bob michael is still with me, kathy johns -- kathy jones, and doug peebles also. condary market continue to rally. that did not happen with campbell soup. they said maybe it is the beginning of the end for investment grade. what is your view? doug: it is nonanonymous switch, but they are slowing significantly. the liquidity that was available 12 months ago is a different level of liquidity now. it is a dimmer. we do not expect to see light out at any point in time. markets are behaving today more normal than they were 12 months a name and a concession in the marketplace. it prices and is not trade immediately stronger. we are digesting it, and from the day after issuance till now, it is doing well. jonathan: kathy? kathy: there was a huge amount of supply and the expectation of higher rates down the road. , everyone did not believe rates were got a go up and be higher six or 12 months from now. now if you are a buyer, you have to give concessions to discount that. jonathan: it is silly something you should take some time to look at and pay attention to pdc saw spot

still with me, bob michele, kathy jones and doug peebles.campbell soup, a lot of people use it as an example to say maybe it is the beginning of the end of the good times for investment grade credit. what is your view? douglas: i think it goes back to this discussion around the central bank. it is not an on-off switch, but they are slowing significantly. the liquidity has been available 12 months ago, it is a different level now. it is a dimmer. we don't expect to see lights out at any point in time, but markets are behaving today i think more normal than 12 months ago. namely, there is a name that comes up, a concession in the marketplace, it prices, it does not trade immediately stronger but we are digesting it and from the day after issuance until now, it is doing reasonably well. kathy: there has been a lot of supply to absorb, a huge amount of supply to absorb, and you have the expectation of higher rates down the road. a year ago, i'm not sure everyone believed rates would move up and be higher six months or 12 months from now. now if

morgan, kathy jones, and doug peebles.the good old days, 12 months ago, you could narrow through execution. they would go into the secondary market and then continue to rally. that didn't happen with campbell soup. a lot of people use it as an example to say maybe it is the beginning of the end of the good times for investment grade credit. what is your view? douglas: i think it goes back to this discussion we had around the central banks. it is not an on-off switch, but they are slowing significantly. the liquidity that has been available 12 months ago let's say is a different level now. again it is a dimmer. we don't expect to see lights out at any point in time, but markets are behaving today i think more normal than they were 12 months ago. namely, there is a name that comes up. there is a concession in the marketplace. it prices, it does not trade immediately stronger, but we are digesting it, and from the day after issuance until now, it is actually doing reasonably well. jonathan: kathy. kathy: there has been a lot