effort to wipe out any non-isis fighters to turn to the world d y that the only choices are either assad or isis. second point is that the growth of isis will continue in iraq, they are spread into libya where they become significant presence degreesingly in a arage as well. they are using all these operating bases not to conduct regional efforts but to grow, recruit people online. >> dickerson: how mucucof the united stateteshould be worried about the russian presence in >> the goals are pry prayerly flee hold. putin wants to be viewed as important international leader on par of with the united states. part is deflecting attention away from ukraine. part is about becoming a regional power that replaces the united states in terms of the power broker in the region and its direction. the interests are to prop up assad who is provided for them a foothold into the region. so they are stepping into vacuum we left behind. ideal world you'd be able to work with rush that to delete jihaddists. >> dickerson: let's switch to talk about executive experience. in 2008 republicans running talking about democr

he twoonts deny any credible to the regime of bashar al assad or isis.t is those two choices. >> we are watching these tensions between turkey and russia. turkey is already on board. can that region take one more conflict? >> well, syria has ceased to be very sorry to say, a popular protest movement against a dick ta tore yara jeem i don't know what the main event is any longer. this recent confrontation between turkey and russia is very long in the making. putin and erdogan have a lot in common, both megalow manical. they have suppressed any kind of media to conduct any policy they like with impunity. turkey has been picking a fight with russia for a while. turkish fighter jets a few years ago escorted a russian cargo plane down to the tarmac because they were carrying military equipment for assad. in 2012, a turkish f-4 reconnaissance jet was shot down presumably inside syrian air space. rumors among syrian opposition at the time and i know because i was in turkey, were that a russian technician was the guy that pushed the button on that attack. there

or terrorized in their home country. i think if we send them away, we're playing right into isis' hands. >> they then have a choice of either joining bashar al assadisis. i get your point. governor, thank you for being here. this week, another governor, john kasich, who is running of course for president, said our government should have a judeo christian values agency. i have a problem with that. isn't that the concept that is awfully close to what isis is all about? and in fact what is the ultimate goal of the isis terrorists? the author of a widely read article, what isis really wants, says it's all about the koran. an american professor who is a muslim scholar says they're criminals and ignoring their religion. both of them are next. for seven, we did battle. until i said... you will not beat... meeeeee!!! greg. what should i do with your fish? gary. just put it in the cooler. if you're a fisherman, you tell tales. it's what you do. if you want to save fifteen percent or more on car insurance, you switch to geico. it's what you do. put the fish in the cooler! the uncertainties i don't wantof hep c.with or wonder... ...whether i should seek trea

obama did not take action against assad or isis when he could have and because the president pulled all, there's chaos. my memo is right on. why is the president not removed from office before it's too late? i believe you can't just remove a president because you don't like his policies. come on, man. jim charles, clearwater, kansas. bill, you are right a lot but not about muslim refugees. we don't want them because they are muslim and don't assimilate. you guys aren't close to being the majority. most american muslims are loyal to the country and make it a better place. come on. mason city iowa, why do you keep promoting donald trump and giving him more voice than the other candidates? i'm not promoting him phyllis and it's obvious i'm not promoting him if you noticed last night's segment. you may have noticed he's the poll leader and the most controversial candidate. we invite all on the program. some decline. most accept but their appearances are dictated by events. are the people waters interviews left, right or center? we don't ask ideology. all are chosen at random. dorothy long,

in order to present us with the unacceptable choice of bashar al assad or isis. >> i want to ask you all your contemporaries, at least you lived through all of this with the bush 43 white house, we now have this new book by john meacham, highly respected, spent a lot of time with bush 41, and he is basically suggesting that dick cheney and don rumsfeld have captured bush 43, that he describes them both as hard-asses and that they were hardliners and made bad decisions and did not serve the president well. what is your reaction to this? >> well, i would have to say, you know i said so at the time, i agree with bush 41 in that i called for the resignation of donald rumsfeld because we were failing in iraq at the time. lindsey graham and joe lieberman and i were there enough to see that we were on a downward spiral and i've got to hand it to george w. bush. he fired him after the 2006 election debacle. i praised george w. bush for that and he brought in david petraeus, he brought in the surge and we turned it all around. unfortunately, then president obama decided to pull everybody out

