we're not comparing to nokia at all in terms of trying to say apple is like nokia. i want to be clear what we said in our report is that what we observed with nokia in late 2007 as that downturn got under way was rapid reduction in replacement activity by consumers and the point i was trying to make is that a company like apple, near full penetration can see rapid reduction in replacement volume if you get into macro weakness like we're seeing in china we definitely don't think -- nokia in 2007, if i can paint a picture for you, that company at that point was facing a complete product transition, so when you get to 2009, 2010, the smart phone is taking over nokia as we know is losing share to apple there we don't see any similar product transition in the market today, there's no alternative to the smart phone. the smart phone is the primary device people use. the point is that when you get into macro weakness, replacement demand can blow out quickly, i think that's what we're observing in china. >> rod, how much of this do you think is macro weakness, slowdown in ch

when you look at where nokia was then and apple today, nokia had massive market share a large part of its profitability was based on volume apple does not have that because it's the premium device manager and its profitability is based on its able to premium price products if you went out and cut products, you would see margins fall hard. i don't think that's where apple would go, but i would be extremely surprised come september this year if we don't see some moderation on the price in terms of the next generation of products. apple will specify those devices accordingly. if you look for the last five years, every iphone has a 70% gross margin i think you'll see them continue to match that when they release the next iphone. >> richard, thank you very much for joining us >>> double line capital ceo jeffrey gundlach also weighed in he said this is the kind of stuff that happens in a bear market in mid-december he correctly predicted u.s. equities would hit new lows and days later they did. for more on how apple's share price drop will hurt investors like warren buffett, head to cnbc.co

looking at nokia. taking a look going into this, analysts looking for some turnaround progress, also a boost from 5g especially after they well-received update a few days ago. nokia, let's have a look. fourth-quarter adjusted operating profit at 1.1 2 billion euros. the estimate is 1.7. that is a beat on the fourth-quarter adjusted operating profit. the fourth quarter eps coming in thing in line at 13 euros and 2019 adjusted operating margin nine to 12%. that is for 2019. for 2020 it sees that adjusted operating margin at 12 to 16%. nokia technologies margin at 6%. manus: this is the bank and brokerage in japan, coming in at 90 ¥.3 billion. it looks like they are taking a one-time loss, that has gone red. it one-time loss of ¥81.4 billion. in need to drilling a little bit more in terms of what the write-down is. the big issue for nomar out, they are going through restructuring. let me give you some depth on the net revenue. the revenue for nine months through december 31 and decreased by 27% from the s

erickson a nokia are both expanding in china.do not want blocked -- want to be blocked from chinese networks for bashing huawei publicly. the point the ceo of erickson raised to date is, with all this indecision from governments, particularly in europe, about what do they do about huawei, a lot of them are considering banning it, but have not taken action. it could delay the rollout of 5g . they just don't decide where they are going to put their money. taylor: the rollout of 5g has been the story of the last couple years. we heard earlier this week about how they are seeing revenues and profits boosted by the increase in 5g spending. what other companies are you seeing besides erickson that are starting to see a big benefit from 5g? rebecca: i think erickson and nokia in europe are the key beneficiaries. when it comes to 5g spending, it actually is benefiting. they are providing the network equipment. today, when erickson -- ericsson reported, they met profit targets two years early. a lot has to do with the man from networks to

nokia, down by 5.5%.g from any boost from qualities -- huawei's troubles, it's not there. unilever, concern around latin america, that stop by around 3%. let's get a first word update. says he is ok with tax hikes on the rich as long as the revenue goes where he thinks it will do good. an emailed statement, the billionaire jpmorgan ceo said that those earning the most can afford to pay more. that comes as elizabeth warren defends her wealth tax proposal. raiseys it is a way to revenue and bulls are the opportunities available to ordinary americans. >> capitalism without rules is theft. encouraging companies to build their business models on cheating people. that is not capitalism, that is not competition, that is not producing consumer surplus. so what i believe is that capitalism with serious rules. that means rules were everybody gets a chance to play. slowed.'s slowdown has factories contracted in january but came in above levels. this comes as high-level talks continue between the u.s. and china, but

