richard haas. admiral, i'll start with you first, about the so-called pottery barn rule. add on, that developed in the 19 0s. that's a reaction to the failures of vietnam. it seems like such sage advice, such krit kalg advice for our policy makers to follow. and yet, we have failed time and again to heed his warnings, to heed his advice, to follow the lessons that he learned from the fallout of vietnam. >> yeah. joe, this -- again, go back to the pragmatism of general powell. there's so much there. also cautiously optimistic. but he'd seen things go wrong in an enormous way in vietnam. i think it did shadow his judgments going forward, but in positive ways. and, again, i just keep coming back to these 13 rules of leadership of colin powell that were so much for me a north star when i was a senior officer in the military, and i think is true for a generation of us. and it's a balance of having a vision, but knowing you can succeed. don't take counsel of your fears. perpetual optimism is a forced multiplier. but certainly he is the wisest one in the room on so many occasion