guiliani claims reporters have been asking questions about its occurrence, and guiliani is trying to make clear it did not happen. >> there wasn't another meeting, that has been leaked, but hasn't been public yet. that was a meeting, alleged meeting three days before. he says there was a meeting with donald jr., with jared kushner, with paul manafort, with gates, and possibly two others in which they out of the presence of the president discussed the meeting with the russians. we checked with their lawyers, the ones we could check with, four of the six. that meeting never, ever took place. it didn't happen. it is a figment of his imagination or a lie. >> reporter: this as guiliani ramps up attacks on michael cohen, going after him personally. >> the guy is unethical, he is a scumbag, he is a horrible person. >> reporter: and pushing back against the revelation that according to sources cohen claims he is prepared to tell the special counsel the president knew in advance about donald jr.'s meeting with the russians and approved to it. >> when you're lying, there's a trap. when we said

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the hacking is the crime. >> guiliani may not always sound that cogent or coordinated. look, he is on this media blitz for the white house from the past strategy, avoiding mentioning bob mueller by name, donald trump saying bob mueller has a conflict of interest. >> what's he referring to? >> a dispute i imagine he disclosed it to rosenstein when he appointed him because it involved something last year wasn't settled to this day. that's up to the president and mueller to describe. >> what's the conflict? >> i can't tell you. >> are you saying the business conflict mueller and president trump had, is that about his golf course. >> i'm not going to go any further. >> he's not going further on that. there were some specifics when guiliani talked about other alleged meetings before the trump tower meeting. >> the meeting with the russians, how can you be sure that the president didn't know before. it's he said she said. >> nobody can be sure of anything. in a situation like this you have two things that argue against cohen. two-on-one -- sorry, three things. then you get to

let me start with what we heard from rudy guiliani about the ground rules we have seen rudy guiliani laying down first in the "new york times" piece yesterday. he added some color to them this morning on the sunday shows. you're a former prosecutor, how reasonable are the demands we're beginning to see from rudy guiliani? >> they're absolutely unreasonable. i mean, there's just no investigation in the world, including one that involves the president, where the person who, you know, has evidence to offer, testimony to give, gets to say, show me -- show me some evidence first, and then i'll come in. and also, you know, i think we really have to take with a grain of salt everything that rudy guiliani says. as geoff said in his piece moments ago, guiliani has admitted everything he's doing right now is to sway public opinion. this isn't about getting to the truth. this isn't about getting to the bottom of this investigation of how russia, you know, influenced our election. this is about now trying to prevent the president from getting impeached. and so when he says mueller says this, mue

is that trump and guiliani definition of truth?mp, guiliani next to the word truth equals oxymoron. stay tuned. what does that tell you? >> giving the trump team a taste of their own medicine. even the stay tuned, a twist on trump's we'll see that he's fonld of. if you go back, look at where cohen has been the last few months, think about that time when michael avenatti was on anderson cooper show, holding that cardboard picture of him like a mugshot on a milk carton. probably feels like he has been a patsy or punching bag, probably wants to fight back now. has guy patrillo, now lanny davis, a democrat, someone that can go toe to toe with mayor guiliani. >> someone close to hillary and bill clinton. >> i am sure that goes over well with donald trump. one source says this is michael cohen's july 4th moment, in other words, declaration of independence from the president. >> quickly, gloria, what are you looking for at the big unveiling? >> everybody is looking for everything. you know, i think all of these choices are completely cons

that's what guiliani has said explicitly.bly whise considerin the circumstances to doing that. this will come to impeachment in congress or 2020, how the president is dealt with. so they're playing that political game. so what i see as the legal process progresses, the president and his allies attack the media, law enforcement, try to erode americans' ability to ascertain truth about the russian investigation, about wrongdoing that may have been done. that's their approach and frankly i think they're having some success in some corners, especially among trump's base with that approach. >> evan, of course, if you're applying pressure to people, the expense of defending yourself, pressure to your family and reputation, that's really serious. it is really not a political game, this is people's lives, their families, more pressure. the expense of having an attorney. >> hundreds of thousands just for the team he has. >> just retaining an attorney in these matters, these are serious. a person like michael cohen doesn't have billion

guiliani said he would not say yes or no. he said it's extremely inappropriate to talk about pardons at this time. he said there was no discussion at this moment. >> let's talk turkey for allege second. since we're all dealing from the same him nal or recording, you don't hear the president express surprise that someone setting up an llc to take care of it? >> no surprise from then-candidate trump. it's been deeply reported by the post and others that there's been a long-standing relationship with david pecker which is part of that whole thing with michael cohen, with trump. they've had this close nexus for along time. >> the president's pseudonym in court papers was david dennison. there's much speculation on the web as to which david they're talking acts. >> that's exactly right. >> i will not make you discuss that. can we get a charge for him? >> please save us. do you hear any laws being broken as you listen to that recording. >> so from a prosecutor's per suspectsive, what i see here, hear on this recording is a good pie

