there is no post office _ is no post office... there is no post office there _ is no post office...uite a bit after that topic and i don't think there is any way we would have taken that topic if it involved the post office without him there and without any representative of the post office there. , ., ., there. does that, that can come down... there. does that, that can come down- -- to _ there. does that, that can come down... to the _ there. does that, that can come down... to the best _ there. does that, that can come down. .. to the best of- there. does that, that can come down... to the best of my - there. does that, that can come - down... to the best of my memory. does that again _ down... to the best of my memory. does that again reflect _ down... to the best of my memory. does that again reflect the - down... to the best of my memory. does that again reflect the fact - does that again reflect the fact thatiust — does that again reflect the fact thatjust like the mainboard, just like the _ thatjust like the mainboard, just like the audit and risk committee, the management b

mrjackson confirmed the post office agreed and promoted the post office starting point for the meetinging and clarifying what needed to be done in line with your directions, ensuring reasonable and proportional disclosure and minimising disruption to the hearing timetable and inquiry proceedings. t the inquiry confirmed the aim is not minimising disruption to the hearing but eliminating it. given the post office highly disruptive late disclosure in the fourth face. mr jackson come from the post office also aspired to eliminate disruption for every it was possible to do so and the post office recent structural work should have mitigated the likelihood that a new discussion issue would come from left field. in order to achieve that objective part to the meeting the inquiry had provided the post office with a series of deadlines for any further let disclosure of microsoft exchange documents and correspondence and in summary and i quote for all witnesses but for those listed within the four weeks of the inquiry timetable, the inquiry directed any late disclosure must be provided by the pos

by the post office-— the post office.he post office. that's correct, then onto the board. i'm i the post office. that's correct, i then onto the board. i'm looking for somethin: then onto the board. i'm looking for something to _ then onto the board. i'm looking for something to jump _ then onto the board. i'm looking for something to jump from _ then onto the board. i'm looking for something to jump from the - then onto the board. i'm looking for| something to jump from the agents, the supposed masters, to you and your board. is there a facility to do that without going through either of these mechanisms, that the post office managed? i of these mechanisms, that the post office managed?— office managed? i don't believe there was. _ office managed? i don't believe there was, though. _ office managed? i don't believe there was, though. i— office managed? i don't believe there was, though. i think i office managed? i don't believe there was, though. i think it - office managed? i don't believe there was, though. i think it

, the people within the post office, the people within the post office who you have just listed. — postand your board's attention?— board's attention? i would have exected board's attention? i would have expected them _ board's attention? i would have expected them in _ board's attention? i would have expected them in the _ board's attention? i would have expected them in the first i board's attention? i would have i expected them in the first instance to draw them to the attention of the exec team and board and to absolutely, yes, if they were serious and systematic, to the management team and the holdings board, yes. 50 management team and the holdings board, es. , ., management team and the holdings board, es. ,~. ., management team and the holdings board, es. , ., ., ., board, yes. so you would have expected _ board, yes. so you would have expected it — board, yes. so you would have expected it not _ board, yes. so you would have expected it not to _ board, yes. so you would have expected it not to have - board, yes. so you would have expected it not to have been i board, yes. so yo

— the post office? because, at this time, we the post office?s obviously severely dent in confidence in the post and indeed of the companies that used it, there was a lot of mail, one of the reasons we were failing quality of service targets was a lot of mail was not being delivered, it was either being dumped or hoarded, so a whole host of reasons as to why there was a real issue in terms of what we used to call, there was a programme run by ourselves, very much monitored chord mails integrity, all about the integrity of the mail itself. in integrity, all about the integrity of the mail itself.— of the mail itself. in any event, throu~h of the mail itself. in any event, through this — of the mail itself. in any event, through this route, _ of the mail itself. in any event, through this route, you - of the mail itself. in any event, through this route, you would i of the mail itself. in any event, i through this route, you would have known _ through this route, you would have known about the royal mail's prosecutorial activities?- prosecutorial

it was important to the post office to _ post office.t thing the post office _ wasn't it? ii9. the last thing the post office wanted was the bad publicity of the griffiths claim being — publicity of the griffiths claim being progressed through the mediation scheme, wasn't it? that was never my _ mediation scheme, wasn't it? “irisgi was never my consideration. my consideration was to support the family. consideration was to support the famil . 9. 9, 9, .. consideration was to support the famil . . :, :, ,, . consideration was to support the famil . . . 99 ::;~,:: , family. can we look at pol 00306172? this is a draft — family. can we look at pol 00306172? this is a draft letter— family. can we look at pol 00306172? this is a draft letter you _ family. can we look at pol 00306172? this is a draft letter you prepared - this is a draft letter you prepared for sending mr griffiths' widow, gina~ _ for sending mr griffiths' widow, gina~ if— for sending mr griffiths' widow, gina~ if we _ for sending mr griffiths' widow, gina. if we scroll down,