they'll be either executed or imprisoned either by assad or by isis. i think we should have -- we should focus our efforts for the christians being slaughtered. >> how does the united states, how do screeners tell which refugees are christian and which ones are not? >> well, we do that all the time. it takes almost a year for a refugee to be processed into the united states. i think we need to be obviously very, very cautious. this also calls to mind the need to make sure we protect our borders, our southern border particularly. we need to focus on count counterterrorism capabilities. this is a threat against western civilization. and we need to lead. the united states has pulled back. when we pull back, voids are filled. they're filled now by islamic terrorism that threatens our country. >> what would you be doing differently that president obama is not? there are obviously bombing campaigns going on in syria. they killed jihadi john just a few days ago. what would president bush be doing? >> i would first have a strategy. the president has admitted h

isis has the funding. we should describe what is our political strategy. who is the enemy here? assad? ors isis the enemy? do we think we should not have assad on a designated enemy? >> eye sassad is a bad guy. i think it's clear that isis represents the real threat to our country, to the world. i said so 15 months ago in a press conference when i was asked about isis. i said this is a force we've never seen before. they represent all the dynamics we have never comfonfronted bef. assad has to be dealt with. you can't confuse your allies anded adversaries by saying ass must go and we can't deal with him because he's lost legitimacy to rule. what he's done to his own people. and we'll deal with him later. we want you on the ground. the opposition groups we're funding, training, and prepare to go after isis. they don't see it that way. the turks don't see it quite that way. they have a lot of different problems and measures that are subterranean. religious differences. >> what was your concern when you wrote the memo to the white house? >> my concern was, by the way, i wasn't blaming everybo

or terrorized in their home country. i think if we send them away, we're playing right into isis' hands. >> they then have a choice of either joining bashar al assadjoining isis. i totally get your point. governor, thank you for being here. this week, another governor, john kasich, who is running of course for president, said our government should have a judeo- christian values agency. i have a problem with that. isn't that the concept that is awfully close to what isis is all about? and, in fact, what is the ultimate goal of the isis terrorists? the author of a widely read article, what isis really wants, says it's all about the koran. an american professor who is a muslim scholar says they're criminals and ignoring their religion. both of them are next. ono off-days, or downtime.ason. opportunity is everything you make of it. this winter, take advantage of our season's best offers on the latest generation of cadillacs. the 2016 cadillac srx. get this low-mileage lease from around $339 per month, or purchase with 0% apr financing. i was on the bus and i couldn't stop streaming. i don't even want to think about the overages. it's okay. t-mobile no

the obama administration here has been we are not supporting assad or isis, both of which of good principledions, these of both kind of evil political players. the way to solve this is a third way. there is enough political support for that within syria that we can do this without committing war troops on the ground, because frankly, there is no support for that from the united states. we know that doesn't end well most of the time, either. that balance may not be possible for this or any other future american president. >> russia flexing its muscle more than since the cold war, there was the incursion in crimea. it is pointed out most of what vladimir putin is doing is his desire to bring back the glory days of the old soviet union when washington was on par with washington. do you see that, as well that putin is only worried about bringing back russia -- >> to a great extent, president putin wants russia to be seen as a geopolitical counter. >> can it be? >> no. just this incident yesterday or the day before yesterday with this plane, the turks shot down this plane and a few weeks before t

they'll be either executed or imprisoned either by assad or by isis. i think we should have -- we should focus our efforts as to refugees and christians being slaug slaughtered. >> how does the united states and screeners tell which refu e refugees are christians and which ones are not? >> we do that all the time. it takes almost a year for a refugee to be processed into the united states. i think we need to be obviously very very cautious. this also calls to mind the need to protect our borders, our southern border particularly and focus on counter-intelligence capabilities that have been weakened when the patriot act was re-authorized. this is a warning for our country this threat is not going to go away, this is a threat against western civilization. we need to lead. the united states has pulled back and when we pull back voiced are filled and filled by islamic terrorism that fills our country. >> what would due different president obama has not. there are bombing operations going on in syria. they killed jihadi john a few days ago. what would presi

