i want to go back to the bannon for a second because carl rove, really no one closer to bush than carlremember him. our old friend carl rove was explicitly excluded from this principles committee level meeting that jeremy correctly describes because there was a feeling that obviously president can get advice from whomever they want. george w. bush believed when the campaign ended, the business of government was deadly serious. you shouldn't have even the appearance of a political advisor in the room. steve bannon isn't just any political advisor. he's the one that made donald trump answer questions about the alt right. he's the one who is the reason we know what the alt right is. he may be a honey bunch, i have no idea. as a political persona, esthhe terrifying to donald trump's -- you don't want somebody at the table who tear identify people. >> 70-year-old ideologues more malleable to this kind of thing? >> i have not seen anything that suggests donald trump is malleable in terms of wanting his way. he's not idea logical. i think on policy he's probably very malleable, but steve bann

remember carl rove when he sat in on one and axelrod. look the roll of the chairman of the joint chief of staffs has been did diminished with this reorganization. one person indispensable is the joint chief of staffs, in my view. stkeufplt than>> dickerson: thae to leave it there. >> dickerson: we turn now to keith he will i go son who joins us from minneapolis. defenders would say after the -- jimmy carter asked students to reports to immigration offices. during the obama administration they paused the iraqi refugee processing. what donald trump is doing here is maybe bigger but keeping with what previous presidents have done. >> you know what, we never have had a religious based ban before. this is a muslim ban, they can't deny it. on the campaign trail he said he wanted a muslim ban. he said on national television there would be other religious groups receiving priority. this is a muslim ban. rudy guiliani who helped him write it said they started with a muslim ban and then languaged it up to avoid that label. it is a religiously base

carl rove was never in a meeting that i cared about while i was director of the central intelligence agency. i think that's the right formula. >> general hayden, it's always good to have you on the show. thank you so much, sir. >> thank you. >> we turn now to capitol hill president trump's nominees for attorney general, secretary treasury have been delayed by democrats. how the cabinet confirmations were brought to a stand still today. that story next. never waver. ♪ because going around is rarely ever as enjoyable... ...as going right through. ♪ ♪ ♪ ♪ [and her new business: i do, to jeanetgo. jeanette was excellent at marrying people. but had trouble getting paid. not a good time, jeanette. even worse. now i'm uncomfortable. but here's the good news, jeanette got quickbooks. send that invoice, jeanette. looks like they viewed it. and, ta-da! paid twice as fast. oh, she's an efficient officiant. way to grow, jeanette. get paid twice as fast. visit quickbooks-dot-com. ...stop clicking around...travel sites to find a better price... the lowest prices on our hotels are always at hilton.

david axelrod did come to some of those meetings, george bush made sure that carl rove never did.is very unusual to have a political advisor, counterpoint from sean spicer is that he has military experience, seven years in the navy. but that is -- that hardly makes him a foreign policy advisor. he's a strategist. he is a big idea guy with right wing connection to breitbart. and interesting past, you know, gold man sachs, many careers. so he's obviously very close to the president. increasingly close to the president. as clearly is jared kushner from the proximity of the office right off the oval and also the president said, i want him to negotiate middle east peace, i want him involved in foreign policy. it does diminish and importantly we see a diminishment, or diminishing of michael flynn, the national security advisor, but it does put him on a par with other important figures and despite what spicer said and jeremy can bear me out on this, he was the chief of staff to leon panetta, there is a diminishing role if by invitation only you have the chairman of the joint chiefs and t

> there is a political wisdom, you know, there are, you know, books written abut lee atwater and carl rove -- karl rove, a playbook, a political person, a smart, political >> anybody who came up in the normal school of this is how you run a campaign, this is how you manage a crisis, throw that out, steve bannon, i believe, may be an evil genius, i believe they're operating on a different plane than the rest of us. and i think this is -- we have to sort of put ourselves and -- in his head, he's a radical, a revolutionary, a nationalist, everything we know about politics and that we've learned is a politic, it hurts us when it comes to understanding what they're doing. >> call me old fashioned, call me boring, i like a government that is not in total chaos all the time. that is not picking fights with our allies, the media, picking fights with the 1.4 million people who work inside of the government, i want to see a little bit of stability. this is the moment where i lodge for barack obama. >> and we haven't -- >> the white house go to the hill. there is, at a certain point, can you do a bun

he basically said, there is this character in every administration, valerie jarrett, carl road -- karl rove that is a label that has been put on steve bannon. >> there is no doubt that steve bannon has a clear worldview, a political perspective, very different, it is populist. i think it does form the basis of terms governing philosophy. it is good to have someone like that around. as the national security piece that has people wondering. i don't know if those concerns are legitimate or not. >> martha: tucker has got a show coming up tonight at 9:00. we won't give away anything, nothing that we just talked about will be repeated. we like surprises. good to see you. >> thank you, martha. >> martha: nice to be with you. who will be back with some of the final thoughts and tonight's quote of the night after this this. my friends think doing this at my age is scary. i say not if you protect yourself. what is scary? pneumococcal pneumonia. it's a serious disease. my doctor said the risk is greater now that i'm over 50! yeah...ya-ha... just one dose of the prevnar 13® vaccine can help protect you

. >> i saw former presidential staffer carl rove wrote about an encounter on his first day in the whiteate conversations. of course, they remain private. is in tears on that last morning to say goodbye. >> what's the hardest part of leaving? >> the hardest part of leaving the president or -- >> the president and the white house? >> you know, after i only spent four, four and a half years there, i got attached to both presidents, but, you know, leaving that house, i have to admit other than the presidents themselves, it really is the staff because we get to know each other and you keep that friendship even after you leave. >> admiral, thank you for your service and thank you for joining us today. we're seeing now the president and first lady preparing to leave. special air mission 28,000. that's what they're calling that plane right now. no longer air force one. final salute from his military aide. final honor guard, his head held high. >> pierre thomas, this farewell, touching for so many. >> indeed, george. you know, president obama, former president obama became a symbol of diversity