robert litwak is vice president for programs at the wilson center where he also serves as director nationalurity studies. gentlemen, welcome to dialogue. thanks for joining us. >> thanks, john. >> thank you. >> john milewski: i want to begin with a little scene setting. let's not assume that the history is widely known. as i was preparing for the discussion, one thing i realized is that troops in europe are not the way americans think of troops in other places. we accept troops in europe as part of the [inaudible], part of the national security picture. we don't talk about whether or not they should be there or how long they've been there. it's something that we almost accept, but there is a history to it. when did we first have troops on the ground permanently? >> lieutenant general mark hertling: obviously it was during world war ii. after the war we had several million troops on the ground and as developments occurred and the onset of the cold war we were able to keep various sized forces throughout europe. as recently, john, as 1989, we had about a quarter million troops. they were kidd