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my source tonight is veteran tech journalist kara swisher. and kara just is someone who has interviewed elon musk, who's observed him, who's known him for years. what is your takeaway on on what we've seen him do in the last two weeks? >> well, it's very typical. this is how he conducts himself all the time. he's always in a state of high drama, high agitation. he did this when tesla was in big trouble. he had to sleep on the floor of the factory, even though there was a hotel next door, because it was dramatic. he thinks he's the center of the universe, which is really strange. he's very into video games, and so i think he thinks he's sort of ready player one. he thinks nothing can happen without his existence. he often used to say, if tesla failed, the human race was doomed. to me, on a number of occasions, things like that. so, you know, it's massive narcissism with a lot of talent and a lot of pr and a lot of drama. and that's what you're seeing right now. >> it's interesting what you said about the bed thing, because i saw in the new york

kara swisher and katie drummond, two reporters known for covering musk's extensively, are outfront tonight, together with their latest breaking reporting and the senate voting this hour. on the. man some are calling trump's most dangerous. nominee and author of project 2025 now about to be in charge of all the money, the budget chief. let's go out front. >> and good evening. >> i'm erin burnett. outfront tonight, the breaking news rejected by the court. so trump's sweeping plans to dismantle the federal government did hit a major snag late today. two courts actually shutting trump down. for now, i'll go through it here. the first hit came after musk's massive buyout offer to federal employees, which he builds the fork in the road offer was blocked by a federal judge. now, that offer gave 2 million federal workers until midnight tonight to accept a deal to resign. that's it. they had to cut off. and this is it. no questions asked. but that's now been pushed back until at least monday. then there's going to be another hearing to decide if the controversial so-called buyout is legal. it's the

she's also the host of the podcast on with kara swisher and pivot. also with us is richard posner. he's the former chief white house ethics lawyer under president george w. bush. bush, thank you both for being with us. richard. first to you, let's start with the obvious question. are these actions by elon musk actually legal well, elon musk is acting as if he is a federal officer, a federal officer appointed by the president of the united states. >> and president trump can appoint him as a federal officer and then send him into the agencies. some of what he's doing is legal for a federal officer. some of it is not. but he would be a federal officer bound by the criminal conflict of interest statute at 18 united states code 2018, which says it is a crime for a federal officer to participate in a government matter that has a direct and predictable effect on their financial interest. and so that means that musk is going to have to sell his interest in tesla x, spacex, and the rest of it, or recuse from any and all government matters that have anything to do with or could impact those

here in studio, kara swisher. malik abdul. joanna coles and solomon jones. it's the weekend. join the conversation at the table for five. good morning. i'm abby phillip in new york. in donald trump's second week on the job, america has once again been reminded of how he copes with the crisis. he suddenly becomes a pundit. it wasn't four hours after the nation's deadliest plane crash in nearly a quarter century, when the president started ruminating about blame, questioning the competence of the tower and military pilots. then, 14 hours after the crash, he took to the white house podium with a different and clearer message about who he thinks is at fault. >> i put safety first. obama, biden and the democrats put policy first. the faa's diversity push includes focus on hiring people with severe intellectual and psychiatric disabilities. that is amazing. a group within the faa. another story determined that the workforce was too white, that they had concerted efforts to get the administration to change that and to change it immediately. this was in the obama administration, but

cnn's kara swisher said unlikely to have a deal here, for obvious reasons, but that might not reallythe ultimate goal here. musk could be trying to throw a wrench in some of openai's fundraising efforts. their effort to convert to a for profit company. but we've got to stay tuned to this, this story, because it's not going away. >> yeah, it's somewhere between trolling and also literally wanting to spike some business interests of openai. >> yeah, there could be some strategic moves here by musk. >> so he's got elon musk, some other issues going on with regulators right now. >> yeah. >> well look, he's at. >> the forefront. >> of this effort to essentially gut the cfpb. remember that's the watchdog brainchild of elizabeth warren. it's going after big banks like wells fargo payday lenders. et cetera. and musk. last week he was on x and he sent out a message saying rest in peace cfpb with a tombstone emoji. and a source told cnn that just hours later, doge, which is led by musk, they went and they deleted cfpb's x account. they were granted access to cfpb. since then, systems. and sinc

but like kara swisher was on our air talking about, um, what this actually is. and she says that the way that elon is going about this annie, is a feature, not a bug. let's watch you know, there's an expression in in technology. >> it's not it's it's a feature, not a bug. this this is what they do. they are careless. i don't believe any bit of them when they say they vetted these people and they just there are people that will listen to whatever elon says and do whatever he wants and thinks. it's a ball to do this. and very funny. and so they're willing to do things, say adults wouldn't be willing to do or cross lines that they wouldn't be. he wants these malleable, malleable young men in particular, in order to do this. and they think it's fun, and it probably is for them, you know, being able to hang out with elon musk and, you know, take down government agencies for them. and the arrogance is massive and the ignorance is even bigger. >> yeah. i mean, i'm glad you played that from kara. i think right now in washington, d.c., if you want to understand elon musk