let me start with what we heard from rudy guiliani about the ground rules we have seen rudy guiliani laying down first in the "new york times" piece yesterday. he added some color to them this morning on the sunday shows. you're a former prosecutor, how reasonable are the demands we're beginning to see from rudy guiliani? >> they're absolutely unreasonable. i mean, there's just no investigation in the world, including one that involves the president, where the person who, you know, has evidence to offer, testimony to give, gets to say,

rudy guiliani is making the case that this is exculpatory. i have spoken to one source with knowledge of the tape who says that the conversation between trump and michael cohen is not as rudy guiliani described and the source went on to say that in fact the tape is not going to be good for donald trump but the source refused to elaborate. so brooke, here wave te have the of the tape. you have rudy guiliani saying this clears my client, and another source with knowledge of the tape saying not so fast, it doesn't clear your client. there is a tape somewhere, there is a transcript somewhere, somebody is going to have to make that judgment. >> you and i were just chatting, you were saying you worked mob cases and in this case, talking about the parallels, you always wanted access to the mob boss, and if you even had a recording of the mob boss, even better fon that person's case. what are the parallels? >> so the main parallel is you're trying to penetrate a closed, secretive organization, whether talking about the trump organization or the mafia

not sure if guiliani has ever done this before. oh, wait, he has. that he wanted comey to go easy on mike flynn. watch this. >> as a prosecutor, i was told that many times, can you give the man a break. either by his lawyers, by his relatives, by friends. you take that into consideration. but you know, that doesn't determine not going forward with it. >> all right. so joining me now, cristina greer, associate professor of political science at fordham university. tara dow dell, democratic strategist. ed mcmullin, former chief policy director of the house republican conference and gloria brown marshal associate professor at john j. college of justice and author of "the voting rights war." let's start with this admission we heard from guiliani here. i'm going to go with you. give me a reaction to what he just had to say. >> yeah, well, i think guiliani is -- he's in a terrible position, as is his client. president trump. >> they don't see it that way, though. >> well, i think they do. i think they have decided they're going to fight this battle. it's a

rudy guiliani was on "face the nation" i believe earlier today talking about this and fox news. let's take a listen to that. >> cohen said that he was present at two different meetings. present at a meeting with donald jr., jared, a group of other people, in which they talked about the meeting two days later with the russians. then he says he was president of the meeting the day of the meeting in the president's office, in which either donald jr., jared or a few people came in and told the president. every other participant in both those meetings say it is not true. there was no such meeting in advance. there was no such interruption. if he taped everything else, why the heck didn't he tape this? not on tape. >> so, danielle, there is a point to be made here in that if he were taping a conversation with don trump jr. about the payment that was made to karen mcdougal, which we all heard this week, why would he have not taped a conversation in which donald trump -- excuse me, donald trump and karen mcdougal, about the payoff to karen mcdowell involving donald trump our president,

rudy guiliani on behalf of the president says, there's nothing illegal here. you can talk about whether or not you agree that the conversation should have happened in a personal way but professionally as far as the president running for the highest office, there's nothing potentially criminal about what went on. then my question is, why are we looking a in the so deeply? is this point attorneys can pressure michael cohen. this was a referral from another conversation. >> i think that you hit on an interesting point right before the trump-putin summit. you had report a michael cohen was switching attorneys and start cooperating with the prosecution. that put heat on president trump at the time. it's interesting now that things have -- we had four days of trump and putin summit. thank you very much for your time. >> another fox news alert now. could we see trump-putin round two? this time in the white house. president trump is inviting vladimir putin to washington this fall. russia says it is open to the idea. the president warning in a new interview if their re

the only one that talked about the contents of it is rudy guiliani. may have waived privilege inadvertently. >> then your idea, michael, on the fact that the president has said and inferred that if there were some recordings between you and his attorney, that might be illegal. what is the case on that, if there were recordings and whether it was interaction with trump or other clients, how legal or illegal is that? >> two things. first, michael cohen recording with his clients, legal clients without their permission may be a violation of ethics rules which may jeopardize his practice, license to practice law. in new york whether or not one person recording without consent of the other violates new york statutes really is pretty fact dependent, so it may be that the recording violates new york law, it may be that it puts michael cohen's law license in jeopardy, and it may be something that's of interest to the federal prosecutors, the contents of which will fit into the examination of whether or not these payments or alleged payments violent federal el

