jeffrey gundlach of double line. the idea, look, i wouldn't be a seller necessarily of stocks here, though he obviously favors and he's a bond guy and has a specific trade and the best way to play it. >> yeah, and i don't think you have to choose. one of the things to keep in mind in 2022, there was nowhere to hide. you lost money on cash, relative to inflation, you got killed in bonds, down 17% in the highest quality bonds you could have bought and you got crushed in the stock market down 18, 19%. in that environment, there was a lot of talk about, well, there is nowhere to hide. in this particular moment, it is the exact opposite. you n buy stocks, away from the magnificent seven, you can buy stocks at historically average multiples. then you can also look at the bond market for the 40 portion of your portfolio or the 30 and you have a lot of choice. you can choose do i want to take a little bit more credit risk, jeff is talking about leverage close and then funds. great idea if you have the wherewithal. you can bu

right after jay powell, jeffrey gundlach joins us. [ laughter ] i hope you'll join me then. rich, final trade, what are you looking at me for? >> canadian natural resources, cnq. 4% dividend yield. >> all right. yeah? you finished up. it's like you have more to say. it was like yield and i thought there was more to come. >> oil stance company in california -- in canada. >> tesla. buy the puts. >> microsoft. >> yesterday, we bought apollo. >> just to reiterate, right after chair powell's done, jeffrey gundlach will join me. "the exchange" is now. ♪ ♪ welcome to "the exchange." the house has a new speaker, but as the clock is ticking on a potential government shutdown again, will congress be able to come together to get anything done? the u.s. government will run out of funds in less than three weeks and another stop gap funding bill is likely. i thought that felt a little detailed about the machinations of washington. welcome to the special edition of "the exchange," everybody. i'm kelly evans with tyler mathisen. >> welcome, everybody. as we enter this final 60-minute

speaking suggest that they're starting to price in some real rate cuts. >> so you agree with jeffrey gundlach the time to buy bonds? >> i don't know. this could be a head fake. i don't know that rates need to go that much higher so might be a fine mace to be. over time especially like the short end of the curve over time will come down but how long is that from now? who knows? on the short end of the curve. the long end is really a question of how long can the -- can yellen stave off more treasury issuance, what happens internationally so this move right here given that we aren't going to have a surprise in treasury instruments might be okay but it might be a head fake. what is the jobs data is strong tomorrow? >> good news has been greeted with bad news and vice versa. you think we're at risk of that again. >> i think we are. actually i think there's a reflexive dynamic. when there's bad news the market rallies and bond yields come in. that's a key part of the financial conditions that powell was speaking about, like, if financial conditions loosen, they loosen for him. he's going to keep ra

and last week as well, bill gross, bill ackman, overnight as well, jeffrey speaking to cnbc, jeffrey gundlach at this level in terms of interest rates, the current government deficit is really not sustainable over the longer-term. he is saying that a recession is possible or will arrive in the first part of next year. he says the key rate is going to be at 2.5% by the midpoint of next year. jeffrey is someone who is saying that 200 basis points of cuts could be possible over the next few months. quite a bit more than what the consensus is for markets and pricing for three cuts next year, 25 basis point reduction. haidi: thank you for keeping an eye on markets as we open through the next few hours. live, we see past interviews on our interactive tv function, tv . you can go to the security functions we talked about plus between the conversation by sending us messages through our shows. check out itb go -- check it out at tv . this is bloomberg. ♪ haidi: jp morgan is searching for a potential partner to grow its private credit business. the bank continues to push into the lucrative corn

