in libya? how could it be used more effectively. citizenr as participation, i think that benghazi and triple the -- tripoli are different. ibo wanted to participate. in the absence of results, participation waned off. we have a handful of organizations with not very strong grassroots our reach. groups that already exists on the outskirts. they are not necessarily doing civil society activities, but organizing the activity, and getting their communities safe on a daily basis. ipending on your definition, suppose, there are active citizens. there is no rule of law and libby. it is a state of anarchy. it has always been that way. manages have learned to their affairs, and learn to create the peace. air actually actively working towards keeping the safety, keeping the order by virtue of them being libyan citizens. advocating very limited activity in their regard. >> i will take a shot at the issues. first of all, the activities are absent downs. if there are issues, that really gauge, like the issue of most dire issue, the presence. thos

he was willing to use it in libya in 2011. that cost us nearly a billion dollars. also resulted in a government that cannot protect its own people in libya. the question that the congress is asking and the issue is how many of them feel strongly enough to make a difference. what will we do after we strike? will that put us in a stronger position. connell: that is important. >> what is next? you have to plan for the worst-case. not hope for the best. learn from your mistakes. do not assume that everything will come up roses. the assad regime that will not use chemical weapons on americans. if they come apart, al qaeda gets chemical weapons and they will use them. >> i think the president has really boxed himself in. the clearing redlines without being willing and able to make sure you make good on that promise sent a really bad message to the rest of the world. connell: thank you to both of you. let's go to the markets here for a minute. the dow is down 37 points. it has been a tough month for us stocks. >> good morning. it has been a tough week for stocks. if you l

used. in libya, there is a concern with correction. it goes hand-in-hand with the institutions that can monitor the spending of funding. in the absence of institutions, and the absence of civil society to execute on programs, the understanding is that currently it is working ok. the funding as it stands. we do have one of our largest grants from the libyan national telecommunications company, a local libyan company. our spirits with them is that while they offer us cash in a bag essentially, which is any dream country, the capacity to support is limited. the oversight took them nine months ended the grant issued to us. some of the items in the contract are not necessarily following through. they just change the board of directors because of the political isolation law. the people we signed with initially have been replaced. doesn't situation is -- because the situation is not more stable, they're becoming more fluid, we believe there will be a reliance on foreign funding for the more time to come. therefore, a transition plan a couple o

used. in libya, there is a concern with correction. es hand-in-hand with the institutions that can monitor the spending of funding. in the absence of institutions, and the absence of civil society to execute on programs, the understanding is that currently it is working ok. the funding as it stands. we do have one of our largest grants from the libyan national telecommunications company, a local libyan company. our spirits with them is that while they offer us cash in a bag essentially, which is any dream country, the capacity to support is limited. the oversight took them nine months ended the grant issued to us. some of the items in the contract are not necessarily following through. they just change the board of directors because of the political isolation law. the people we signed with initially have been replaced. doesn't situation is -- because the situation is not more stable , they're becoming more fluid, we believe there will be a reliance on foreign funding for the more time to come. aerefore, a transition plan couple of years

because before the americans went to strike libya together with a coalition, the house brought a bill to the vote and actually refused to give authority to use force in libya to the president. it didn't make a difference back then, because a senate is democraticcally controlled. but back then the president did not seek congressional approval. so this is a different situation, and we really don't know when this vote is going to come, because congress is scheduled to come back from recess on september 9. they might come back earlier, as the british did this week. but that's not a given. and even if they do, it takes some time to restart this congressional machinery. so all the plans, the timetable, many people in washington saw was in effect for early military strikes in syria, that's off the table for now. max, thanks for that. do stay with us now. we'll come back to you in a moment. but first, the united nations team investigating the use of chemical weapons in syria has now arrived in the netherlands. the inspectors and the samples they collected while in syria have been taken to the hague where the organization for the prohibition of chemical weapo

in libya. especially since they've just intervened alone in mali in conditions that were already technically difficult to get and france only intervened in libya because the us gave support in the form of infrastructure. which is a shame by the way and we need to change that and so i don't think that there will be an intervention but i still think that bunch of leaders are under the influence of qatar and saudi arabia who are pulling the strings far behind the scenes and who are providing weapons and assisting islamic fundamentalists across the world. and we must announce that which is what i'm trying to do in my own country you say defend the. right so that was not in a band way to her vision of france this is saying to you for being with us and i will see you next time. they actually what happened that i don't know but a woman killed. piers later is when i got arrested for. her crime or did not do. we have numerous cases where police officers lie about polygraph results. innocent people to confess to police officers don't beat people anymore i mean it just doesn't happen really. in the course of interrogation why because there's been this said lightman no