they won't with inexpensive gear relative to a nokia and caught up on the technology.y lead on the technology forefront. the second leg of their was low-cost premium smartphones and they became the smart from provider globally. from a technology standpoint, they stack up well with leaders. in that vein, they should being consideration for global contracts. >> we are starting to see more transparency -- more speaking out coming from the company, but china in general. china's ambassador to canada is warning about excluding huawei. founder, the the father of the cfo who is on bail in canada. pushinghear the company back on allegations particularly when it comes to reap -- to criminal repercussions? >> i am not surprised about the huaweiand opening of when it comes to a global nation. 5g transition, we are still talking about significant revenue that while way -- huawei could miss out. they came the number two player in mobile infrastructure by winning the 4g transition. if that they miss out on the 5g transition, they could slip to number two or number three player and ha

that will benefit. >> i don't want you to buy nokia. you want one, sky works solutions is the way to play 5g. it has been derisked the sun is not set on apple. unfortunately, the truth does not matter more ahead up 12% canopy growth how does canopy feel i got the exclusive. then dex com i am talking to the ceo. and tonight's edition of the lightning round. stay with cramer >>> earlier in the show we talked about the outgoing ceo as well as the incoming ceo no wonder rob just bought more than a million shares. the best of breed marijuana out known for medicinal and reaction use. something that was just legalized by the farm bill last month. we talked to bruce linton cofounder and ceo. >> they invited you and canopy, how come >> when you get 4 billion, maybe your iq and looks go up. but that was a big break through in august because it said moran stanley advised constellation. and jp made sense. and last year i wanted to come to this event and we were not welcome. now our dance card has been chalk ablock because everybody in pharmasaying

look at their other products i don't think we're going to see apple go the way of the likes of a nokiar a palm or a blackberry so clearly anybody who has those kinds of concerns are certainly overblown. the fact remains we look at apple as a stock, almost 40% or plus off of its highs. could we see it refrench back to a level of 115, 125 a share before all is said and done? yeah most likely. most of the damage has been done here that said, we do need to have a clear indication from management as to what their growth plans are going forward before people, i think, start to pile in and see this company as being the tech sector bellwetherthat it has been over the course of the stock market cycle off the march 2009 lows. >> all right david garrity, thanks for those thoughts >>> square tapping amrita ahuja to be its new chief financial officer. she replaces sarah fryer who announced she was leaving her post in october. shares are up by 2.75% in extended hours trade. >>> we are getting a fresh read on the health of the u.s. auto market as well let's get to frank holland with those details. >>

than nokia.don't have the technology that is as good as wawai they don't but because of the world ganging up on wawai, think you you're right and you can indeed buy ericson. and that is a qualified buy. the company is not as good as wabai. they can come on and tell me otherwise though i'm an open minded fellow. just like i said about the cowboys. how about doug in i willinois. >> i'm talking about the pfizer merger it's an all stock deal and stock prices are always fluctuating. should i sell. >> no! no this is going to be the premier company. the combination is terrific. congratulations, frank a lot of people good money i like the combination we need more fintech you stay in it dean in ohio dean >> caller: first time caller, lifetime listener. boo-yah. >> first time, long time, love that. >> china mobile. chl. >> wow >> after building a multibillion fiber optic network across china, it has over 900 million subscribers. even lower pricing even lower pricing than a $10 currently charge higher prici

. >>> nokia is back in the u.s.hey're selling two budget friendly smartphones that run on android. the nokia 3.1 plus is now on sale at the cricket wireless website for 160 bucks. the 2b will be available at verizon stores starting on thursday. reminds me of a banana. was i the only one? >> had a curve to it. >> interesting. >> it was bright yellow. >> yeah. >> how about that? back to the future on that one. let's take a look at what's going on. we'll be back to the future in a few days. rain is back in the forecast. san rafael looking cloudy and 52 degrees. it will be partly sunny and mild. that's what you should expect in our sky today. spare the air alert. the north bay could have unhealthy air for those most sensitive. all of us under the wood burning ban until midnight. chance of rain begins wednesday with a stronger storm friday and sunday. let's jump right in and show you what's going on. a nice push of mild air coming our way with mid and upper level clouds. if you're following it on our app, live doppler 7,

nokia will soon start selling two budget friendly phones that run on android.no word on whether it has that familiar ring. those are your techbytes. >> have a great day. >>> not just any new ship. the future of the u.s. navy fleet. >>> volunteers scour san francisco's baker beach for while i was on a combat patrol my c in baqubah, iraq,nned out. a rocket-propelled grenade took my arm off at the shoulder. when i came home, i felt alone. my family was around me, but i couldn't talk to them about what i'd seen and what i'd done. i remember just thinking, man, the way i am right now, i don't want to live. i was discharged from the army, and i've been working with the wounded warrior project since 2007. warriors don't have to be severely wounded to be with the wounded warrior project. we do have a lot of guys that have post-traumatic stress disorder. being able to share your story, i guess it kind of helps you wrap your mind around what did happen over there. just because you've left the military doesn't mean your life is over, because when these guys are coming hom