guiliani clapping back alleging davis lied for president clinton and the original barb to guiliani thatohen should just tell the truth. >> are you concerned michael cohen will start cooperating with the feds? >> no. in fact, if he wants to cooperate, i think it's great. >> you have no concerns at all about anything michael cohen might tell you? >> as long as he tells the truth, we're home free. >> if he believes it's in his best interests to cooperate, god bless him, he should cooperate. >> davis not tipping anything about cooperating, there are reports cohen is ready to talk and kick off the lanny davis era, a coming in of one of those all important defense agreements. i'm joined by a. scott bolland and a fort lauderdale prosecutor. what does this mean? >> lanny davis has been with hillary clinton for decades. he's a 72-year-old lawyer ending a storied career. why would he take this case? my theory is this is payback. lanny davis believes donald trump, working with the russians, stole the election from hillary clinton. >> he wrote a book to that effect. >> yeah. now, he's representing

of events, though guiliani disputes that. essentially, we have a battle between michael cohen's lawyers and the president's lawyers. very significant. >> looming over all of this is robert mueller and his investigation. how could something like this play into the mueller investigation. does it say anything or signal anything about michael cohen's willingness to work with the special investigator? >> the legal matter related to michael cohen was initially unearthed by mueller's probe, mueller handed it over to investigators in the southern district of new york. that said, one thing i can tell you based on a conversation last week with a person familiar with what i'm speaking is that michael cohen's friends are urging him to affirmatively go to mueller and try to potentially bring contacts to the special counsel's attention. that doesn't mean he is going to or voluntarily is going to turn in anything. people in his orbit are pushing him to take that step. >> anyidea whether or not we see more tapes released in the future? >> my

guiliani seems to be confused. he expressly waived attorney-client privilege last week and repeatedly and inaccurately as proven by the tape, talked and talked about the recording, forfeiting all confidentiality. in the center ring is president trump and michael cohen. president trump retweeting a 2017 tweet from michael cohen that read cohen was proud of don jr.'s honesty and transparency. cohen's tweet coming on the very same day don jr. released e-mails about the russian meeting at trump tower. joining me now is msnbc white house correspondent, geoff bennett, christopher dickey, world news editor at the daily beast. also an msnbc contributor. and sara mchammond, covering the white house. geoff, i'm describing the main event, lawyers fighting lawyers. give us your perspective here on what's going on and what's going to happen next. >> where to begin, wolf. you begin with lanny davis saying that rudy guiliani waived some weeks ago. remember, after the fbi raided michael cohen's properties, a system was set up so s

rudy guiliani told nbc it was already out there so there seems no point in objecting except on principal. a source tells nbc news that on the tape they discuss whether to reimburse "national enquirer." the white house denies any affair took place. this morning president trump tweeted that it is inconceivable that a lawyer would tape a client totally unheard of and perhaps illegal. the good fuse is that your favorite president did nothing wrong. reverend al sharpton hosts politics nation and sat down with cohen yesterday. here is what he has to say about the meeting. >> he said, i want you to know, rev, i am not going to be the sacrificial lamb here. i'm going to do what is right for my family and i'm go doing do what is right for my country. he seemed to feel like i was out by my himself. that the president had not stood by him. he would say things like i have been loyal. but loyalty has not been given to me. and i think the fact that he reached out to me, someone very known to be a trump critic, sent a message both to trump and to the investigators that i'm not one you can depend on the

the president's attorney rudy guiliani scored a front row seat. somehow he must outrank the attorney general of the states sitting in the back. he was seen shake hands with rod o oez oezen stein. rosenstein. guiliani continued to represent foreign clients including pro ukrainian officials and the group designated as a terror group as recently as 2012. let's get all things supreme court, columnist and msnbc contribute or and a former attorney and assistant to the attorney general during checkpoint administration harry, good to see you. >> likewise. >> usually you are in new york or elsewhere. what road do you think the democrats have realistically to try to block this, given that mitch mcconnell controls the rules, senator grassley controls the timing and the questioning at the hearings. he's got the gavel. and the president has this huge lobbying effort under way. >> i think you answered your own question. it is a very uphill road to defeat this. >> what is their best path? >> their beth past is to have something we don't know about come forward,

watch fox news sunday where rudy guiliani will sit down for an interview. check your local fox stations for the listings or you can catch it here on fox news channel sunday at 2:00 p.m. and 7:00 p.m. eastern. >>> president trump is thanking kim jong-un as north korea has returned the possible remains of 55 u.s. service members killed in the korean war. is this a sign of progress after the summit? does this show that the regime is serious about denuclearization. live report with analysis, stay close. >> these are incredible american heroes will lay at rester on american soil. we honor the memory of every incredible american patriot who fought and died in that war. so, i needed legal advice, and i heard that my cousin's wife's sister's husband was a lawyer, so i called him. but he never called me back! if your cousin's wife's sister's husband isn't a lawyer, call legalzoom and we'll connect you with an attorney. legalzoom. where life meets legal. we all want to know you know, the new, new thing. with xfinity's retail stores, you can now see the latest. want t

