jon meacham, what are your thoughts? >> i was just thinking as we look at the images of -- going to what mika was talking about. the democracy of death is obviously perennial fascination because it is going to come to all of us, perhaps even you, joe, i don't know. but you look at the -- you look at the flag-draped coffin which on moments of state seems to take on a certain distant air almost. almost as if it is a ceremonial touch that is beyond most of our reach. what's so fascinating to me about flag-draped coffins is that anyone that served their country will have that. that ted kennedy who is in the arm, no matter what, there are funerals today unfolding around america where veterans are being laid to rest with the same honor, the same flag because they serve a common purpose and served a common cause. and i think that one of the things that we could so well in america, one of the reasons the constitutions no titles, no ranks, is that there's -- a democracy. and a sense that if you serve, you are honored. some let's

jon meacham is waiting for it.ill join us and later which of these stories is going to make the cut for the week in review? >> oh, i know which ones. >> everybody is waiting. stay tuned. >> you be nice to hillary. most for headaches. for arthritis pain... in your hands... knees... and back. for little bodies with fevers.. and big bodies on high blood pressure medicine. tylenol works with your body... in a way other pain relievers don't... so you feel better... knowing doctors recommend tylenol... more than any other brand of pain reliever. when i really liked to be outside, i did not like suffering from nasal allergy symptoms like congestion. but nasonex relief may i say... bee-utiful! prescription nasonex is proven to help relieve indoor and outdoor nasal allergy symptoms like congestion, runny and itchy nose ansneezing. (announcer) side effects were generally mild and included headache. viral infection, sore throat, nosebleeds and coughing. ask your doctor about symptom relief with nasonex. and save up to $15 off

jon meacham is with us and has a question for you. then we will get to pat. >> a classic brokaw question. tom, have you written about the greatest generation and you have written about the boomer generation. ted kennedy seems to be one unto himself. and having been born in 1932. where would you put him in the story of the country in terms of generational history from did 20th century and as we move forward? >> jon, you are putting on me on the spot. the bad generation i represented in a way, i was born in 1940. so my earliest memories are of the war. i was not a boomer. but i came to understand the boomers and the cultural unhappiness with the way the things were in the country. at the same time, i was a beneficiary of the greatest generation. i think that senator kennedy probably felt that way as well. he was raised, in effect, as a shadow of his brothers, both of whom served in the service. bobby at the end of world war ii but his brother was heroic and lost a brother in world war ii. so that was always with him. but then he became

jon meacham, a fascinating political story. they were in the '90s after the 2000 race, estranged farhile and seem to be back together again. >>t's like the bush/clion brokeback mountain. you know, we're back to that. i think the -- what's so terrific in a way is clinton was able to get these reporters out. that's a very serious matter. north korea is a foe of almost epic -- possibly epic dimensions. and anything that gets us in there to get a sense of who these people really are is a good thing. sending the most -- sending bill clinton, whose emotional intelligence is off the charts, was really lucky for us. if anybody can come back and paint a character sketch of what's going on with those people, it'll be bill clinton. and i just want to say if it's all right -- >> sure. >> -- there are twoe two place where is this is going on right now. "newsweek" has a correspondent who is being held in custody without access to a lawyer and without a formal charge in iran. there are a number of show trials going on in iran as that regime,

to want, president clinton in north korea, john meacham and general tony zinni when we continue. captioning sponsored by rose communications from our studios in new york city, this is charlie rose. >> rose: bill clinton arrived in pyongyang on an unannounced visit. north korean television is reporting the former president left the country, the jailed journalists with parr were pardoned following an apology in a meter with kim jong il earlier today. the mission comes at a time of heightened tensions between washington and north korea over its nuclear program. as we tape this broadcast at 7:00 p.m., the white house has not commented on the release of the journalists. joining me from washington is glen kessler, diplomatic correspondent for the "washington post" and joe cirincione, president of the plow shares fund, i am pleased to have them both on this program, welcome. >> pleasure to be with you. >> thank you. >> rose: i want you both to tell me everything you know about what happened. (laughter) >> what we know is that this was a carefully arranged agreement put together by the w

and jon meacham is still with us.and rush limbaugh calling the other side nazis. you have nancy pelosi saying these protestors are "unamerican." the extremes are choosing upsides, and it's getting uglier than it was been in a while. >> yeah, bipartisan ship could be still up and kicking. perhaps the kingdom of god is not coming to us. i think -- to be completely serious, i think it's revolting, and it cheapens and lessens and minimizes the important lessens we have to learn from the 1930s and '40s to introduce a once-civilized nation. whatever we want to say about health care in this country in 2009, we should not be using imagery of a suicidal society. >> 77% of americans think bipartisanship is the same as george w. bush or has gotten worse. >> i think we are in the media -- just because i want to make fun of it -- >> that's a little harsh. >> well, irony. >> thank you. because it just seems like -- maybe it's a sweden model, which is okay, the dutch model, and i think that is worth arguing about, and civilized nati