yes~ _ post office's system, won't they? yes. ., , post office's system, won't they? independently investigate itself, could it? no. if you had seen this come you — could it? ij>. if you had seen this come you think that isjust could it? ij>. if you had seen this come you think that is just absurd babble? _ come you think that is 'ust absurd babble? , ., babble? so, when i saw this for the first time, which _ babble? so, when i saw this for the first time, which i _ babble? so, when i saw this for the first time, which i think _ babble? so, when i saw this for the first time, which i think was - babble? so, when i saw this for the first time, which i think was this i first time, which i think was this week, i was amazed at the content. he continues, that way, we can start to bring _ he continues, that way, we can start to bring things under our control. that— to bring things under our control. that was— to bring things under our control. that was always the plan, wasn't it? the concern — that was always the plan, wasn't it? the concern amongst senior leadership, it wa

director of post office, he was in the post between 2006 and 2010. and was exposing faults in the horizon system. alan cook was talking about the fact that that came to his notice. nonetheless it appears the organisation persisted with the idea that there were no faults with horizon system, as a result several hundred postmasters and post—mistresses were prosecuted. a lot of discussion as to the role of the post office, notably alan cook at the very beginning said that he was not aware that there post office was taking initiative. he thought that this was external, it was crown prosecution service. in fact, two thirds of the cases were initiated by the post office and pursued by the post office. that must have been some legal team within the post office, in order to achieve that. he emphasised that the legal team was not purely devoted towards doing that, and he made that point several times in his defence. he did however apologise. he was presented with two former workers who had been prosecuted, both ladies in fact, who had spent time in prison, wr

post office was writing to you on post office was writing to you on post office headed paper and formallyng? i would expect public officials, as pauta _ i would expect public officials, as paula vennells was, to tell the truth — paula vennells was, to tell the truth but— paula vennells was, to tell the truth. but i would have had, at the back of— truth. but i would have had, at the back of my— truth. but i would have had, at the back of my mind, the knowledge that the post— back of my mind, the knowledge that the post office has been as a matter of almost _ the post office has been as a matter of almost routine and lots of supposed masters that they were the only ones _ supposed masters that they were the only ones. that would have been at the back— only ones. that would have been at the back of— only ones. that would have been at the back of my mind. i would have at some _ the back of my mind. i would have at some point— the back of my mind. i would have at some point questioned what they were saying _ some point questioned what they were sa inc. :. .. some point questioned what they wer

when i arrived, it was just the system that the post office used.— the post office used.d. were you i therefore not aware of the history of the _ therefore not aware of the history of the procurement for the contracting about and the development of horizon? not contracting about and the development of horizon? not in the sli . htest, development of horizon? not in the slightest. no- _ development of horizon? not in the slightest. no. it— development of horizon? not in the slightest, no. it would _ development of horizon? not in the slightest, no. it would be _ development of horizon? not in the slightest, no. it would be quite i slightest, no. it would be quite unusualfor slightest, no. it would be quite unusual for people to be taken back eight years or five years or whatever. i eight years or five years or whatever-— eight years or five years or whatever. ., ., ., ., whatever. i want to ask about the extent to which _ whatever. i want to ask about the extent to which any _ whatever. i want to ask about the extent to which any of _ whatever. i want to ask about the exten

over how the post office... and you believe, this is my summary, not yours, that the post office was entering into the enterprise in good faith. es. did entering into the enterprise in good faith. es. , ., ., , ., faith. es. did that remain your belief? by _ faith. es. did that remain your belief? by this _ faith. es. did that remain your belief? by this stage, - faith. es. did that remain your belief? by this stage, yes, - faith. es. did that remain your belief? by this stage, yes, i i belief? by this stage, yes, i certainly — belief? by this stage, yes, i certainly did _ belief? by this stage, yes, i certainly did believe - belief? by this stage, yes, i certainly did believe that. i belief? by this stage, yes, i l certainly did believe that. we belief? by this stage, yes, i - certainly did believe that. we will come later— certainly did believe that. we will come later to _ certainly did believe that. we will come later to when _ certainly did believe that. we will come later to when seeds - certainly did beli

that was - opposed by the post office? that is correct. opposed by the post office?orrect. the court order _ opposed by the post office? that is correct. the court order that - opposed by the post office? that is correct. the court order that the . correct. the court order that the claim should _ correct. the court order that the claim should be _ correct. the court order that the claim should be managed - correct. the court order that the claim should be managed under| correct. the court order that the l claim should be managed under a group litigation order from the 22nd of march, 2017, despite that? that is riuht. i of march, 2017, despite that? that is right. i think— of march, 2017, despite that? that is right. i think the _ of march, 2017, despite that? that is right. i think the announcementl is right. i think the announcement was made by _ is right. i think the announcement was made by press _ is right. i think the announcement was made by press release - is right. i think the announcement was made by press release by - is right. i think the announcement was

