>> if it's thursday, we now know exactly how much hillary clinton and donald trump need to improve before the first big debate. about last night, why hillary clinton needs to work on style. >> i communicated about classified material on a holy separate system. >> and donald trump needs to work on substance. >> no. but when i do come up with a plan that i like and perhaps agrees with mine or maybe doesn't. >> plus, gary johnson, don't know much about geography? >> and what is aleppo? >> you're kidding? >> and gary johnson may have ruined his hopes of playing a role in the presidential race. and a slew of battle ground state polls on "meet the press." this is "mtp daily" and it starts right now.

good evening. i'm chuck todd here in washington. welcome to "mtp daily." 18 days until the first presidential debate. we now know both candidates have a lot to prepare. to put it simply trump has a substance issue and clinton has a style issue. either way, neither candidate pairs to be ready for the bright lights of a presidential debate that's just over two weeks away. in 24 minutes trump made at least nine controversial statements last night and here is perhaps the biggest one. he praised putin as far better leader than the sitting president of the united states. >> i've already said, he is really very much of a leader. you can say oh, isn't that a terrible thing. the man has very strong control over a country. it is a very different system and i don't happen it like the system but in that system he has been leader far more than our

president has been later. >> he struggled with the plan to defeat isis and he hammered our current military leaders. >> is the plan you've been hiding this whole time asking someone else for their plan? >> no. i have a plan. but i want to be -- i don't want to -- look, i'm not going to call you up and say, matt, we have a great plan. the generals have been reduced to rubble. been reduced to a point where it's embarrassing for our country. >> but you're going to convene a panel of generals and you've said you know more about isis than those generals. >> they would probably be different generals to be honest with you. >> clinton though, she had her struggles as well. she was lawyerly, on the defensive again, about her iraq war vote, promising no ground troops ever again in iraq or syria. and of course struggled whenned pressed about her controversial use of her e-mail material. >> none of the e-mails september or received by me had such a

header. i communicated about class find that material on a holy separate system. i took it very seriously. when i traveled, i went into one of those little tents that i'm sure you've seen around the world. i did exactly what i should have done and i take it very seriously. always have. always will. >> and perhaps most telling of all clinton calling a press conference, first in more than 270 days. almost immediately after the forum first thing this morning. we got 16 minutes of rapid fire attacks on trump that perhaps she left on the cutting room floor. >> he is temperamentally unfit, unqualified. unpatriotic. insilting. scary, dangerous. happy talk. totally inappropriate. undisciplineed. every republican holding or seeking office in this country should be asked if they agree

with donald trump about these statements. >> folks, that's a campaign that on one hand is worried that they didn't come out on top last night. but more importantly, they want the focus all on trump this afternoon. i'm joined now by republican congressman chris collins of new york. first member of the house to endorse donald trump. essentially he did it before other republicans got on board. congressman, good to see you sir. >> good to be with you. >> let me start with the putin statement. are you comfortable with the idea that your nominee, the person you are supporting, you could argue he is running a dictatorship of sorts. a loosely democratic elected dictatorship that that somehow makes him a stronger leader than the president of the united states. >> one thing we need to agree on is isis is attacking civilization as we know it. when we hear donald trump say he will reach out to political enemies like russia and to

leaders like putin, in a combined way to take on isis. we don't like what he has done in the ukraine. part of that came from the weakness of our current president who ignored the and drew in syria -- >> wait, let me see you there. what does the red line in syria have to do with crimea? >> i'm saying what obama put out to the other leaders, dictators of the world was, i will say things and not back it up. no teeth in that tiger so like a green light for china, green light for russia to do pretty much what they wanted to do if he wasn't even going to stand up to assad. that's what we saw. we're not afraid of barack obama. he is a toothless tiger. and boom what do we get?