on a foreign vendor anyways because there's only really three major players in this market who are nokia ericsson and while way still to come on al-jazeera cyprus prepares to host a regional summit we'll tell you how it's coming coping rather with an increase the number of asylum seekers the first funerals are held for victims of the brazilian dam collapse as the search goes on for hundreds still missing. hello again welcome back to here across parts of china we are seeing some rain as well as snow across much of western and central china over the next day you can see here on our forecast map expression the higher elevations we're talking about the snow but that's going to move quite quickly over here towards the east so for shanghai winds are going to be a problem as well as going to a rainy day few low clouds with the temperature there of about eleven degrees by the time we go towards friday that system will be pushing out and better conditions for you but also cooler air as well down towards hong kong though we do expect to see attention there on thursday of about twenty four degrees

she is the nokia 5120. we saw that last night.l there because there is no—one else. who wa nts to ta ke because there is no—one else. who wants to take on the mantle of dealing with brexit?|! wants to take on the mantle of dealing with brexit? i think there are quitea dealing with brexit? i think there are quite a few wrangling... at this particular stage. i don't know. that is often said. the lure of being in number10, is often said. the lure of being in number 10, there would be people who would jump. you cannot falter. what he may lack charm, resilience is something else after what she has been to —— you cannot falter. she may lack charm. she can really put her own vision of brexit through parliament. bus, no, she forges on. one wonders how she does it. -- but no. your express of working at number10, and the no. your express of working at number 10, and the leaders they are, it must be so difficult hearing you being frankly slagged off every other day. you're not up to it, you are lacking the charisma, the charm, the nimble foo

hopefully this turns out the way it turned out when i went through something similar in nokia.: are you still bidding for qualcomm? paul: the opportunity is not there right now but we are prepared. if it turns out that it becomes possible and interesting, we would look at it again. emily: either way, qualcomm has been touting the arrival of 5g technology. how would the arrival of 5g impact the heal experience or supercharge what you are trying to do here? nick: from our perspective, the more universal wireless signals, the faster it is, the more conversations the doctor can have with the patients. a quick video call with a specialist that might not be in the area that day. the more pervasive and universally effective that technology is, the better it makes data-driven precision care. data can enable doctors to give precise care to patients. we love the fact that technology is getting more ubiquitous, signals are getting faster. plus, it helps my kids watch videos better on their mobile devices. paul: i tried to motivate the engineers at one point by saying, we want to build a w

to sign up a deal with nokia. with nokia. >> we're 90 minutes into the trading session in tokyo.lly, not a good welcome back traders in tokyo here today. thanks to that surge in the yen. seeing the nikkei 225 down 3.74%. the brings us back to lowest levels we've seen back in day ber -- that christmas when we saw that 5% decline across the board there. topix also down 2.6%. we've seen 10% losses for the in december alone and the japanese yield down five basis points. negative territory right now at the moment. a lot of questions about whether to have to y going intervene? japan appleat these suppliers. >> apple, of course, playing yesterday. looking to the federal reserve. yellen and ben bernanke on-board. open, not as bad as we've been seeing. by 3/4 of 1% in the hang seng market. lower.one that's what we have at the moment. >> gold futures topping at 1,300. show the risk. slowdown tremors spurring this new year rally. this rally sticks and what's different this time. let's go back to the china market. our next guest says he's positive when it comes to chinese equities because of

steve jobs introduced the iphone up until that moment, the wireless industry was 2g, the blackberry, nokiascellphone, the flip not roll la this is what people thought about. and rapidly kodak filed for bankruptcy, apple had completely reinvented a new way to think about photographer and we were in the era of 3g so these things quickly. i believe that we will see something similar in health. we'll go from curiosity to useful to indispensable. and indispensable means that that has to do things that are significantly more capable in terms of health and preventive care than what we have today with wearable devices. or things to be able to enable people to do more self-diagnosis, where the coupler can have a bigger role just as they have in other industries >> and it can't just be for the wealthy. john sculley, thanks for in-side. "squawk alley" returns in less than three minutes duncan just protected his family with a $500,000 life insurance policy. how much do you think it cost him? $100 a month? $75? $50? actually, duncan got his $500,000 for under $28 a month. less than a dollar a day. his s