the it director in the post office would have reported to ceo of post office.eak, but it is a hard line relationship. group technology director, who was largely focused on driving through this automation and modernisation of royal mail, was also there for advice and help to the post office technology team if required. if, as we now know to be the case, putting it neutrally, there were issues with horizon technology, would you have expected, or was the system, that the pol it structure, post office it structure, would have pushed those issues up for your attention and for the royal mail group board attention, through the group board attention, through the group it director route? first of all, i do not require pol it ever doing that. second of all, i would have expected them to raise it with pol executive team first of all, that was the reporting lines, they were running and controlling post office and had responsibility for horizon. if they needed technical expertise, yes, i would have expected them to speak to group technology director, but if there were any r

what was the name of the post i what was the name of the post office?n llandudno. what kind of post _ office? it was in llandudno. what kind of post office _ office? it was in llandudno. what kind of post office was _ office? it was in llandudno. what kind of post office was it? - office? it was in llandudno. what kind of post office was it? it i office? it was in llandudno. what kind of post office was it? it was | office? it was in llandudno. what| kind of post office was it? it was a three position _ kind of post office was it? it was a three position counter. _ kind of post office was it? it was a three position counter. when i kind of post office was it? it was a three position counter. when we i three position counter. when we first bought the property was very much _ first bought the property was very much at _ first bought the property was very much at the back of the property and was a _ much at the back of the property and was a bit _ much at the back of the property and was a bit run — much at the back of the property and was a bit run down.

your civil servants and the post office will not tell you about post office will not tell you about postice, they will decline the applicant to drive the business into the ground. you won't hear about asking for audits of offices and having to wait up to five years for someone to turn up. in a office turning over £5 million a year. neither will they tell you cases where the post office has run audit, closed the business and bankrupted the owner, holds a pending court case and then dropped the charges. nor will they tell you about how they are stopping sub—postmasters telling their side. they want even telling their side. they want even tell you that the horizon system is designed to entrap sub—postmasters so they can finish up in prison just by trying to open up the day after a trading period balance. this isjust a taste of some of the paps as the company is going out in your name, they brandish a big legal stick, failed to provide evidence and rely on clause in the old contract about sub—master being liable for any loss. but their shoddy horizon system is the root of all of this. the po

was that the post office strate: ? . ., , claimants. was that the post office strate: ? leading _ strategy? that was my understanding of it. three leading counsel— strategy? that was my understanding of it. three leading counsel were - of it. three leading counsel were instructed. _ of it. three leading counsel were instructed, why _ of it. three leading counsel were instructed, why so _ of it. three leading counsel were instructed, why so many? - of it. three leading counsel were instructed, why so many? sorry, j instructed, why so many? sorry, threem — instructed, why so many? sorry, three... three people at the time. | three... three people at the time. i was three... three people at the time. was aware of three... three people at the time. i was aware of two. mr _ three... three people at the time. i was aware of two. mrjustice - three... three people at the time. i was aware of two. mrjustice fraserj was aware of two. mrjustice fraser said this, paragraph _ was aware of two. mrjustice fraser said this, paragraph 58, _ was aware of two. mrjustice fraser said this, pa

view on the basis of what the post office said and what the post office did?r the post office wanted the investigation to succeed. to engage openly and transparently with it, and for the truth to emerge. i transparently with it, and for the truth to emerge.— transparently with it, and for the truth to emerge. i don't know. they use to see — truth to emerge. i don't know. they use to see at _ truth to emerge. i don't know. they use to see at meetings _ truth to emerge. i don't know. they use to see at meetings that - truth to emerge. i don't know. they use to see at meetings that they . use to see at meetings that they wanted the truth as well. i had a lot of faith in james wanted the truth as well. i had a lot of faith injames arbuthnot, they weed mp supporter —— the lead mp supporter. i wave to keep forward, at least people starting to investigate and look seriously at these cases. to investigate and look seriously at these cases-— investigate and look seriously at these cases. ., , ., ., ., these cases. to see how it got on. you said you _ these cases. to se

post office in cheshire. that is riuht. b post office in cheshire.ime of his death, he had been the _ right. by the time of his death, he had been the sub-postmaster- right. by the time of his death, he i had been the sub-postmaster there had been the sub—postmaster there for 18— had been the sub—postmaster there for 18 years, is that right? i had been the sub-postmaster there for 18 years, is that right?— for 18 years, is that right? i don't remember _ for 18 years, is that right? i don't remember exactly, _ for 18 years, is that right? i don't remember exactly, but _ for 18 years, is that right? i don't remember exactly, but it - for 18 years, is that right? i don't remember exactly, but it sounds| remember exactly, but it sounds about right. by, remember exactly, but it sounds about right-— remember exactly, but it sounds about right. a series of shortfalls had arisen _ about right. a series of shortfalls had arisen at _ about right. a series of shortfalls had arisen at the _ about right. a series of shortfalls had arisen at the branch, - about ri

the post office-— post office.e team that i started to be exposed to what you just described, when i started to be exposed to that. leading on from that, that's why i wanted to get involved in the initial investigations into the cases and scheme. what we haven't seen at that time or anytime _ what we haven't seen at that time or anytime is _ what we haven't seen at that time or anytime is any what we haven't seen at that time or anytime is any documents what we haven't seen at that time or anytime is any documents which what we haven't seen at that time or anytime is any documents which say something _ anytime is any documents which say something along the lines of, gosh, maybe _ something along the lines of, gosh, maybe there's a problem with the horizon _ maybe there's a problem with the horizon system. imagine the harm we are doing. _ horizon system. imagine the harm we are doing. to— horizon system. imagine the harm we are doing, to families, the mental health— are doing, to families, the mental health of— are