maria: that's what jeffrey gundlach told me as well he was here a couple months ago saying the fed willnts. for talking about a hundred basis point that means the fed is responding to a serious decline in economic growth, will be watching not, good to see you. we will take a break and when we come back we work file for bankruptcy protection it was named as the most valuable startup. what went wrong next ♪ ♪ (adventurous music) ♪ ♪ ♪ be ready for any market with a liquid etf. get in and out with dia. (woman) what if my type 2 diabetes takes over? what if all i do isn't enough? or what if i can do diabetes differently? (vo) now you can with once-weekly mounjaro. mounjaro helps your body... ...regulate blood sugar... ...and mounjaro... ...can help decrease how much food you eat. 3 out of 4 people reached an a1c of less than 7%. plus people taking mounjaro... ...lost up to 25 pounds. mounjaro is not... ...for people with type 1 diabetes or children. don't take mounjaro if you're allergic to it,... ...you or your family have medullary thyroid cancer,... ...or multiple endocrine neoplasia syn

what jeffrey gundlach told us after jay powell finished, a great time to be a bond investor. he certainly said he wouldn't be a seller. t-bill and chill is how he described it. i ask you this, is it time to buy bonds and stocks, how about that? >> on the bond side it depends on what your needs are. over the next 10 to 20 years stocks are still going to deliver a better return than bonds. >> can we talk about the next couple of years, 10 to 20 years? >> then for sure and particularly if you want to talk about the next year or two. in my office we've been having this debate. i'm more team t-bill and chill. i think can you go out six months, 18 months, get 6% to 6.8% on corporate bonds, kick back, relax, not worry about anything. my colleague, greg, is taking a different approach. he's saying, look, buy the ten year vanguard treasury. you'll get 5.5%. i think there's a lot of ways to do it. you need to be short-term focused and know that if the market rallies, you're not going to participate, but, yeah, now is the time you can start thinking about this again. there's real return

let's move on to the labor market, which has been the pillar of strength in this economy, but jeffrey gundlachsn't think that will persist. >> i believe that layoffs are coming. we have seen hours come down. we've seen hiring freezes. and now we're starting to see layoff announcements. not en masse but they're out there in financial and technology firms. i believe that's going to spread. >> although my next guest says his data shows the opposite. his firm, recruiter.com, saw a jump in open positions for job recruiters last month. typically an indication for a pickup in hiring. let's bring in the chairman of recruiter.com. evan, good to see you. is this a new development? >> good to see you, as well. look, i think jeffrey's right. there are layoffs coming. we're seeing them in the hundreds and in different sectors. i think when you talked about recruiters, and finally now, we're seeing open roles for recruiters, jumped up 8% month over month from our partners. that's a leading indicator. so i think the tech companies that laid people off earlier in the year, that was successful. they reset thei

. >> so, jimmy, jeffrey gundlach every fed day is with us after jay foul finishes the news conference. was with us yesterday. a bond rally has started, and you can see it obviously showing up. he also said stocks can do well. i want you to listen. >> i've been negative on the equity market for several months, but just a couple of days ago i observed that the s&p 500 has fallen all the way down to its trend line from the low in 2020 up through the low between now and then, if you just connect those low points. and the s&p 500 came down and met the trend line this week. and we're sitting right on it. so with this relaxation of bond yields, which has obviously been a problem for the stock market and this trade location on the s&p 500, i certainly think this would be a poor trade location to be a seller. >> okay. there's the bond king saying poor location to be a seller of stocks. >> it always catches your ears and eyes when a bond person says it's a good time to buy stocks. that's a high hurdle to clear. i wonder what jeffrey would say today if he saw the productivity numbers. and i know

. >> just to reiterate, right after chair powell's done, jeffrey gundlach will join me. "the exchange" is now. ♪ ♪ welcome to "the exchange." the house has a new speaker, but as the clock is ticking on a potential government shutdown again, will congress be able to come together to get anything done? the u.s. government will run out of funds in less than three weeks and another stop gap funding bill is likely. i thought that felt a little detailed about the machinations of washington. welcome to the special edition of "the exchange," everybody. i'm kelly evans with tyler mathisen. >> welcome, everybody. as we enter this final 60-minute countdown to the central bank's decision on interest rates, a pause once again expected today, but it's jay powell comments that investors will be paying close attention to. less what they do, more than what they say. we have team coverage from the stock market to the bond market to the economy and how rising rates affect the consumer. and representative brad sherman and senator kennedy will join us to talk about the legislative challenges