jon meacham? last three presidents have all faced questions of legitimacy, clinton, bush, because of florida, and the obama thing is all about legitimacy and whether or not he can legally be in this office. but weirdly, as paranoid as american politics has always been, as richard hoff said or taught us, what is it about post 1992 america that has raised the stakes of this level of conspiracy theory, do you think? because you didn't hear this about nixon. >> no, you didn't, and people on the left obviously have strong feelings about nixon, have strong feelings about reagan, but didn't contend that somehow they were illegitimate to occupy the office. i don't quite know what that is, that we seem not to be able to -- >> let me take a shot. >> -- to have any right to exercise any kind of authority. >> i remember when i was running for congress ' 4-'94, before people started using e-mail and get hateful faxes day in and day out. i think a crazy person in wisconsin being able to reach a crazy person in

john meacham will be with us.enator kerry, thanks for being with us. >> thank you. >> especially that story. we'll be right back. >> this november, the torch will be passed again to a new generation of americans, so, with barack obama and for you and for me our country will be committed to his cause. the work begins anew. the hope rises, again. and the dream lives on. most f headaches. for arthritis pain... in your hands... knees... and back. for little bodies with fevers.. and big bodies on high blood pressure medicine. tylenol works with your body... in a way other pain relievers don't... so you feel better... knowing doctors recommend tylenol... more than any other brand of pain reliever. 90s slacker hip-hop. ♪ that can strain your relationships and hurt yourody 'cause we'pride ♪ng a ride ♪ ♪ it's the credit roller coaster ♪ ♪ and as you can see it kinda bites! ♪ ♪ so sing the lyrics with me: ♪ when your debt goes up your score goes down ♪ ♪ when you pay a little off it goes the other way 'round ♪ ♪ it's just t

'ltait driwi arooinil fen ddeiahiri al jourli i washitoned wh vesenatokeedy and john meacham,he editor of ewsw magaze ich is cong wh a commerative issue. d we'll hr frenator kennedy h ow words in rviewst heiditme one i00 and e in he'sn ex>> this is aplac tt youa isble.at the sutou peoplon bothsisf the cobuti tth f is ser inhesetehat can tick off giatn evythinge, u as grtas if you had r foes a hadtwo ter in presiden. placanbout bei a sator ane gacy thatoure il it's a enormous hon. mean, 's the greest pubc nor u uld ibly have. an rea and prte the tst thahepeople of mase gito me. to be able teprent them e nate. and we' tried to... i've alwaerceivedy ros try toetso in . 's bnrustrang in the o seone th's psione t naon hlt iurce and s en fighng that over0 snd istil..we see tse.very sin day maragedies h falies tt ha been ab to do i buwe've some pgrs ert. ani as fe that asg as c keepge ogress tnd the people willp m, i..t's >> donan you'lln for ti? xpecso. willou let me ke an >> i wlndeed.our show? >>rnolhis, not me?n aroia ch. tif of tekennedy en wenu captiongpoor by se communitis rose: looso

he was detained on june 21 he's still in prison andwe'll talk aut that with "newsweek's" edir john meacham spl >> whas so disappointing is we for six weeksave rpectfully as that he... that iranian law be folwed. they areot followi their own duerocess. the other thing that's unfortunate is iran clearly wants to be pa of the fami of nations they want to be taken seriously. they want to be part ofthe world community. but is is not the way o acts ifne wants to d that. >> rose: we conclude wi part one of a two part nversation with general tonyinni, a stinguished marine who seed in t mitary all of his life with obseations about amera's role with america's role in the world, especlly middle eas >> i've heard both sides, arab and israeli,nly you could do it, put it onhe table, i'm coinced that for it to be a comprehensive sustainable plan they have toork it out, put it onhe table wehould not be in the an of putng it on the table. >>. >> rose: the head ofkessler motorsas scheduled to tell us about his electric car, that interview willake place later. to want, president cnton in north rea, john meaa

david brooks, anchor of cnn's "street signs" erin burnett, and editor of "newsweek" magazine, jon meachamrst general james jones, welcome back. >> thank you, sir. >> north korea, the two american journalists back home. this was the scene in los angeles on wednesday. former president bill clinton accompanying the two journalists back home. he has since come back east and you have been able to fully debrief him. what can you say you have now learned about north korea and specifically kim jong-il? >> well, i think that, first of all, i want to emphasize this was a private mission, and we can get into that if you'd like, but this was a private mission where -- in which there were no official or unofficial messages sent by this government or by president obama. so, we celebrate the fact that we've had this great reunion and -- but we can say that -- we can al report that the president did -- former president did spend time with the korean leader, that he appeared to be in control of his government and his -- he sounded very -- very reasoned in terms of his conversations. >> his health. right?