isis filling the void in iraq. but what donald trump is saying, one thing about putin, he is running the show. >> so is kim jong-un. congressman, kim jong-un is running shot in north korea. does that make him a strong leader and stronger than the president of the the united states? it seems like an odd thing to do to praise somebody whose country shot down an airplane killing over 250 people. over ukraine during this and including 23 american -- why praise this man as strong when he is using dictating tactics? literally just got rid of a polster out of the country because he didn't like the numbers the guy was doing. kills journalists. >> i'm not going to defend putin the dictator. and i will say the heard of north korea is a psycho path. i'm not going down that road. but when donald trump is president and we defeat isis, we

need the civilized countries in the world. that does not include north korea. whether we disagree or agree with them, we need them to come together. russia is under attack by isis just as the united states is just as europe is. i think there is a way to defeat isis where we can disagree on an awful lot of issues and still work together on the greatest threat to human kind today, which is isis. the radical islamic terrorist the president obama and hillary clinton won't even identify as such. >> let me get to you respond to something your leader in the house, paul ryan, said today about donald trump. >> i'm not going to sit up here and do the tit for tat on what donald said last night or the night before about what hillary said about donald and i'm not going to be the election pundit. >> are you still comfortable in him being commander-in-chief? >> i'll leave it that. >> the "i'll leave it at that"

comment, helpful? >> no, not helpful. but i won't speak for paul ryan. a great speaker of the house. someone i admire and respect greatly. we have a binary choice. hillary clintois not a heard. hillary clinton disclosed again the strategy i will never have troops in iraq and syria. none of us want troops but you don't go out like obama said and i will pull troops out on a date certain and then he did and boom. and the person who gets the economy moving or person who will defeat isis, it is hillary clinton or it is donald trump. that is our binary choice. to me it is an easy choice. certainly donald trump. president trump. so i again i'm not going to speak for other republicans and how they characterize it. since february 24th, i'm aboard the trump train and have been. will continue to be for the next seven or eight weeks. nine weeks. however long we have to go.

and america's got a buy inary close. and they are moving to trump. the independent -- >> let me go back to putin. when you say donald trump is a strong leader, like putin, what does that mean? i don't think people are comfortable with the idea that if you're saying he will be a strong heard like putin. >> i don't know about the "like putin." donald trump will be a leader putting america first. no one, not putin, not the heard of north korea, not the ayatollah, the push donald trump around like they have pushed barack obama around. and the fact of the matter is, call it out for what you want, there is a very strong individual, call him a dictator and loosely elected democracy of sorts -- >> why praise him so much? that why a lot of people scratch their head. why does he praise putin so much? >> i can't speak again for donald trump. can i just point out the fact we have to defeat isis and i believe there's a rool for

russia to play in defeating isis. i'll leave it at that because again i'm not going to speak for paul ryan. i'm not going to speak for donald trump. but i know versus hillary clinton and that binary choice, i know who will defeat isis and who has no clue and that's hillary clinton. >> all right. congressman chris collins. appreciate you coming on. thank you, sir. >> thanks, chuck. let's check the other side. we are joined by angus king of maine and does caucus with the democrats. welcome, sir. >> glad to be with you, chuck. >> i want to ask you about this issue. how concerned are you about hillary clinton? a lot of supporters are concerned that, boy, she doesn't have a good e-mail answer. and if anything, the e-mail answer keeps changing a little bit. are you concerned about this at all? >> yeah. i think she is lawyering it too much. i think she is trying to be too precise and too defensive as many people have commented. i think she ought to just say,

hey,t was a mistake. something that i shouldn't have done. i regret it. i have learned sething from it and i'm going to move on. i don't know anybody that's been in public life for 30 years that hasn't made a mistake and i think that you know, trying to get into all of the little details about whether the e-mails were marked and how they were marked, there is some have a i have lid tha /* /- something to that. i get classified information and it has a header. and that's true. that's just not coming through. she should say, look, i made a mistake and i will move on. we should move on. the real question is who is the best commander-in-chief and who will be best to lead the country. >> all right. i want to ask you about another pledge she made, it has to do with ground clips. i will play a clip and this morning redefining what she said and get your reaction. here it is. >> we are not putting ground troops into iraq ever again. and we're not putting ground

troops into syria. we're going to defeat isis without committing american ground troops. >> i think putting a big contingent of american ground troops on the ground in iraq and syria would not be in the best interest of a fight against isis and other terrorist groups. >> you think it was a mistake for her last night to pledge no ground troops ever? and can you comfortably say that? over the next eight years, an scenario where the united states may have to send ground troops into the middle east? >> well, i think she's right as a matter of policy, that she said it in an absolute way and of course there are ground troops there now. a lot depends on how you define ground troops. people who are actually on going kpan operations or providing support and artillery spotting and those kinds of functions or the iraqi foes. but the policy, the broader question is, no, we don't want ground troops over there. i've been saying that for two