you saw objectivity being the key word in what rudy guiliani said. he is trying to demonstrate they are not being active. the mueller team is out to get them, donald trump is right when he says witch hunt every time. so this is something they will continue to press and say in the weeks and months to come. >> let's turn to this reporting on manafort and this unnamed banker, who had advisory roles, the company was not involved with the administration, helped them get the $16 million in loans. what is the significance for a white house that says anything that manafort is charged with happened years before he was involved with the campaign, has nothing to do with trump or any of trump's associated? >> i think it sets them back a little bit. obviously, they want to continue to say, no, this is all foreign interest. this has nothing to do with us. but, once again, here we are. there are ties to the trump campaign. so they can no longer say, you know, there is nothing to see here, this is a witch hunt. because they can, there are ties now and mueller is try

it is not, collusion is not a crime. >> legal experts say technically guiliani is correct.ere are specific laws on the books that may campaign if the campaign is found to have collaborated with the russians. >>> president trump's former campaign chairman is going on trial today facing a series of federal fraud charges that could land him in prison the rest of his life. >> the trial is expected to focus on his lavish spending and off shore bank account. russia is looming large. >> reporter: this is the first trial out of the investigation by mueller of possible collusion between russia and trump's 2016 campaign. >> paul manafort has done an amazing job. he's here some place. where's paul? >> reporter: the trial is expected to the to make mention of collusion or russia but will give a wind into the nearly year-long investigation the white collar crime case arose from the broader mandate that sprung anything directly from its initial investigation. trump is trying to distance himself from his former campaign chairman. >> manafort has nothing to do with our campaign. but i feel

now the president's attorney, rudy guiliani, is calling cohenna liar, a cohen a liar. going on. how much does this reveal about how nervous donald trump is or people around him might be. >> so that seems to be the strategy from mayor guiliani and others to discredit cohen. we don't know what he said or reportedly said is true. just like cohen's credibility will be investigated, so will the credibility ultimately of the president and some of his spokespeople be challenged or called into question. mayor guiliani, you played a clip of him saying months ago he thought cohen was an honest, trustworthy individual. now shifting to cohen has been lying for days, years, you played that clip with sean hannity and trump jr. where he said no quickly and didn't emphasize the denial, but said there was nothing to tell from this meeting, focusing on that, rather than the fact of whether or not president trump or then candidate donald trump knew about the meeting. so credibility will be an issue. of course, cohen may have other information that can corroborate this, ultimately it will

he's lied all his life. >> back in may of 2018, rudy guiliani was defending michael cohen. saying that the fbi was heavy handed. they shouldn't gone in and taken all these documents. he's had a change of heart. i can understand why the white house would want him to have no credibility now, meaning cohen. two months ago they were defending him. >> it is kind of a comical hypocrisy there. cohen will have so much baggage. to have an attorney to defend to the death his client. who deprayed with not only recordings and leak of the recordings. he's following facing disbarment. that stacks up. >> if he was thinking -- if their idea is maybe this would make the prosecutors southern district of new york go easy on michael cohen for these other matters this taxi cab issue, doesn't this behavior to get really mad about these things? i don't see how it's helping his case. >> he is putting himself in an increasingly unattractive position to southern district of new york or the mueller team. >> what could happen, though, for don jr. who testified in front of congress couple of times. you

>> i know rudy guiliani and he's a fine man. a good lawyer. knew him when he was doing mob cases in new york when i was an fbi agent in chicago. i think he's having a bad week here. it appears to me there is no coordination between what the white house communication shop is doing or at least his lawyer shop is doing, i should say, the president and what this guiliani shop is doing, they have this go out and fix this thing. guiliani isn't really doing the legal work it appears to me, doing the pr work. i thought in the last couple of days he wasn't at his best. >> he said, just since he's been representing the president, he said some things not necessarily consistent as well. the last couple of days, you're right, not at his best. >> there's a japanese proverb that says only lawyers and painters can make white into black. think about it. history he's been on both sides of this issue. michael cohen a terrible -- great guy, and now an awful and terrible guy. i think you will see more of that as the pressure of this case mounts. the one that got m

guiliani said he didn't know he was being recorded. on the tapes, they discussed the right of buying the story from ami the parent company of "the enquirer." the recording was one of several seized by the fbi during a raid of cohen's hole room, apartment and office back in april. there are other tapes of michael cohen and powerful individuals the fbi seeds beyond the president that could be embarrassing on the tape according to a source familiar with those tapes. prosecutors in new york city are examining possible election investigation for sexual encounters with trump. stormy daniels received $130,000 to keep quiet about an alleged affair. she then sued trump over that agreement. daniels attorney is urging him to release the recordings. >> if michael cohen is a true patriot like he wants the american people to believe, then michael cohen should release all of the audio recordings and i will tell you for a fact, there is more than one. there is multiple recordings. all of them should be released for the benefit of the american public.