we have heard from some post office staff. - heard from some post office staff. sub—postmaster is to cover up theft and fraud. your evidence is that you were being transparent from an early stage in the life of horizon. a new complaints about horizon discrepancies, about the use of the suspense accounts, to hold over disputed psalms, whilst continuing to assert that the money wasn't old, and ought not to be made good? that is correct. and ought not to be made good? that is correct- was _ and ought not to be made good? that is correct. was that _ and ought not to be made good? that is correct. was that practice _ is correct. was that practice challenge? _ is correct. was that practice challenge? not _ is correct. was that practice challenge? not during - is correct. was that practice challenge? not during my l is correct. was that practice - challenge? not during my tenure. i understand — challenge? not during my tenure. i understand it _ challenge? not during my tenure. i understand it was _ challenge? not during my tenure. i understand it was later _ challenge?

office. fin post office.sation, _ post office. an atrocious organisation, they - post office. an atrocious organisation, they need| post office. an atrocious _ organisation, they need disbanding, it needs removing.— it needs removing. finally we will aet it needs removing. finally we will net to it needs removing. finally we will get to know _ it needs removing. finally we will get to know everything _ it needs removing. finally we will get to know everything the - it needs removing. finally we will get to know everything the post | get to know everything the post office _ get to know everything the post office knows. _ get to know everything the post office knows. the _ get to know everything the post office knows. the truth. - get to know everything the post office knows. the truth. the - get to know everything the post. office knows. the truth. the whole truth _ office knows. the truth. the whole truth. �* . , office knows. the truth. the whole truth. ~ . , ., truth. alan bates may have reached national tr

br; that prosecutions were overseen in the post office?— the post office? the post office? by the l investigations team. and the post office? by the - investigations team. and so, is the post office? by the _ investigations team. and so, is it effectively _ investigations team. and so, is it effectively that... _ investigations team. and so, is it effectively that... is _ investigations team. and so, is it effectively that... is your - investigations team. and so, is it| effectively that... is your evidence effectively that... is your evidence effectively that... is your evidence effectively that the investigation team and security team maybe round the investigations, but at board level there was no oversight? it level there was no oversight? it reported up through the operations director~ _ reported up through the operations director. but we wouldn't have been progressing each case at board level because _ progressing each case at board level because the organisation was just too large — because the organisation was just too large. it wouldn't be looking a

all the numbers in the post office are i numbers in the post office are very large.illage that will be nameless, and the sub—postmistress took me back into her kitchen behind the shop, and went through the process of how car insurance was sold, and why she couldn't be bothered to sell it, because of the tortuous process that was followed, following which we change that. was there anything else instead other than those four sets to try to understand how cyprus masters found the horizon it system? i understand how cyprus masters found the horizon it system?— the horizon it system? i wasn't 'ust talkin: the horizon it system? i wasn't 'ust tatktng about — the horizon it system? i wasn't 'ust talking about horizon i the horizon it system? i wasn't 'ust talking about horizon hi the horizon it system? i wasn'tjust talking about horizon it system, - the horizon it system? i wasn'tjust talking about horizon it system, i l talking about horizon it system, i was talking about the business as a whole. my whole. my question is about horizon it system. my system. my primary focus

and it just never did, it just kept... just he kept posting and posting and posting. >> did you consideryou know, i was 18, i was stupid, and i was kind of just wanting to look at information. >> yeah. >> a lot of people told him, you know, "hey, you do realize that's illegal, right?" (typing) he was like, yeah, i know, i don't care. i thought he was an absolute idiot and was definitely going to get arrested. >> narrator: air force memos show that on more than one occasion, he was caught in the act. >> it says that jack teixeira had been observed taking notes on classified intelligence information in the scif. he was observed putting a note in his pocket. >> narrator: he was told to stop. then a month later, another warning. >> but then they go on to offer him essentially a promotion to become an analyst, and it says that he declined the training opportunity at this time. >> narrator: and then three months later, teixeira was caught viewing classified content without authorization. ♪ ♪ the air force declined to give an interview, but this week published its own investigation, which point

it is also the way that the post office dealt with the sort of _ that the post office dealt with theters in an unconstructive way~ that _ sub—postmasters in an unconstructive way. that was one of the big problems— way. that was one of the big problems and that we will probably tet problems and that we will probably get to, _ problems and that we will probably get to, something further on, but i will wait _ get to, something further on, but i will wait for — get to, something further on, but i will wait for that. can get to, something further on, but i will wait for that.— will wait for that. can we turn to the next bullet _ will wait for that. can we turn to the next bullet point, _ will wait for that. can we turn to the next bullet point, please? i will wait for that. can we turn to i the next bullet point, please? you raise the idea of setting up a new independent third party that sub—postmasters could approach if they are facing issues with horizon which cannot be resolved through the normal post office processes and she said that aligns with some of their own thinking and they ar