years. that plays into isis's hands. they want this to be a war between the west and islam. and to have american troops in there is exactly what they would like to sort of up the ante. as a matter of policy, she is right to say no ground troops and then this morning no substantial number or something like that. i think you've got to always leave yourself some flexibility. but the broader policy question i think she is absolutely right on. >> while i have you here, your governor is maine, there was controversy with him about ten days ago. some, he seemed to throw out the idea he might resign and then he pulled that back. should he still be governor of maine? does he still have the will of the people, do you think, to be governor? >> well, he was elected twice. i think there are processes in place involving legislature and that's where that question needs to be asked. it is not up to me to answer

that question. >> do you support a process that would support that procedure and an impeachment or whatever procedure is and in maine, it is slightly different, but would you support a process that would remove him from office? >> an impeachable offense involves crime. i think what he did is regrettable. i don't support it. i don't agree with it. i think it was in many ways embarrassing for maine but i think when you start taking somebody, talking about knocking somebody out of office for saying and doing things that you don't agree with that don't rise to the level of a criminal offense, i think that's not the way our system is supposed to work. >> we are talking about governor paul la page. angus king, doing caucus for the democrats, thank you. >> thank you, chuck. chris cillizza of the washington post -- >> saquizza --

>> i got get it right. >> pod tunes. >> and i don't think you have your own pod cast yes. >> i don't. >> and rick tyler, msnbc contributor. have you a pod cast yet? >> not yet. only matter of time, rick. >> trump and pence essentially say the same thing that collins said. it is in the trump surrogate world that says they are trying to clarify about what trump said and simply say he is a stronger leader for his people than president obama is for his. acceptable answer to you? >> no. remarkable thing he is saying this. this is a man who grew up in the cold war generation. i lived through part of that generation and putin is a former cia/kgb agent, what ronald reagan called an evil empire. and to somehow praise putin because he praised donald trump, i think it is completely

unacceptable. having said that, we did align with the russians in world war ii 1 and world war ii to defeat nazi and fascist italy. working with the russians to defeat isis, is an opportunity. but to praise putin -- >> do you think voters care? i've been wondering this. i don't know. >> yes, based on the trump campaign to date broadly that voters don't sort of -- terribly accountable for the stuff he says. again, stewart stevens, mitt romney's lead strategist twieted out if obama said this in the campaign there would be calls the next day for him to quit the race. i don't disagree with that. he is held to a -- >> the praising of -- what you -- what rick and what collins said got to was, look, what we're basically saying here

is, isis is the greater evil. we are going to have to work with people with whom we agree and not everything, i think that's fine. that's not what he said. what he said is, he has -- his first response is he has 82% popularity. his second response is i've said these things about saying things -- it had nothing to do with the -- what rick is talking about, his policy piece -- i get that -- >> but the older -- in the audience -- >> those two things completely aren't related. i understand why the congressman had to say that. but you can say we need to work with russia where we can without praising putin. >> basically what every american president policy is -- >> but you're right, but the bar is so low for donald trump. like the fact he can stand up and basically not fall over on his feet last night means that he wins somehow. >> i thought that answer was, and i thought that -- it was astounding. >> but to your point, i'm not sure people thought like well trump did great.

most of the press coming out, we have -- i know the washington -- we have written a bunch today his comments about the general suggest he doesn't understand. you can't replace the generals. this response on russia is nonsensical. i do think that hillary clinton, she did it today pushing the idea of i'm held to one standard and he is held to another. maybe by the voters. but in my opinion, not by media. i'm biassed, i'm a member of the media. we write stories. >> i hate all of the equivalency arguments for this reason. one person says well they did this -- no, no. if it's wrong, it's wrong. >> hillary clinton's e-mails, focus on what donald trump said. >> the nbc poll showed that trump won the debate. it was pretty clear. amazing. >> and that's all that matters. fact of the matter is she did sound like a lawyer to me too.