in libya. i would like to thank here for the national endowment for democracy, because they have been, in the last 10 years, backing usin our work. thank you, ned. to talk to you about the role of civil society today, this seemed like a far-fetched possibility two years ago. those who know the situation in libya, we combat the regime for many years. to see its end suddenly, the way it had, was beyond our imaginations. the fight for freedom in libya started in 1969. i am a witness of that personally. it manifested in a new forum during february, 2011. many people, close friends and colleagues, sacrificed their lives, for the liberation of libya. even with the turbulent transition we are seeing, i just wanted to share this reflection with you. with regard to the current environment in libya, i will touch base on a few points, then try to emphasize. the security issue is number one, number two, and number three in the country. we have the armed groups who have the arms and who are really the de facto power in our country. we have a nation army in the making. they have not been able to take charge of the country. we have

signs of a al qaeda really ramping up, and i am talking about the jailbreaks in iraq, in libya and pakistan, for us they were signs that al qaeda was backed in the action in getting 500 of the main opera tours from iraq out, 1200 in libya, and pakistan a handful of 100. then within three or four days, there comes a tape. all these were signs that something big was on the back burner. the fact that there have been so many operatives going around is telling us at this point that this is just the beginning. we are going to see much more in the coming weeks and months, possibly attacks in iraq and syria, in libya. i think this is just the beginning and has nothing to do with the nsa scandal. >> de see the al qaeda reach, the attacks going beyond that, going to other countries, going to the west? i don't want to mention countries just in case to give someone an idea, but you know what i am getting at. >> indeed, there is troublesome intelligence regarding countries not far from us, as far as the risk is concerned. obviously spain that i mentioned earlier could be one of them. there were incidents a few

us right now. this seems like a big moment that in some ways the president obama seems to reset power here in terms of using military forces. we didn't go to congress in libyait's not something that some leaders have done in the past for kosovo waited until after president clinton did, granted president bush got it for iraq. what do you think president obama is trying to do here, especially in terms of his legacy? >> well, he may be trying to escape spons responsibility, but here's the dilemma that not only the president or the country faces. when the president says, draws a red line, that is not an expression of personal opinion. he speaks for the nation. he has put the nation's credibility on the line with that commitment. now the time has come, tragically, to make good on that commitment. maybe -- i'm one of those who thinks it should not have been made but it's time to make good and he has put responsibility into the hands of the congress that is notoriously paralyzed and dysfunctional. not only put the responsibility into the hands of the congress but put it in the hands of the congress in not immediately but when they come back from holiday, without c

used in military operations in mali. >> we do not have all the means necessary to carry out this kind of operation. during the war that we lead in libya, the united states gave us 80% of the targets we dealt with. >> on the other side of the atlantic, a very different situation. thousands of drones are in the hands of the u.s. air force. these images of a secret drone project in the 1960s show the united states understood the importance of unmanned aerial vehicles at an early stage. france has decided to buy a dozen from their american counterparts. after years of hesitation and trailing behind in the technology race. >> a former general told me he did not want the topic to be mentioned. there have been many obstacles coming from within the french air force. >> an ethical issue delayed the program. drones can be equipped with missiles, deadly robots operated in afghanistan and iraq with devastating effects. these are iraqi rebels trapped, -- tracked, and they did not see this coming. the french army's position now seems clear. >> it is a false debate. there is a pilot in the drone, and operator. >> to avoid the unreal computer game fe

in berlin for us right now moving on now we'll be back just after the break a strife and desperation in libya as the nation marks two years since the fall of gadhafi will have that report after this as well as of the flooding in russia's fly east to stay with us. for the. science technology innovation all the developments around russia we've got the future covered. you know sometimes you see a story and it seems so you think you understand it and then you glimpse something else you hear or see some other part of it and realize everything you thought you knew you don't know i'm sorry welcome to the big picture. language. because we can we know if you're going to show some. true it's good to consider. the opinions that immigrate to. choose the stories that impact your. choose the access to. thanks for staying with us here on r.t. r t years on from the fall of colonel gaddafi in libya the euphoria of the revolution has all but gone today armed militias and islamist rule much of the country fighting over territory smuggling routes and shares of drilling oil revenue to top that off desperate gover

