volodymyr dedov volodymyr samchenko details tv channel inter marathon yatini news they are not our enemies protect yours a year ago i hugged you a year ago we were building our own future a year ago we thought about what we would be like in 20 years or 30 years ago we laid the foundation for our grandchildren a year ago we held hands listened listened how the tram stops nearby, we listened to how at night at the entrance a young man becomes enlightened, we listened to the wind of our times with you, a common dream , one for two, a dream of our victory, yours and mine, and then again the warmth of the hands of the tram without locusts , lovers at the entrance after our victory after our victory i protect ukraine, my blue sky, the morning silence of the fields, i protect the traditions, the cossack land, i protect the borders of my country, i protect what is important, life , family, mother, father, brothers, wife, i protect my ukraine, will, freedom, love, we are the ones who are building a new, strong, free and i defend independent ukraine i defend i defend i defend ukrainian gives freedom we have 45 synonyms for the word killed and you are free to choose exactly how you want to get even with the enemy it is difficult to convey your feelings for lack of words create new ones this is how we got the art of a dream and a future the occupiers wag their tails pro-ukrainian cottonwood and cotton and we are happy with 30 letters did not mention us do not destroy us protect us power of three forms of the future tense we will go we will go we will go to victory in spite of everything ukrainian language of the free let's be frank even after 8 years of annexation crimea and the occupation of parts of donbas broke in the minds of many ukrainians exactly on february 24, 2022. at first there was shock , refusal to believe, then when bucha gostomel mariupol destroyed peaceful ukrainian cities, killing adults and children, torture from rape, until the end we could not imagine that our neighbors were capable of such but now we realized we faced fascism in its purest form, which in terms of cruelty sometimes exceeds even german nazism of the 20th century marathon continues the only news on the air column accent my name is oleksiy fadeev and accent today we let's address the question of how russian fascism arose and how it will end, and our guests today are serhii puzan, head of the ukrainian center for security and cooperation, congratulations and dmytro zolotukhin, executive director of the institute of post-information society . congratulations, gentlemen. so, the first question for you is , in your opinion, when did it start with what started russian fascism? i think it is necessary to understand here that russian fascism and chauvinism in general are the consequences of that imperialism, which , actually, the russians professed during the entire time of their existence. state, and if we look even at the second world war at the entire history of russian statehood, or even starting with moscow statehood, then there is this spirit of chauvinism, it is literally permeated, it just changed form, that is , from the tsarist, from tsarist russia, smoothly transitioned to soviet russia, and i i will remind you that there they also tried to talk about the absence of a nation there, about the friendship of peoples and the like, but in the end this soviet union turned into this neo-imperial entity completely out of chauvinistic and with imperialistic aspirations, the same russian federation itself changed its form to a federal state and a federal state, but in its essence it simply did not change, that is, in other words, you are saying that this eurasianism, fascism, chauvinism has always existed in the comprehensive history of russia, absolutely absolutely, and the attitude towards other nations is the same starting from tsarist russia, when literally other nationalities were exterminated only because they were, well, less strong, less developed, this is absolutely in nature of russian statehood, dmitry, what do you think there have always been very good articles by the american historian timati snyder, who is actually considered one of the key researchers in the world of issues related to the e-e period of the fascist invasion of hitler's germany on the soviet union, and he uses a very interesting term called schizo-fascist schizo-fascist and he says that the schizophrenic fascism, the schizo-fascism of russia consists in the fact that they will be fascists , they call everyone else fascists, and it is the historian and historians, in fact, as experts who investigate the very phenomenon of the fascist narrative and the fascist state. he very carefully sets this up and gives examples from the history of hitler's germany, that is , how hitler and his nsdp party formed this narrative regarding the attack on stalin and, in turn, formed the same narrative that was just a mirror image of what was and then connects it with the narrative that vladimir putin is building, saying that stalin was a hero . that is, his joseph stalin is one of the key historical figures for modern russia and they support it in every possible way. i gave birth to the fact that it was stalin who built the greatness of russia on the fact that this is what he did, which means a victory once a victory. so we can repeat it, so it is ours, it is our work, but in my opinion it is necessary to explain it to a wide audience on simple things , and it reminds me of an unhappy child. and what actually succeeded did she succeed, if only with her physical capabilities, that is, such a great, such a boot, but very unhappy, whom no one loved, who was constantly pushed out, gone sochnits and this is the narrative that they say and we and here and i and i you and i will punch you all in the face and i you all it seems to me something similar i heard in uh some similar opinion i heard once in some interview of some of a russian dissident about the fact that, in fact, all these atrocities of the rashists deep down have the desire to be loved, that is, they kill in order to be loved , a huge, huge amount of testimony from the occupied territories. media and site detector media she described how she was under the occupation of a and b, including a lot of authors wrote about it, and people, when they are russian fighters, when they come to ukrainian land and see how ukrainian houses are arranged there, how is everything there, yes, everything is fine there and they don't believe that ordinary people can live like this, well, there's some kind of interception when you introduce them to wooden asphalt, yes, to wooden asphalt, they have juice that is delicious, so apple-like to me, and so on. and this inability also converts me once at the beginning of the zero years i saw yes, you can see yevheniya hryshkovts performances. this was one of the cultural phenomena, and here he is telling how he served on a russian island and how they were told, look here , machaon butterflies are flying and you can’t touch them, and then he tells me that means i personally killed three and when he says this he is so guilty she says and who else could we take revenge on and here is this formula and who else can we take revenge on it clearly reflects this cultural class that these are deeply traumatized people who do not see any meaning in their lives except for harming others in order to prove to yourself that you are not living in vain well, i think that for the audience it is worth making a remark that we we are not trying to justify them here so we are trying in a certain way to