or perhaps it's time to seize the day. don't just see opportunity, seize it! (applause) ♪ no sleep to brooklyn >> it's true that now that the spotlight is pretty bright here in new york some things have been said. >> can you name one decision she made as senator that shows she favored banks because of the money she received?

[ applause ] >> he can not come up with any example because there is no example. i stood up against the behaviors of the banks when i was a senator. i called them out on their mortgage behavior. >> secretary clinton called them out. oh, my goodness. they must have been really crushed by this. and was that before or after you received huge sums of money by giving speaking engagements? >> wait a minute. wait a minute. >> that's not accurate. >> i have stood on the debate stage with senator sanders eight prior times. i have said the exact same thing -- >> senator, please. >> if we can do in the los angeles or new york or seattle, let's do it. >> i put it out -- excuse me, i think i'm responding. >> please go ahead. >> i love being in brooklyn. this is great. >> whoa. what a night in brooklyn last night. i think bernie sanders gave hillary clinton a run for her

speech money. the crowd loved him but they were going at it. it got rough and it was -- it stuck to the issues but they both went at each other and slightly personal. lot of big political stories going on this morning, the "new york post" endorsing donald trump. they say he electrified the public, inspired people who'd given up on ever having a candidate that would fight for them. that's the "new york post." prosecutors in that case against corey lewandowski, remember the reporter michelle fields who claims she was assaulted and lots of women journalists signed a petition behind her because they felt something horrific had happened. listen to what florida officials who were investigating the case say about what really happened. we'll get to that. i think a lot of people were blinded by their hate for trump and that is finally come to pass. sam, we'll have to talk. >> i was prepared for this.

>> so we've got sam stein here. good morning, everybody, it's friday. april 15, joe will be here in just a little while. with us on set we have legendary columnist in and msnbc contributor mike barnicle. >> thank you. >> senior political editor and white house correspondent for the huffington post, sam stein. >> legendary. >> mini legend. >> managing editor of bloomberg politics and co-herself of "with all duty respect" mark halperin. and donny deutsch. >> can i get a nice word? >> no. we're going to get to the debate because it was insane, it was incredible, but muscle and fitness magazine? what? >> they did a spread on me. it's the truth. i kid you not. i swear to god. [ laughter ] >> what year did they do it in? >> we had a shoot the other day. >> ew! >> oh, no! >> come on! it's 6:03 in the morning.

stop that! >> what is that face you're making? >> you are so unself-aware. >> i'm promoting men's health. >> nobody wants to see that. >> it's a magazine. >> nobody wants to see that. >> people haven't had breakfast. >> we're promoting men's health. we need to get healthier in the country. >> donny, that's not healthy. >> don't be hating. don't hate the player. >> that's not healthy. >> donnie is going to live forever. >> i just threw up a little bit. >> i'm going to be trump's vice president. >> who needs a border wall when you have that? geez. >> you guys all watched this? >> it was like watching a chapter of the bickersons. the mutual contempt these two have for each other at this stage is off the charts. >> i agree that it was bernie east last stand and he had to go tough and he did but he made some good -- it will be very

difficult for her to navigate trying to keep his supporters if she continues on the winning streak she appears to be on. i don't know what his path is but, boy he pounded serious issues last night. >> if you were a hillary supporter, you loved what you heard and if you were a burny supporter there was not one vote that changed last night. >> i thought he would be weaker on foreign policy and weaker on some issues and there would be more of a difference between them. they both were tough. just days ahead of the new york primary, hillary clinton and bernie sanders faced often in a fiery debate last night in brooklyn. miles away from the center of the financial universe, the issue of wall street took center stage. things got heated when senator sanders sanders was asked to name one decision secretary clinton made as senator that showed she favored the banks and clinton was asked why she won't release the transcripts of the paid speeches and put the issue

to rest. >> look, there are certain expectations when you run for president. this is a new one and i've said if everybody agrees do it, because there are speeches for money on the other side, i know that. [ boos ] but i will tell you this, there is a long standing expectation that everybody running release their tax returns and you can go to my web site and see eight years of tax returns and i've released 30 years of tax returns and i think every candidate, including senator sanders and donald trump should do the same. >> you're running for the democratic nomination. >> right. >> and it's your democratic opponent and many democratic voters who want to see those transcripts. it's not about the republicans. [ cheers and applause ] >> let's set the same standard

for everybody. when everybody does italy do it. but let's expect the same standard on tax returns. everybody does it and then we move forward. >> so she'll do it when ted cruz releases her speeches? that was -- that is just not -- you guys, come on. >> i just think -- i'm going say it again. this speech thing is so irrelevant. people give speeches, when you're in an audience you somehow engage that audience and say "i love wall street." >> you do that? that's what you do? >> if you gave a speech right now -- your raison d'etre is women's rights and all that stuff. if you gave a speech to a group of 500 men -- well, you'd be screaming at them. that's a bad example. but you'd say "i'm so happy to be with you guys!" that's just speech -- it's such a non-issue. >> that's not true. i was brought into talk about my book "know your value" to a

bunch of ceos and i believe a lot of them in the banking industry or whatever talking about how women navigate and i talked about how much i liked elizabeth warren and i got booed. you're not going to find a different me in that room. >> it's not a different me. you frame a speech, it's just grown up stuff. >> no, actually. she knew she was going to run for president and needed -- felt the need to make the money but let us see the speeches. >> let's go to ring side. these two guys were at ring side last night. mark halperin, your take. >> on the question of the speech transcripts, minimum wage, social security, she gave answers last night that bernie sanders if he were a skilled debater could take advantage of. he's proven to be a great candidate building crowds, raising money, giving a speech that fires up a crowd, appealing and energizing young people. he's not proven after nine contests to be a good debater. a skilled debater would have

taken advantage of many openings she left last night and she did. >> for instance? >> her answer on social security was waffling. her answer on whether she supported $15 minimum wage was waffling. didn't pin her down. >> better one. she asked him specifically to name one instance where she had been compromised by contributions and he notably failed to do it. but we've played a videotape of one of those instances on this show that involves elizabeth warren talking about a bankruptcy bill that hillary clinton did flip on, a skilled politician, to mark's point, would have had them the back of his memory and put it out there in the moment. for some reason he whiffed on that. i think bernie had the better debate. he got at her on a number of fronts but i don't think it was the type of debate that moved the dial in a way to overcome the question. >> the audience was with him and she kept at it, she kept herself together and moving forward. >> let's step back for a second

and the truth is if you look entirely at this campaign, no one would have had imagined bernie would be at this point when he launched his race a year ago. this is a remarkable achievement. he will come through new york. >> he's not going away. >> he's a skilled politician. >> but he's not skilled at this. >> i hear what you're saying but it was -- i watched the very end. i couldn't stop. it was pretty riveting and unlike what we've seen on the republican side you knew you were going to learn a lot about two these people two people are and where they stand on certain issues and maybe you might mold your opinion on why it's important. do we have more? there's an argument about judgment versus qualifications? let's look at that. >> does secretary clinton have the experience and the intelligence to be a president? of course she does. [ cheers and applause ] but i do question her judgment.

a question a judgment which voted for the war in iraq. [ cheers and applause ] the worst foreign policy blunder in the history of this country. voted for virtually every disastrous trade agreement which cost us millions of decent-paying jobs and i question her judgment about running super pacs which are collecting tens of millions of dollars from special interests, including $15 million from wall street. i don't believe that that is the kind of judgment we need to be the kind of president we need. >> now that the spotlight is pretty bright here in new york, some things have been said and senator sanders did call me unqualified. i've been called a lot of things in my life. that was the first. and then he did say he had to question my judgment. well, the people of new york

voted for me twice to be their senator from new york. [ cheers and applause ] and president obama trusted my judgment enough to ask me to be secretary of state of the united states. >> i actually think a theme of it was hillary several times did the pragmatic thing. you're very good, mr. sanders about talking about the problems but we need grown up solutions. and every time it was let's let a half million prisoners out and we'll pay for them, we'll have the banks pay for colleges it was pie in the sky non-answers. >> i thought his answers on education and how splomehow oth countries in the united statfig out. and in the united states they're strapped with debt. >> but he's not giving one intelligible pragmatic solution. >> is that true, mark halperin? >> name a policy he's proposed

that much different than hers that's concrete and specific that you're confident he would enact as president. he has been a fantastic candidate for what he believes in in defining the problems and inspiring people to say we need change. but when the "daily news" editorial board was mentioned several times last night for a reason which is she can say -- it was perfect, it kicked off the new york campaign and it said in effect i care a lot about change but i haven't thought through specifics about how to make change. even on my signature issues. >> i'm not sure that's completely fear. >> there was a little more nuance to that "daily news" interview. the stuff on dodd-frank, there are provisions in it that you can break up the big banks, you have to tell them how to get certain sizes and his position is let them decide. >> front page of the "new york times" yesterday, banks are still too big. >> it's not totally divorced in reality of legislation. the bigger picture is how much the democratic party has moved in the past 10, 20 years.

'94 crime bill completely abandoned? >> what about the last eight months, how far he's pushed her to the left. >> and two years ago we were talking about a minimum wage legislation that would raise it to $10.10. we're debating to whether to go to $12 or $15. so he's affected the party. he's affected the tone and for better or worse depending on your perceptions but he's going affect the next presidency. >> i think he's found a way which i think is fascinating and important and the impact still remains to be seen but there will be one is how he has been able to on a number of issues intellectually connect with the voters. >> emotionally -- that's my whole point. it's pure -- that's exactly my point and what mark was saying. >> i don't think he has the -- >> the intellectual argument would be "here's how we're going to pay for college for everyone, here's how we educate a half million prisoners." not just "we got a problem and

we're going to do it." he's going to increase the deficit by $15 trillion if you go on the math. >> name one candidate on both sides right now who really talks about a certain issue -- whether it's the problems or solutions -- where people go wild when they hear about that issue. they're not going wild -- >> that's emotion. that's my point. it's emotion. that's exactly -- they go wild but it's right brain. >> married to a president for years and is internationally known. it's literally the issues -- >> here's why i think it's partly intellectual. because his critique of what's wrong with america appeals to tens of millions of americans. >> the intellectual argument would have a solution to it. >> intellectual critique, not a proposal. >> okay, that's well put. >> let's show the back-and-forth on social security because it led sanders once again labelling hillary clinton as part of the establishment. take a look. >> maybe i'm a little bit confused. are you or are you not supporting legislation to lift the cap on taxable income and

extend social security for 58 years and increase benefits? yes or no. >> i have said yes. we are going to pick the best way or combination. or combination of ways. [ boos ] it's always a little bit challenging because if senator sanders doesn't agree with how you are approaching something, then you are a member of the establishment. >> from a reader of the "new york daily news" -- >> you are a member of the establishment. >> let me ask the two of you, constant followers of this campaign, a question that i think a lot of people are interested in. on a scale of 1-10, the loathsome scale, 10 being bunsen burner hot. how much do these two candidates and their campaign december spies one another at this point? >> i think it's a little overstated when it comes to

candidates. the sanders supporters don't like her very much. i'm struck every time i go to a sanders event. >> oh, my god, yeah. >> her supporters i don't think loathe him all that much. i think they will forgive each other pretty quickly but i'm not sure how much she'd be willing to give up to get him to come her way. there's a stubbornness there. but i don't think -- compared to those previous campaigns i don't think -- >> i was going to say that. if you remember the obama/clinton loathing, that was far more intense than this. i do get an increasing sense that the clinton officials, the people in the campaign, find this to be going on a bit too long. >> that's what her face is telling me. are you freaking kidding me? >> that they would like to make that pivot and focus on the general election. >> but they're realistic, he keeps winning. >> what's going on? >> i think what happened was they looked at eight years ago where obama effectively used in the context of the campaign a math argument and said this is done, you'll never catch up with me, i have the pledged delegate lead, let's get on with it.