guiliani isn't really doing the legal work it appears to me, doing the pr work.ouple of days he wasn't at his best. >> he said, just since he's been representing the president, he said some things not necessarily consistent as well. the last couple of days, you're right, not at his best. there's a japanese proverb that says only lawyers and painters can make white into black. think about it. history he's been on both sides of this issue. michael cohen a terrible -- great guy, and now an awful and terrible guy. i think you will see more of that as the pressure of this case mounts. the one that got me, i will say this, don, if col collusion isn't a crime -- even if were a crime, my client didn't have anything to do with it or wouldn't have done it. boy, that's just close to being irresponsible with your language when this matter is that serious. i hope they go back and rehuddle up and come out of the gate a little stronger for his client. >> can you put the genie back in the bottle. i have to ask you about some news here, a new report in the "washington post." u.s.

rudy guiliani denies cohen's claims and accused him of lying in an interview with chris cuomo. >> he has been lying for years. >> reporter: that is not how he clarkized cohen weeks ago on cnn's state of the union. >> i do not expect michael cohen is going to lie, i think he will tell the truth. if he does that we are home free. >> it effectively brings the issue of collusion or conspiracy right no the president's feet. >> this claim wrapping up a week that saw a stunning fallout between the president and one of his closest confidants. >> thank you so much. >> the president does not have public events, he is staying at his golf resort in med minister, new jersey. good morning to you, sarah. >> reporter: good morning, martin. that's right, president trump is spending the week at new jersey amid the stwirl of unanswered questions surrounding that now infamous meeting at trump tower and his son and a russian lawyer, leaving the twhous yesterday, president trump refused to take questions of his former attorney michael cohen that cohen had advanced knowledge. trump and his legal team denie

the only recording featuring the president guiliani says has already been released. guiliani was asked why he described cohen as honest just weeks ago. >> i didn't know that he taped conversations surreptitiously. i didn't know he would grossly violate the attorney/client privilege. >> reporter: the pushback comes as president trump prepares to campaign almost daily he says to boost republican prospects in the midterm elections now 100 days away. a new cbs news battle ground tracker poll finds 43% of americans approve of the president's handling of trade issues and 50% support his stewardship of the economy, but the russia probe is divisive. almost half of republicans say the investigation makes them want to defend the president while 73% of democrats say it makes them suspect he did something wrong. errol barnett, cbs news, berkeley heights, new jersey. >>> still to come california veterans taking a stand for their cannabis. >> tonight they credit a kpix5 report for helping them keep their dispensary open, but their fight isn't over just yet. >> i got to do somethin

. >> guiliani telling nbc news the tape shows there was nothing criminal about the conversation and he insist nose payment ever occurred. >> so are you still maintaining then tonight that the recording that was released this evening is 100% exculpatory towards the president? >> there's no indication any of crime being committed on this tape. and that is absolutely right. i don't think anyone can suggest that this represents anything where the president did anything wrong. >> trevor: i love that the secret "playboy" affair hush money tape is the evidence to help trump, yeah. i mean, it can, but you have to admit, it will probably make an awkward dinner with melania. "great news, honey, the tape about my second mistress totally gets me off the hook." like "wow, everything coming up melania." ( laughter ) and, honestly, honestly, i agree with rudy guiliani here. and not with his decision to surgically replace his teeth with horse teeth, no. ( laughter ) i agree-- i agree that none of the stuff on this tape is impeachable. it's embarrassing and scandalous, but it's not criminal. but all le

so this, of course, comes as trump's current lawyer, rudy guiliani, is confirming to nbc news that the formally waived attorney client privilege over that tape we were referencing earlier. danny, you say this could be a, quote, all-trial strategy by trump's legal team. could the president be making his case for the public, not necessarily for the courts? walk us through your thinking here. >> okay. if trump's team already views these tapes as going over old ground, maybe they're using an old trial strategy, which is, get out the damaging information about yourself, put it out there on direct. put it out there in your own case in chief so that later on, you don't get lambasted with it on cross-examination or by the defense when they put up their case. but whatever the decision is, we can reasonably assume that rudy guiliani and trump's defense team balanced out the risk and reward here. and they concluded that whatever risk of releasing this information, the fact -- which evidences that trump had extra marital affairs and may or may not have paid people off. they must view that as not a