libya has pushes little to be applauding. with the us i'm not sure it will be right to assume that there's a government in libya there's no army no police militias are in control is violent chaos the. militia violence stalks the jihadist groups are growing strength wishing to cripple the oil industry and economic stagnation is everywhere with all the bad negative things that they will say about that they those that. control it by force the situation of these device divided countries libya mr duffy is far from the key days of the with the new shinobi euphoria human rights watch says a wave of assassinations has killed dozens of politicians activists judges and members of security agencies all we hear is very. very troublesome because we hear about clandestine detention centers. detention centers that are run by militias that are not accountable to anybody these armed militias reportedly have more power than the government turning the country into a new kind of ways not make extremism over the past few weeks we kind of can see the need to be open to the south libya is becoming the main base for al qaeda in the maghreb we also kn

libya. the russians felt very much duped by the americans. they had abstained from vetoing the resolution to allow the use of force in libya, and then what endedup happening was not, you know, the use of force was much more than they had anticipated and then gadhafi ended up getting killed. this really, really rattled putin. then you had the protests, the kind of anti-kremlin protests that broke out around the time of putin's return to power. and the kremlin chose to take an anti-american line in not accusing then secretary of state secretary clinton of almost orchestrating the protests. things just kind of snowballed from there. things haven't been going well for about two years, a year and a half, and the snowden thing i think was really just the last straw. >> and chrystia, isn't the awkward reality here that this anti-americanism actually plays well in russia? is that fair? >> well, i agree with you, fareed, and i would double down on that argument. you know, i've seen some people talk about the cancellation of this summit as a blow for putin, and i think that nothing could be further from the truth. i think that what we're seeing in russi

us now from somerset in england. thank you for being with us. how much of a connection is there, then, to these prison breakouts in places like iraq, pakistan, libya, and the warnings that we heard? >> there is a from a logical connection, but it is doubtful the recent escapees could have been able to plan coordinated activities against embassies. i think that the closures are precautionary. >> in your experience as a former intelligence man, what sort of information might have tipped them off in this case? clearly, they have had some information to lead them to believe that some sort of attacked would take place. let's say that they intercepted a communication between two terrorist cells saying something along the lines of -- the bombs are ready and we will use them against the embassy next week. you do not know what they there were talking about, which embassy there were talking about, all you know is that something is trying to happen next week. when that happens, you err on the side of caution. >> the warning issued by the u.s. state department a couple of days before, there are of course political overtones with a number of lawmakers in washi

us. let's take a look now at some other news making headlines around the world the brutal military crackdown in egypt to use to stoke international anger this time in libya where crowds gathered in front of the country's embassy in tripoli branding egypt's army chief a killer of innocents they demand he be brought down to justice brought to justice i should say for the victims of the anti morsi crackdown at the same time libya itself is struggling with controversial militias who gained substantial policing power at the ousting and execution of colonel gadhafi. america's national security agency has broken the law over a thousand times every year that's according to an internal audit and documents edward snowden leaked to the press they say that since gaining sweeping powers back in two thousand and eight the n.s.a. has been legally spied on american nationals and foreigners if confirmed it openly contradicts president obama's declaration that the n.s.a. operates within the law. all deadly weather fronts continue to batter china after both a typhoon and a tornado wreaked mass destruction and their rescue operations are underway after the tropical storm le

only friends in mali for example the french were helping put a filter used to fight against terrorists and from this illegal groups. which were armed and supported by the french be in libya so even if the us so here we should step back from their personal political remove likes and dislikes we have to determine the main threats that is terrorism that extremism millicent arms trafficking. accumulation of weapons in the. a lot of them are allowing the weapons to go into the hands of the illicit armed groups and this creates huge threats this water we should discount but not probably the fact that the letters just deal with syria forgetting everything else it happened so in libya and it had happened so in iraq unity salutes to conclude that there may be consequences and implications for arab world were not taking into account. and the fact that external players are being involved in this conflict forcibly involved in this or that conflict in the middle east and in the north of africa this fact could lead to. the aggravation of the initiate. when we see the likes and dislikes in the islamic world we shouldn't forget that islam school so through which. the including during ou