and the press by and large bought it and she's in an arguably better position in terms of pledged and this contest is still going on. she's wondering why she's not being -- >> here's exactly why. she's qualified. she's got it all. zhoek this job, everyone knows that and the question is do you want to go with that and go with what you know you're going to get, which is probably not a lot of change but not a lot of massive screw ups or do you want to go with someone who believes in what you believe the problems are and take a chance on that person? >> everybody agrees on the problems. why has there been an 11-point shift in the last month against hillary towards bernie? there's been a dramatic shift in women. what's happening? >> well, it's not yuan form everywhere. >> where are you seeing the shift? >> i just made it up. [ laughter ] >> senator sanders challenged clinton on minimum wage after she said she would sign a bill to raise it to $15 an hour. >> if a democratic congress put

a $15 minimum wage bill on your desk, would you sign it? >> well, of course i would. [ cheers and applause ] and i have supported the fight for 15, i am proud to have the endorsement of most of the un n unions that have led the fight 1235r. >> i am sure a lot of people are very surprised to learn that you supported raising the minimum wage to 15 bucks an hour. [ cheers and applause ] >> wait a minute. wait a minute. >> that's not accurate. >> i have stood on the debate stage with senator sanders eight prior times. i have said the exact same thing. >> senator, please -- >> if we can raise in the new york or los angeles or seattle let's do it. >> if you're both screaming at each other, the viewers won't be able to hear either of you. >> when this campaign began, i said that we've got to end this starvation minimum wage of $7.25, raise it to $15. secretary clinton said "let's raise it to $12." there's a difference. and by the way, what has happened is history has outpaced

secretary clinton because all over this country people are standing up and they're saying 12 is not good enough, we need $15 an hour. >> mark halperin, off your earlier comment about senator sanders' deficiencies in his debating skills, what about that exchange? >> he -- she opened the door to these kind of answers and that was probably the one that was the most -- left to the most vulnerable. i think if donald trump face s hillary clinton in the general election and she gives answers like that he will be more effective as saying "that is a business as usual answer, that answer makes no sense to an ordinary person, is she for 15 or 12?" and bernie sanders didn't take advantage of it. i talked to several democrats last night who said boy, as good a debater he she's reputed to be, those are not good answers. >> remember when in the 2008 debates she was asked about elliiot spitzer's driver licens for undocumented immigrants in new york and she couldn't give

you an answer about whether she support eed he was doing or didt and chris dodd took her to task and that precipitated what was her downfall. >> clintonian can mean two different things, it can mean positive or negative. those were clintonian answers that are not good in a general election debate and leave her vulnerable. >> that was a fox news poll, by the way, that shift. just getting that out there. >> let's get to other headline this is morning. the cdc has confirmed the zika virus can cause severe brain damage in infants and now health care experts are divided on what advice to offer women about pregnancies. some argue avoiding conception is the only sure way to prevent babies born with microcephaly. women's health specialists counter the government should not tell women what to do with their bodies. also, a new nbc news/new york' wall street marist poll shows bill de blasio's approval

ratings have fall on the just 35% that describe his job performance as excellent or good. 62% of spon didn'ts said they thought the mayor was doing a fair or poor job. that is up from 58% in november. finally a california review board recommended parole for a former member of the charles man son family cult. lesley van houten was convicted in 1969 of the killings of two beam. she's been denied parole 19 times. if upheld, it will be forwarded to governor jerry brown. and still ahead on "morning joe," things fall apart. the case against donald trump's manager is dismissed. we're going to dig into the implications of that and what really went on. i tried to hold my fire on this because i thought people would go crazy and that it was a women thing. >> yes? >> i'm sorry. that was -- >> we'll talk about this. >> that was a sad case of

histrionics gone wild and blind hatred for donald trump and i'm not talking about trump here, i'm talking about how we covered the story. that was pathetic. and florida officials will show you that with tapes and diagrams. chuck todd is here to break down the debate and his town hall with ted cruz plus kasie hunt is here with a look at the toughest campaign ad yet from senator sanders. and later, the great carol king on why she's stepping into the presidential fight on behalf of hillary clinton. you're watching "morning joe." we'll be right back. playing for the usual phil? always stacy. at kpmg we've always believed leadership is about vision and integrity. confidence. inspiration. and passion. pitching wedge.

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>> oh, i'm the bigger man. with the bigger hands. [ laughter and applause ] and the bigger -- [ laughter ] you can't see me but i'm pointing at my trump tower. >> i'm really glad not to be on

face time right now. >> okay, donald trump is still republicans' favorite candidate for the nomination only they are now less confident he will get it. a new fox news national poll of republican voters finds trump at 45%, up four points since last month while ted cruz has fallen 11 points to 27%, barely ahead of kasich at 25%. a cbs news poll shows trump 13 points ahead of cruz, 42% to 29% and kasich far back at 18%. if the republican field were winnowed down to two, trump would still lead 48% to 38% over cruz. yet republicans are now less confident in trump winning the nomination, down 17 points from last month to 60%, cruz, meanwhile, is up 12%. a florida prosecutor's office decided not to pursue a case against donald trump's campaign manager corey lewandowski. the prosecutors say while lewandowski grabbed reporter michelle fields, the evidence was not strong enough to support a criminal prosecution.

they also say that she entered a protective bubble near the candidate. >> the press was directed toward the back, there's a bubble and she makes her way beyond the press area and gets right next to mr. trump and actually makes slight contact with mr. trump and you can see he sort of recoils. >> if this hand, her left hand, that we were able to capture that touches him. when she touches him, you see him recoil his right arm like this away. and based on the position where mr. lewandowski was standing, his vantage point would have been such that he could see that. so in his mind, it's reasonable to believe that he just -- he had just witnessed, observed, a touching or her trying to grab on to mr. trump in some respect and he then reaches in and he pulls her away. from an area in which she was not supposed to be in to begin with. >> the bullet entered where?

>> back and to the left. back and to the left. back and to the left. >> the zapruder film. >> the trump campaign released a statement saying the matter is now concluded. in an interview last night, lewandowski said he regrets the distraction but used the occasion to contrast trump's handling of it to others. >> first let me say how much i am thankful for mr. trump and his loyalty in this very, very difficult time. you know, many other candidates, all of the other candidates in the race asked for me to be fired and said i should have my day in court and what we saw today was that they looked at the evidence and decided there was no way they could prosecute this case and move forward so first and foremost i want to thank mr. trump. >> you've got to give trump props for that, that showed his mettle. >> for the first time we've heard nothing from the reporter who's made these accusations, nothing at all. she tweeted a lot about it. she was very upset when it happened, you could hear the audiotape. she was saying, oh, my god, oh, my god. >> one of the things i've said

about trump all along is his employees are very loyal to him. that's run of the reasons. >> sam, you were very upset about this. >> i think fact that we are talking about this story at this point in time is political malpractice by corey lewandowski. this thing, this whole incident, could have been resolved in literally two seconds with him saying "i'm sorry." instead what he did, again, was to go out there, manufacture a fake story about how never saw her, never touched her, which was disproven by the film. i never said when we talked about this last time it looked like a horrific attack or anything but he clearly lied about it and now we're here -- >> are you sure she told the truth. >> i don't think she necessarily told the truth, either. >> he is a private citizen. what i want to know is why did the people who arrested him -- it wasn't hot pursuit. this was a couple weeks later. why did they feel the need to not consult -- arrest him without consulting the people who decided he didn't need to be prosecuted.

it's unfair. whatever the facts -- sam's right, perhaps he should have apologized, it could have ended. but it's unfair to him to make him go through the weeks he had to go through when all they had to do is consult with the prosecutors and say here's what we found, would you prosecute this case? there was no rush to arrest him. >> i agree with that. >> there's no doubt that that's a legitimate point. there's no doubt that had he -- had corey apologized immediately it would have disappeared that evening. there is also no doubt that if john weaver, john kasich's campaign manager, had done a similar thing, we wouldn't even know about it. it's trump that fed this. it's the trump campaign. the whole furor -- >> but, again, it was fed by the fact that he lied. i mean, he said he didn't know her and never touched her and then there was video of it. >> i think you all are talking about very important parts of this but you're failing or afraid to talk about where it all began. >> with the woman who brought it

up. >> listen, she obviously overexaggerated the extent to which she was pulled down. >> please tell the truth more. >> but she also felt like she had been assaulted. >> she said she was almost thrown to the ground and -- >> and then she had someone who did -- i mean the videotape shows him grabbing her. we had that person tell her she was crazy and he never met her and touched her and that's a fact. >> but why are you afraid to talk about both sides of this? >> i'm not afraid. i just said she -- >> let's say that was a man instead of that female reporter and that man brought up those claims and suits. he would have harassed and harangued and called all kinds of names. >> well, she has been. she has been. >> but can you imagine a man? >> oh, i think she's been harassed more than a man would be. >> do you think so? >> yeah. >> if a man claimed he was -- >> and come on, man, there's a total different dynamic than a woman being grabbed by a man. >> a lot worse has happened to

me in a press scrum. a lot worse. >> no doubt. >> it hapned to me last night in brooklyn. >> people don't like you. that's why that happens. >> i'm not going to say it but i'm surprised that even now when you see florida state officials literally spelling out what happened totally debunking the story -- >> mika, there's a difference between a crime and inappropriate behavior. >> but it was a "w" for trump he stood by his man. at the end of the day it's true other candidates would have fired him and donald got up there and -- >> and john kasich said that. >> and he said "he's a good man, this is ridiculous." >> he also called the prosecutors to talk about the case which i'm not sure that was the best idea but typical donald trump. helped him get off. >> i don't like what happened. >> i hear you. we'll have to agree to disagree. >> the fact that it received such extensive coverage. shame on us. >> i don't like what happened. coming up -- [ laughter ] >> we didn't hear you. did you like or not like what

happened? >> i'm just going to be very careful but i think we -- i think women have a responsibility to make sure that we -- >> leave it. >> we should go to break. >> that we bring to the table valuable credibility and that we don't -- i think something really -- something that is sort of hard to talk about happened here and i'm not going to -- >> i was trying to get at that. >> -- push it forward and lead to more problems but this was a joke from the beginning. it was. donald trump lands an endorsement from one of new york's major newspapers and this wasn't isn't published by his son-in-law. well, that's good. that's next in the must-read opinion pages. "morning joe" is back in a moment. if you're going to make a statement...