dismissive remember in 2007, apple introduced the cell phone and the kings of cell phone were motorola and nokia, they were dismissive of them coming in to do something different they talked about profitability, they haven't been able to do it profitably yet, and if they start competing with bmws and may never have it. >> do you want to see them go into the market when the profitability is a little bit of a question mark? >> i think they have to and i think barr sees it as an existential for gm and put resources there. this has been a monumental shift over years i think gm can compete, not reflected in their stock price but i think they can compete >> for more on the detroit auto show, go to cnbc.com >>> in the meantime, here's what else is coming up on "fast." >> i am going to be a very rich dude >> if you want to be rich, too, our top fund manager who beat the market last year says she has the one key to getting ahead in the markets this year, too. >>> plus, health stocks are lagging behind to kick off 2019. but pete is stepping up to the ho r ie th one he says could b a meunn the sector much

as a nokia don't have that immunity. you go to jail or be executed in some countries.does not do it that much but we become risk-averse especially post- watergate with intelligence reform. idea would take someone from a military background who does suspicious things and odd things and that he would be a knock in the most aggressive country for counterintelligence seems exceedingly unlikely. kennedy: he was discharged for the marine corps from bad conduct stealing social security number and writing bad checks so he was kicked out of the service and it's not like he's an exemplary marine - in that way he was expendable by the government and of course the first place to look is with diplomats but not diplomat beyond russian social media for 13 years it's a little fishy? >> people with a mixed economic these were petty crimes but he was court-martialed and kicked out of the military and those be targets for recruitment by foreign and hostile and ultimate service but not by our own. people they have as officers who are engaged in espionage or running espionage is to the oth

what happened to the nokia cell phones they bought?f acquisitions, particularly big ones in technology do not work. charles: bottom line, if you have the money, it's almost like being a venture capitalist. vcs don't expect to make money on every deal but to stay relevant they want to be a player in services. they want to get away from hardware, the low valuations that come with being a hardware company. let's talk about this. it was broken down into highly probable, maybe, meaning netflix, disney, video game publisher. that gets people excited. imagine if they took over disney. that would be the deal of the century. >> yeah. they are going to be rolling out apple streaming services later this year so they want better content. the two big content players in the world are netflix and disney. i don't know why netflix would want to join up with apple. they just rotated off their itunes so they are distancing themselves. disney would be one of the biggest acquisitions in the world. you need to look at the next tier down, some of the smaller

. >> companies like erickson, nokia, these are not nationalized industries.omies. but that doesn't matter. it is emotion. it is kind of idea that the people should be taxed. you should have a bigger welfare state. you should do more good. i think that is ocasio-cortez's appeal in the party. a the lot of young people believe that sort thing. connell: that could definitely not for her, not even age eligible. that is the type of person they turn to. thank you, dan. melissa: national security advisor john bolton outlining u.s.'s next move in syria. what it means for our troops on the ground. meeting face-to-face once again, kim jong-un. is reportedly on his way to china. for his fourth summit with the chinese president. what does it mean for talks with the u.s.? what is next? metastatic breast cancer is relentless, but i'm relentless too. mbc doesn't take a day off, and neither will i. and i treat my mbc with everyday verzenio- the only one of its kind that can be taken every day. in fact, verzenio is a cdk4 & 6 inhibitor for postmenopausal women with hr+, her2-

could be an element of so—called unconscious stockpiling, along the supply chain ahead of a possible nokia one of the things we have is the nhs has been good at getting trucks at that price is. but of course the companies are involved globally. if they get a better price with smartness in the well it may well be the air supplying fells other countries and priority to the nhs and the uk. the government says it is working closely with the industry to make sure patients get the medicines they need. catherine burns, bbc news. thank you for joining us here. how much of a problem is this on a daily basis for pharmacists across england ? pharmacists are spending for much time trying to start medication at the moment. unfortunately that is taking away from valuable time with patients. at the moment we can be contacted for or five wholesalers and be struggling to obtain what we would call bread and butter trucks, really. common drugs in my practise that i have been struggling to get hold of, things like naproxen and hrt medication. medication which might be used to treat a range of conditions. medi

