austin, texas, in turmoil. and i had to get away from all that, and i went out to south carolina, where my folks had moved, and i got into school there, went through english and political science. and then during the time of the pentagon papers case, you remember, and right before watergate, i took a survey course in journalism. and i realized, 'here's a profession where they pay you money to go around the world and indulge all of your -- your interests, kind of like a graduate student. and all you have to do is write something about it that's interesting.' and i thought that was a great career. c-span: where'd you start then? >> guest: i started at the two county seat weekly newspapers in the swamp country of south carolina called the allendale county citizen and the hampton county guardian. and i was the editor at the te -- tender age of 20, 21 years old. and i did that for a year, and i really learned courthouse politics, general sessions court, land transactions, all the things that are available in local government and school boards, city council. learned all of those issues at the grass roots, and it --