as you know ellen rattner doesn't let you get by with anything. she will tell you right now in an unfiltered tone and i mean it with all flattery. ellen has been a wonderful friend. c-span: where do you live now? >> guest: near columbus ohio which i used to share -- are narrowed governor and the current congressman pat t. berry. c-span: married twice, divorced twice. current relationships? >> guest: no. c-span: kids? >> guest: two kids and a grandchild. right to go back to the prison. the thought of public officials being in prison and the experience is rarely written about and you put it here on paper. what was it like in the first couple of days am a kind of a cell where u.n.? you mentioned there was a toilet in the cell with you. it does serve the people? >> guest: the toilet is if you are put into solitary confinement. the shue as i mentioned and i mention that because if you get in trouble that's where you are placed with another person and is not a good place to be. c-span: did you ever get in trouble? >> guest: i do get in trouble once becau

>> guest: the first time i got out of prison in 2008 i was working for ellen rattner and she wanted to go to the house dining room with some reporters for dinner. i said i'm not going to go to the dining room. i have a lot of shame. i had a lot of friends at the capital but it's not good for me i didn't feel. so she said just walk over and as i walked in i have my former members card that has my picture on it when i was a member and i will never forget this. the police officer is standing there and he says welcome back mr. chairman. that card is not needed here. i walked into the house dining room and a couple of lady started crying and i saw some members. they said hello democrat and republican. better than i deserve. it was in awe of moment for me and i went back to the capital in 2008. c-span: do you get a pension? >> guest: i did get attention. i got pension early because all my money was gone. c-span: how much did your legal fees cost? >> guest: $518,000. part of it is paid in part of it is not paid. c-span: how did you raise the money for that? >> guest: that was legal but then s