isis together. what our priority is which is our priority, getting rid of assad or taking care of business with isis first. we need to decide our strategy and then decide how russia fits into that strategy. >> rose: and we conclude this evening with david miliband, he is president of the international rescue committee. >> there are always very difficult decisions and very difficult judgements. but what my piece of learning is, you have to build up the systems that are robust. and what i have seen of the u.s. system, 12 to 15 different agencies, the full panapoly of buy metric tests, no refugee has committed an act of terrorism in the united states, and long may that continue. what i have seen is systems that are very dill gent and very well built. >> rose: lisa monaco, bob gates and david miliband when we continue. funding for charlie rose is provided by the following: and by bloomberg, a provider of multimedia news and information services worldwide. from our studios in new york city, this is charlie evening with our continuing coverage of the paris attacks. more details emerging about the plot tha

even if russia does turn more attention to isis, vladimir putin's primary aim is to weaken the aim at assad. either assad run syria, ordoes. that is not much of a choice for the europeans. alix: when it comes to vladimir putin, russia's economy is not awesome. it seems like vladimir putin has become instrumental. hishe one hand, international policy is doing well, where is -- as his internal is not so much. alexander kliment: one way those things could come together is if russia can, by virtue of its role in syria, can get itself out of european sanctions. that is a key objective for vladimir putin. he is trying to use that as leverage to soften the sanctions. it will not do wonders for the economy. the russian economy was in trouble, stagnating before the ukraine rices, before oil prices collapsed. any little bit helps. if they can get out of sanctions next year, it makes a difference. joe: what odds you place on that? alexander kliment: i think it looks good. repeal, but out of the diplomacy surrounding syria, the vienna process develops -- the europeans will get to a point where they have to do trading with russia

isis. he is just propping up bashar al-assad. maybe he gets isis oraybe he doesn't, i don't think he really cares. this is according to our intelligence officials. but now you may be in a situation where isis targeting putin? >> well, i mean that is why this is interesting. if this is isis, it's a big win for isis, trish. this means they have been able to pull off mass casualty attack. this is the first major mass casualty attack they have been able to pull off on international stage. but your point, it is also bad news for isis. why? putin can not but respond and he will respond viciously and ruthlessly without mercy. why? because his whole political career was launched in 1999 and 2000 when he put down the chechen, islamic extremist terrorists in his own country. he won the second chechen war. the reason his predecessor, boris yeltsin was kicked out of office because he couldn't put down islamic extremists. this is personal for putin. if this was attack on russians by isis he will go after isis. yeah? trish: i want to jump in. i wonder how many this

they either want to take out isis or they want to prop up assad. assad is kind of isis' evil twin. his brutality to his people is one of the things that brought isis in to being. so the russians are going to have to figure out a way and i think the talks in vienna are mildly hopeful to move assad out and then concentrate the fire on isis. clearly, the russians, the french, the americans, the gulf states, even the iranians focusing on isis, is going to make a world of difference in that fight. >> if we make a political decision that we can trade a recognition of a slow departure of the assad family from damascus in some way or another, it's handled, for cooperation on going after isis, then we still face, after the politics that have been put together, the need for a land army of indigenous people. if a bunch of europeans and americans come to that part of the world, they will make the isis case, won't they? >> chris, that's exactly what isis wants. they want this to be a war of the west against islam. that would be sending our troops in there would be a gift. if they have to be mus

isis develops. is assad the enemy or is isis the enemy? >> i'm wondering your take on that. is there no military solution to fighting isis because this is an ideology that has spread so rampantly. >> we have said for a very long time poppy that this will not be involved militarily. i thought the former secretary's interview this morning was fascinating because it outlines some things which message the fact that -- well, let's put it this way. there has been a strategy from the very beginning. there are seven lines of operation to this strategy, two of which are military. the other ones have not received as much attention from the general public or even from the congress. so the focus on those other lines of operations, stopping the transport of fighters, influencing the economics of this terrorist and criminal organization, attempting to counter the messaging and the ideology and many other things are all part of the overarching strategy that has not received the attention that bombing syria has received. i think what we're seeing now is several other nations, france, later