in other communities. i. thanks for staying with us here on r.t. now two years on from the fall of colonel gadhafi in libya the euphoria of the revolution has all but gone today armed militias and islamist through much of the country fighting over territory smuggling routes and shares of drilling oil revenue to top that off desperate government is quietly reactivating colonel gadhafi is feared surveillance a parrot is using it to hunt down the dissenters are his policy reports on the sobering anniversary. anniversaries are often a time of celebration for two years on libya has pushes little to be applauding. i'm not sure it will be right to assume that there's a government in libya there's no army no police armed militias are in control is violent chaos the. militia violence stalks the jihadist groups are growing strikes threaten to cripple the oil industry and economic stagnation is everywhere with all the bad negative things that they say about that they those that. control it by force the situation of these device the by the countries libya post gadhafi is far from the haiti days of the with the new sho

both in the case of the former yugoslavia and that of iraq in libya the us and its allies have effectively carried out a regime change although the un mandate was to protect civilians we came we saw he died. because we acted quickly a humanitarian catastrophe has been avoided but for many libyans a humanitarian catastrophe has just started as the nation plunges deeper into chaos and tear like in iraq where the intervention was followed by a decade of terror for those wondering what awaits american politicians found to have light no weapons over there. should be under here. to check on r.t.e. washington d.c. . u.s. officials though say a direct hits on chemical weapons storage sites would be too dangerous so instead they want to cripple assad's forces capable of delivering the warheads such damage to the military would give a huge boost to the rebels who have recently been losing ground artie's can do to actually read tons and says this is all playing into the hands of the terrorist groups the national security council of britain is meeting because david cameron the prime minister. foreshor

in bosnia or libya. a hoard sale for a war-weary nation. cruise missiles useden in the last 20 years in iraq, in afghanistan and in libya. with the u.s. navy adding fire power in the mediterranean, now considered the most likely option if there is to be a military response in syria. >> there is no point in just firing a weapon, dropping a bomb to drop a bomb. i think you have to start by building a coalition of the willing around a regional organization. >> reporter: a mission to eliminate syria's chemical weapons could trigger more problems. >> obviously if you go in and try to secure the weapons themselves, now you are getting into a whole other area of risk involved of what are the potential fallout with the players involved around russia, just for make two. >> reporter: a final decision is expected in the coming days. mike, al jazerra, washington. >> now as mike just mentioned, the obama administration is considering a range of possible military options. in fact, there is already a military presence in syria's surrounding areas. navy officials have told al

the question for us in libya, don't just judge what goes on in benghazi.ir other places places that have affect the way worked out and solved many issues without having to go to the resource of arms. arms and killing and tensions between some of the tribes that have been in the western mountains between some of the tribes in the south. in the east, which is known to be the tribal basin of libya just shows that it is not the tribes. it is an animosity that can be created and who feeds it and who ignites? there are many speculations. to conclude the civil society organizations can and have shown they can stand up to the arms groups. >> anybody else? >> i would completely agree. i would say a few things. number one, civil society is a much better place than i was a tunisian civil society at this point when it comes to the blurred line between political party versus civil society organization. you cannot have resistance becoming more political residents in asia it is so blurred it's really difficult to for that political party has. i would say it is a huge pos

business desk and as one of our he's been up to the week nearly lost in the last week receiving really close corporate used to libya's all industry the country's lifeline is in danger of destruction as ports guard strikes continue to disrupt the country's exports with an estimated loss of one point six billion dollars the lawlessness at the ports has been caused by competition between members of the nudie placed petroleum facilities gas made up of ex militia members fighting amongst themselves the selling of the country's oil for personal gain and the country is reliant on or like sports accounting for ninety five percent of all output the produces shipments have been cut to their lowest level since the civil war twenty eleven with some estimating just three hundred thousand barrels a day are being shipped out of the country.