the president's personal attorney rudy guiliani said that payment was never made.rence jones is a radio host and conservative commentator. lawrence what do you make? >> it's interesting. i don't know any attorney goes around recording their client's conversation without their permission. it's going to be interesting. i'm interested to see how -- i saw lot of democrats on twitter talking about this and using this as a way to attack the president. i don't think american voters care about this issue. they knew what they were getting when they got donald trump. from a legal standpoint, michael is going to have problems with the president. >> when your fixer turn on your and starts recording your conversation, that's probably a problem. donald trump is probably nervous today. because it's embarrassing. there maybe no legal problem here, although they are looking into whether there were campaign contribution violations in either this payment or the payment to stormy daniels. there maybe legal issues. this is embarrassing. lawrence maybe right, i'm in columbus, ohio, vote

who has more credence, guiliani or cohen?, cohen, it may be very possible that cohen has been lying, yes. we know the president has been lying. what their fear has to be is not just credibility versus credibility but what does cohen have that is evidentiary, what e-mail does he have, what contract did he execute, what meeting can he corroborate with another witness. and these are years and years of transactions. and everyone believes that mr. cohen was the dirty deed player for the president. and who knows what he has that can be corroborated. it is not just going tobac b be cohen's credibility versus the president's, it is what evidence can cohen produce or corroborate, and i think it is a very, very bad sign for the white house. >> all right. governor andrew cuomo, appreciate you taking time to talk with us today. thank you so much. >> thank you for having me on your show. i'm still waiting for invitation from one of your other shows. >> who might that be. we'll see what we can do. thank you so much, governor. >> thank you.

. >> they're saying he can use social media, rudy guiliani is making the case jeffrey is talking about to obstruct justice, why would he do it in plain view. you can look at some of these tweets and say this is kind of witness tampering. i went back and looked at the 40 plus questions that teemu ler gave to trump's attorneys months ago saying, these are some of the things we'd be interested in. one of them was, for example, what was the purpose of your may 12th, 2017 tweet? that was the tweet in which he said to comey, you better hope there are no tapes. so they're already interested in tapes. then he said, what was the purpose of your september and october statements including tweets, regarding james comey? what was the purpose of your july 17 tweet regarding mr. sessions? it's very clear that if they're going to make an obstruction argument and we don't know that they will, they have to piece together, it's tough, you guys are the lawyers, it's tough, they'd have to piece together some kind of mosaic that went to trump's intent, which is what they want to ask him about if they ever g

we do know this was a secret tape, according to rudy guiliani. in that donald trump claims he didn't know at the time he was being recorded. michael cohen did this without donald trump's knowledge. and we also know that this was a recording that was taken in by the fbi as part of its gigantic raid of michael cohen's home and office some months ago. we also know based on dana and gloria's reporting that there are other recordings of michael cohen speaking to donald trump. that of course is very significant, again, that there are other recordings involving the president. and we also know that of the recordings that were taken, also include recordings of cohen talking to other significant people. now, back to the woman at the center of all this, karen mcdo you goal, former playboy model that alleges she had a ten month long affair with donald trump years ago. i want to play a sound bite of her interview with anderson cooper, the only sit down she's done on camera. she doesn't mention recordings, conversations between michael cohen and donald trump,

later on the broadcast, we'll talk to president trump's lawyer, rudy guiliani. next, the fight over the supreme court and a reality check on north korea. the panel is next, so stick around. i wa able to turn the aircrafound, a, and was able to save two men's lives that night. my first job helped me to grow up pretty quickly. that'll happen when you're asked to respond to a coup. in 2001, i signed up for the air force. two days later, 9/11 happened. l.this is your wake-up c if you have moderate to severe rheumatoid arthritis, month after month, the clock is ticking on irreversible joint damage. ongoing pain and stiffness are signs of joint erosion. humira can help stop the clock. prescribed for 15 years,nd humira targetslocks a source of inflammation that contributes to joint pain and irreversible damage. humira can lower your ability to fight infections, including tuberculosis. serious, sometimes rsfatal infections and can including lymphoma, have happened; as have blood, liver, and nervous system problems, serious allergic reactions, and new or worsening heart

guiliani and a lot of russia developments. and the biggest of all of president trump's announcement in the next week, of course, is his pick for the supreme court, which we wi find out tomorrow evening. but we're going begin with a ory that the entire world is watching right now. and that is the rescue attempt to g those 12 boys and a soccer coach out of caves in let me go to bill neely right now in chang rai, thailand where it appears we have a good news ending so far. bill, what can you tell us right now? >> reporter: yeah, good morning, chuck, from a very rainy northern thailand. and just a few minutes ago, the third and fourth of those boys went past here in ambulances. so four of the 13 -- the 12 boys and their coach now in the hospital receiving medical treatment. they came down the jungle path ambulances. the first two just a few hours ago. and let me bring youight up to date, because as we speak, there is a news conference going on with the rescue commanders. first of all, confirming fourow children are free and in the