isis and to take out assad. this has all been made a lot more complicated with the russian involvement. >> is it isis or assad, or both. >> so you would pursue a strategy getting rid of assad and dealing with isis. >> and having a political solution that would create stability in a place. 250,000 people killed by both sides. christians being murdered because of their faith. moderate muslims that believe in their faith that are being raped and held as slaves. this is a tragic case of inaction by our own country and chaos in this place. and so i think we need to be engaged with safe zones. and air power to be protecting the safe zones. both for the refugees, as well as a fighting force that there should be a unified effort in the region. the saudis and the turks and others need to join us. the europeans seeing the consequence of millions of refugees coming towards them should be engaged as well. we should be leaders, this is what america does best. >> do you accept some of the analysis that says without the invasion of iraq we wouldn't have isis? >> no, i don't. isis was created after al qaeda in iraq was taken out

isis possesses, the funding. so we should more clearly define what is our political strategy, what are our priorities, who is the enemy here. is assad the enemy or is isis the enemy? >> air strikes are gereat, but air strikes alone won't win here. what isis has achieved is the ability to gain territory and it's that caliphate where they're designing their ability to kind of now do outreach and attack other countries. >> panetta also says that the u.s. deserves some of the blame for not getting involved sooner. >>> another sign of the country on edge, suspicious behavior from three unruly men on a southwest airlines flight forces an emergency landing. passengers say the men were switching seats and not listening to crews during takeoff from indianapolis. the plane then landed in kansas city where police and the tooib were waiting with k-9 units. travelers describing a confusing scene. >> just a little terrified because i didn't know what was happening. i thought something was wrong with the plane. >> they didn't say what was going on. i was just nervous and ready to move on with my flight. >> after you've been reading about all the threats overse

it is not necessarily a strategy that is aligned with assad must go or isis must be destroyed. the aspirations of the policy. the real policy has been we don't see people that we can support and give weapons to and feel comfortable that they will stay in their hands, or that we know where they're going to fight. and we certainly don't see any utility to trying to prop up assad who has done more with his regime to lead to the refugee crisis that we presently have across the region and europe. >> rose: are they calling the first order of business to defeat assad? i thought the president had changed on that and said yes, we want him out but that's not our first priority. >> that's right. i would say in the past couple of months, since certainly since the russians decided they were going to take a leading role in military intervention in syria, the united states kind of backed off the assad must go now, and more the assad cannot be a part of the ongoing political process. but there is still a big gap between the americans and the russians, a huge gap. >> is there any question aroun

assad. so, we are very, pragmatic and very realistic and very busy to solve the problem. and, the target is isis, no? so for assad they will see later. >> i don't think the european response or the french response is to accommodate assad. it is to fight isis in an even more determined manner and with more military means. i mean, if you want to see the equalibrium of french politics and policy on that, as hollande said the enemy is isis but the solution shouldn't have assad as an outcome. that is not exactly what you described. >> and -- final word, is yours on the refugee issue. if you can put this in the context of what now seems to be perhaps the most significant flow of muslims to europe in modern history. >> this is a major controversy in france of course because the electoral campaign of the extreme right is to say that the refugee flow into france is, is manifold. on one hand as you just said this is going to change the demographic balance of europe. there is this feeling in some circles here, what they call the great replacement. that is to say that european population, this was also something that you had in, you could read in some books by bernard lewis and others i

isis possesses, the funding. so we should -- we're clearly defining what is our political strategy? what are our priorities? who is the enemy here? is assad the enemy or is isis the enemy? >> perhaps the biggest target of the recent air strikes has been isis' self-declared capital of raqqah in syria. in a cnn exclusive, nick paton walsh gets close to the isis headquarters. >> air strikes can repeatedly pound raqqah, but it's here any ground offensive against isis would have to begin, and still, a sense of steal mate. their ultimate goal of raqqah visibility on a good day from a distance. and hit by isis mortars. >> don't miss nick's full exclusive report from syria monday morning on new day, starting at sick:00 a.m. eastern. >> a woman who survived the mali hotel siege talks about the moment she first heard gunfire down the hall. her emotional interview coming up. >>> plus, members of the american rock band eagles of death metal tell us what it was like to see their fans and friends dying during the paris terror attacks. padvil pm gives you the healingu at nsleep you need, it. helping you fall asleep and stay asleep so your body can heal as you rest.