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shoshow me more like this.e. show me "previously watched." what's recommended for me. x1 makes it easy to find what you love. call or go online and switch to x1. only with xfinity. so this is interesting, in the must-read opinion pages. i'll start with the "new york post" endorsing donald trump and then i'll back up what they say with a piece submitted to the "wall street journal," written by donald trump.

that's the endorsement from the "new york post." now look at this pivot happening. donald trump writing an op-ed. >> whoa. >> are you being sarcastic? >> no! >> it just sounded like it. i'm just saying. sam seems touchy this morning. >> i'm tired. >> it's written in iambic pentameter. read it correctly. >> you read it.

the problem with that is donald didn't write that, bernie sanders wrote it. >> might as well have. >> he said i understand rules are the rules and we'll fight for every delegate which is a good paragraph for him to

collude, but this message is very powerful because these rules are not democratic. >> this is a pivot to presidential as well. >> why do you think they did this? >> i agree but why is that a pivot? >> because in the beginning of this campaign he was making outlandish statements, he was going on tv all the time, he was calling everyone, he was literally a 24 hour riff machine. now you see him not on sunday sho shows. he's holding back and writing a piece in the "wall street journal." >> can i just say something to you guys? let's not set the bar so low that the man writes an op-ed that 100% of america would agree with, the system is rigged, and call that presidential. let's just call that 101. >> the chairman of the republican party doesn't agree with it. >> i hope he does pivot, we've talked about this but let's not set the bar so low that because he doesn't call in to every show and because he wrote a very obvious safe op-ed that that's presidential.

>> it's not obviously safe. >> is this the bigotry of low expectations? >> it was not obvious and safe for the guy on precipice of becoming the republican party nominee to attack the way republicans pick their nominee. and i will say if he's going to be elected president, he's going to have to be the candidate of change against status quo. if it's trump/clinton, this is a great change editorial. >> i think what's interesting about this is where he placed it. he could have said this on fox news if he wanted to. he could have written a column for townhall.com, breitbart, he put in the the "wall street journal" editorial page because he wanted to give a brushback to people in the establishment of the republican party that he'll fight. >> i think he put it there for another reason which is if it's trump versus clinton he can not let her be the candidate of business because if a democrat is the candidate of business, the democrat wins. if she -- barack obama proved that, bill clinton proved that. he needs to be the candidate big leading business people who read that editorial page say "yeah,

i'll take a chance on trump." but. >> but this wasn't a pro-business op-ed. >> it's for changing status quo in washington. i'm not talking about ceos with corporate lobbies, small businessmen and women around the countly who want washington to change. he needs. >> his references to the delegate selection process. do you think stephen hawking could figure out the republican delegate process? >> on a good day. >> no. it's byzantine and purposely so. it's for insiders to let them pick the republican nominee which is the republican party's right to do. donald trump is saying that's not the way it should be. but it's extraordinary for a guy who could be a couple months away from accepting the republican party nomination to blast the way the republican party picks their nominee. quite something. >> it's great. >> donny doesn't get. >> it i get the point i just don't see that as presidential. i see that as smart campaigning. >> flex your muscles and then you might get it. >> presidential and pivot would be shifting some of the

statements -- >> you just want to talk about michelle fields more. you were blinded. >> what? >> the two of you, you cannot see anything positive -- i'm not pushing for trump here, i'm probably going to vote for hillary clinton so let's make sure we're clear on our world views but you guys are a so blind you cannot see a change when it's happening. you cannot see something positive? even slightly? when it's happening? >> i see a smart op-ed. i don't see -- the pivot will come when he takes back the muslim statements and the other divisive things. that's the pivot. this is smart cam panic. >> can i get a gold star? >> no. >> wow. >> we've got to go. >> donny's right. >> up next -- i think joe needs to take over the consideration because i'm getting a little shrill. >> if only he were here. >> i'm getting a little shrill. >> send out the bat signal for joe. beep beep. >> what happened? look what the cat dragged in. >> i've been down at the police

precinct. >> were you looking at the zapruder tapes? >> there was a public pornography complaint against donny deutsch. have you shown the photo yet? >> i don't want to see it. >> it's too much. >> it's disgusting. >> it's "men's health." i put that instagram on with you in mind. >> it's disgusting. all the tanner involved and the touching of self. [ laughter ] we'll be back. we'll be right back. new york mar y'a he has a sharp wit. a winning smile. and no chance of getting an athletic scholarship. and that is why you invest. the best returns aren't just measured in dollars. td ameritrade. it's realizing beautyg doesn't stop at my chin. roc©'s formula adapts to delicate skin areas.

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earlier this year, a south carolina voter told your daughter chelsea "i think a lot of african-americans want to hear, you know what, we made a mistake." chelsea said she heard you apologize but went on to say if the voter hadn't heard it then "it's clearly insufficient." do you regret your advocacy for the crime bill? >> well, look, i supported the crime bill, my husband has apologized. he was the president who actually signed it. senator sanders voted for it. >> but what about you, senator?

>> i'm sorry for the consequences that were unintended and that have had a very unfortunate impact on people's lives. i've seen the results of what has happened in families and in communities. that's why i chose to make my very first speech a year ago on this issue. >> the operative words there, mika, my husband was the president. and he's apologized. just throw bill under the bus. >> poor bill. joining us on set, president and ceo of the national urban league marc morial. your wife would never -- unless you're wrong. >> never, only behind closed doors. >> so does bill clinton owe more of an apology? >> i don't think so. the crime bill of 1994 was a comprehensive bill. it had bad stuff in it and it had some positive things in it. what i prefer to hear is a conversation about what you're

going to do to fix the criminal justice problems and an endless ad nauseam. bill clinton proposed it, bernie sanders voted for it. hillary clinton supported it. so there's no distinction here. the distinction in the conversation ought to be about what you'll do. >> is bernie sanders proposing enough forward-thinking policies? >> i think bernie sanders and hillary clinton i think hillary's policies and the meetings we had with them are more in-depth, more thought out. bernie's got vision and aspiration on some important issues. so you see sort of a distinction between the two in that regard. i don't see wide differences. >> so why is there such a wide difference between who black voters are voting? why is there such a massive -- >> it's history, joe. it's really history. african-american voters are like a lot of voters. a long-standing relationship

counts. familiarity counts because that breeds trust. bernie with a good message but basically he's a brand new face on the national scene. he's meeting a lot of voters and leaders for the first time so it's not animus. it's a choice. >> but would you argue he's been fighting for the interests of african-americans his entire career? >> i think he's had a positive progressive voting record the a great extent but have we seen him visible on a voting rights exsnen extension? have we seen him visible on a broad range of issues very important to the african-american community? not necessarily so but that doesn't mean he hasn't "voted" in the correct way. so this is a fabric because politics is about a choice. it's about who you prefer the most or who you trust the most or who you dislike the least. >> i'm wondering what you made of his argument at the very end

of the debate where he was talking about the states that had voted already and he kind of dismissed the southern states as being more conservative. for a lot of people that rubbed them the wrong way. they were wondering what it was that was conservative about those southern states when predominantly the electric there for the democratic primary -- electorate there for the democratic primary is black. >> i think the bigger process is primary states where people vote and caucus states which are an inside ball game. i'm not a big fan of caucuses because i think caucuses can be controlled, manipulated, don't reaffirm all of the voters' participation so i don't think anyone should dismiss a state based on region i don't think that's a good thing to do. but they're trying to make distinctions and trying to reaffirm why "his" wins may be more valuable than her wins but at the end of the day you count delegates and you count the

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>> look, there are certain expectations when you run for president. this is a new one and i've said if everybody agrees to do it because there are speeches on the other side, i will tell you that. but there is a long standing expectation that everybody running release their tax returns and you can go -- [ cheers and applause ] you can go to my web site and see eight years of tax returns and i've released 30 years of tax returns and i think every candidate, including senator sanders and donald trump should do the same. >> you're running now for the democratic nomination and it is a democratic opponent and many democrats who want to see those transcripts. it's not about the republicans.

[ cheers and applause ] >> you know let's set the same standard for everybody when everybody does it, okay, i will do it. but let's set and expect the same standard on tax returns. everybody does it and then we move forward. >> so what happened? why is bernie -- what's in his tax? >> i don't know, man, something is going on. >> was he rusting dairy cows in vermont and not reporting the income? >> the back story is bernie hasn't released his tax returns yet. he says 2014s are coming today and he says that it's because his wife jane does their taxes, they've been on the road and they haven't done it. we suspect -- it's mike's theory. >> look at you all! >> massive investments in banks. >> yes, huge. >> huge j.p. morgan stock. >> no way! >> so you fell for the deflection? the question was about the speeches. welcome back to "morning joe." you guys are a bunch of -- oh, they're talking about tax

returns. yeah, you're right. >> no, you're right, you're right. >> it's not like we haven't talked about the speeches for like 8,000 years. so we talk about something other than the speeches and you're like, "oh, you're dumb!" no, actually -- >> joe doesn't like being called out. >> we're not one trick ponies. >> you fell for the deflection. >> it's good to have joe on this show. thank you for showing up. >> do you want to see the transcripts? >> i've said it a thousand times so you don't go "oh, you guys --" >> when she is asked about why she won't release her transcripts is the answer "let's talk about tax returns"? >> the answer is she should release her transcripts and bernie should release his tax returns. >> deal. >> that would be a smart deal for him to propose. let's just do that one at a time. >> i guess that makes me dumb. >> i fell for the deflection again. >> did you really? >> yeah, look at the bern! it ee's the clinton shuffle.

look at bird! where did they learn that from our friend in louisiana. it's ka it's kasie hunt. still with us on set, legendary columnist in mike barnicle. >> legendary! >> enough! >> white house correspondent for the huffington post and i think today officially a whiner, sam stein. >> why? why do you say that? >> because of the whole corey story. >> you remember barack obama's bowling? whee! what we say when we introduce mike barnicle, legend. what do we say when we introduce sam stein? whee! let's try it. whee! sam stein, whee! we also have msnbc political correspondent kasie hunt. what's going on? >> she has a new ad.

