pro life leaders were worried about him. you wound up calling him the most pro life president in history. then after the midterms did not go as well as expected for the republicans he said this. it wasn't my fault the republicans didn't live up to expectations in the midterms. it was the abortion issue poorly handled by many republicans that lost large numbers of voters. so what's your response to that accusation? this issue actually hurt? >> the pro life movement is very grateful to president trump. he appointed three constitutionalist justices that worked very hard to get confirmed.

i even called him after the overturn and thanked him for that. we just basically disagree. what we saw happen was republicans listening to the consultant class, running away from the abortion issue, being told only to talk about inflation and joe biden and being outspent 35:1 on this issue. the other side spent $391 million on ads to republicans little $11 million in ads. the other side painted them as extremists when the real extreme opinion on this is the other side that says abortion should be legal any time any reason any number all paid for by the taxpayer. we know that is not the position of the american people. this question has been returned to the american people. we are happy to advocate for our position and go state by state. that's the next step. that's the next phase what steve scalise said at the march. >> shannon: there are things that are still happening here both on capitol hill as well. there's talk about a national

ban or national cod tpeu kaeugs. couple things the house has voted on. in control of the gop. they voted on a resolution to con testimonstimony tkepl attac. there's also a bill that would have called for medical care for a baby that survived an attempted abortion. only one democrat voted for that. why will vote no on those kinds of measures? >> i haven't seen the particulars of those bills. i think we should condemn violence on all activists who are, people who have been threat subjects and danger to people who are trying to facilitate abortion care. i think one of the piece of legislation that i find interesting for this moment is actually the respect for marriage act that passed with bipartisan support in the last congress. i think what that showed that, with overturning of roe, people woke up to the idea that other rights that they thought were deeply embedded in constitutional principles of equality and liberty, like the

right to choose abortion fell, including marriage equality for lbgqt people, interracial couples. they saw those could be on the chopping block, too. that's why this legislation that would protect the marriage equality that we have come to expect from our constitutional rights into law. so i think we're seeing a great awakening of people recognizing that if this supreme court isn't going to recognize the full spectrum of equality and liberty that was supposed to be guaranteed to us in the 14th amendment particularly, that they are going to need to use other channels like the congressional enactments that i just talked about and like their ballot measures. we, the people, are coming back to say we need equal citizenship stature. we need to come to the public square as people who can make fundamental decision about our own bodies, about our own lives for ourselves. >> shannon: it sounds like with roe over, one thing you both

agree on is that the issue is not over. like, we're just going on to the next phase of it. we hope we can continue the conversation with you. we thank you for coming together today. >> thank you. >> shannon: all right. coming up next, former president trump may soon face opposition from a familiar face in his third white house bid. plus what to expect as the senate investigates the ticketmaster meltdown, left all those swifties just hanging. we pulled people off the street and asked them about their hearts. how's your heart? my heart's pretty good. you sure? how do you know? you're driving a car you have to check engine light. but the heart doesn't have a hey check heart sign. with kardiamobile. the fda cleared a personal ekg device. you can take a medical grade ekg in just 30 seconds from anywhere. kardiamobile is proven to detect atrial fibrillation, one of the leading causes of stroke. kardiamobile is now available for just $79. order at kardiamobile.com or amazon.

>> so a lot has changed. if i'm this passionate and this determined, why not me? >> shannon: former u.n. ambassador nikki haley appears to inch closer to saying she might challenge former president trump, her old for the 2024 republican nomination. we are back now with the panel. i'm kind of itching. >> it's early, shannon. >> shannon: i feel like we're already there. it never is over. we're always in the next presidential election. >> it's still january. i'm hearing from republicans they think they shr plenty of time to make decision around this. same thing for democrats. we haven't seen president biden get in the race either. he is expected to run for re-election.

the fact that he directed his own 2024 primary schedule is seen as an indication that he is planning to run for re-election. next week democrats will be gathering together to talk about, however, what to do about the state of new hampshire, shannon. >> shannon: my goodness. >> given that governor sanunu said they are going first no matter what in 2024. they are going to have the first primary in the nation. democrats have to figure out what to do. >> shannon: those headlines are a nightmare. democrats face obstacles. you see there, your piece, in the usa today, talking about the governor saying no matter what. new york dems put biden on blast. i guess as the kids say. marie, what does this say though about the current president's power and ability to call shots if these states are like, no, no, not so fast? >> i married into a new hampshire family so i have to be careful on this one. this is tricky. but look, i think democrats have

realized that the primary calendar needs to better represent the country, be more diverse, better represent the electorate. for those on the ground in iowa during the last cycle, we know that caucus wasn't run well for a number of reasons. we knew there had to be changes. i love the fact that new hampshire voters are invested in the process early. they get a lot of face time with candidates. it's a small state. they get to really ask them questions, probe their different policies. i want new hampshire to be near the front of the calendar. it is in their state law that they are first. states like nevada, south carolina, i think those better represent the full picture of the electorate. democrats are trying to figure out how to do both at once. the new hampshire conversation will be a very interesting one. with my in-laws, i have to just say they should always be first. >> shannon: i don't know whales you do with the in laws. you need to keep the peace. >> in laws are tough to navigate. >> shannon: it does say the president is setting things up. like south carolina. that was a turning point for him. probably propelled him to the presidency.