>> i would want her to prosecute my case. >> sounded like she was talking to 12 jurors. and you know -- rick and i talked about this. he goes, he had this problem with ted cruz. >> she can't win for losing. the senator said she should have just come out and said, i made a mistake. she has done that. the question she got was very detailed about the classified markings. so once again she had to go through and explain. >> but 12 minutes. >> i that i angus king, i tweeted it out already, she was too lawyerly. in some ways, if you had to have a sentence to diagnose her and sort of her difficulties in the camp, she as great gift. but she tends to view everything has a legal proceeding rather than a court of public proceeding which is what politics is. you can hate that fact, but -- >> so many self righteous people on tweeter. look, the public will respond to

what the public responds. >> and some say matt lauer pushed her too hard on that. it is not his fault. she blew 12 out of the 30 minutes she had to be on her ground making a strong case. >> when you have your own microphone, can you do what you want with it. ultimately she never figured out a pivot off of it. normally when there is a controversial thing to deal with, look at trump, say what you want, sometimes he is all pivot. but when it comes to -- >> just going in a different direction. >> but she hasn't developed the pivot. i'm glad you asked about that. she never figured out how to do that. why? >> but i do feel like she has tried to do that. even when she does the questions come back to the e-mails. one of the questions in the audience was about the e-mail. she was asked. >> she doesn't say it every time but she has said i made a mistake and i wouldn't do it again but for the people who

care, it is everybody, but that doesn't feel like enough. she has done it. >> to a lot of people the mistake thing felt like it was something she decided it was a mistake three months later. >> part of it is find an answer and repeat it and don't make news. >> make it seem repetitive. coming up, the presidential campaign with a terrible no good very bad day and his last name is not trump or clinton. stay tuned. if you're searching other travel sites to find a better price...

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what would you do if you were elected about aleppo? >> about? >> aleppo. >> and what is aleppo? >> you're kidding? >> no. >> gary johnson with a moment he would like forget there today. stumbling on a question about the syrian city, aleppo. he said he feels horrible about

it. it was jaw-dropping and got us thinking of other jaw-dropping moments on the campaign trail that just made you say, they did or said what? here is some memorable ones. >> there is no soviet domination of eastern europe and there never will be under a ford administration. >> and then we go to washington, d.c. to take back the white house. yeah! >> i read most of them again with a great appreciation for the press, for the media. >> what specifically, i'm curious? >> all of them. >> so you agreed with president obama on libya or not? >> okay, libya. >> the third agency of government, i would do away with the education -- the commerce.

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plus $500 bonus cash. . my colleagues katy tur and christie walker watched the forum last night in ohio. this is what they thought about the next choice for commander-in-chief. >> is there anything that trump said that would make you find him more appealing? >> no. extremely pessimistic about america in general. and you know, he doesn't give any details. >> it is hard to trust mer on the issue after she changed her story so many times over the past year. and as this goes forward -- >> absolutely i know who i'm going to vote for. and against. i'm voting against mr. trump. >> who is supporting their candidate enthusiastically with a show of hands. so just two people. >> here you go.

joining me now, paul rye cough, founder and ceo of veterans of america, our partner last night in the commander and chief forum. good to see you. >> good to see you. thank you so much. >> i had talks with veterans in the audience. you probably spent more time with them. give me their reactions. what was the highlights that you heard about and what were the low lights? >> i think highlight was that it happened. we finally add policy discussion on commander-in-chief issuees. veterans finally got ask questions. i think that's the biggest reaction. real sense of unit, community. veteranes from all over america. all political background. all generations. and they really have the candidates in the middle. literally surrounded by veterans in the hot seat. they are happy to have that conversation. i think they would have liked to see more veterans policy and less other policy. we wish we had more time. we could have gone three more hours with just questions from veterans. >> and we should let people

know, we wanted to do more time, the candidates were the ones that wanted to limit time. >> now it will overflow, right? we hope it goes out on the campaign trail. every time they are at a pancake breakfast or vfw hall, these conversations keep going. gold star families continue to push their questions out and this is jump-starting a conversation. and i hope changes the trajectory of the campaign where all candidate of all of the parties have to address our issues. >> i have to say on substance you have them both coming out and spnding more time talking to veterans, talking about what they would do with the v.a. i add conversation yet with secretary mcdonald and one of the questions he was pretty stride on is whenever you want it call it, but having some access to a private doctor if the v.a. is backlogged. and how to manage that. it doesn't feel as if veterans are sort of split on this issue. what do you hear from your group on this issue?

how much privatization do they want versus wholly fixing the v.a.? >> they don't want whole privatization but they do want a choice card to go outside the v.a. but it has been poorly administered. people don't understand it. so it can sound great in concept but it is a true policy dividing line between trump and clinton and trump is more aggressive on privatization than any modern presidential candidate we have ever seen. it is an issue we need to go into specifics. talk about how you will privatize it. where to go. if you have a prosthetic leg, you can't just walk into one medical and get care for that kind of issue in your local town. so the specialized care that is exceptionally important. we also want to hear, would you keep mcdonald or replace him with someone else. who would you replace him with? or name some names. >> that's the question you wanted to hear last night. >> absolutely. that's an important choice.