>> with tax returns? >> well, with the ads. >> well, with tax returns i think there is a filing cabinet at their home in burlington, vermont, that jane hasn't been able to open and that's probably part of the explanation. >> usually similar prime minister when it comes to bernie sanders and his wife jane. >> but on the subject of speaking fees which, of course, was the original question that has led us to this discussion, nbc has obtained bernie sanders' latest ad new york city which deals with this subject. >> wall street banks shower washington politicians with campaign contributions and speaking fees. what do they get for it? a rigged economy. tax breaks and bailouts. all held in place by a corrupt campaign finance system. and while washington politicians are paid over $200,000 an hour for speeches, they oppose raising the living wage to $15 an hour. $200,000 an hour for them but not even 15 bucks an hour for

all americans. enough is enough. >> i'm bernie sanders and i approve this message. >> so no hillary clinton by name. >> it's a tough ad. >> $200,000 an hour and you don't support $15 an hour, mike? us and them. >> and then the reference to hillary clinton once supporting $12 an hour minimum wage. for this. there are a lot of people around bernie sanders that are trying to get him to air ads like this for months now. i think they're starting to feel like this is where they should have gone all the way along. we saw this in iowa. >> well, there's this tension. is he started out saying i'm goipgs to do a strictly positive campaign but as they've gotten to do closer and closer, the surge to go more personal on her. >> this is not personal. this is about issues. and positive campaign?

you want to show people what needs to change. so it isn't going negative and getting personal. this is talking about issues are clearly, clearly very present in the minds of the american voters. >> it gets into the gray area successfully. it's been tough to find the sweet spot of him. >> i think we started on monday rigged, rigged. remember we were saying everything was rigged, rigged, rigged? next day trump is using it. now you're seeing rigged in that ad. that is the message of this campaign, the system is rigged against us. >> well, both the economy and the delegate selection process are clearly rigged. it's clearly rigged. >> so with last night's debate as the backdrop, bernie sanders was slipping among new york voters. in the new nbc news/"wall street journal"/marist poll, clinton leads by 17%. on monday, clinton is up 14%.

the story gets war for sanders among jewish voters who count for as much as 16% of the electorate in new york. he trails by 33 points. last night the subject of israel and palestine revealed interesting fracture between the most successful jewish presidential candidate in history and the former secretary of state over whether israel's response to gaza attacks has been proportional. >> of course israel has a right not only to defend themselves but to live in peace and security without fear of terrorist attacks. was that a disproportionate attack? the answer is i believe it was. and let me say something else, in the long run, if we are ever going to bring peace to that region which has seen so much hatred and so much war, we are going to have to treat the palestinian people with respect and dignity. [ cheers and applause ] >> i don't know how you run a

country when you are under constant threat, terrorist attacks, rockets coming at you, you have a right to defend yourself. that does not mean -- that does not mean that you don't take appropriate precautions and let me say this, if yasser arafat had agreed with my husband at camp david in the late 1990s to the offer that prime minister barack put on the table, we would have had a palestinian state for 15 years already! [ cheers and applause ] >> she evaded the question. the question is not does israel have a right to respond. not does israel have a right to go aft terrorists and destroy terrorists. that's not the debate. was their response disproportionate? >> the way hamas places its weapons, the way that it often has its fighters and civin civi garb, it's terrible. i'm not saying it's anything

other than terrible. but it would be great -- remember, israel left gaza, they took out all the israelis, they turned the keys over to the palestinian people and what happened? hamas took over gaza. so instead of having a thriving economy with the kind of opportunities that the children of the palestinians deserve we have a terrorist haven. >> sam, you said it was a defining moment. >> seminal. >> not just in this debate but in generations of foreign policy debates, bernie sanders opened a door that virtually no major presidential candidate that i can remember has done with respect to talking about the palestinian side of the conflict and humanizing the palestinian side in a way no presidential candidate has ever done. >> you may disagree with the merits of bernie sanders' argument last night but you cannot disagree with the fact that it shows courage stepping into that. >> i think the fact that she is

jewish -- although he never emphasizes it. but the fact that he is jewish gives him an ability to talk about this in a way i think some other candidates probably can't do. also the fact he probably -- he's an unconventional mainstream foreign policy -- he's not a mainstream foreign policy thinker. this is what he believes and he wasn't going to hide it. the irony here is this is happening at the same time his jewish policy liaison is being suspended from the campaign for voicing very similar opinions. >> the jewish liaison that worked for the campaign for a couple day which is should tell you they're far behind a little bit reaching out to the jewish community. >> listen, you would have to search far and wide at least when i was there to find anybody more pro-israeli than me. i had people on the house floor joke all the time if you ever need a key to the city of tel aviv, you've got it. i've spoken at a lot of aipac

events, fund-raising events in the past but i said it in realtime. the attacks weren't proportional and the thing that upset me as a staunch supporter of israel was that hamas was on the run. hamas was getten weakened by the day and these attacks, which were not proportional, only played into hamas's hands and strengthened them at the same and caused a great deal of human suffering. and, yes, of course, the onus is on hamas. the onus is on the palestinian terrorists who continue launching rockets into israel every single day. and it's a constant attack and, of course, i understand that. the response was not proportional. the response was not in the best interest not only of the palestinians who many of them innocents were killed. but also the israeli people. they had hamas back on their heels but hamas doesn't know how to run anything.

>> there's a very pro-israel position to take out that says you need to call out israel when it's excessively retaliating and it's a more sophisticated position. the problem has always been thaw that if you make that argument it's too convoluted to fit intera presidential campaign. what bernie sanders did was open the door to make that argument more forcefully. >> well, i don't know if bernie sanders has had a 20 year plan of -- >> he lived in israel. >> yeah, we've heard that. >> why are you discounting basic parts of who he is. >> what do you mean? >> he showed courage and plays to the truth. he never panders. >> we got into the discussion partly because of the "new york daily news" interview when sanders misstated the number of casualties caused by that response and there was swift backlash from the anti-defamation league and others and he is saying the number he used was those injured

not killed. >> but you can, though, and i'm not speaking for bernie, buck pro-israel -- >> absolutely -- >> and at the same time say you're not helping your cause, you're not helping those of us who supported you our entire live liv lives but, again, mike, so much of it depends on context, is it coming from a life long supporter of israel, who supported them in congress or was it coming from somebody who had never seemed to be quite as supportive on policy issues. >> to sam's point and to what you just said, you can make a strong case in point that bernie sanders by opening the door to this discussion is very strongly pro-israel. because the only way this is going to work out if it ever does is there has to be some

legitimate palestinian state. it has to be on the table for open discussion. the extraordinary thing here at let to she that a few weeks ago when donald trump indicated that he was going to speak to both the israelis and the palestinians about coming up with a middle east peace deal which he said would be the hardest deal to ever get anywhere in the world, he was vilified and there's not that much distance between what donald trump put on the table and what bersz opnie sanders op the door to. >> we saw the same thing with nato when nato was brought up. what bernie sanders was saying about nato sounds like donald trump is saying about nato trveg. >> the "wall street journal" piece you read earlier, sounds like bernie sanders. >> written by donald trump. >> you know, another issue that came up was guns last night. did not turn out well for bernie. >> came out front and center. the back-and-forth began when clinton was challenged on her

assertion this week that the highest per capita number of guns that end up committing crimes in new york come from vermont. >> are you seriously blaming vermont and implicitly senator sanders for new york's gun violence? >> no, of course not. of course not. this is a serious difference between us and what i want to start by saying -- it's not a laughing matter. 90 people on average a day are killed or commit suicide or die in accidents guns. 33,000 people a year. i take it really seriously. i have spent more time than i care to remember being with people who have lost their loved ones. so, yes, we have a problem in america. we need a president who will stand up against the gun lobby. we hear a lot from senator sanders about the greed and recklessness of wall street and i agree, we have to hold wall street accountable. >> thank you. >> well, what about the greed

and recklessness of the gun manufacturers and dealers in america? [ cheers and applause ] >> the only problem is, folks, she didn't answer your question. you asked her whether she thought vermont was responsible for a lot of the gun violence, a statement that was refuted by the governor of the state of vermont who was a supporter of hers who said, oh, yeah, in campaigns people tend to exaggerat exaggerate. >> sanders sanders was asked in light of his recent statements that he doesn't think victims should be able to sue gun manufacturers if he owes the sandy hook shooting victims an apology. >> i don't think i owe them an apology. they are in court today and actually they won a preliminary decision today. they have the right to sue and i support them and anyone else who wants the right to sue.

>> the law that senator sanders voted against, giving this special protection to gun manufacturers and dealers is an absolute abdication of responsibility of those who voted for it. >> strong moment for hillary clinton. >> i thought it was bernie's weakest moment. when he started laughing at the notion of vermont being the gateway for guns in new york, that contrast of him laughing and her jumping in there being like "it's not a laughing matter" i thought was powerful image imagery. >> there are moments in this debate when physical moments, laugh, are extraordinarily revealing. unfortunately for senator sanders that moment revealed a self-righteous streak in him that to say that, you know,

you're wrong in this issue. no, i'm not wrong because i'm better than you. >> i think that's one of his challenges as he's learned how to navigate this stage that's gotten bigger than he thought it would is how to take a sensitive issue and make sure he's focused on it. he was feeling personally under attack and i think you saw that. >> last night bernie sanders had hesitations about the president's supreme court nominee. >> a third grader understands the president of the united states has the right to nominate individuals to the u.s. supreme court. i will strongly support that nomination as a member of the senate. but in elected president i would ask the president to withdraw that nomination because i think -- [ boos ] i think this. i think that we need a supreme court justice who will make it crystal clear -- and this

nominee has not yet done that -- that he or she will vote to overturn citizens united and make sure that american democracy is not undermined. [ cheers and applause ] >> only thing i'll say about this, mika, is i'm have surprised that sam stein believes the president should nominate ted cruz to be the next -- >> it would be a brilliant move. strategically smart. >> off-the-charts different. still ahead on "morning joe," wall street has tripled its contributions in this presidential cycle compared to 2012. >> but the impact isn't the same. we'll talk about that ahead. first, nbc's andrea mitchell joins the conversation. plus our political director chuck todd is standing by. you're watching "morning joe." we'll be right back. will you watch?!

do you have the courage to stay up all night? because this is our time! the greatest tv week of our lives! ladies and gentlemen, in the business of binge-watching,

sleep is for the week! so i want you ready to order takeout, every single night! now are you with me? to awesomeness! to watchathon!! big is back. xfinity watchathon week starts april 18. the greatest collection of shows free with xfinity on demand. you called the senate majority leader a liar on the senate floor. that hasn't sat well with your colleagues. do you regret that? >> washington is an amazing place. when somebody stands up and lies to you and someone else points out they lied --

>> he lied to you? you stand by that. >> every word i said was true and accurate. nobody dispute add word i said. the reaction in the senate is "how dare you say that out loud?" they're not upset somebody lied to them. >> i guess there are just a thousand different ways you can say it instead of running around calling people liars. >> it wasn't even just running around. it was going to the floor of the senate. >> he was supposing. the thing is, if everything he did was not posed for political effect or gain maybe people would give him more of a break. there's no doubt when he did in the a shakespearean cadence, as you say, he was doing it in political -- >> "green eggs and ham" in shakespearean is like nothing you've ever seen. >> it ee's all right when you c somebody a liar on the senate floor. >> with iambic pentameter. >> with us now, we're andrea mitchell and in washington, host

of "meet the press" and "mtp daily" chuck todd. mark halperin back on the set along with everybody. sam stein. >> whee! >> very good. very good. so, sam, it's going to be fun. >> i'm not going this show again. >> it better be fun, sam. >> let's not make this a thing. >> what 's this? >> it's like his own at-bat music. >> if only the at-bat music made you feel like a piece of -- >> so chuck todd, you sat down and talked to ted cruz. you talked to ted cruz yesterday. did you break through the facade at all. do you get a sense of whether this guy is feeling it? he's back on the ropes in third place in a lot of these huge states. >> the reason i love the mcconnell clip more than any other with cruz is i feel like it exemplifies. he's on one hand trying to hard to say, hey, rally around me,

i'm more electable than trump, please do it and he's -- you know, on one hand he's trying to sound more open on person hood, he was very careful trying not to say he would push it at the same time not to say he would shut it but he was trying to seem a little more open on this, trying to be open minded to a moderate republican's question and then you see the slam on mcconnell and it's like at the end of the day if he's going to win the nomination, he has to suck up to the establishment. he needs the establishment to bail him out. >> or at least apologize for calling them liars. if i'm mitch mcconnell and people closest to mitch mcconnell and you have donald trump who is out of control but is bringing establishment people around him and he's going to reach out to you and probably do whatever he can to get your support versus ted cruz who still is adamant this late in the game about mitch mcconnell being a liar and being called a liar on the senate floor then