. >> and now, assad needs to go according to our officials, but some countries are asking, what is the lesser of two evils isis or assad al bashar? >> well, that is the problem for a long time. assad's violence that he had to run the country has a lot the do with the isis running the country. and i looked at the white house senior officials a year ago and i said, really, if you could push a button and assad would be gone, would you do that? because if so, then who is in damascus? and face it, assad is an embarrassment to the people backing him. he is an embarrassment to the russians and iran. and so, you can't wish the man away, and you can't snap your fingers and have a vacuum in damascus, and if we have a vacuum there, it is going to be looking like the vacuum in tripoli and so many other cities around the area where the leadership went away, and the bad people moved in. >> congressman himes, thank you for talking to us on this holiday friday. have a wonderful holiday. >> thank you, briana. >> all right. take care. >>> protesters are going in the streets right now in chicago. this is in protest of the shooting

besides bashar al-assad, or baghdadi, leader of isis no one man on earth more responsible than the refugee crisis than barack obama. year after year he resisted action to take crisis in syria to a conclusion. millions of refugees destablizing european union. instead of being held accountable for that, instead of debating causes, instead of how we're bringing a closer, we're having debate over token number, 10,000 or so that syrian refugees president wants to settle here, belittling, country, more than half the country. trish: more than half the country feels like that right now. a lot of people, when you press them on this, they get a lot of questions. aaron, good to have you here, thanks very much. >> thanks for having me. trish: for citing root of the problem, we allowed, we allowed al-asad doing what he did and we're confronting reality of millions of refugees around the world. president obama calling out republicans and refugee opponents saying they're scared of widows and orphans. a congressman trying to halt the program's funding response, right after this. >> apparent they're scared

a neighbor, whether aaligned with assad or nusra or isis they see it is a place without a future anymoreave done but they want to go somehow into the world. >> this is a really extraordinary piece of journalism. thank you for joining us to talk more about it today. happy thanksgiving even there in london. you can't predict... the market. but at t. rowe price, we can help guide your investments through good times and bad. for over 75 years, our clients have relied on us to bring our best thinking to their investments so in a variety of market conditions... you can feel confident... ...in our experience. call a t. rowe price retirement specialist or your advisor ...to see how we can help make the most of your retirement savings. t. rowe price. invest with confidence. this is black friday.zy. oh my god. does anybody want to be part of this? nooooo. well, chevy has a better way, with black friday deals all month long. that's a great idea. what if you could get up to twenty percent cash back when you bought it? bam. twenty percent back? that's awesome. it's black friday. find your tag and get

they just say either isis or assad's regime, both ways you will be dead. >> so what has life been like in the u.s. for two years. how are you coping? how is your daughter adjusting? >> oh, my god. she refuses to speak arabic now, she's funny. i'm always trying to teach her language. she tell me mommy, i love i think beneficiary. i don't like to speak arabic. baby, it's fine. that's your language here in the united states, it's your country. but you have to be prepared for college. you have to learn care bik for your college. no more, no less. so she is american despite the fact that they didn't give us a paper yet. but, that's her country. she is proud to be here. >> you said that this really isn't your choice. you were forced to leigh syria. >> yeah. >> do you think you will ever go back? >> if the war sop stop. but with all the chaos, it's a battlefield. it is. syria is a battlefield pop too do you think it will ever be over? >> no, i don't. in my lifetime, no, i don't. i hope i'm wrong for the sake of good people. there's still a lot of good people there that cannot flee. >> it is a

assad in aleppo and the kurds at the border. in conclusion, i say isis will not be defeated quickly, also because assad in russia is needed. if isis retreats, it's not for russian ally's benefit orassad but not for the other rebels. isis is pushing assad arm syrian people threatened by the jihaddists, as we can see on this map, the religious minorities in syria, otherwise jews and christian are in the syrian army area in the rebel zone in the isis zone there is , it is she add it is jihad but is the exception. and in the north, of course, the kurdish territories are under control. france is going to strike isis and russia the other rebels but the rebels will not do the difference between french and russian bombs. nd probably we are going to be , as a ally enemy of assad and russia. but in fact the threat is to hide no in france and to destroy the isis organization quickly to preserve the social peace in europe to prevent future attacks. another massive attack in france will be disastrous for the co-al igs. -- coalition. and would probably be for the first time in history. and in 2017 we will have the presidential election and would be in the second term and suspect she will not