it doesn't sound like these states want to go long yet. >> i think new hampshire had the audacity to vote biden fifth in 2020. we forget. it wasn't just bad. it was real bad, in terms of his performance in 2020. i'm not surprised that they'll try to reorder things. he turned things around in south carolina. clearly they would like that to lead the way. there's a rich history in new hampshire that will be resistant. state law, not much they can do anyway. >> shannon, this feels like people trying to rig the game. i get inclusivity. they're the first in the nation. new hampshire. it demands retail politics. we've been on the ground there. they demand a certain something from candidates, one on one. they talk back to candidates. so it's a great training ground. i'm sorry, if joe biden feels he's not quite up to that task, then he shouldn't run for president. go through the blades of new hampshire. if you can survive that, then you get to reach south carolina and the rest of the primaries. i'm sorry. changing the rules early because

you don't like the way the game might play out, shannon, bad look for the president. >> shannon: how many t pizza ki iowa. these people are like, i have talked to them three times each, the candidates. they really engage with you. okay, marie. you're back because we have a very important senate hearing to talk about. you were here last time. the ticket master meltdown. senator klobuchar said the issues within america's ticket industry were reminded when ticketmaster failed hundreds of thousands of fans hoping to purchase tickets for taylor swift's new tour. i did reach out and got crickets. >> what a day on capitol hill that would be. amy klobuchar going for the teethless fan base. ticket master is a monopoly. it has been problematic with every huge release. i tried to get garth brooks tickets for vegas. couldn't do that. it's been long overdue for

someone to have some regulatory action here, and investigation. this is something americans care about. right? this is something they don't always pay attention to the debt ceiling or any of these topics, which are important. i wish they did. but at the end of the day if you say, what drives you crazy, a loft them will say ticket master. >> shannon: we talked about this during the commercial break about how i don't even try to go to the initial marke. you automatically are thrown to the secondary market because it is almost impossible. >> it only took taylor swift to bring republicans and democrats together in washington. look, the white house says that they don't see much more that the president can do on this particular issue, but administration officials tell me they do expect additional action on junk fees, as they're called. those are the service fees that in this case you pay going to an event like this. that's something the senators who are investigating this are also looking into and also to your point certainly something americans are paying attention

to. >> who thought we could find a website worse than southwest airlines? it's this. here's the rub. remember, ticket master and live nation are merged. live nation controls 200 venues, 400 artists. so they're policing and running the game in the front of the house and the back of the house. that demands scrutiny. i think people on both sides of the aisle would agree to that. >> shannon: staying in our hollywood lane which we do on fox news sunday. word alec baldwin will be facing involuntary man slaughter charges. he has denied that he pulled the trigger, that he's responsible. prosecutors feel otherwise and have charged him. this headline alec baldwin he, not the gun, will be charged with manslaughter. according to baldwin, everyone and everything are to blame for the shooting except for himself. this has all kinds of currents to it. we have a woman, helena hutchens who lost her life. this is a very prominent case involving a very prominent celebrity. >> tragedy, obviously, with the

loss of life. i think alec baldwin probably would not be in this amount of trouble had he just kept his mouth shut. i mean, it's the perfect example of a celebrity going out, trying to justify themselves in the court of public opinion not knowing that ultimately down the road everything that he said in all these interviews with stephanopoulos and everything else is used and is admissible to the ultimate criminal charges that are up against him. that's his problem. i think that's why he's in this hot water. >> shannon, i spoke to guy who have ran action cases. you expect there is nothing in that chamber. that's what he was assured. i don't think you can hold the actor culpable. one charge of manslaughter might apply to him as producers. the armor and the prop person were the same. shouldn't have happened. no live rounds should have been there. >> shannon: we will follow that case. thank you very much, panel. we'll see you next sunday. up next, saying good-bye to a

beloved member of our family here at fox.

>> shannon: we have some difficult news to share. a treasured member of the fox news family passed away this week. he died following a heart attack. he was our senior vice president of news and politics. for decades alan was a guiding force here. he started as a writer when fox news channel launched back in 1996.

alan worked his way up the ranks. alan was part of every major news story and every election night for decades, meaning he had a hand in how fox covered the biggest stories that affected your world. alan, who i will always remember with a smile on his face, was just 47 years old. he is survived by his loving wife rachel, who was his high school sweetheart and prom date, and their two children, 17-year-old son ben and 13-year-old daughter olivia. alan was so very proud of them. as my colleague said this week, alan made all of us better. he will be remembered in a service today in east brunswick, new jersey. we are wishing comfort to his family and his friend, and to everyone who is feeling this loss. that's it for today. thank you for joining us. we'll see you next fox news sunday.

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being people have been killed. 10 others injured after someone opened fire at a dance studio near los angeles. the shooter still at large, the very latest details coming up in a live report. and in san francisco, flames broke out at a building overnight this morning. more than two dozen people are without a place to live will tell you what we're learning about what happened. and another search has led to the discovery of more classified documents at the home of president biden will tell you what we know about those documents and what congressional members are now calling for from ktvu. fox two news this morning's onto.oo