the only presidential cabinet member to resign in scandal, and that's in the obama administration. >> thank you. >> we appreciate it. >> don't be a stranger. >> see you soon. >> you got it. still ahead, could donald trump still lead his company while leading the country? is it against the law? stay tuned. ♪"all you need is love" plays my friends know me so well. they can tell what i'm thinking, just by looking in my eyes. they can tell when i'm really excited and thrille and they know when i'm not so excited a thrilled. but what they didn't know was that i had dry, itchy eyes. but i knew. so i finally decided to show my eyes some love. me eyelove. when is it chronic dry eye? to find out more, chat with your eye doctor and go to myeyelove.com. it's all about eyelove, my friends. gilman: get it, marcus. go get it.

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could donald trump run list company from the white house? it's more complicated than you might imagine. but first, hampton pearson. >> thanks, chuck. stocks closing lower today. the dow down by 46 points. s&p off by 5. and the nasdaq down as well. airbnb is apologizing for not responding sooner to allegations that some hosts racially discriminated against renters and it says it is taking steps to combat the problem, including reducing prominence of photos in the booking process. wells fargo will pay $185 million to settle complaints to opened accounts to customers without their knowledge. employees opened accounts in a bid to hit sales targets. that's it from cnbc first in business worldwide. he.. where you going? we've got that thing! you know...diarrhea? abdominal pain? but we said we'd be there... woap, who makes the decisions around here? it's me. don't think i'll make it. stomach again...send!

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so you put your business in a blind trust?

>> well, i don't know if don and ivanka and eric run it. is that a blind trust? i wouldn't be involved because i wouldn't care about anything but our country. anything. >> believe it or not, it is not against u.s. law for trum trump to run the country and trump organization at the same time. there are strict guidelines for most branch employees. from cabinet secretary to office clerks. those office holders are forbidden for taking part if government matters that might impact their financial interest or those of a spouse or their children. but there is a different much more lenient set of rules for two individuals in the u.s. government. the president and vice president. president and vice president are required to disclose his or her financial holdings but aren't required to resolve any conflicts that might exist. even if the conflicts affect his or her bottom line.

think of all of tissues that cra president's desk. the list goes on and on. bottom line, this is uncharted territory. that's a big reason why so many reporters are clamoring to see trump's tax record p. to see if there could be in conflict of interest for a president trump. including perhaps financial at stakes in foreign countries. ken gross specializes in ethics laws and worked with michael bloomberg when he was elected mayor and put his money in a blind trust. welcome to the show. >> happy to be here. >> let's clarify this. this idea that every other person in the executive branch has to abide by these rules but the president, it sort of, like where did -- why did it go there? why did it stop? is it clear why the law stops there with the president and

vice president? >> merely because the president is elected and if you don't like what he does, i guess you don't re-elect him and he is in such a high office having control over everything, it would be very difficult, you know, to somehow exempt it out. so i think just a judgment was made that the president wouldn't be subject to gift rules and wouldn't be subject to the conflict of interest rules. >> so it means it is perfectly legal, no law that says he can just simply, if he wants to everyday, move the oval office to his new trump hotel on pennsylvania avenue and make people visit him there, that's actually perfectly legal? >> i suppose. if there was a requirement that if you wanted to do business with the government, federal government, you had to stay at the trump hotel, you know, there may be at some point a problem where decisions are made strictly for his own monetary interest. i'm going to build a national park next to my golf courses so my golf courses are worth more

money, that could be a problem. >> his financial disclosure list businesses in saudi arabia, china, uae are among them. what are concerns if let's say donald trump were applying to be secretary of state and he had the same issue. what would the law dictate when it came to, what would he have to do here veersus as president trump? >> i would think he has it divest interest in assets owned in countries we are dealing with, treaty arrangements, negotiations with. there are inherent conflicts there. and they wouldn't be tolerated. >> who governs, who decides if a conflict is resolved or not in the federal government? >> office of government ethics oversees the process and it would be prosecutable by the department of justice if there was violation. >> so if he were hired to be secretary of state or treasury he would have to divest but as president trump he doesn't have to. >> right.