ahead as well about what he's been up to the week nearly lost in the last week or to be really close to that corporate used to the big libya's oil industry the country's lifeline is in danger of destruction as ports god strikes continue to disrupt the country's exports with an estimated loss of one point six billion dollars the losses the ports has been caused by competition between members of the new day placed petroleum facilities god made up of x. militia members fighting amongst themselves the selling of the country's oil for personal gain of the country is reliant on or like sports accounting for ninety five percent of all output produces shipments have been cut to their lowest level since the civil war twenty eleven with some estimating just three hundred thousand barrels a day are being shipped out of the country now so for more insight into the libyan oil industry and the economy as a whole and joined by stewart and it from plants what challenges faced in libya right now both oil industry and their economy. well i think it's fair to say that libya's oil sector at the moment is in a total state of chaos remember three

both in the case of the former yugoslavia and that of iraq in libya the us and its allies have effectively carried out a regime change although the un mandate was to protect civilians we came we saw he died. because we acted quickly a humanitarian catastrophe has been avoided but for many libyans a humanitarian catastrophe has just started as the nation plunges deeper into chaos and care like in iraq where the intervention was followed by a decade of care for those wondering what awaits american politicians found to have light no weapons over there. should be under here. going to check on r.t.e. washington d.c. for me is the opium diplomat and an expert on the middle east mohamad haasan says syria will not be broken down by washington's war tactics. united a says just invents in order to achieve it is objective it has invented the most destruction weapon we have seen that in the security council that it is the former state department head the general colin powell of how he lied to the whole international community and it's a shame on him again and african origin president who is leading th

both in the case of the former yugoslavia and that of iraq in libya the us and its allies have effectively carried out a regime change although the un mandate was to protect civilians we came we saw he died. because we acted quickly a humanitarian catastrophe has been avoided but for many libyans a humanitarian catastrophe has just started as the nation plunges deeper into chaos and care like in iraq where the intervention was followed by a decade of terror for those wondering what awaits american politicians found to have light no weapons over there. should be under here. to check on our t. washington d.c. . tonight a country now that has witnessed u.s. military intervention iraq is still suffering from a spiral of violence and terrorist attacks that continues to claim thousands of lives every year on wednesday a series of coordinated bomb attacks in the country in the country's capital killed more than sixty people in the left dozens more injured restaurants markets and parking lots in predominantly shiite areas were targeted by the attackers violence in the country has been on the rise

both in the case of the former yugoslavia and that of iraq in libya the us and its allies have effectively carried out a regime change although the un mandate was to protect civilians we came we saw he died. because we acted quickly a humanitarian catastrophe has been avoided but for many libyans a humanitarian catastrophe has just started as the nation plunges deeper into chaos and tear like in iraq where the intervention was followed by a decade of terror for those wondering what awaits american politicians found to have light no weapons over there. should be under here. to check on r.t. washington d.c. . well we get some insight into what a military intervention into syria could maybe bring when we're joined by a former british naval officer in just a couple of minutes here on out. wealthy british style. markets why not. find out what's really happening to the global economy is a report on our choose your language to. make it without. the consent you. choose to give to. choose the stories to. choose access to. is sixty minutes past eight i have more with r.t. top story than the u.k. in

both in the case of the former yugoslavia and that of iraq in libya the us and its allies have effectively carried out a regime change although the un mandate was to protect civilians we came we saw he died. because we acted quickly a humanitarian catastrophe has been avoided but for many libyans a humanitarian catastrophe has just started as the nation plunges deeper into chaos and tear like in iraq where the intervention was followed by a decade of care for those wondering what awaits american politicians found to have light no weapons over there. should be under here. to check on r.t.e. washington d.c. . while the u.s. gears up for a military campaign against syria newly declassified data has revealed that twenty five years ago washington actually encouraged iraqi dictator saddam hussein to use chemical weapons in his war against iran syrian political analyst amar will call values that what it comes to washington stands on his country chemical weapons are just a side issue. they are definitely benefiting from the level of ambiguity that surrounds the perpetrator who did this they're try

the tape you showed of obama speaking about the intervention in libya and using a humanitarian explanationnd justification shows how completely incoherent the policy is. the only constant in all of this is obama as a candidate, as a senator, decided we should be out of these wars, we should be out of the middle east, the tide of war is receding, he repeats it, and pretends it is true. that's the constant. we're not in iraq, not in syria, not in libya. we're getting killed in libya as we did. we're not in egypt. we are doing nothing. all the other actors are in play. jihadists, russians, hezbollah, not the united states. we are irrelevant. >> you were gone monday, juan sat in that seat and said support the military in egypt. >> absolutely. >> you try to act like me on the right and i am utterly sta lly scandalized. you're not getting the seat. >> i am not after it. >> of all the incidents that happened in the past two years really targeting christians, all of these countries there have been many incidents of killings and church burnings, not only coptic christians but different christians i