you government minister, in charge of the post office.— the post office.ou in fact sent a reply to mr— the post office. you in fact sent a reply to mr davie. _ the post office. you in fact sent a reply to mr davie. the _ the post office. you in fact sent a reply to mr davie. the inquiry - the post office. you in fact sent a | reply to mr davie. the inquiry was shown alert _ reply to mr davie. the inquiry was shown alert sent _ reply to mr davie. the inquiry was shown alert sent to _ reply to mr davie. the inquiry was shown alert sent to the post - reply to mr davie. the inquiry was | shown alert sent to the post office minister ed davey injuly 2010, where allan bates called his refusal to intervene notjust disappointing, but offensive. he said the post office had been op writing as little more than thugs in suits, and ed davey enabled them to carry on with immunity, regardless of the human misery and suffering they inflict. interviewed at a building site in kent mr davie responded. billion interviewed at a building site in kent mr davie responded. allan ba

but this is post _ your experience? no. but this is post office's view, not mine.w, not mine. ti 3 included on—site attendances to assist with balances. did that occur? i had two people visits— did that occur? i had two people visits to — did that occur? i had two people visits to try— did that occur? i had two people visits to try and with balancing, but they— visits to try and with balancing, but they could access the system no further _ but they could access the system no further than i could, so it was absolutely no help at all. and _ absolutely no help at all. and to _ absolutely no help at all. and to provide extra training on horizon system, did you get additional training? horizon system, did you get additionaltraining? fiat horizon system, did you get additional training? not that i can recall. the aim was recall. — the aim was always that of difficulties you were experiencing in managing transactions at the branch. horizon system has been reviewed and interrogated in response to your complaints and the report from horizon field support team have confirmed

~ , , , ., post office? bankrupt myself? no, i didn't not to — post office? bankrupt myself?to extent. _ post office? bankrupt myself? no, i didn't not to extent. if— post office? bankrupt myself? no, i didn't not to extent. if these - didn't not to extent. if these after-the-fact _ didn't not to extent. if these after-the-fact reasons - didn't not to extent. if these after-the-fact reasons or. after—the—fact reasons or justifications for the termination of your contract are not on your understanding correct, what do you understanding correct, what do you understand to be the reason for the termination of the contract? imoll. termination of the contract? well, basicall i termination of the contract? well, basically i think _ termination of the contract? well, basically i think it _ termination of the contract? well, basically i think it was _ termination of the contract? well, basically i think it was because - basically i think it was because they— basically i think it was because they didn't like me standing up to them _ they didn't like me standing up to them in_ they didn

the point is that the post office was undergoing _ answers.ost office was undergoing at _ answers. the point is that the post office was undergoing at some - answers. the point is that the post i office was undergoing at some point a fairly fundamental reorganisation and there is a suggestion that it was distracted by the fact that, and i'm imagining at this time, people are writing more and more e—mails and sending fewer and fewer letters and sending fewer and fewer letters and that might have had some to do with it, but was there an element of this organisation with those at the helm saying we were distracted? absolutely. you heard that yesterday from david smith and sir michael hodgkinson. they said there was a situation where the post office was facing a catastrophic financial issue. the former managing director said that a lot of the financial issues were taking up most of his time and when it came to e—mails that came to him, he talked about mrs misra's e—mail and he said, i used to receive hundreds of e—mails every day, this would have

into the post office?just wanted it sorted out. i thought i might as well write to the person who owned it who was peter mandelson. in to the person who owned it who was peter mandelson.— to the person who owned it who was peter mandelson. in the meantime, it seems that a — peter mandelson. in the meantime, it seems that a letter _ peter mandelson. in the meantime, it seems that a letter had _ peter mandelson. in the meantime, it seems that a letter had been - peter mandelson. in the meantime, it seems that a letter had been drafted l seems that a letter had been drafted and perhaps even sent by way of reply— and perhaps even sent by way of reply to — and perhaps even sent by way of reply to your first letter. if we could — reply to your first letter. if we could look _ reply to your first letter. if we could look at that, please. you will see this is dated the 5th of december 2009, and presumably this hadnt— of december 2009, and presumably this hadn't been received by you by the time _ this hadn't been r

post office should have had, post— the directors of post office should have had, post office _ the directorsnts, shouldn't they? yes. - should have had their eye on these| accounts, shouldn't they? yes. the second reason _ accounts, shouldn't they? the second reason them having an accounts, shouldn't they?“ the second reason them having an eye i accounts, shouldn't they?“ the . second reason them having an eye on the accounts — second reason them having an eye on the accounts is — second reason them having an eye on the accounts is the _ second reason them having an eye on the accounts is the cost _ second reason them having an eye on the accounts is the cost of _ second reason them having an eye on the accounts is the cost of the - the accounts is the cost of the legal— the accounts is the cost of the legal action— the accounts is the cost of the legal action being _ the accounts is the cost of the legal action being taken - the accounts is the cost of the i legal action being taken against sub—postmasters, _ legal action being taken against sub—postmasters, would - legal action being taken