rifles, abraham lincoln book by doris kearns could win and the other is american lie and lie in jon meacham, to history books i need to read. if there is by a friend of mine, richard who used to work out dow jones which owns "the wall street journal" and it's called restless genius. it is the story of a famous and very influential american duralast, barney kilgore, the editor of "the wall street journal" many of years who created the modern wall street journal and many ways modern journalism and richard has written and interesting biography of barney kilgore who will go down in history as a great journalist and person who created much of what we think of as journalism in the 20th century. finally for fun i want to read the rocket fell to earth about roger clemens and how he sort of rose and thanks to the drug controversy has somewhat fallen. >> to see more program information visit our web site at booktv.org. >>> now doug stanton talks about the u.s. special forces who fo t

. >> rose: jon meacham, thank you. "nsweek" here."n here it is, spial s commemorative edition "t last other, edward m.ennedy, 1932-2009." and mythanks to myfriend al hunt on the loss of his frie, ted kennedy. we'll be right backnd see two interviews with d kennedy, one 2005 and onen 2007 which n which y will see his passion for health care, yo will seeal how that humor is there and u will see him slightlyig introspectiveut n much but what more important sr. that pasion for the things that heat lieved in andhat is what people are remembering today. not only the causes but als the deepness of family. ck in a moment.ba stay with us. stay witus >> rose: do youthink where you are on important issues of our day is whe the cntry i or where you'd le to see e country ? >> where i'd li to see to country be i believe that individuals and the naon does best when it'sen allenged. i thi this countryas demonstrated it over itstr history. i mean, look how this nation camout of the deprsion. look how we responded in terms of world war ii.of look how w

and became the leading general in the american army 15 years later at the same time as the became meacham 13 the spanish secret service and was a spy for spain for the next 20 years at the same time is to let the american army but the amazing thing was every president you work four, washington, adams, jefferson, madison all knew he was a traitor and the kicked him in this position for strategic reason. is a fascinating untold story and the unknown life. that, and then another biography of an unknown but fascinating figure in history, to win a queen of naples, sicily in jerusalem. deal nei, the only woman to rule in your own name in the 14th century. she was every bit as dynamic a ruler as elizabeth the first of england, rogol break glittering court in naples and an incredibly turbulent time and is a very revealing look at the 14th century to the lands of bearlike. >> you of something of a new catalog that he wanted to show is coming up this fall. >> a book called meltdown iceland. that i think it's going to be a fascinating way into the economic crisis that hit us last year. this is the s

i was still living in that radically bifurcated, meacham alamode four crimination that we saw that evolved with richard nixon in the 1960's. >> so, how the evolved during richard nixon and was he partially was possible in your view? >> he was both, he didn't create the wave but the surf the way. basically, the '60s social movements became all the more passionate, sometimes even violent, lars swath of white middle-class america became very frightened that the normal expectations of law-and-order were being up ended, and richard nixon could have house that rage into political advantage of that ragin not only did he harbored but exacerbated it as a political strategy. >> how? these for example, he argued privately, although some of the said they said it publicly, that they wanted to achieve a strategy a positive polarization. in other words, it is good to have a political discourse that divides the country into because of their belief that the republicans would harvest they decided to divide, so in other words, even though in much of his public rhetoric he would speak the words of unity that

tait driwi arooinil f dredeiahiri al jourli i washitoned wh vesenatonnedy and john meacham,he editor magazich is cong w a commerative issue. d we'll hr frenator kennedy h words in rviet heidit one i and e in he an ex>> this is aplac tt youa isble.at the sou ma peoplon bothdesf the cobuti tth f is ser inhetehat can tick off slatn d evythinge,you as eatas if you had r foesen a htwo tms inhe presiden. placanbout bei a sator d e gacy thatoure il. it'sn enormous hor. mean,it's the greest pubc nor u uld ssibly have. an reat and prte thest thahepeople o massaue gito me. to be able teprent them e nate. and we' tried to... i've alwaerceived by ros try toetso in pe. 'seenrustting in the o seone th's psione t tion hlt iur and s en fiting that over0 snd istil.. we see tsevery sgl day ma tragedies h faliest ha been ab to do i buwe've some pess ert. ani as el that asg as c keepge ogress t..nd the people willp m, i..t' >> d: an you'llrun for ti? xpso. wi you let memake an >> i wlndeed.our show? >>rnoldohis, ot me?sn aroia ch. tife of tekennedwhen wenu captningpoor by captningpoor by se communitis >

. >>> john meacham, you're not as fun as you used to be. you now have a day job. editor of "newsweek." you have a job to do today. >> those were the good days. but, give us your final thoughts on ted kennedy and what's "newsweek" going to say about this great leader. ? >> we're going to explore the things we are talking about. it's not an uncomplicated celebration of a life. it's a complicated one. the life was complicated. it's therefore, i think, more interesting and ultimately more inspiring. one of my favorite things about the kennedy's at large is the great poem to strive to seek to find to not to yield, that they quoted so much. the poem is about a bored king who the idol of the king who was you listen he was trying to engage himself after all the drama, all the vigor of the journey home to ithaca. that's both sides of the kennedys. there's a wonderful strive to seek, find and not yield. there was also another side. that's what makes the family interesting. we all live in the shadow of what this family did. we're better off for it. remember john and robert k