used. >> so, in libya, the government's weapons were no match for the u.s. military.de quick work of that. but with syria, it's a different story because syria actually has an effective arsenal. >> well, it has an arsenal. syria does not have long history of having a real effective military. in fact, the success that they've had has always been a success against their own people. outside their own borders they've enjoyed very little success, at all. in fact, israel has had their way with syrians in military conflicts before. they have tanks and artillery and convention al missiles. they have an array that the insurgents have in some cases, but not entirely. this fight really favors assad's regime. in fact, as we've seen over the course of the last few months, they increased their strength and their momentum. >> a last question because we heard many military experts say go big or go home. if you do surgical strikes, you better do it for a sustained period of time and really leave a mark. >> carol, that is exactly correct. you either go to win. the definition of win is

use the most heinous weapons against the most vulnerable people. >> what are the options? american boots on the ground already ruled out by the white house. a no-fly zone as in bo bosnia or libyasell for a war-weary nation. cruise missiles used often in the last 20 years in iraq, in afghanistan and in libya, with the u.s. navy adding fire power in the mediterranean. it's considered the most likely if there's a military reaction in syria. >> there's no need to drop a boams to stop a bomb. >> obviously if you go in and try and secure the weapons themselves now you're getting into a whole 'nother area of risk involved of what are the potential fallout with some of the proxy players around russia just to name two. >> a final decision is expected within days. mike vequera washington. >> meanwhile the u.n. inspectors are pushing on with their work, the inspectors say they were able to interview witnesses and collect evidence on monday. ban exphoon says he is confident, spite a week after the attack took place. >> our team are are returned and proceeded to the suburb of damascus to carry on their investigation. >> and owall street, shares dropped during the final hours of trading aft

even in libya, the war powers resolution in the united states is not being used. it might be that this is not a war, this is a human rights issue. innocent people are being murdered. setting that aside, the use of economists drones will develop very quickly. i do not think -- autonomous drones will develop very quickly. i could make you a killer autonomous robots within two weeks if i wanted to. the united states is concerned not to kill a lot of civilians, of course, but the problem with these weapons is they cannot -- computer systems cannot discriminate their targets. they cannot tell the difference between a combatant and a civilian. by 2020 at the very latest, the systems will be deployed. they do not know how to be proportionate. as you mentioned earlier, a lot of this war is on one side and that site will be the high-tech countries. any countries will have them. as soon as these are developed, they are very hard to think of the ideas, very hard to develop them, but once they are developed, they're not so difficult to copy. china is developing -- it is a ful

painful experiences we've seen before prior to western involvement in iraq in libya for instance insurgency it ran rampant but a peek at us presence walked hand in hand with foreign participation bringing along terror suicide bombings and even greater chaos to those regions. and online as well that closely forming international tensions bring over syria as well as this is on the ground. for a live update. on those on our website to give us governments assessment of the use of chemical weapons in the sewer in full you can read it closer i'm trying to find where washington's high confidence of assad is coming from. right the same. were struck. and i think you're. on the record. where we go now the u.k. government is pressing the new york times to destroy the documents leaked by n.s.a. whistleblower edward snowden the sensitive materials on the snooping activities of the you asked in britain made its way to the american daily newspaper from the u.k.'s guardian which was forced to a blue trace the hard drives going taining the leaked files however snowden's revelations have still been making their way to the public and here's

the tape you showed of obama speaking about the intervention in libya and using a humanitarian explanationustification shows how completely incoherent the policy is. the only constant in all of this is obama as a candidate, as a senator, decided we should be out of these wars, we should be out of the middle east, the tide of war is receding, he repeats it, and pretends it is true. that's the constant. we're not in iraq, not in syria, not in libya. we're getting killed in libya as we did. we're not in egypt. we are doing nothing. all the other actors are in play. jihadists, russians, hezbollah, not the united states. we are irrelevant. >> you were gone monday, juan sat in that seat and said support the military in egypt. >> absolutely. >> you try to act like me on the right and i am utterly sta lly scandalized. you're not getting the seat. >> i am not after it. >> of all the incidents that happened in the past two years really targeting christians, all of these countries there have been many incidents of killings and church burnings, not only coptic christians but different christians in al