ted cruz is going to lose that inside game. >> and on the senate floor is the key moment. as chuck was just saying, chuck, i got back from brooklyn in the debate at 0-dark-30 and was watching the late replay on msnbc and i couldn't stop watching because you did bring out a different side of ted cruz. he was more personable. he was very precise on abortion and other issues but when you asked him about mitch mcconnell it came rushing back. >> that's right. >> if there hadn't been o o outsider the angry part of the electorate would be rallying around. >> how is the outside game working right now? >> well, the washington, d.c. inside game isn't working well. he's not gotten a single

endorsement since he won wisconsin and became the clear stop trump vehicle. >> so it looks like this might be -- >> well, the biggest request in republican politics right now the are the delegates establishment or grass-roots? are they conservatives or establishmentarians? i think the cruz campaign's profiling of the delegates is he doesn't need mitch mcconnell to win majority on a second or third ballot. he is moderating. he's no longer reason -- running as much on social issues as jobs and security. so he's now the second most likely republican nominee and under some scenarios if he can slow trump down he may be the most likely. >> but trump is doing something different. >> we had two things in our must

read in the new york editorial the post was donboyage before. and making peace with megyn kelly. but then donald trump, another newscorp property, the "wall street journal" does what we've been saying around the table he's needed to do for a long time. not go on table shows and talk and make headlines but do op-eds in papers like the "wall street journal." >> goes back to the aipac speech. give a series of speeches. i had a chance to interview carl paladino in brooklyn yesterday. >> the name. [ laughter ] >> but he said -- >> what's wrong with the name? >> he's just a character. >> he is a character. he was trump before trump. but he's saying trump is listening to advice and you're

seeing changes. he cited the megyn kelly meeting. i've been wrong more than -- as much as everyone. >> i have never been wrong about donald trump. my record is 100% correct. >> we have clips of you going back nine months. >> and we won't repeat them. >> you and nate silver have a special place in our heart. >> as i continue to talk, isn't the biggest thing though that -- >> ladies and gentlemen, sam stein, whee! >> as i was saying, we talk about all these patching up relationships with fox news isn't the biggest thing that the calendar will be better for him? . he's going into new york, it's a good state for him. he's going to win in pennsylvania. this momentum out of wisconsin wasn't accurate. it was about states' demographics and the calendar. >> don't say that.

the day afterwards it was the end for donald trump. the oshkosh collapse of donald trump's campaign. >> i'm sure. >> but we are seeing a shift. mark halperin. >> with all due respect to john kasich and the notion of a white knight, this is a two-person race right now and people are choosing sides. newscorp has chosen up sides today and in the last week with trump for now but i don't think it's a permanent thing. i think they may shift to cruz. some parts of newscorp may shift to hillary clinton maybe but trump is having -- post-wisconsin trump is having a better time despite that loss than ted cruz. >> a couple things have happened. you get hammered in wisconsin but you're up by 20, 25 points in one of the biggest states and you're basically going to your home territory. it's a perfect time to make the shift because you're not fighting for your life. you can bring in paul manafort, you can bring in wiley. you can sit back and shift into

second gear and then get results where you win by 20, 30, 40 points. >> i think the -- i don't know what the stop trump movement thought it was doing when it decided to just rest on its laurels post-wisconsin and didn't contest in new york because if he sweeps the new york delegates, he only needs 50% of what's left. is but on one hand i agree. i think trump has been smart. he's been trying -- you've got to assume the manafort advice he's following. the timing of manafort coming on board and trump ratcheting back media appearances seem to go hand in hand. it's hard to believe it was a coincidence. but the op-ed, yes, it's smarter to write op-eds but is he really going to do this on ned the "wall street journal" complaining about colorado. do an op-ed on policy. do an op-ed on something larger.

it seems the only message of the week from trump is they're trying to screw me. it's political discipline and remember you'll remember this, andrea, chuck, you're such a young man. >> i don't know how to take that. >> but the most remarkable -- one of the most remarkable comebacks -- >> well, joe, you were like 12 in '76. >> one of the most remarkable comebacks was 1988 when michael dukakis was absolutely trashing george h.w. bush after the convention, what was he down 20, 25 points? and they gave him a message for the week. he was the environmental candidate one week, the next week he was the education candidate. the next week he was the candidate of the pledge of allegiance. this week donald trump has been the candidate of reform. the system is rigged and he has used colorado masterfully and he's hammering that home in an

extraordinarily disciplined way. >> it's winning by losing. it's whining about the whole situation. >> you're taking a small loss -- >> winning by whining. >> -- and you're blowing it up to tipify -- >> connect it to how americans feel about everything. >> and preserving the option of stealing the thing back at the convention if things aren't going his way. >> oh, my lord. we have to go to break. >> chuck todd, he's doing a bobby knight here, too. he's working the refs. >> look, he has -- >> i'm going to keep hammering you guys, rnc, good luck, this is just a small taste of what you get if i'm within a hundred delegates, you don't want any part of me. >> look, he has got the easier message to sell and you can see, look at the rnc today, they're out with a memo that is dripping with a tone that says all the candidates got a copy of all the delegate selection processes and every state way back in october. it's important the candidates would have read the rules. it's a lectury tone but it is

the rnc feeling they're under siege and the more they defend themselves from trump the more they look like anti-trump. >> and guess who wins this battle? andrea mitchell, thank you very much. chuck todd, thank you as well. chuck, what do you have for "meet the press" this sunday? >> so far we have an exclusive with the governor of north carolina. his first national tv interview since the controversy hit. >> very interesting. chuck, we'll be watching. coming up, it's been called one of the most underestimated positions in the world. the new book explores the look work of first ladies behind the scenes and in the spotlight. that's just ahead on "morning joe." good.how was your commute? yours? good. xerox real time analytics make transit systems run more smoothly... and morning chitchat... less interesting.

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43 past the hour. joining us now, business and tech correspondent for nbc and msnbc, olivia sterns you're looking at the impact of wall street money on the 2016 race. wall street a big issue in last night's democratic debate as well. >> a big issue, yet wow seems to be losing influence this cycle. the total donations to the candidates and groups affiliated to them tripled since 2012 yet the candidates they funded the most are out of the race, jeb bush, lindsey graham, scott walker. these were the wall street favorites. they're all out of the race, of the candidates left, it's actually hillary clinton which is really surprising because, of course, wall street skews conservative. two-thirds of total donations are to republicans and yet hillary clinton, of the people left, nearly $22 million. look at that, ted cruz $13 million. >> no surprise. they're certainly not going for bernie, trump is a wild card to

them. >> but ted cruz's wife is a goldman sachs employee. >> yeah, there's that. >> and john kasich himself has a history on wall street. >> that's true. >> so why not those two? >> new york values. think about the terrible things he said about the -- the scathing criticism of the big banks and commerce. and let's be honest. a lot of the people in the race right now are talking about what used to be fringe economic policies. nobody was -- you know -- like what? >> bottom line donald trump can't make tim cook manufacture iphones in the u.s. that's not going to happen. so there's legitimate fear throughout that he could spark a trade war or get in a fight with the fed. that's the last thing anybody on wall street wants to happen. $15 minimum wage, it sounds great. but the truth is there's plenty of economics on both sides that it can be good or bad but the bottom line is if you put $15 minimum wage in tomorrow you'll lose jobs. >> sure, but in new york, for instance, they're going to segue it in over time now. >> no one is asking for it

tomorrow, are they? i'm not sure. >> my question is are these wall street donors who traditionally give to republican presidential candidates, they're not just dropping out from giving all together, they're just directing it to congressional candidates now, right? >> i believe so they are, but i was specifically looking at presidential candidates. >> i think they're on the side sideline sidelines. the hedge fund guys are frozen, they don't see any way to go on the republican side. they're begrudgingly saying okay, it's hillary but they're waiting. >> they're begrudgingly going to support hillary because at least she is a known quantity. at least it's with. maybe they don't agree with the regulations. >> uncertainty. >> olivia sterns, thank you very much. still ahead, a look inside the private lives of america's first ladies, next on "morning joe." mary buys a little lamb. one of millions of orders on this company's servers. accessible by thousands of suppliers and employees globally.

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joining us now long time white house correspondent and "new york times" best telling author kate anderson broward, she is here to talk p her new book, "first women" it gives us a revealing look at the lives of true power brokers at 1600 pennsylvania avenue and that would be the first ladies. you even talked to my dad.

>> i did. he was great. >> i'm impressed. >> roslyn carter and he said she knew everything that was going on in the white house, i mean, she went to cabinet meetings. >> right. >> she got into a lot of trouble for it. >> she did. that's really a theme that runs through this entire book of first ladies that you profile all much more powerful than the public would have initially assumed. >> right. behind the scenes they are the power broke ens like roslyn who said she knew she was going to get criticized no matter what she did so she may as well go to these cabinet meetings and she invited the egyptian president to camp david before the accords and actually befriended his wife. nancy reagan of course is famous for getting reagan's chief of staff fired and i think that in nancy's case she wasn't afraid to be criticized and to take a lot of the flak and a lot of these women are grudge holders

for their presidents, after the campaign they bear these deep scars. >> i think there is a lot of empathy among them because they all understand, they are the only people in the world who understand what this role is like as mothers and wives. we expect so much from them, you know, someone wrote a note to betty ford saying you're constitutionally required to be perfect and obviously none of them are. so i got these great letters that show their relationships over time. lady bird writing to jackie, betty ford and lady bird, it crosses party lines which i think today is kind of cool. >> it seems to be these conventional two tracks you can take as a first lady, one certificate moan y'all, you do the things that come with the white house and the other is to be more of a policy lightning rod like hillary clinton was with healthcare reform. were there gray areas you witnessed? >> someone like betty ford so out spoken but got into some trouble with it and hillary clinton regretted having a west

wing office. i think we don't like the first lady to be too out there watching house of cards when clair is a gun control advocate, i don't think that's something we would ever accept from a first lady and i think that's -- >> why is that? just cultural? >> yeah, i think it's totally cultural. people were really upset when hillary clinton had her west wing office. even if michelle obama wanted to do something about gun control, for instance, it's just too charged. >> don't you have to respect about them every president i can think about they have all had great kids, we know how hard it is just to be a mother, period, but how somehow just about every one of them obviously was a great mom at the same time. >> yeah, and it was interesting because hillary clinton reached out to jackie kennedy and asked for advice about being a mother in the white house, how did she do it with john john and caroline and jackie said don't let the resident staff spoil your kids. >> so what happens when bill clinton is the first spouse? are you going to have to do a new book? >> that would be fun. first gentleman. i mean, this he say that he will be sent abroad as a diplomatic

envoy somewhere and she will hire a really good social secretary. >> so you actually say that michelle obama is closer to laura bush than hillary clinton as a first lady. what do you mean by that? >> they are a lot more alike personalitiesiwise and that's interesting. >> in what ways? >> neither one is particularly political. michelle obama doesn't like campaigning, she doesn't like the phoniness of washington and someone like hillary clinton kind of obviously has embraced that. she is so different from obviously all the other first ladies, the only one to run for office. >> michelle obama was over it before it even began. >> absolutely. >> shy did not want to change for washington. >> she's cool. >> she definitely didn't want to lose her identity. >> yeah. >> and get sort of swept into it all. >> and you did get a sense from both laura bush and from michelle obama if their husbands had decided to do something else they would have been perfectly fine with that. >> yeah, absolutely. absolutely. >> probably better with that. >> yeah.