and she spent so much time at the post office, as - much time at the post office, as well, 35 years,asters and it oversaw a lot of the problems with the horizon it issue, and she also was heavily involved in the mediation scheme in 2013 between former sub postmasters at the post office which eventually failed. the big accusation, that the post office strongly denies, is of a cover—up, and so understanding not only what she knew and when she knew but how they approached disclosure and offering that information to these formats are postmasters who were wrongly convicted, all of those really important questions they will want to ask angela van den bogerd over the course of the few days. irate over the course of the few days. we can now return as the inquiry has just restarted.— just restarted. let's look at the briefin: just restarted. let's look at the briefing of— just restarted. let's look at the briefing of the _ just restarted. let's look at the briefing of the meeting - just restarted. let's look at the briefing of the meeting we - just restarted. let's look at the | briefing of t

post office. you and your assistance made 507 calls _ post office.ade 507 calls to _ post office. you and your assistance made 507 calls to the _ post office. you and your assistance made 507 calls to the helpline. - made 507 calls to the helpline. correct. edi made 507 calls to the helpline. correct. . i~ made 507 calls to the helpline. correct. . j~ ., ., correct. of which 85 related to horizon and — correct. of which 85 related to horizon and balancing - correct. of which 85 related to l horizon and balancing problems. correct. of which 85 related to - horizon and balancing problems. yes. and that you — horizon and balancing problems. yes. and that you found _ horizon and balancing problems. yes. and that you found the helpline to be ineffective and indeed of no help. be ineffective and indeed of no hel. , . ,., be ineffective and indeed of no hel. , . ., ., help. very much so, and often we never bothered _ help. very much so, and often we never bothered ringing _ help. very much so, and often we never bothered ringing it. - help. very much so, an

office — out a series of questions, can the post office change transaction data without _ post officeut sub—postmaster being aware of the _ without sub—postmaster being aware of the change? can fujitsu do so? if not, of the change? can fujitsu do so? if not. where's — of the change? can fujitsu do so? if not, where's the for this conclusion? if so, how does it happen? _ conclusion? if so, how does it happen? why was this functionality built in? _ happen? why was this functionality built in? why would fujitsu need to use this _ built in? why would fujitsu need to use this functionality? what controls _ use this functionality? what controls are in place to prevent unauthorised use of this method of access? _ unauthorised use of this method of access? when is branch data been impacted — access? when is branch data been impacted in this way? in relation to the previous e—mail, can it be used to change _ the previous e—mail, can it be used to change ranch counts? what is the impact _ to change ranch counts? what is the impact of— to change ranch counts? what is the impact of this change on

post office. no actors. but _ out of the post office. today no actors, but nearly _ out of the post office. today no actors, but nearly 60 _ out of the post office. today no actors, but nearly 60 real i out of the post office. today no actors, but nearly 60 real sub | actors, but nearly 60 real sub postmasters and family for a special edition of breakfast.— edition of breakfast. some have never spoken — edition of breakfast. some have never spoken about _ edition of breakfast. some have never spoken about their - edition of breakfast. some have| never spoken about their stories before and some travelled hundreds of miles to be here and we appreciate you all coming and we are looking forward to hearing from as many as you as we can.— looking forward to hearing from as many as you as we can. sharon said she lost nearly _ many as you as we can. sharon said she lost nearly everything _ many as you as we can. sharon said she lost nearly everything when i many as you as we can. sharon said she lost near

or was it that you and others in the post| that you and others in the post office studiously avoided only discovered but was also revealed, fujitsu's ability to tamper with accounts. l revealed, fujitsu's ability to tamper with accounts. i wasn't aware of this, and — tamper with accounts. i wasn't aware of this, and i— tamper with accounts. i wasn't aware of this, and i wish _ tamper with accounts. i wasn't aware of this, and i wish i _ tamper with accounts. i wasn't aware of this, and i wish i had _ tamper with accounts. i wasn't aware of this, and i wish i had been - tamper with accounts. i wasn't aware of this, and i wish i had been at - of this, and i wish i had been at the time, — of this, and i wish i had been at the time, because that fundamentally changes— the time, because that fundamentally changes what my understanding was to do with— changes what my understanding was to do with the _ changes what my understanding was to do with the horizon system, and even 'ust do with the horizon system, and even just the _ do with the horizon system, and even just the language used in h

to discredit the post. you had a seat at the table with bezos and trump. my sense is that trump probably expected hey, us rich guys are going to stick together. can you talk about some of the dealings bezos and trump had and some of the dealings you had with trump individually as well? sure. it all came to a head five months after trump took office. our publisher wanted -- it's in the prolog to the book. our publisher felt it would be a good idea if we met with trump. bezos actually met with him previously as part of a group of technology executives but he also had a private meeting before that where trump talked how he liked amazon but didn't like "the post" a whole lot. we had a meeting at the white house for dinner and our publisher felt it would be good to meet him and i was there and the publisher was there and jerod kushner, melania and the president, and throughout the entire time, i was sitting next to his lap and throughout the dinner he was criticizing "the post" and called us the worst of all med