. >> rudy guiliani, he said the investigation should end, and why should they end it now? they continue to turn over evidence and see where this leads? >> anderson, that has been going on for a year now. the fact of the matter is even with this today there's nothing that ties in or connects or says the campaign did anything wrong. at a certain point here, i mean, where is this fishing expedition end? >> we don't want to get any more russians? why wouldn't you be concerned about the investigation going on? as you say, it has not indicated anybody in the trump campaign, but it has netted -- it has named, you know, more than a dozen russians so far. isn't that a good thing and shouldn't that continue so we get to the bottom of what happened in the attack on this country? how else will we get to the bottom of the attack on our country? >> here's, anderson, where i will have to agree more with rudy guiliani and disagree with where you are trying to go, and some on the political left want this to keep going until they hopefully find something that may be gets at president trump

. >> the president's attorney rudy guiliani says that the president is incident. it's time for mule tore ends this pursuit and say so. the logic here, because there were no americans and the president, himself, was not mpgsed in his latest diernlths america must not be involved. what's your take? >> well, it is mind biologying to me. here we have specific evidence, how, where and why an attack on the american people. on the core of our democracy and the republican party is saying something which is not true. which shows there was no cluchlgs where acollusion. where are the statements of condemnation on that attack. rudy guiliani and my republican colleagues are completely uninterested in the nature of the attack perpetrated on our democracy. all they are interested in is defending the president. as a technical matter the indictments yesterday are silent on the question of whether there was collusion. >> that does not mean mueller is not pursuing leads, evidence, other things he quite likely is following up on the question of collusion and obstruction, clooeter of

in the "new york times" and the washington post today, including by the president's tomorrow rudy guilianis concerning a discussion between president trump and his then attorney michael cohen about a claim that was being made against then businessman donald trump. >> that communication would plainly be an attorney/client communication. cohen representing trump in connection with a claim being made by mcdougal some that then raises the question, how can this be lawfully released? and it can be lawfully released if the conversation was in furtherance of a crime or a fraud by mr. trump or mr. cohen or both of them. >> so the privileged conversation put up that second slide again, i love the way he's walked us through it. a privileged conversation may be lawfully disclosed if the court has found it to be in furtherance of a crime or fraud. we don't know how this ended up in the public domain, but are you pos iting the idea that perhaps it's because the special master looking over the totality of all that evidence seized from cohen has determined it falls under the crime/fraud exception to the

now his attorney rudy guiliani is attacking the credible. >> man is a liar a proven liar. there is no way you will bring down the president of the united states on the testimony uncorroborated of a proven liar. i germany tee you, this guy is a proven liar. >> reporter: when just a few weeks ago, guiliani seemed to have plenty of faith in con's truthfulness. >> if he believes it's in his best interest, god bless him. i do not think he will lie. he will tell the truth given his recollection, if he does that, we are are home free. >> even though cohen was an avid taper, sources say he doesn't necessarily have an evidence, no tape, for instance, to corroborate his version of events so this could ends up being his word against president trump's. well, russian president vladimir putin says, he is ready to visit washington. he informally invited the u.s. are the to moscow. he says any meeting between them must be under the right conditions. so interesting to follow the russian investigation at the same time these two leaders are working to meet up with each other again. let's tal

plus the president's attorney rudy guiliani weighs in on the new allegations against mr. trump from his long time fixer, michael cohen. also hear from republican who is not happy with the impact of those tariffs on his home state, ron johnson, a new hampshire democrat. we have new polling from our battleground tracker about america's views on president trump's trade policies and its impact on the mid term elections. plus analysis onnall." thes good morning and welcome to "face the nation." we begin todayÑi with president trump's attorney rudy guiliani who is in our new york broadcast studio this morning, mr. mayor, thank you for joining us. the president told cbs news earlier this month he still wants to speak to special council robert mueller. so, when, where, what format? >> welk youÑi know, we have been distracted on all kinds of things starting with peter and the horowitz report now michael cohen surprising all of us. >> brennan: is that is what is holding up your negotiations? >> keeps us away from it. specid of tied up, although quietly getting ready for the manafor