yeah. i mean, laura bush was great, she defended michelle obama when she came out in 2008 and said that, you know, for the first time i'm proud of my country and laura bush came out in an interview and said i'm sure that's not what she meant, we all know how hard it is on the campaign trail. so there is this sense of camaraderie that the two have with each other, they are not politicians. >> the book is first women. kate anderson broward thank you so much. up next, hillary clinton flips the script and uses her opponent taxes to defect attention from her wall street transcripts. we will break down the hits and misses from last night's brooklyn debate. plus trump's campaign manager cleared, we will tell you why florida officials decided not to move forward with the battery charge against him. "morning joe" is back in a moment. you may be muddling through allergies. try zyrtec® for powerful allergy relief. and zyrtec® is different than claritin®. because it starts working faster on the first day you take it. try zyrtec®. muddle no more®. what if 30,000 people

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it is true that now that the spotlight is pretty bright here in new york some things have been said. >> can you name one decision that she made as senator that shows that she favored banks because of the money she received? >> he cannot -- he cannot come up with any example because there is no example. i stood up against the behaviors of the banks when i was a senator. i called them out on their mortgage behavior. >> secretary clinton called them out. oh, my goodness. they must have been really crushed by this. and was that before or after you received huge sums of money by giving speaking engagements. >> wait a minute. wait a minute.

>> that is not accurate. well -- can i -- >> i have stood on the debate stage with senator sanders eight prior times. >> excuse me. >> senator, please. >> -- or los angeles or seattle let's do it. >> excuse me. i think i'm responding now. >> i love being in brooklyn. this is great. >> good morning. it's friday, april 15th. it's 8:00 a.m. on the east coast, 5:00 a.m. out west. with us on set legendary columnist and msnbc contributor mike barnicle, senior political editor and white house correspondent for the huffington sam stein. managing editor of bloomberg politics and cost of with all due respect mark halperin and donny is with us as well. >> with no credentials. >> yeah, no. >> literally nothing. >> i'm telling you this was -- this debate was -- did you guys all watch it? >> absolutely.

it was like watching a chapter of the bicasons, the mutual contempt that they have with each other at this stage was off the charts. >> i agree it was bernie's last stand and he had to go tough and he did, but he made some really good -- i mean, it's going to be very difficult for her to navigate trying to keep his supporters if she continues on the winning streak that she appears to be on, i don't know what his path is, but, boy, he pounded some serious issues last night. >> it was back and forth. i don't think there's one person if you were a hillary supporter -- >> you loved what you heard. i agree. >> -- a bernie supporter there was not one vote that changed last night. >> i kind of thought he would be weaker on foreign policy and weaker on some issues and there would be more of a difference between them. they both were tough. just days ahead of the new york primary hillary clinton and bernie sanders faced off in a fiery debate in brooklyn miles away from the center of the financial universe. the issue of wall street took center stage.

senator sanders was asked to name one decision secretary clinton made as senator that showed she favored the banks because of money she received from them and clinton was asked why she won't just release the transcripts of those paid speeches and put the issue to rest. >> there are certain -- there are certain expectations when you run for president. this is a new one and i've said if everybody agrees to do it because there are speeches for money on the other side. i know that. but i will tell you this, there is -- there is a long standing expectation that everybody running release their tax returns and you can go -- you can go to my website and see eight years of tax returns and i've released 30 years of tax returns. and i think every candidate, including senator sanders and donald trump should do the same. >> you're running now for the democratic nomination. >> right. >> and it is your democratic opponent and many democratic voters who want to see those

transcripts, it's not about the republica republicans. >> you nknow, let's set the sam standard for everybody, when everybody does it, okay, i will do it, but let's set and expect the same standards on tax returns, everybody does it and then we move forward. >> so she'll do it when ted cruz releases his speeches, that was her -- >> that is just not -- you guys, come on. does anyone want to -- >> i'm going to say it again, this speech thing is so irrelevant. people give speeches, when you are in an audience you kind of somehow engage that audience and say, hey, i love wall street. that's just grown-up stuff. >> you do that? that's what you do? >> if you gave a speech, okay, right now if you gave a speech on women's rights and all that stuff, if you gave a speech to a group of 500 men -- you are a

bad example, you would be screaming at them, but you would say, hey, guys, i'm so happy to be with you. this speech -- it's so -- it's such a non-issue. >> that's actually not true. i actually was brought to talk about my book know your value to bunch of ceos and i talked about how much i liked elizabeth warren and i got booed. you are not going to find a different me in that room. >> not a different me it's just you frame a speech, it's grown-up stuff. >> no, actually, she knew she was going to run for president and felt the need to make the money or what, but let us see the speeches. let us see the speeches. >> let's go to ringside, these two guys were at ringside last night. mark halperin, your take? >> on the question of the speech transcripts? >> no, the whole mess. >> on the question of the speech transcripts, minimum wage, social security, she gave answers last night that bernie sanders if he were a skilled debater could have taken advantage of.

he has proven to be a great candidate -- >> feisty candidate. >> raising money, giving a speech that fires up a crowd, appealing and energizing young people, he has not proven to be a good debater. any skilled gator would have taken advantage of many openings she last last night. >> for instance? >> for instance, her answer on social security was waffling, her answer on whether she supported $15 minimum wage was baffling, didn't thin her down. >> she asked him specifically to name one instance where she had been compromised by contributions and he notably failed to do it, but we've actually played a videotape of one of the instances on this show, it involves elizabeth warren talking about a bankruptcy bill that hillary clinton did flip on, a skilled politician to mark's point would have had that in the back of his memory and put it out there in the moment but for some machine he wifd on that. i think bernie did have the better debate last night, i just

don't think it was the type of debate that moved the dial in a way to overcome that. >> the audience was with him and she kept at it, she herself together and moving forward and strong, but he was -- >> let's step back for a second because the truth is if you look at the totality of this campaign no one ever would have imagined bernie would be at this point when he launched this race a year ago. this is a remarkable achievement. he will compete in new york, his advisors tell me he is going to go well through may. >> he is not going away. >> he is not going away. i want to show some of the moments. i hear what you're saying, but it was -- i mean, i watched to the very end. i couldn't stop. i thought it was -- >> it was pretty riveting. >> it was pretty riveting and, you know, unlike what we've seen on the republican side you just knew you were going to learn a lot about who these two people are and are they stand on certain issues and maybe you might even mold your opinion on why it's important. so do we have more? there's i think an argument about judgment versus qualifications.

let's take a look at that. >> does secretary clinton have the experience and intelligence to be a president, of course she does, but i do question -- but i do question her judgment. i question a judgment which voted for the war in iraq, the worst foreign policy blunder in the history of this country, voted for virtually every disastrous trade agreement which cost us millions of decent-paying jobs and i question her judgment about wanting super pacs which are collecting tens of millions of dollars from special interests including $15 million from wall street. i don't believe that that is the kind of judgment we need to be the kind of president we need. >> now that the spotlight is pretty bright here in new york some things have been said and

senator sanders did call me unqualified. i've been called a lot of things in my life, that was a first. and then he did say that he had to question my judgment. well, the people of new york voted for me twice to be their senator from new york and -- and president ama trusted my judgment enough to ask me to be secretary of state for the united states. >> i actually think a theme of it was hillary several times did the pragmatic thing, very good, mr. sanders, at talking about the problems, but we need grown-up solutions. once again every time it was let's let a half a million prisoners out and we will educate them, we will have the banks pay for colleges, it's these pie in the sky non-answers. >> i thought his answer on education and how other countries somehow figure this out and how we here in the united states have kids across this country strapped with debt

just trying to get an education. >> yes, he's highlighting the problem. >> she will continue it. >> he's not giving one intelligible pragmatic solution. >> is that true, mark halperin? >> name a policy he has proposed that's much different than hers that's concrete and specific that you are confident he would enact as president? he has been a fantastic candidate for what he believes in in defining the problems and inspiring people to say we need change, but when the daily news editorial board was mentioned several times last night for a reason which is she can say it was perfect for her, kicked off the new york campaign and it said in effect i care a lot about change, but i haven't thought through specifics about how to make change. even on my signature issues. >> well, i'm not sure that's completely fair. >> he has been a great candidate. >> there is a little bit more nuance to that daily news interview. the stuff on dodd-frank, for instance, there are provisions in it that you can break up the big banks, you have to tell them

how to get certain sizes. his position is essentially let them decide, which is not totally divorced from the reality of the legislation. but i thought the bigger picture shear is how much the democratic party has moved in the past 10, 20 years. 94 crime bills completely abandoned. >> what about the last eight months how far he has pushed her to the left. >> two years ago we were talk being a minimum wage legislation $10.10. right now we're debating whether to go to $12 or $15 and there has been no movement at all but we are still going to that point. he has definitely affected the party, definitely affected the tone and for better or worse, depending on your perception, he's going to affect the next presidency. >> i think he has found a way, which i think is fascinating and important and the impact still remains to be seen but there will be one is how he has been able to on a number of issues intellectually connect with the voters. he is connecting. >> emotionally. that's my whole point. it's pure -- that's exactly my point and what mark was saying.

>> i don't think that he has -- >> intellectually -- intellectual argument would be, okay, here is how we're going to pay for college for everyone, here is how we are going to educate half a million prisoners not just we have a problem and we're going to do it. if he's going to increase the deficit by $15 trillion if you go on the math he's doing. he has an emotional -- >> name one candidate on both sides who really talks about a certain issue, whether it's the problems or the solutions where people go wild when they hear about that issue. they're not going wild -- >> emotions. it's emotion. they go wild, but it's a right brain -- >> -- and married to a president for years and is internationally known. it is literally the issues -- >> here is why i think it's partly intellectually -- >> more than partly. >> his critique of what's wrong with american he appeals to tens of millions of americans. >> the intellectual argument would have a solution to it. >> let's show the back and forth on social security because it

led sanders once again labeling hillary clinton as part of the establishment. take a look. >> maybe i'm a little bit confused. are you or are you not supporting legislation to lift the cap on taxable income and extend social security for 58 years and increase benefits? yes or no? >> i have said yes we are going to pick the best way or combination -- or combination of ways. you know, it's -- it's always a little bit challenging because, you know, if senator sanders doesn't agree with how you are approaching something then you are a member of the establishment. >> yes, secretary clinton, you are a member of the establishment. >> go ahead, mike. >> let me ask the two of you, constant followers of this campaign, a question that i think a lot of people are interested in. on a scale of one to ten the

loath some scale, ten being bunsen burner hot, how much do these two candidates and their campaigns despise one another at this point? >> i think it's a little overstated when it comes to the candidates. sanders supporters don't like her very much. her supporters i don't think loath him all that much and i don't think they -- i think they will -- they will forgive each other pretty quickly, but i'm not sure how much she will be willing to give up to get him to come her way. i think there's a stubbornness there, but i really don't think compared to some of the previous campaigns i've covered -- >> i was going to say that. if you remember the obama/clinton loathing, that was far more intense than this. i do get an increasing sense that the clinton officials, the people in the campaign, find this to be going on a bit too long. they would like to maybe make that pivot and start focusing on the general election. >> he keeps winning.