so many post offices doing it's just your post _ post offices doing it's just your post office havingstill fighting, - people, as well. how are you doing now? good, still fighting, the - people, as well. how are you doing now? good, still fighting, the fight| now? good, still fighting, the fight is still on until— now? good, still fighting, the fight is still on until proper— is still on until proper accountability is done, but we are altogether. accountability is done, but we are altogether-— accountability is done, but we are altoiether. ., . , . altogether. you are pregnant when ou were altogether. you are pregnant when you were sent _ altogether. you are pregnant when you were sent to _ altogether. you are pregnant when you were sent to prison. _ altogether. you are pregnant when you were sent to prison. what - altogether. you are pregnant when you were sent to prison. what the | altogether. you are pregnant when i you were sent to prison. what the -- you were sent to prison. what the —— what do your children make of it? might eldest son, i was eight weeks pregnant and we didn't k

nobody in post office can do that, _ can. nobody in post office can do that, you — can. — that, you say. mr athwelll says, are you sure? he replied, have you asked? — you sure? he replied, have you asked? i— you sure? he replied, have you asked? i have asked them and these will come _ asked? i have asked them and these will come out into the open later on. will come out into the open later on what— will come out into the open later on. what did they tell you? did they tell you _ on. what did they tell you? did they tell you that people in post office can access? they cannot access it because _ can access? they cannot access it because it — can access? they cannot access it because it is _ can access? they cannot access it because it is done against a user id. 0k, _ because it is done against a user id~ 0k. i'm _ because it is done against a user id. ok, i'm not going to argue over it. then— id. ok, i'm not going to argue over it. then mr_ id. ok, i'm not going to argue over it. then mrgillibrand, id. ok, i'm not going to argue over it. then mr gillibrand, it is a fact no

| ie independent of the post office? i don't ie independent of the post office?dent of the post office? i don't know about that, it should have been an investigation within the post office but from my working knowledge and my memory, there certainly wasn't a function that did that back then. it was only when we started working on the second site and i started bringing that a team together that we pulled together, from my perspective, knowledge and they know how to put and deal with this type of request, what has happened, can we understand what the cause of the loss is? i don't think it would have been done back then. but why not is my question? we have seen a _ but why not is my question? we have seen a couple of examples now that happened _ seen a couple of examples now that happened to concern you in the roles that you _ happened to concern you in the roles that you performed relatively early on in _ that you performed relatively early on in the _ that you performed relatively early on in the life of horizon with sub—postmasters raising the suggestion that the

t can government to the post office. i can understand them _ government to the post office. but, no, i can say was aware of it. tt with many of the mps there. but, no, i can say was aware of it.— i can say was aware of it. if we go to -a~e i can say was aware of it. if we go to page one. _ i can say was aware of it. if we go to page one, please. _ i can say was aware of it. if we go to page one, please. we - i can say was aware of it. if we go to page one, please. we can - i can say was aware of it. if we go to page one, please. we can see | i can say was aware of it. if we go i to page one, please. we can see on this page e—mails within the post office starting in the middle of the page... susan crichton says when discussing what reply to give, the problem is, the problem we have is that he doesn�*t know if we have seen the letter that has you, the minister is not seen to be aligning with those... the problem we have is that he, that is you, doesn�*t know we have seen the letter, your letter, we need to be careful that the minister is not seen to be aligning with us, that i

the post office gave gina griffiths — post office. the post office gave gina griffiths £140,000 payoff, | post office. the post office gave i gina griffiths £140,000 payoff, but gina griffiths £1a0,000 payoff, but it was confirmed today that she had to sign a confidentiality agreement. zoe conway, bbc news. if you are suffering distress or despair and need support, a list of organisations that can help is available at bbc.co.uk/actionline, or you can call forfree on 0800 066 066. a 13—year—old girl has been remanded to youth detention accommodation after being charged with three counts of attempted murder, after two teachers and a pupil were stabbed at a school in south—west wales. police said the teenager was arrested at the school in ammanford in carmarthenshire. the teachers and pupil were taken to hospital with non—life—threatening stab wounds, and have since been discharged. two men who were arrested after five people died trying to cross the channel in a small boat earlier this week have been charged with immigration offences. y

post office and it is in transit as a comes through the post office.the issue of trying not to put temptation in people's way, but in any retail business, that is not possible. what did you or do you understand to be the point being made there about temptation being put in people? why? fist made there about temptation being put in peeple? why?— made there about temptation being put in people? why? at the meeting ofthe put in people? why? at the meeting of the 17th of— put in people? why? at the meeting of the 17th of may, _ put in people? why? at the meeting of the 17th of may, with _ put in people? why? at the meeting of the 17th of may, with all _ put in people? why? at the meeting of the 17th of may, with all of - put in people? why? at the meeting of the 17th of may, with all of the - of the 17th of may, with all of the n and me, paula venables and others had raised the problem of there being lots of cash lying around in unexpected places and whether this meant that they thought that that led some postmasters into temptation and being inherently dis