up, is it going to be a sore spot with the acolytes of, who are in the stock and love this company nokia, blackberry, any worries that years from now we're going to be looking back, thinking that >> look, there's always a risk that hardware platforms are frontiers change so we don't know if ten years from now, the predominant device that we're interacting with is going to be a smartphone or whether it might be some kind of a wearable on our body, including you know glasses, or some kind of fashionable head set. that will supplant the functionality of an iphone we don't know that >> that's the outside risk those paradigm shifts from pc to smartphone from email-centric device to a blackberry to a smart device like an apple, it's those paradigm shifts that can break companies. right now we see the form factor of the smartphone being persistent that you could have complementary form factors like a watch. like a pc. but the utility of the smartphone in its current form factor, we think has legs so yes there's an outsized risk there's, there's a risk that that could change over time. and no on

on a foreign vendor anyways because there's only really three major players in this market who are nokia ericsson and while way so in a sense in the u.s. if it's about national security i mean does the u.s. really have. local domestic alternatives to walk away. no they don't on the wireless side they do not on the wireline side they have cisco but they're going to have to work with the chinese a finnish or or a swedish company they could also work with samsung or any c. who are korean and japanese so no they do not have a domestic alternative and i think that is what is underpinning a lot of the news that we're reading about now what would locking while way out of the u.s. market what would that mean not only for china but for the whole i.t. world it's a big company or so i think yeah i mean i think for the telecom providers not only in the u.s. but globally it means that they're really going to have two major options for five g. you know for four g. there are you know more than ten companies so there's going to be less competition are and i think that that is something that could end up

it's not a problem like we had with nokia in the past, where people stopped using the product.lly a change. akin to the change we saw with pcs where the cycle was much slower you're now looking 18 months ahead to 5g. really, that's the next change in cell phone technology >> do you think that's why people are not buying or upgrading now, or it they don't want to pay $1,000 when their phone still works? >> i think that's why people like us aren't upgrading it yet. it will be eight months before they start thinking i can get -- >> 5g is after 4g. we know what that is >> maybe the 6 >> if you look at the sales and not relying on sales and you look at services up 25% year over year, is that enough to say long term i still really like this >> yeah, long term, you still really like it and reasons for people to continue to buy their products and if it's a three-year period where apple is trying to extract 400, $500 from that could be a subscription >> tim lesko, thank you. >>> when we come back, legendary market strategist byron wien will join us to unveil his 2019 surprises for the m

there is concern she may not be able to avoid the potential economic catastrophe of a nokia brexit. set to leave the eu in less than 10 weeks. -- of a no deal brexit. david: they are debating the no confidence motion. jeremy corbyn is speaking. theresa may will respond. they expect to vote this afternoon. it is clear after that emphatic rejection yesterday, that parliament does not want to go along with the deal. that left eu officials horrified, but not willing to negotiate. >> what yesterday's vote showed is that the political conditions for the ratification of the agreement are not at their in london -- not yet there in london. >> we regret this. >> i will tell you how i see things. first option, they go towards no deal. they say there is no agreement. the first losers of this are the british people. >> in all probability, the united kingdom will leave the eu at the end of march. that will change the union. i would like to reiterate it is a sad development from my point of view. maria, who now to has been covering the drama. is there any reason to believe brussels will give the u

. >> you loved your blackberry keyboard >> i had a nokia both my brothers had an iphone for a year >>ou never had a blackberry? >> for work. i did not like it. i didn't like my old job as much so i did not look at the blackberry >> upgrading ever since. >> slowing down the upgrade cycle and now it has been quite a ride the company sold its 1 billionth iphone in june and the stock is up 1200% since the iphone came out. >> the company is facing headwinds. last week they slashed their revenue guidance for the first quarter and cutting iphone production for the next three months by 10%. has apple peaked that is something investors are asking right now brian merchant, the author of the one device the secret history of the iphone secret history of the iphone." brian, so many people are asking whether the new updates, are innovated enough to charge $1,000 and get people to keep upgrading. what's your take >> the iphone has always been sort of the standard bearer for the industry it's always been sort of the best and i think it remains the best in terms of usability, in terms of a status symb

here from morgan stanley to citi, from jeffrey's to goldman sachs, goldman even comparing apple to nokia in a note to clients. the one upgrade we can mention too, news street to neutral saying they don't see reasons for apple to underperform further this year, dow jones, the average target is at a nine-month low back to you. >> josh, it is interesting what tim cook said in november about china, not falling into the category of slowing sales like other emerging markets like brazil, for instance and then in your interview, clear china was slowing in the second half of the year. was there a huge element of surprise -- did things material -- materially deteriorate in that basically month and a half since tim cook said china didn't fall into that category, and it seems like he's sort of contradicting himself when he also says that it was clear that china started slowing the second half of the year. i don't know what to believe >> so, yes, so when you give that last conference call, he did call out the emerging markets. emerging markets, they included turkey and russia and brazil at that point