>> what is going on? >> he's not just a guy hanging around. >> they looked at eight years ago where obama effectively used a math argument, said this thing is done, you're never going to catch up with me, i have the pledged delegate lead, let's get on with it and the presby and large kind of bought it and she is in an arguably better position in terms of pledged delegates and this contest still going on, she's wondering why she is not being supported -- >> she's qualified, she's got it all, she can do this job everyone knows that and the question is do you want to go with that and go with what you know you're going to get, which is probably not a lot of change but not a lot of massive screw ups, or do you want to go with someone who believes in what you believe the problems are and take a chance on that person? still ahead on "morning joe," charges dropped against donald trump's campaign manager, plus with time running out before voting begins will trump walk away with the primary in his home state? our nbc correspondent covering the trump and cruz campaigns,

katy tur and hallie jackson are here in studio. but first bill karins with a check on the forecast. >> the weekend is going to be, well, sort of those rules, whatever you get on friday is a good chance you will have right through the weekend. we are in a blocky slow moving weather pattern. if you have great weather today in st. louis, chicago, minneapolis to the northeast it will stay that way all weekend long. the problem spot today severe weather is going to push out into the rural sections of northern texas, amarillo, garden city and eastern colorado, isolated tornadoes. things really get interesting on saturday. colorado is famous for these april snowstorms, april is where their snow is months of the year. they will be 37 degrees for a high in denver, after being in the 70s all this week and will have a major snowstorm in colorado. look at the warmth, 75 chicago, spring fever here, ohio valley, great lakes, northeast, mid-atlantic you are gorgeous, florida will be dealing with afternoon thunderstorms, very warm in areas of southern california and a windy day in southern california. let's talk about the snow that's

going to fall in areas of colorado. the highest snowfall totals will be found in the mountains outside denver, the ski resorts there, everybody outside of the foothills could see upwards of 2 to maybe 3 even as much as 4 feet of snow. denver itself we're calling for you to get right around 12, anywhere -- maybe 12 to 14 at most, if you are a little higher, once you roll out into the valley areas it will be a little less than that. this forecast continues to be very nice for many areas on the east coast right through sunday. we will have pictures to show you on monday of a snowy colorado. new york city enjoy spring fever, allergy sufferers are suffering. 75 this sunday and beautiful. no complaints. ♪jake reese, "day to feel alive"♪

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republicans favorite candidate for the nomination although they are now less confident he will get it. a new fox news national poll of republican voters finds trump at 45% up four points since last month while ted cruz has fallen 11 points to 27%, barely ahead of kasich at 25. a cbs news poll shows trump 13 points ahead of cruz 42 to 29 and kasich far back at 18. if the republican field were winnowed down to two trump would still lead 48 to 38 over cruz, yet republicans are now less confident in trump winning the nomination. down 17 points from last month to 60% cruz meanwhile is up 12. a florida prosecutor's office has decided not to pursue a case against donald trump's campaign manager cory lewandowski. the prosecutors say while lewandowski grabbed reporter michelle fields the evidence was not strong enough to support a criminal prosecution.

they also say that she entered a protective bubble near the candidate. >> the press was directed toward the pack, there is this bubble, and she makes her way beyond the press area and gets right next to mr. trump and actually makes slight contact with mr. trump and you can see that he sort of recoils. >> it's this hand, her left hand that we were able to capture that touches him. when she touches him you see him recoil his right hand like this away and based on the position where mr. lewandowski was standing his vantage point would have been such that he could see that. so in his mind it's reasonable to believe that he just -- he had just witnessed, observed, a touching or her trying to grab on mr. trump in some respect and he then reaches in and he pulls her away. from an area in which she was not supposed to be in to begin with. >> the bullet entered where? >> back and to the left.

back and to the left. that's back and to the left. >> zapruder film. >> the trump campaign released a statement saying the matter is now conclude. in an interview last night lewandowski said he regrets the distraction but used the occasion to contrast trump's handling of it to others. >> first let me say how much i am thankful to mr. trump and his loyalty in this very, very difficult time. many other candidates, all of the other candidates in the race asked me to be fired and said i should have my chance and my da i in court and what we saw today was that they looked at the evidence and decided there was no way they could prosecute the case and move forward. first and foremost i want to thank mr. trump. >> you have to give trump props for that. >> for the first time we have heard nothing from the reporter who has made these accusations, just nothing at all. she tweeted a lot about it, she was very upset when it happened, you could hear the audiotape, she was saying, oh, my god, oh, my god. >> one of the things i said about trump all along in addition to his family is his

employees are very loyal to him. that's one of the reasons. the kind of boss he was. >> i think the fact that we are talking about this story at this point in time is complete political malpractice by cory lewandowski. this thing, this whole incident could have been resolved in literally two seconds with him saying, i'm sorry. instead what he did, again, was to go out there, manufacture a fake story about he never saw her, never touched her, which was disproven by the film, i never said when we talked about this last time that it looked like a horrific attack or anything but he clearly lied about it. >> are you sure that she told the truth? >> i don't think she necessarily told the truth, either. >> sam. >> he is a private citizen. what i want to know is why did the people who arrested him -- this wasn't hot pursuit, this was a couple weeks later. why did they feel the need to not consult to arrest him without consulting the people who eventually decided he didn't need to be prosecuted. it is unfair, whatever the

facts, sam is right, perhaps he should have apologized, could have ended it, but it's unfair to him to make him go through the weeks that he had to go through when all they had to do was consult with the prosecutors and say here is what we found, would you prosecute this case? there was no rush to arrest there. unfair to him. >> no doubt that that's a legitimate point. there is no doubt that had he -- had cory apologized immediately it would have disappeared that evening. >> yeah. >> there is also no doubt that if john weaver, john kasich's campaign manager had done a similar thing we wouldn't even know about it. it's trump that fed this. it's the trump campaign, the whole -- >> again, it was fed by the fact that he lied. he said he didn't know her and never touched her and there was a video of it. >> you all are talking about very important parts of this, but you're failing or afraid to talk about where it all began. >> with the woman who brought it

up. >> i mean, listen, she obviously overexaggerated the extend to which she was pulled down, but she also felt like she had been assaulted. >> and that she was almost thrown to the ground and -- >> and then she had someone who did -- i mean, the videotape does show him grabbing her. he had that person actually tell her that she was crazy and he never met her and never touched her. that's a fact. the truth is he had met her, he had touched her. >> why are you all afraid to talk about both sides of this? >> i just said that she -- >> to your point let's say that was a man instead of that female reporter and that man brought up those claims and suits, he would have been harassed and harangued and called all kinds of names. i guess to your point -- >> she has been. >> can you imagine a man? i still think the big story is -- >> i think she was harassed more than a man would be. >> do you think so? if a man claimed that he was -- >> come on, man, there is a total different dynamic when there is a woman being grabbed by a man than a man being grabbed by a man. >> a lot worse than happened to

me in a press scrum. a lot worse. >> a lot worse happened to me last night in brooklyn. >> thank you. >> people don't like you, that's why continued. >> i'm not going to say it, but i'm surprised even now when you see florida state officials literally spelling out what happened, totally debunking the story -- >> mika, there is a difference between a crime -- >> and saying there was no crime. >> and inappropriate behavior. >> it was a w for trump, he stood by his man. >> we spent three weeks talking about this. >> at the end of the day it is true a lot of other candidates would have fired him and donald got up there and said, look, he is a good man, this is ridiculous and i stand by him. >> he also called the prosecutors to talk to them about the case which i'm not sure was the best idea, but typical donald trump. helped him get off. >> i don't like what happened. >> i hear you. we will have to agree to disagree. >> such extents of coverage, shame on us. >> i don't like what happened. coming up -- >> with you like or not like what happened? >> i'm just going to be very

careful. but i think we -- i think women have a responsibility to make sure that we -- >> leave it. >> i can't comment. >> -- that we -- yeah, that we bring to the table valuable credibility and that we don't -- i think something really -- something that is sort of hard to talk about happened here and i'm not going to push it forward and lead to any more problems, but this was a joke from the beginning. it was. coming up on "morning joe," what is driving the day on wall street. cnbc's sara eisen has business before the bell. plus, six-time grammy winner carol king is here on set. why she's lending her voice to hillary clinton's campaign. plus msnbc contributor mike lube at that joins the conversation.

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you say what are new york values? number one, honesty and straight talking. it's a work ethic. hard working people. it's about family. new york, believe it, is about family. so important. it's the energy to get things done. big energy. if jeb bush came here, i'm telling you, he would have much

more energy than he has right now. i'm telling you. >> wow. >> what's going on? >> i don't know what's -- >> what? >> whatever. i just -- you usually keep lunch on the outside of your flees. >> i don't know what that was. >> that was donald trump talking about new york values. with us on set nbc news's katy tur, hallie jackson has been following ted cruz. it's exciting. >> this is like you are the dream team, trump/cruz. >> how exciting. >> i want each of you to tell us what you think is really going on here because who has the edge right now? is it ted cruz? organization alley? >> organization alley i doings. he started organizing early on and is coming into the delegate strategy game drilling down incredibly hard. they are going after his delegates, have had a plan since june, trump obviously reentsly has gotten in on this. if you look at the successes so

far it feels like cruz right now. >> i think the trump team is nervous about it because they are coming off an editorial in the "wall street journal" today saying that ted cruz is trying to disenfranchise voters, but when it comes to message i think trump does have an advantage right now. what he's doing is by decrying the rules and saying it's not fair for an outsider or for somebody that's coming in that's not part of the washington establishment, he's able to speak to a lot of voters who themselves feel disenfranchised or left behind by washington. >> "wall street journal," trump's piece today, we could debate it whether or not that was -- >> bernie sanders. >> we debated whether or not it was bernie sanders, we also debated whether it was kind of a pivot beginning. >> i don't think it was written by donald trump. it doesn't read like it was written by trump, there was no exclamation points, there were no superlatives. >> so you're saying it is a pivot? >> i'm saying it's definitely a pivot.