libyas in his lifetime. >> for so long the news has been the personality. gadhafi turned up to open a shopping center, to open an envelope. those of usho knew libya, who knew there was another libya and wonderful people, we would talk about it as you talk about a dead person. do you remember this? do you tlaer? then in february, 2011, suddenly there was resurrection. the dead came back to life. >> we meet at a libyan coffee house. a traditional, male only sort of joint. cafe culture is big here, a holdover from the days of italian colonization when mussolini tried to rebuild rome's long lost empire. >> it's just been the most amazing experience seeing the rebirth of a country, of a people. >> last night's fireworks. exuberance bordering on anarchy. i felt very happy if somewhat in peril. >> it's christmas. it is the 4th of july rolled into one. but it also, there are people who are trying to stop it, puritans, extremists, you want to say militants. what has happened is people have come out in defiance of that. they're showing, we want to have fun. remember for a long time in libya you couldn't have fun. the biggest misconception is t

in libya. i would like to thank you for the national endowment for democracy, because they have been, in the last 10 years, backing uswork. thank you. to talk to you about the role of civil society today, this eemed like a far-fetched possibility two years ago. those who know the situation in libya, we combat the regime for many years. to see its end suddenly, the way it had, was beyond our imaginations. the fight for freedom in libya started in 1969 area i am a witness of that personally. it manifested in a new forum during february, 2011. many people sacrificed their lives, for the deliberation of libya. even with the turbulent transition we are seeing, i just wanted to share this reflection with you. with regard to the current environment in libya, i will touch base on a few points, then try to emphasize. the security issue is number one, number two, and number three in the country. we have the armed groups, who are really the defect oh our -- de facto power in our country. we have a nation army in the nate -- in the making. they have not been able to take our -- take charge of the country. we have attacks on poli

and those destroyers out there cost us about $1.8 billion, and each of the missiles is about $1.5 million, and that's in a $500 billion budget. another good model is libya. the laboren invasion that lasted 70 days cost us only $1 billion over and above what we had in the regular budget. >> here is the interesting thing about red line and red ink, if you don't get your debt deficits under control in the near term, this kind of situation, a generation from now is something you can't react to, because you don't have room in the budget because you are paying all the interest, but right now there is plenty of room for the u.s. to do what it wants to do? >> right now there is. over ten years if you see a sequester, the problem is cutting everything equally, and that means your other accounts as chuck hagel was talking about, your training and things like that, that could hurt us because if you stop training in a couple years the forces will not be able to do what they need, or if you can't buy the ships in the numbers you would like because you have to cut ships, planes and tanks and let's say you don't want tanks, you want ships, no, you have to cut them all

i'm not going to use a cookie cutter strategy for every foreign policy crisis in front of us. the way he handled libyabout against syria. syria has been using chemical weapons -- >> but a much larger scale tactic than before. this possibility he'd get more international support this time around. >> clearly not. i agree exactly -- i think exactly the opposite. he would have gotten much more international support two years ago than he does now. he has no international support. >> he just started making the case. i don't know if we can judge that. >> the case inside the halls of power was made a long, long time ago. we all agree you're not allowed to use chemical weapons. if we are serious about making sure that no chemical weapons are to be used, we -- the time to make the case was, you know, 14 attacks earlier. >> that's one of the questions that hangs over this, too, is we -- chemical attacks on civilians, you talk about the international -- it is an atrocity. there are also 100,000 people who have been killed over the last two years. and it does seem strange on some level that this is what -- this is

painful experiences we've seen before prior to western involvement in iraq in libya for instance insurgency it ran rampant but a peek at us presence walk hand in hand with foreign participation bringing the long terror suicide bombings and even greater chaos to those regions. well we always invite you to get involved with our stories here on r.t. today we're asking a what do you think military intervention in syria would result in you just go to r.t. dot com right now get involved with our latest world wide web poll and see how the numbers are stacking up for this hour right here on the program though the majority there the majority saying that a catastrophic conflict would result perhaps engulfing the entire region including israel and iran now about a fifth who say well they foresee a libya like scenario coming out of it with possibly a huge amount of vibrations still to come years of possible violence in islamic insurgency as well a few less the believing that a washington won't dare attack syria on its own and now down to the bare handful here they're saying that the except obama's claim that the strikes will be short