i think that michael gove did a terrific job.achievements driving up standards. and she's going to drive schools back to the 1960s. >> very much. does she? because they've got too much control. >> and again, i'm sorry because i've got to know some very great respect for many people on the left. but there's this obsession with what fairness is and making sure everybody gets an equal start. but the problem is i'm all for everybody getting every opportunity and getting a good, fair chance to be lifted up. but there comes a point where you just have to accept that some teachers are better than others, and that's going to advantage some children. what you can't do is take away all the incentives to drive up the less good teachers. >> but why not pay teachers more if they are good teachers? >> well, i would. >> well, i would. >> love that money. >> love that money. >> but you know that. >> but you know that. >> the academies were had the freedom to do that. not anymore. >> well, that's what she's now said. she's rowing back on that now

. >> well, let's talk now to former adviser to michael gove, charlie rowley, who joins us in the studioood to see you this morning, charlie. good morning. what's your reaction to what we've seen in munich? another horrific car attack. >> well, as you say, germany. exactly as you say, it's another one. another one in germany, a horrific attack where people who are going about their everyday lives in the morning. it was a organised sort of march by trade unionists and a chap in a white mini, as you can see, has driven into the back of the people at the back of that protest, taking out up to 30 people, including children. it is a horrific it is another attack, as you say, something that we're getting used to and seeing this all too familiar sight. >> people just ask why charlie? they look at that and they think, what's he achieving? what statement is he making there? >> and that's the question . >> and that's the question. because, you know, it's coming up to a general election in germany where there's the rise of the afd. that's the far right, the. >> alternative conference going on. >> b