now, with ferguson, with timir rice in cleveland, with what we saw of the horror of those fraternity brothers on the bus. how important are images, video telling the story? >> they are enormously important because they do show to a looking public what's going on, what people are doing, what's happening here in ways that you couldn't show them before. you could show photograph pictures of things but it would take a couple of days to get them out. but today, bam, bam, bam. whatever you want to see, you can see. >> so the selma march, the fact that the images went worldwide, how much of an effect did that have on the work that you all were doing on the ground? >> it had a tremendous effect. i mean it's almost i am measurable. you can't tell because here are these ordinary people, innocent people doing nothing at all, walking down the street, bam, bam, bam, please policemen jump upon them, beat them in this horrific way. all the sudden the world sees it in ways the world could not see such things before. so it was just a magic tra transformation in the way people learned these things. >>