>> the financial forms that all officials fill out and a it. return, what is it that you can learn from a tax return that are not in the financial disclosure? >> there is a lot in a tax return that you would not see in a financial disclosure statement. >> give me examples. >> deductions perhaps. you would see debts that were held. likely in certain types of investments would show. payment to creditors. charitable contributions would be on the returns. and perhaps some income that's not disclosed. kind of a different filing. i think it is very important to have that information with a president of the united states that is not otherwise subject to conflict of interest rules. >> explain how though -- i'm going to ask you this, are blind trusts really blind? i say this because, okay, so the whole idea of a blind trust is so the person can't make trades. but you still know it is in your trust. >> totally. >> it is not like you erased

your brain. >> you don't get amnesia when you put assets in a blind trust. >> does it really help resolve a conflict? >> it can. if you hold the empire state building, you are going to know you own the empire state building if you put it into a blind trust. but if you own securities and you have trades and securities, you're not paying much attention whether ibm or general electric or general motors is in there. it is a benefit for liquid assets to be traded and you are just out of it and you say you're out of it. it helps legally and politically. but yes, certain types of assets and liquid assets, and you just karnt erase your knowledge of. >> by the way, one more clarification. secretary of state donald trump, i'm using this example here, secretary of state donald trump, his kids could not, it wouldn't resolve the conflict of interest if his kids were in the company. >> right. under the office of government ethics rules, for a real executive branch blind trust at

any official in the executive branch would have to go with except the president, an independent trustee would have to run those. couldn't even be a banker that you dealt with before. very high bar. your children don't qualify. >> but as president of the united states? >> he can do it. he can call it a blind trust. he doesn't need a blind trust. he can pretty much do what he wants. >> wow, ken gross. fascinating uncharted territory. but important for people to understand this is why the public does need to see his tax return. thank you, sir. appreciate it. up ahead on the lid, how newly released e-mails between colin powell and hillary clinton could impact the ongoing e-mail controversy. you do know that collin powell likes to go to the hardware store on his own. and. and why i'm obsessed with tim tebow's new gig. you can move calls between phones, so conversations can go where you go. take your time. i'm not going anywhere.

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...stop clicking around...av sites to find a better pce... the lowest prices on our hotels are always at hilton.com. so pay less and get more only at hilton.com. time now for my obsessed with segment and much like the sports media the past decade today, yes, i too am am obsessed with the tim tebow story. he signed a deal with the new york mets. yes, mets, not jets. he played baseball now or trying to. tebow hasn't played baseball since high school. he showed skills last month but mlb scouts ek yog what their counterpart said former quarterback lacked arm strength. tebow said he is committed to baseball and to his broadcast career and will miss a couple of days each week to do sec games.

he is not so much achasing the dream. will he make it? almost certainly not. will he get publicity and sell some mets tickets and jerseys in certainly so. but can you bet george steinbrenner would have never let this happen. remember, he first signed young sanders to a contract as casey stang el would say you can look it up and the signing of tebow is the intersection of would things that a lot of americans love to hate. tebow for some reason. and of course, new york teams. that's me. so let's remember this. tim tebow lives a clean life and is disliked by some by wearing his heart on his sleeve. i think hating on him is ridiculous. do you really hate him? this man is exemplary as a person. it is fun to hate on him, for me, perhaps, because he is a former florida gator and to me that's a sin you can't ever get rid of. tim tebow, good luck in baseball.

i wish the yankees and steinbrenner would have had chance at you. the circus comes back to town soon. we'll be right back. and the alzheimer's association is going to make it happen by funding scientific breakthroughs, advancing public policy, and providing local support to those living with the disease and their caregivers. but we won't get there without you. visit alz.org to join the fight.

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time now time for "the lid." a new development in this saga on the hillary clinton e-mails. house democrats released e-mails between clinton and former secretary of state colin powell. this is the most bizarre side story of the week. the two discussed the use of personal e-mail accounts and devices at the state department. powell warned clinton about the dangers of using a blackberry because quote, it may become an official record and subject to law, unquote. and he told her to quote, be very careful. i got around it all by not saying much and not using systems that captured the data. secretary powell said today, secretary clinton has stated she was not influenced by my e-mail in making her decisions on e-mail use. i was not trying to influence her but just to explain what i had done eight years earlier to begin the transformation in the state department's information system. the e-mail did go a little bit