i've been talking to sources close to the campaign and sources close to donald trump who have been saying for days that they need to change the message when it comes to the rnc. they can't go after the rnc as hard as they're doing, it's not effective or beneficial for them if they get the nomination, especially when it comes to delegates. >> you've been there, though, just covering this campaign through all the madness, through the violence at the rallies and through the late night angry trump -- tweets and the tweets on heidi cruz and the cory lewandowski blowups. it's been like a week, week and a half, he hasn't been on the sunday shows, you don't hear the stories about the rallies anymore, he is not holding press conferences where he has steaks and water. he's putting out statements, he's doing op-eds. >> he's becoming more of a traditional politician and that is precisely because he has brought on paul manafort and rick wiley who are trying to change the campaign, who are

trying to tighten it up and build it so it's potentially general election ready. it's done well with cory lewandowski leading it and allowing donald trump to be donald trump and they have to get through the convention. it's looking increasingly likely like he's not going to get 1,237, if he doesn't get 1,237 he needs to make sure he's going to win on that second ballot and to do that you have to convince delegates and delegates -- >> i want to ask you guys about the cory lewandowski development in just a moment but first hallie you have some sound. >> we talk about the idea of what you do to nail down these delegates and the idea that trump maybe has the advantage when it comes to messaging and the advantage when it comes to being that candidate who is railing against the system. cruz is in a more difficult position in that he has to talk about process and rules. this is how he did it with chuck todd at that town hall. here is the message he's trying to put out. listen. >> who is picking this republican nominee, the delegates or the voters? >> both. look, it's a democratic process, it's about been in place have

from the very beginning. if we go to a contested convention it will be the delegates elected by the people who make the final decision but they have been elected by the voters in the first place and this is a battle to earn the support of the american voters across the country. >> the challenge for cruz is that he's got to lead the stop trump movement. i spoke with an operative who said which are doing what we can to give these delegates enough cover to get out and resist some of the moves that donald trump is making and some tactics that they're doing to nail these delegates down but the cruz campaign has to take the lead here. it remains to be seen whether they will embrace it and run with it. they are now but you have to start to see the rest of the never trumpers coalesce around cruz. >> how far ahead do the cruz people people they are from the trump organization in terms of grabbing delegates. >> publicly they will say we're doing what we can, privately they feel very confident about where they are because they are not places where they are not seeing donald trump or his people or john kasich or his people for that matter but this is a reflection of where they

were last year in iowa and new hampshire before you saw the other organizations come into play. >> they are miles ahead of the trump organization when it comes to that. >> katie florida prosecutor's office has decided not to pursue a case against cory lewandowski. the prosecutors say while lewandowski grabbed reporter michelle fields the evidence was not strong enough to support a criminal prosecution. they also say she entered a protective bubble near the candidate. take a listen. >> the press was directed toward the back, there is this bubble and she makes her way beyond the press area and gets right next to mr. trump and actually makes slight contact with mr. trump. you can see that he sort of recoils. >> it's this hand, her left hand, that we were able to capture that touches him. when she touches him you see him recoil his right arm like this away and based on the position where mr. lewandowski was standing his vantage point would have been such that he could see that. so in his mind it's reasonable

to believe that he just -- he had just witnessed, observed, a touching or her trying to grab on mr. trump in some respects and he then reaches in and he pulls her away from an area in which she was not supposed to be in to begin with. >> all right. i remember one morning where we wasted a lot of time talking about this. we don't do this now. katie, are you surprised by that? >> yes and no. >> really? >> yes and no. >> well, i think that -- when you talk about a protective bubble around the candidate, and this is a guy that i've been following for ten months, all of us go into what could be considered that protective bubble, you go in and ask him questions. this was not a rally, this was not a public event, this was a private event at his -- at his own golf club, everybody was vetted, they were all given credentials, it wasn't a ton of people and there are reporters that were next to michelle fields at the time, reporters across from michelle fields, i was across the way reaching in,

someone was in front of me so i couldn't physically moved from donald trump. >> are you ever moved away or pushed away. >> we are always pushed away. the secret service their job is to push us away. >> i have definitely been pushed away, i've been shoved by reporters, too. >> i've been shoved, too. >> i have never -- i have never had -- i have had the secret service do this, i have had the security do this. i have never had a member of campaign staff anywhere in my career grab me or pull me or touch me ever. so i think that's different and that's unusual. i have had their security do it, i've had the secret service do it but not the campaign staff. >> i am not surprised it was dropped. this seemed a little bit too much adieu about nothing. >> ted cruz, strange reception last night. what happened? >> so he gets up to give this speech and it was flat. i mean, people were not paying attention, they were talking. >> was he not doing shakespeare? >> he was doing his normal speech and he was giving his normal applause lines, his laugh lines but you weren't seeing it.

it was not his crowd. >> correct. >> it was a trumpville crowd. >> half of the room was very much in trump's corner, there was construction friends, they were screaming, they were wild for him, the other half of the room was chuckling along and into his speech, but trump had home court advantage, he talked about his greatest hits and wolman rink. >> the grand height where we were in last night, he built that hotel and talked about how he got the address changed from lexington to park avenue. supporters will say, listen, it was late, everyone had six glasses of wine, that's their spin. >> it was not a ted cruz crowd. ted cruz just doesn't play in new york and the whole new york values thing, he probably didn't think it would get this far to, you know, haunt him and now it's completely haunting him. >> katy tur, hallie jackson, thank you very much. >> thank you guys. >> thanks for having us. >> maybe if you work hard enough you will get one of these.

you guys aren't there yet. >> i want a -- >> we'll talk about -- still ahead, bernie sanders was challenged on whether his wall street stance makes his bad for business. sara eisen is going to be with us next from the new york stock exchange on "morning joe." we also have carole king here and mike lupica. some say "free the whales." for them, nothing else is acceptable. but nothing could be worse for the whales. most of the orcas at seaworld were born here. sending them into the wild wouldn't be noble. it could be fatal. when they freed keiko, the killer whale of movie fame, the effort was a failure and he perished. but we also understand that times have changed. today, people are concerned about the world's largest animals like never before. so we too must change.

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now an msnbc contributor michael lupica. >> carole king, it is great to have you back here. tell us. >> so i'm here to see you. >> of course you are. of course you are. >> i'm in new york to campaign for -- for hillary clinton and it's great to be here because i feel, you know, connected to the people here. i was canvassing yesterday. >> how exciting. >> it was fun. >> where were you canvassing? >> in brooklyn. >> oh, really? >> in brooklyn and i knock on a door and i said -- the buzzer who is it, i said it's carole king, i'm the carole king who you probably know of -- >> do they make you sing to prove it? no. but it was so much fun to canvas and of the people i canvassed quite a few were for hillary already, but it was interesting to talk to people who weren't sure and make the case, you

know, to them on why. most of the people that i talked to -- >> you got them over? >> i got them over. >> of course you did. >> they were there, they just didn't know they were there. all i did was help them realize that they were already there. >> did you support hillary in '08 as well? >> i did before barack obama won the nomination, but i never said a bad word about barack obama because i liked him, too. >> right. >> i just know hillary, i have sat across the table from her just, you know, heard her in conversation. you know. >> yeah. >> she is so present and so knowledgeable and that -- one of the things that i find is i'm actually inspired by her and, you know, you see all this flash and people saying that other candidates are inspiring them, but the thing about her is she does the work. you've said it. she does the work. puts her head down, when she got to congress, put one foot in front of the other, saw what needed to be done, worked across the aisle. >> nothing flashy about it, in fact, just the opposite, kept

her head down and did exactly the opposite of what everybody expected. >> if you didn't say anything about bad about obama eight years ago you were clearly out of step with modern american politics. >> as soon as it was known that barack obama was the nominee i made the call and i said how can i help the campaign? i worked to help get him elected and i think he is a fantastic president, especially -- >> so does joe. >> it's interesting, carol -- >> carol and i are friends so we're going to let that lie and be quiet. >> i think there's definitely some sort of gap with bernie sanders and young people, even young women and hillary clinton and young women. my assistant who is obsessed with hillary clinton, just pounds me every day with great hillary clinton stuff, but she did something interesting and i urge young women to do the same thing because back in the early '90s when she was first lady and she was campaigning or whatever she was saying things that were so like, oh, my god, should she be doing that as the first --

listen to her now. it is like she was ahead of her time and she's speaking our language no matter what age you are. >> way ahead of her time. >> absolutely. and she's still doing what she was doing then, speaking out for women and children and families. >> do you see a difference in women over a certain age who automatically say i'm voting for hillary versus younger women who almost take it for granted. of course we are going to have a woman president. >> there is that. there is that. no. definitely. but the other thing i want to say, and this does need to be said, it's not a battle of women against women, it's a battle of women against some men, but there are men who love and respect women and i want to acknowledge them. >> thank you. mike lupica and i appreciate that despite the fact you are in the presence of donny deutsch. mike, how interesting it is that

we have on the republican side you have somebody that's running an insurgent campaign or just a radical departure from business as usual, the same thing with bernie sanders on the democratic side, but we may end up having somebody actually elected president of the united states that actually is the center of the establishment for the past 25, 30 years. >> that's where people may turn at the end. >> joe, i remember writing a column last summer about how sanders and trump were winning the silly season. they were louder, they were more outrageous and it was resonating with a certain group of voters. now here we are, it's april of 2016 and they're still hear. what impressed me about hillary clinton last night is she stands in there pretty good against this guy and she called him out on something that she had to call him out on which is the gun thing, because bernie comes to new york and when he wants our vote here he's a brooklyn guy, okay, but when he wants to

defend gun manufacturers he is just a guy from a little rural state like vermont. you cannot have it both ways. >> all right. carol, threw fank you for comin back. you need to come back to the east coast. >> all right. >> are you going to go to the inauguration if hillary wins. >> if i'm interested, of course. >> i'm sure you will be asked. >> happy canvassing. ♪ ♪

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it's time now for business before the bell with cnbc's sara eisen. sara, what are investors looking at? i almost said what are investigators looking at today. i hope there aren't a lot of investigators on wall street this morning. what are investors looking at today? >> investigators are investigating the bank earnings this week and they have been better than expected and that has helped lead the charge higher for stocks. stocks are at the highs of 2016, the dow is about to open at the highest level since last july. we will see if the earnings beats can continue into next week, we will get a bunch of names in technology and consumer. the other thing we are all talking about here is the anti-business rhetoric continuing on the campaign trail, especially from senator bernie sanders at the democratic debate last night going after not just wall street but general electric and verizon. listen. >> the word contempt is not right. there are some great businesses who treat their workers and

environment are respect. verizon happens not to be one of them. and what we need to do is to tell this guy immelt who is the head of general electric, doesn't like me, well, that is fine, he has outsourced hundreds of thousands of decent paying jobs. by the way, turns out that both verizon and general electric in a given year paid nothing in federal income tax despite making billions in profits. >> wow. >> and this after both ceos, verizon and ge came out defending their company saying that is simply not true, we've paid billions in taxes, we employ hundreds of thousands of workers, they are not taking it sitting down, they're defending the companies and their employees as this business bark continues, guys. >> sara eisen, thanks so much. i'm going to say on the ge part he is just wrong. >> yeah. >> he is clueless. by the way, he should go visit the ge plant up in vermont.

>> irresponsible. it's irresponsible to go ahead and say is something like that. a guy like jeff immelt is a class act. this is capitalism. >> by the way, jeff immelt was the first person years ago to start talking about how outsourcing was short sided and we need to bring jobs back. do we have the e-mails drks did you find any e-mails for donny deutsch? >> yeah, there's a couple here. somebody says the completely nonlegendary donny deutsch. >> that's a reference to barnicle there. >> there's another one saying keeping the 60-something men young. >> i have one. i have one. >> ew. >> put it down. >> wait. wait. wait. >> take that down. take it down. >> this one says mika brzezinski secretly loves this. this is just the people speaking. the people speak. >> joe, before we go what's your fleece going to eat this

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