joining us is the chairman of the transportation committee, senator mark desaulnier of concord. get to it. caltranssaid there is no cover up and that they didn't tell people not to put things in writing. what is your read? >> i don't believe them. i think they're lying. >> it's simple as that? >> we're halfway through the investigation and we're going to bursue it. if you listen -- pursue it. if you listen to the testimony, three caltrans employees and one very well-respected expert from a contractor in charge of quality insurance. if you listen to the response from caltrans, it was pretty clear to me they were lying. >> this is about welds on the bridge. the bridge was fabricated in china. and going in from the onset, it was -- there was debates about the work being done. would you have had those specs written out in advance and said this is what we want up to this standard and no questions asked, instead of debating on what is good or not this big? >> they were. the head of the quality insurance, one of the most respected contract experts in welds told them you have a problem.