about how to get around everybody. that's a separate question. the panel is back. daniella, i will start with you. what colin powell outlined in that e-mail, he basically said had hillary clinton said what he did, which is i wanted to go around everybody and i didn't want to bother with everybody worrying about who's going to break into a blackberry, she would be crucified. >> yeah, she would be. i have to wonder how much this new twist in the story matters. it matters to us, it matters -- >> and that's it. >> i don't think people are thinking about what the former secretary of state told her in an e-mail when she first started. >> my favorite part of his e-mail was him complaining about the state department protection. he would sneak around to go to the hardware store. >> i think it matters to colin powell. >> that i agree with. >> for me, brand perspective, i'm not sure colin powell cares that much but he probably cares because he's a very public

figure. >> right. >> this does not look good for him. he's saying in his statement basically what i was doing was giving her advice on how to best work within an old and heavily bureaucratic system. what it reads like, if you just look at it, he's essentially saying be careful because you might get called on these things. for colin powell, who is above politics, endorsed obama, all these different things, he wasn't in a partisan box, he now looks more like a politician which i would guess is -- >> not good for him. you read this a little more exculpatory of clinton? everyone is holding her to one standard and you're going geez, why don't they subpoena colin powell? doesn't it make it all seem political? >> this device wasn't even invented. we have been in this sort of transition period with this technology. we wouldn't have imagined there would be edward snowden or wikileaks or people would be able to break in and hack into each other's e-mails.

i think colin powell's advice might have been sort of obsolete. >> let me move on here. everybody know where aleppo is today? >> yeah. >> by the way -- >> i do. >> except gary johnson. >> yeah. >> my goodness. >> this happened right at a moment that he was going to perhaps get his 15 minutes. >> again -- >> timing couldn't have been worse. >> the difficult thing, we have talked about this on and off the air for years, which is the idea of a third party candidate is always very appealing to people because they get exposed to the two candidates they like and -- >> or fourth party. >> the problem is a third party candidate has to have a name and background and weaknesses and strengths. gary johnson's weakness, a big weakness, got exposed. that's who you're voting for. >> you may only get one shot when you are a third party candidate. one shot at respectability. >> exactly. you cannot not know the name of

the city of the biggest conflict happening in the middle east and say i can be commander in chief. everybody may not know where aleppo is but you need to know where it is. >> correct. rick, you are a political professional. can you imagine, it is offensive to me when the people, we would be expected to know this or we would be fired. >> my heart would stop. it would literally, if i were advising gary johnson in that moment. >> by the way, there's still no excuse. you are a two-term governor. read the newspaper. >> the worst possible spin that was out afterwards is this is an example of radical transparency. no. this is an example of not knowing things that are critically important. >> some things it's okay not to know. as a reporter you ask -- >> this is not one of them. >> you say i don't know the answer, that's okay. in this case -- >> by the way, syria's a linchpin to a lot of chaotic

problems. >> it was also the moment if you didn't like what you saw last night with clinton and trump -- >> we have five battleground state polls. four states, five polls. i want to run through them. what's really interesting, chris cillizza, they all make sense if you believe the national race is clinton under five right now, all of these. north carolina, trump 44%-41%. if she's up two to four points nationally, trump should be up two to four points in north carolina. let's move quickly to florida. i believe it's the next we have. this is quinnipiac. clinton up four points. okay. if you believe north carolina is turning -- >> by the way -- >> margin of error. let's look at florida, dead even. again, that would make sense with the national numbers. ohio, trump up in the four-way, 41%-37%. considering he's been overperforming. finally, pennsylvania, clinton up five. >> the four states i think that are the closest right now and have been are ohio, florida,

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finally in case you missed it, the senate landscape is changing. democrats need to net four seats and win the white house to take over. three republican-held seats are likely to flip, illinois, indiana, wisconsin. over the last couple weeks, democratic groups have more or less given up on winning in

florida or ohio or at least for now. they are certainly acting like it. democrats still need to find one more republican-held seat to win and hold on to nevada's seat. very possible. but winning the senate is no longer the same sure thing it seemed like it was just two months ago. the check on both clinton and trump is that a message that republicans are actually finding is working. we shall see. it's still just september. that's all. "with all due respect" starts right now. i'm mark halperin. >> i'm john heilemann. "with all due respect" to gary johnson, perhaps your question would have been more appropriate in a slightly different setting. >> geography, 16. >> this city had been its nation's business capital and was once the end of the silk road. gary? >> what is aleppo. >> you're kidding. >> no.