no. lwas— post office? sorry? weren't you the lead? no, i was there _ post office? sorry? lead? no, i was there to assist in terms of information _ lead? no, i was there to assist in terms of information to _ lead? no, i was there to assist in terms of information to them. i lead? no, i was there to assist in i terms of information to them. who was the lead _ terms of information to them. who was the lead in _ terms of information to them. who was the lead in terms _ terms of information to them. who was the lead in terms of the engagement with second sight? they were engaged — engagement with second sight? inez were engaged by engagement with second sight? the: were engaged by alice, engagement with second sight? tie:1: were engaged by alice, paul engagement with second sight? ti9:1: were engaged by alice, paul and susan was there at the time, so it was susan really who was the overall lead —— paula. was susan really who was the overall lead -- paula-— lead -- paula. you were in charge for the provision _ lead -- paula. you were in charge for the provision of _ lead -- pa

we found the original version of the clip, which was posted to tik tok in february.nd the israel defense forces posted this video compilation on ex of iran's retaliatory attacks. most of the clips are of the attack, but there's one old clip here right at the end of the video, and that's from nearly ten years ago of a russian grad rocket launcher. as well as those two examples, last weekend saw a plethora of other cases of disinformation being circulated. video of palestinians praying at the al—aqsa mosque last week was claimed as showing them celebrating saturday's iranian strikes, and footage from this video game, arma iii was posted as showing israel's iron dome defence system in action against those strikes. meanwhile, video from iranian sources said to show missiles launching on saturday originated variously from the war in gaza in 2021, turkish rockets fired in syria in 2020, ukrainian missiles targeting russian ships last month, and an old farm fire in chile. more footage claiming to be of israelis panicking at the drone attacks actually showed fans of the pop

and to the post office inquiry.nd you of course, the post of the scandal here in the uk has led to this inquiry examining howa in the uk has led to this inquiry examining how a faulty computer system known as horizon led to the persecution of hundreds of people across the uk who ran post offices and they were wrongly convicted of theft and fraud. let's listen into theft and fraud. let's listen into the evidence being presented. find i the evidence being presented. and i am seekin: the evidence being presented. and i am seeking to _ the evidence being presented. and i am seeking to clarify _ the evidence being presented. fific i am seeking to clarify that there the evidence being presented. fific i am seeking to clarify that there is nothing wrong with the statement as it stood then but there have been three cases identified since. at it stood then but there have been three cases identified since. at the time ou three cases identified since. at the time you sign _ three cases identified since. at the time you sign the _

can i start with your career at the post office? you had _ with your career at the post office?irst 'oin the post office in 1985, _ correct. you first join the post office in 1985, straight - correct. you first join the post office in 1985, straight from i office in 1985, straight from school _ office in 1985, straight from school. . office in 1985, straight from school.- he _ office in 1985, straight from school.- he began - office in 1985, straight from school.- he began as i office in 1985, straight from school.- he began as a | office in 1985, straight from school. yes. he began as a post office counter _ school. 193 he began as a post office counter assistant, working the counters, a person who rose up through— the counters, a person who rose up through the — the counters, a person who rose up through the organisation, holding numerous — through the organisation, holding numerous managerial roles. that is correct _ numerous managerial roles. that is correct can— numerous managerial roles. that is correct can i — numerous managerial roles. that is correct. can i outline your

matthew, the post - implausible. thank you so much, david. matthew, the post office | implausible.for the impact this has had on victims and it is cooperating with the inquiry. meanwhile, this phase of the inquiry is trying to figure out who knew what and when, so much of what we have found out today will be put to the former chief executive of the post office paula vennells who will give evidence in the coming weeks. for now, the inquiry continues. studio: thank you very much. i want to show you live pictures of president biden at the white house, he is meeting with japan's prime minister at the start of the visit, talking about the strong and growing partnership with japan on the white house. this kicking off on the south lawn of the white house. there was an arrival ceremony a short minutes ago with some early comments. we will keep a cross that, if there is anything significantjoe biden or the japanese prime minister says we would bring back to you, especially keeping an ear out for any further comments from the american president about the middle east. a major report into gend

worked within the post. and i think he saw that he could actually make a difference. and so, for a variety of those reasons, i think, he bought it. he has not used it to exercise influence, but he's been accused of that by trump over and over and over again. but there's no evidence of that and the reason there's no evidence for that is because he's never actually done it. >> your book was published after you left the paper, but the review of your book said it was three books in one. bargain hunters be aware, the three books in one and sorry about the kibitzing here, revealing examination of bezzo's stewardship of the post and sometimes a thriller that navigated a perilous time in journalism and how trump tried to discredit the post and sink amazon. you had a seat at the table for a lot of that relationship with bezos and trump and my sense probably expected hey, us rich guys, we're going to stick together. can you talk about some of dealings that bezos and trump had and some of the dealings you had with trum