rudy guiliani and the rest of the president's team have been very effective in the absence of -- there was a big lag in the indictments and the first one was kind of hard to understand. and so the public opinion has been waning when it comes to this investigation. and so it hasn't been just the base. it is expanded and that is why you've actually seen -- and i've heard from republicans who have said that they actually think that this russia investigation is a political plus because people think, oh, it is just the media and the deep state going after this president. >> well tell that to paul manafort and michael cohen. i have to go because we're over but i enjoyed the conversation and i appreciate you joining us on a friday night. have a great weekend. >>> when we come back, rod rosenstein said he briefed the president earlier this week on the robert mueller indictment of 12 russian intelligence officers so why did president trump say this about vladimir putin? >> he's not my enemy. and hopefully some day maybe he'll be a friend. it could happen. ♪ this is a story about mail and packag

important point dana made about rudy guiliani as well. when these lawyers are speaking, they have a client. when we're listening to what rudy guiliani says, it is because he is representing donald trump, so his public statements are in donald trump's interest. when michael avenatti is speaking, he is the lawyer for stormy daniels who has these different lawsuits and is arguing against the president and trying to get out of an agreement that she made. when michael avenatti is speaking publicly, i think it is important to point out that he has a client. his calls for michael cohen to release these tapes are not in michael cohen's interest necessarily, those interests are going to be determined by michael cohen's lawyers, and michael avenatti has a client he is giving a public presentation for. >> great analysis, guys. thank you very, very much. appreciate it. >>> there's more news coming up. a tragic scene unfolding in missouri after a duck boat capsizes leaving 17 people dead. so he took aleve. if he'd taken tylenol, he'd be stopping for m

the first time that many of us were going after the story wrong, and the airing of the tape was a guiliani method of lessening cohen's value. in fact, in the piece you contributed to in "the times" tonight, i'm looking at this >> matt, you were last on this broadcast friday night when a reporter was proffering the theory for the first time that many of us were going after the story wrong, and the airing of the tape was a guiliani method of lessening cohen's value. in fact, in the piece you contributed to in "the times" tonight, i'm looking at this giuliani quote about lanny davis. "he's basically destroying his client as a witness because he really isn't a criminal lawyer, he's playing it like a shill as opposed to a lawyer. his whole theory, you bring it all out, that's great, but now the guy's ruined as a witness. what prosecutor is going to use him?" you see where i'm going, that it's diminishing of cohen's potential value as a flip. >> yeah, and it's interesting because, to phil's point about how michael cohen feels, you know, out in the wilderness, cohen's lawyers actually approached

the president is surprised, guiliani insists, by this conversation about a hush money payment. says it's the president who wanted the payment to be made by check and not cash, that that would effectively memorialize it. but what's significant there is, if this payment were made, and giuliani says the payment was never made, whether or not it was cash or check, either way it would be a campaign finance violation. perhaps as important as anything here, andrea, is what we heard from lanny davis speaking to nbc news overnight, effectively comparing this case to the john edwards case. the reason that's important is that it suggests that his client, that michael cohen would potentially be willing to testify that the proposed payment and possibly others were discussed in an effort to try to help the president's election, andrea. >> but -- and this was only two weeks before, and it was involving trying to buy the rights to a story that had already been held by a friend of the president's, who was the publisher of this tabloid. so it was this catch and kill practice by this tabloid to e

gru rudy guiliani is trying to set new limits on the special counsel. is he making an offer robert mueller is certain to refuse? >>> chance sessions. the conservative crowd yells lock her up. the attorney general acts amused and repeats the mantra of trump supporters. is this how the nation's top law enforcement should act? >>> out of fashion, ivanka trump is shutting her clothing company. are sagging sales and ethics problems the real reason she's calling it quits? we want to welcome viewers in the united states and around the world. i am wolf blitzer. you're in "the situation room." >>> we're following breaking news on all the zigging and zagging and distracting by the president a week after his disastrous summit with vladimir putin. tonight, mr. trump is putting a brazing new spin on attacks on the news media and critics, telling supporters what they're seeing and hearing is not what's really happening, and he is making a dubious and misleading claim about russian interference saying moscow is looking to help democrats win the midterm election. this

rudy guiliani and the rest of the president's team have been very effective in the absence of -- there was a big lag in the indictments and the first one was kind of hard to understand. and so the public opinion has been waning when it comes to this investigation. and so it hasn't been just the base. it is expanded and that is why you've actually seen -- and i've heard from republicans who have said that they actually think that this russia investigation is a political plus because people think, oh, it is just the media and the deep state going after this president. >> well tell that to paul manafort and michael cohen. i have to go because we're over but i enjoyed the conversation and i appreciate you joining us on a friday night. have a great weekend. >>> when we come back, rod rosenstein said he briefed the president earlier this week on the robert mueller indictment of 12 russian intelligence officers so why did president trump say this about vladimir putin? >> he's not my enemy. and hopefully some day maybe he'll be a friend. it could happen. (♪) i'm a four-year-old ring bearer wit