them, ericsson, nokia and the rest. we have all of these players in our networks globally.dy one find the pilot going with huawei. yesterday, we announced the next one with ericsson. our plan is to have several 5g pilots before we go into a more operational and commercial phase, probably after 2020. it is exciting and we need to work with several in order to get the innovation up and the right fit. francine: will you work less with huawei in the future, and if you do, are you worried about possible repercussions? are you possibly worried about some of the equipment that they make going up? : i think we are facing a big issue and a complex situation. what we do is try to listen to experts, listen to governments. we will obviously comply with whatever decisions are made, but and we a vast portfolio, are also very focused on the innovation part here and motivated to keep relationships as long and as good as we can with several lenders. talk to me about your relationship with the activist investor. do you know what they want from telenor? jorgen: we obviously talked to stakehol

nokia's there.e is inside the restored hotel figueroa. the specialty -- >> the dry ice is going to kill the gin down before i add the soda -- >> reporter: a gin and tonic that's other-worldly. >> it releases a little bit of the aromas. >> reporter: this is fun to watch! pinchos or small bites aculture the experience. inspired by lane's travels through bass country. >> we have a sea urchin noon, bacon-wrapped dates, one. my favorite things on the planet. >> reporter: but the hotel's restaurant anchor is the culinary showcase. what's this? >> that's the r i'm gl on. but good here. from pitch to heaping plates of paella. >> everyone has fun because you get to make your own dish out of it. >> reporter: i sense that every restaurant has little bit of something from -- >> they share, for sure. any good brand shares a red thread. it ties together like a group of products or offerings that somehow have a very similar kind of feel. >> reporter: back up lane's got even bigger fish on the fryer. will i see lan

suffer in the same way, so we should look at nike and where me see nokia ash nike, the quarterly resultsa, we will know. apple has with chinese competitors in the smarts bone -- smartphone space corps the u.s. brands? we see futures deteriorating, -33 right now on s&p futures. he got more across "bloomberg surveillance" this morning. coming up, michael mckee's and nowt interview timely interview with robert kaplan of the dallas fed. robert kaplan. this is bloomberg. ♪ >> this is bloomberg surveillance. let's get the business flash. apollo global management in his talks to buy a narrow space manufacturer. share,would pay $22 a roughly and 18% premium over the closing price yesterday. the parties are negotiating a that would protect from liability in the deadly greg hill tile -- greg hill tower fire. according to a bloomberg survey, officials tracking data, saudi arabia is cutting output. opec is trying to keep oil prices from falling further. fedex has dropped a plan to begin cargo flights to cuba. the trump administration has imposed new restrictions on the ability to do business with cu

thank you, nokia. >> thank you for having me. google maps with an update here.- how speed limits on roads where you're traveling. also if you approach a speed trap, even better. but you know the locations of speed cameras. maybe they are making nice with customers after all. also, in the oreo under fire by tribal cookie maker for some unsavory business practices. liz: wow, what a story. who knew the cookie business was so cutthroat. the owner of hydroxy followed a complaint. it is accusing the oreo is basically the parent company of foul play saying they use their own to stock the shelves. they push cookies to the back room of them to the shelves entirely. foul play. who knows, hydroxy versus oreo. charles: oreo saying it's called business 101. liz: they're the number one cookie. charles: all right, folks. thank you very much, liz per the race for 2020 getting crowded. we are on top of that. also, looks like we are making progress with china ahead of the talks at the end of the month. former ambassador to china says there's a big bump in the road right ahead. he

when i step back and look at the strength of ecosystem and hear the naysayers say is this the new nokiae back in the day. at the time when the first iphone came out 12 years ago and android on top of that, you know, these were game changers in terms of being software driven, app driven, et cetera. i don't see anything on the horizon that is more revolutionary. yes the upgrade cycle has slowed, but you're still going to go to an iphone there really isn't a better alternative out there. so you're going to have these potholes in the road, i think, from time to time. depending on the cycle we think there's still an annuity stream around iphone and of course as we've discussed, you've got services going 28% to help offset that -- more than offset that at that point. >> jason trenert here. in terms of what would better shareholders at this point given the amount of cash that apple has, i mean, are there any discussions? i still find it hard to believe that stock trades at 12 times earnings and at a peak, might trade at 14 times earnings is there any talk about share repurchases or increasing