it is just a kamalanomenon. i'm getting better at saying it. in a way we haven't seen with certainly any other female presidential candidate. like many other presidential candidates period. john, you know we talk about whether what kamala harris is, what makes her different now versus 2020. that she is less concerned about the progressive wing of her party than she has been or was in 2020 and i wonder, a, if you agree with that, and b, how you think that filters into her decision making around her running mate. you have some new reporting on who is in the mix there and what might happen. can you talk a little to that end? >> there are a few things at work here. number one, she was on a ticket that pushed back on the left. particularly when it came to law enforcement, police reform, and spending on police. that was a major issue during the summer of 2020. joe biden, you know, effectively said i'm not going as far as the left wants me to go here, she watched that worked for him. she has been in an administration that has sometimes appealed to the

so with each day it becomes clear that the thing the internet has dubbed the kamalanomenon that that thing is real and showing no signs of going anywhere anytime soon. the new york times michelle golder traveled to the recent rally in atlanta where she interview people in the crowd and spoke to 156-year-old woman of color named tracy who described what she is seeing in her community since kamala harris rose to the top of the ticket. i'm telling you something she told them, i go on my walks in the morning, i see women of color and we just look at each other and we just smile like yeah, says, we got this. we got this. joining me now is michelle goldberg, and with me is nbc news political reporter jonathan allen. it's great to see you both, thank you for being here. michelle, i was so struck by the anecdotes that you have in your latest column about kamalanomenon, a phrase i'm still practicing too little success but can you talk about what you saw and what you are hearing on the ground and the impression it left you with? >> i think that we all had some sense that there was this incredi