attacks have gotten us closer to russia's goal of presenting the west with a very stark choice of isis or assad because they know in that situation of course we're going to choose assad however reluctantly. >> who is leading those developments? is it the french and does the rest of the west now. >> v take the french's lead giv the tragedy they have suffered? >> the rest of the west has to defer to france's desire to hit back against isis and to make the kind of strategic concessions to russia, to syria, perhaps to iran that france needs to dodgers achieve the sort of 100% effectiveness in it's strikes against raqqah and elsewhere in the islamic state. i do worry that the president's back footedness over the past nearly half decade has really -- i mean, even forgetting these attacks for a minute, has really reduced our ability in negotiation with assad's backers like the russians to insist on any kind of hard nose deal where assad steps down. i don't think we have the bargaining leverage. >> i want to ask you. a lot of people are concerned about who might be the next target. is it the u.s. or he

issues -- one, that the assad removal question should be set aside and secondly, that isis is the principal fool and not say, for instance, with the turks who think the kurds are equal oraudi's who think assad is perhaps worse than isis. so unless the united states can deliver the saudis and the turks, the 35 minute meeting may not prove to be as significant as it seems right now. amy: i want to go to the presidential debate, the democratic presidential debate saturday night. yes, it was held. the presidential candidates in the democratic party met for their second debate, former secretary of state hillary clinton and senator bernie sanders sparred over the u.s. supper handling the claimed islamic state this is the debate moderator john dickerson of cbs. talks secretary clinton, the was isisis about underestimated? i will act, the president referred to them as the jv and you and you 2014 said, i cannot a predicted the extent to which isis could be affected in seizing cities in iraq. prescriptions for the future, but how do we know if there any good if you missed it in the past? >> what happened when we abided by the agreement that george w. bush made with the iraqis to

assad out and end up eating isis. some say defeat isis first and then get rid of assad. is there a correct order or not? the number one crisis is to stop the cancer from spreading throughout syria and iraq, of which isis controls 1/3 of both countries. you simply cannot defeat isis without restoring the territorial integrity of both countries. in iraq, there is no more iraq that is unified. thet into kurdistan, backup, and the sunnis are welcoming isis because they would rather have them than the militia led by iran. we have to look at working to perhaps even put a few more troops on the ground to iraq. restoring the territorial integrity there, working with the kurds and other. the tougher question is syria. there are two questions. when is a nato-led force to restore the territorial integrity, which i don't think is happening. or to beef up the forces on the ground, which is unfortunately the assad regime. this is hard for us to swallow, but working with the russians and iranians to make that happen. i don't think you can overthrow assad and expect an undefined and yet unformed regime to take that ove

isis take out assad and then putin will take out isis. that's like a board game, that's like playing monopoly or something. >> trevor: wait, let me get that straight. monopoly is the first board game that comes to your mind? there's no better board game to describe the risk, of a strategy that puts our battleships into trouble. sorry. (applause). >> trevor: but who knows, maybe the bush family's monopoly games just get really intense. you have been captured by isis, go directly to the mass quer aid mass grave, do not pass go, do not say good-bye to your family. (laughter) now we also saw the possible new narrative in this story. donald trump might be overstaying his welcome. >> ronald reagan was strong but ronald reagan. >> ronald reagan walked away at reykjavik. he walked away, he quit talking when it was time to quit talking. >> can i finish with my time. >> why does she keep interrupting everybody? >> terrible. >> yeah, i would like to finish-- i would like to finish my response, basically. >> trevor: yeah, boo! boo, donald trump. don't you dare shush carly fiorina. she may have another great fake abortion story to tell. (laughter) (ap

the question is whether the russians are actually attacking isis or trying to prop up bashar al assad. back to you. >> lots of controversy there. thank you so much. >>> late last night, two air france from the u.s. to france were forced to make emergency landings after receiving phon phoned-in bomb threats after takeoff. one was diverted to halifax nova scotia and the other was dive diverted to salt lake city. both flights landed safely and there were no reports of injuries or arrests. the planes were safely inspected and cleared to resume their flights. >>> and attacks against the raqqah stronghold in syria. this after russia announce they had a bomb brought down plane earlier this month killing all 224 people on board. russian president putin has vowed to find them wherever they are hiding. saying we will find them any place on earth and punish them. russia has offered a $50 million reward for information leading to those responsible. >>> and -- in his announcement yesterday he said running is an honor but this is not my time. there are 14 left. and ben carson is defending his forei