steam and watch with people who are mentally unbalanced we lock them up for forcible treatment, and actually you, this is what should be done with the russian federation , it must be closed for the forcible treatment of those citizens who became victims of this even more far-fetched thing, we will talk about it a little later absolutely, it is even about this question, but now i want to return to a-ah recent history, yes, to the concept of us, we understand that the ukrainian nation or ukraine as an entity. by the russian people and about these problems, everyone there probably wrote classics by shevchenko and so on, and historians, we know this, but for the most recent history , for the history that for us there, conditionally for the ukrainian new state, begins in 1991, when exactly these signs began to appear well, conventionally speaking, something is wrong with the neighbors , what do you think, look at the arrival of putin, that is, in fact, these signs were just uh. i apologize for the year 2000, yes, it is already the beginning of the 2000s. his government, if we carefully follow it, well, it will not be a surprise to everyone, uh, all these explosions in residential buildings, which were arranged by the russian special services , and all western commentators also wrote about it, and everyone understood that this is how they come to power in russia. is gaining popularity, that is, what is it for? it was done only in order to get support from the same people, to mobilize various different peoples who live within the borders of this territory, and for this support, what happened next is the continuation of the chechen wars , soldiers, and precisely the use of these carpet bombings, carpet bombings, wait . well, the first and the second chechen war , they were in favor of that, if we could say that according to the nature of society's attitude towards them, they were a little different, in my opinion, or they collected signatures against the first chechen war and for the termination of the first chechen war, and so on. and yes we all know how it ended with the hasidic agreements and so on. it is impossible at this moment. that is, this is the rhetoric of the president - this is who is mentioned, approximately what period is it, is it the second or the first, or somewhere in between, yes, the second chechen says yes, the second , yes, yes, yes, yes, yes, yes, yes, this is already, this is already their last company . that is, this is a saying for me, the editor, what is it after on the kashirsky highway, these explosions are so artists of sorts, so absolutely putin’s rating is rising just to the sky, that is, he doesn’t need anything else, we will remember the invasion of georgia. that is, again , putin’s rating immediately rose, and in fact, a first-year student who studied eh, well strictly speaking , state building understands that states have an extensive, intensive path of development, and all, let's say, all the smaller european states have followed precisely the path of intensive, where their production improves and is organized social relations, but there are many national in weight imperial formations, they simply have no other way like you, this extrasive way of development, that is, to capture something in the process of this capture, to mobilize completely different peoples of nationalities, which in fact have nothing in common except the power of this state , and to move in this way further and as soon as they stop this expansion , those internal contradictions immediately emerge . it is paradoxical that, if you insist on this logic, as you are currently teaching , european small states with limited resources managed to an intensive a-a path of development yes, russia is a country with well, if limited, then very, very large resources , human, natural, any there managed to extensive why, what kind of paradox is this , eh, i think that eh, to the authorities at the turn of the 90s and zero years, a group of people came who no longer knew how to do anything, i.e. now we are returning to the discussions around, that is , mikhail khodorkovsky and the people who allegedly support him there, and if, well, again , we roll back, we retrospectively consider that all these people, they tried to build something there, they stole something, they built something, but it’s still a big complex. the russian federation , because of its location on the gas and oil reserves, requires some management approach that will be able to sell these resources and people began to build them accordingly . the first accumulated capital. and at this very moment vladimir putin and his entourage came to power precisely against the background of this psychological breakdown when we when they said let's shut the door on all eyes and we will provide you with security because here you are exploding to a joint contract social change of the social contract and boris yeltsin when he proposed his joint contract he said let's take responsibility here i am i took responsibility we destroyed the soviet union and now we are something let's make a new social contract proposed by vladimir putin here, he said to close your eyes as i will make all the decisions instead of you and in exchange for this i will give you the security that he is actually because of this feeling of greatness, of course, that is, i will give you i will say that you are cool. that you are all fine. everything is safe, everything is fine, just don't pay attention to anything, and as a result, he simply leveled the entire polyana under himself, that is , the people who came to power, they did not know how to earn, they only knew how to squeeze planting, twisting, committing torture and so on and the like, well actually then the field was completely cleared and berezovsky was killed, nadrukovsky was planted and so on and so on. that is, all the people who uh, it's not that they're good, well, if not, no, we have someone good, someone bad, just when, uh, in ukraine, an oligarchic consensus was formed precisely with the help of the fact that there was some kind of competition between people who were setting up some kind of economic growth, then in russia, it was all attributed to one group of people who simply are not able to think in terms of construction and er, if she is able to think er in terms of development, in the conditions there, the volume is my own, it’s all right now, and how do we see these meetings in the federation council , putin’s speeches, and these famous military men and bloggers, they go out and take selfies and videos in which they say that volodymyrid everything, how we love everyone, the volume of everyone, we will rob everything, that means everything is leveled , yes, yes. actually, remind me about the warlords a little later, now i just want to ask an additional question, if possible, in this logic, what are you saying now do i understand correctly that nothing so unusual has happened to the russian people, it happened to him there first stalin, then putin means which one means him and how was it deceived, or is it correct that there cannot be a social contract on the one hand, a social contract is always concluded with two offers, that is, yes, vladimir putin proposed it, that is, i remove all responsibility for your life from you and take it upon myself, and i will advise yes, and i will spin you as i want and in return , i give you here is conditional security, conditional your majesty, you will feel like members of a great power there, i will give you back the soviet anthem, and this was a huge discussion , i think in 200