ms. sommers? >> from the cftc's perspective, they're subject to civil prosecution and there could also be criminal prosecution by other authorities. >> your civil authority, would that just be a fine? >> yes. and >> is there a limitation on how much of the fines could be? could you charge enough in fines to cover this? if you did, could you use that to make good on the accounts anyway? >> it is mind standing that there are a number of different avenues with regards to the authority that we have a for fines. it is $140,000 per violation of the act or three times the amount of the monetary gain as well as additional fines that we could charge for restitution to customers and various other fines. if there are a number of different ways we could go in assessing the fine that would be appropriate. >> but that money would not be available to make good those accounts. it would go to the cftc? >> it is my understanding it would go to the general treasury. the restitution would go to the customers, but the

ms. sommers? >> from a cftc's perspective they are subject to civil prosecution under our rules and there would also be a potential for criminal violations of the act is also criminal prosecution by other authorities. >> so your civil authority, would that just be fines? >> you writes. >> is there a limitation on how much the fines could be, or can you charge enough lines to cover this? if you did, could you use that to, you probably couldn't use that to make of these accounts anyway. >> it is my understanding that there are a number of different avenues with regard to the authority we have for fines. it is $140,000 per violation of the act, or three times the amount of the monetary gain as well as additional fines that we could charge for restitution to customers and various other fines, so if there are a number of different ways we could go in assessing the fine that would be appropriate. >> but that money wouldn't be available to make good the customer accounts. that will go to the cftc right?

ms. sommers on the phone, and the third meeting at 3 30u. can you explain the topic of the calls? >> to me recollection, i was on the phone call, the conference call with chairman at one, and chilton at the time you brought forward, and, again, as we have suggested and written in my response to questions, primary subject of that conversation were between the broker dealer and the fcm. >> three separate meetings, three sprit commissioners that you participated in. did you have separate calls or participation with mr. ginsler when you took the job at mf global to the present time? >> to my recollection, you have my calls, my meetings. >> okay. >> outlined. >> you never once called their cell phone? >> no. >> did you call another member of the administration during this time about any of these issues? >> i'm sorry, congressman, i couldn't hear you. >> did you ever call a member of the administration? you're close to the current administration, as a very generous campaign bund leer, did you -- bundler, did you visit with anyone in the administration about your business at mf global? >

ms. sommers, again it's remarkable that you mentioned lehman brothers and things like this. this, is this unique, this sort of thing happening? certainly to this extent but is it unique in itself? >> yes it is, sir, for the customer funds. >> you mentioned customers. how we differentiate between what is and what is not customer dollars? >> the customer funds on this side would be put in a segregated account, and those accounts would be tagged as for desegregated accounts. >> end of the money that they've discovered outside? >> vara can be money in a lot of other accounts outside of 4-d. the to the broker-dealer accounts, future accounts we tag as 40.7. >> very good. >> mr. giddens, the 550 million-dollar guarantee, is that money going to be used to make customers whole if we can't find the shortfall? >> that's not the nature of the guarantee. .. and if you end up with only having 60 cents or 65 cents, he'll make up to 10 cents. we don't go above the 75-cent number. it's basically cme -- if he pays up to 75 cents, finds out he doesn't have 75 cents, has 70, then we pay 250 mi