assad. you made the case very strongly that you cannot really deal with isis until you have dealt with or without dealing with assad. the russian view is that you essentially can deal with isis that he is a critical part of the anti-isis coalition in part because it's the only thing holding the rest of syria together. in part because he has a lot of forces on the ground in there are no other groups in that coalition. to listen to laura, i think that the french, even some of the americans have been a little attracted to this concept. can you tell us quite directly, what is wrong with this? mr. bahout: first of all, very quickly, your three-point arguments are factually wrong, the three of them. assad is holding 20% of the territory, not syria. the syrian armory -- army has become a shadowy corpse. it is perhaps at 25% of its original capacity. three, so far assad has not shown a lot of willingness to fight isis either. we can multiply that. i think the russian view is -- this is where i also said before so far according to all the reports that we read that are probably serious, russia has 20 perce

assad. not primarily battling isis. does this mean orink we have to look at this from everyone agrees they want isis out. the other thing is, though, they always -- there's always a but. they always want something else. they want assad in power. they want their footprint in syria. the americans want -- the french want assad out but they don't want to send troops. why can't they get isis out? there's no reason we physically with the military coalition we can't push them out. i think the russians want that footprint. it's very, very important. they need assad in power. if isis was wiped out tomorrow, there's a vacuum. until we have a solution, what's going to happen with syria, no one is going to push isis out. >> how far do you think vladimir putin and the turkish president erdogan will push this macho battle over the plane? >> they put the s-400 which is a fairly integrated -- it's a game-changer. it poses quite a dilemma and quite a threat to the air crews flying in the region. that being said, i think this is just posturing. the russia

russia's involvement in syria and whether it is fighting to keep president bashar al-assad in power or focusing on isis after the group claimed responsibility for bombing a russian plane leaving egypt last month. hollande is expected to continue his call for the u.s. and russia, , fight together in a single broadad coalition. the white house says they will continue the conversation with russia, but at this point they are making no promises. norah. >> all right, chip reid. thank you so much. presidential front runner donald trump will bring back water boarding or go further if necessary. polls show trump leading in iowa, ted cruz is right behind him. ben carson who led in iowa a month agis now third. the pom find iowa republicans give trump the most support for handling terrorism. nancy cordes reports the billionaire is using a 9-11 memory to back up his claims. >> reporter: the fact checkers make trump seem more convinced he did see thousands of muslim americans celebrating on 9/11. he repeated the claim in ohio and blamed the media on the controversy. >> nobody will believe me. some people believe me.

is a good idea for putin to be in syria, let isis take out assad and then putin will take out isis, that's like a board game. that's like playing monopoly or something. that's not how the real world works. >> donald trump's promise to round up and remove millions of undocumented imgrants also became a flashpoint when governor john kasich cut in. >> the people think that we are going to ship 11 million people who are law-abiding, who are in this country, and somehow pick them up at their house and ship them out of mexico -- to mexico? think about the families. think about the children. come on, folks, we all know you can't pick them up and ship them across, back across the border. it's a silly argument. it's not an adult argument. it makes no sense. >> all i can say -- is you're lucky in ohio that you struck oil. that's one thing. let me just tell you that dwight eisenhower, good president, great president, people liked him, i like ike, right, the expression, i like ike, moved a million and a half illegal immigrants out of this country. we have no choice. >> no, he didn't -- >> let me -- >> governor bush -- >> just -- >> what -- >> you're n

isis, but we don't want to empower assad. turkey wants to take out assad. and there are secondary goals to take out isis. russia wants to protect assad. and their secondary orclaim secondary goal is to take out isis. it's very hard to lead when people are going in different directions. >> but, again, who should take the lead in this? who should lay down the law about how we operate in the fight against isis? doesn't some country need to do that? >> i -- need to. we live in a world where we don't always get what we want. and the idea that america will step forward and compel everyone or persuade everyone to adopt our objectives and to follow our rules is -- you know, that's donald trump on a political platform, but that's not how you can conduct things. the fact is we can work -- >> but, sir, do you agree -- what is the united states' plan to defeat ice dismiss can you articulate it for me? >> first of all, eve had some successes. we've taken back in territory -- >> i'm talking about the plan. what is the plan? >> okay. our plan, number one, is not to lose 4500 americans the way we lost them in iraq. the number two part of that plan is to force isis to contr