ben crump, are you there? ben, are you there? we're going to go back now. there's obviously technical difficulty. we will speak to attorney ben crump shortly. i do want to go back to jake tapper, who's in the thick of it all in ferguson, missouri where the violence is in full force there. jake, what are you seeing now? >> reporter: well, we're here still on south florissant, and there's a gentleman who has passed out in the middle of the street, and there's a crowd going around him and we're not really exactly sure what happened specifically. what happened? >> tear gassed. >> reporter: he was tear gassed i'm told by somebody here. the tear gas obviously can cause quite a violent reaction in your body when you get tear gassed. so a bunch of people who were down south florissant and who were tear gassed are coming up here and having reactions to it. hold on. i'm being told something by my producer. yes? don lemon, we're going to go to you now. wherever you are. what's going on? >> we're by the police department. and i would urge you, jake. it's good to see yo

ben crump is not an impartial observer. he's an advocate with a client. he starts with officer wilson is guilty and works backwards from there. one level you can look at that is that is our job as advocates to take the facts and marshal them in a way that's consistent with our theory. on the other hand, it is a dangerous thing to announce that someone is guilty and then say we have respect for the system. i mean that is a dangerous thing. >> right. >> however, again, as an advocate you have to wonder, after a while maybe that falls on deaf ears because people are increasingly going to recognize he -- >> mel. >> he has a drum to beat. >> two things that were said. today ben crump saying, as michael bodden was going into to testify about his autopsy results, this is how benjamin crump characterized what that grand jury is going to hear from michael bodden. have a listen. >> there is evidence that shows michael brown had his hands up. yes. that no doubt about that. and that is not in regards to his testimony, that is in regards to what we know based on our r

and ben crump told me very clearly that the family doesn't trust the process because of that.sn't trust the system. and was hurt quite frankly be being so kept out of the loop on what has been going on. they were shocked when they did finally get notified that there was a decision, that they were notified only after it had been widely reported and only after i told them. and so this is just very, very unusual process from the beginning. >> why is that, sunny? you have said that all along you believe this grand jury process, the way it's been handled you think it's unusual. elaborate on that. >> you know it's unusual because when prosecutors want to indict a case, in police shootings or any other case, typically the evidence brought in front of the grand jury is your best hit. it's very streamlined presentation. sometimes you only put in your investigating officers to give a detailed report of what they investigated and what they saw. and then you present the charges, the potential charges to the grand jurors and, you know, the grand jury deliberates. never have i heard in any

i'm with ben crump. i just met with him for about 30 minutes and interviewed him. he says that no one has notified him, no one has notified the family, no one has notified his co-counsel anthony gray about a decision. the first they learned about the possibility of a decision was from cnn and was from me. he said that the family is very upset. they are distraught that no one from the prosecutor's office has reached out to them. they are offended and they had an agreement in place whereby the prosecutor's office was going to give them some notice. ben tells me, benjamin crump tells me at one point it was about six hours notice and that then changed to some notice, but at this time, no one from the prosecutor's office has reached out to the family. >> so, sunny, again, remember we were talking about that 48 hour notice. that's not going to happen. you're saying there was supposedly, as a courtesy, a six hour notice, but nothing yet. and has the family really been in contact or the attorneys with law enforcement or with the prosecutor, with officials in this case? >>

. >> ben crump, i want to thank you. leslie, thank you for your time this evening. we'll see you later in the show. and to remember your son. i want to say this though. that i think it is important that people understand that this is a mother. as we saw the father last night. you didn't ask to be in this public platform. and i think that's important. >> yes, sir. and reverend sharpton, thank you for being there for the family and these other families today who are going to experience their first thanksgiving without their child. >> well, thank you. and all we want to see is the truth come out. we'll be right back. sensitive bladder? never miss a chance to dance... introducing a revolution in bladder leak protection. new always discreet. up to 40% thinner, for superior comfort. absorbs 2 times more than you may need. for dance-all-you-want protection. no wonder more women already prefer new always discreet pads over poise. new always discreet. now bladder leaks can feel like no big deal. because hey, pee happens. visit alwaysdiscreet.com for coupons and your free sam

you have to remember ben crump is a great, zealous advocate for his client, he is not bound by the facts. he is believing what he is believed to be said on his client's behalf and that is not fact. it is interpreted on his behalf. >> and that is my point. people will see that and people will get angry. he has the ability to have people lose faith in the system even that is not what he is intending to me. >> it seems to me that ben crump's job is to defend his client and he is a lawyer and he won't sit here and hisk riz credibility, so if he is saying this publicly, there must be something to support what he is saying and he's also -- i've spoken to him and he's passionate, about the conversation, about there being any response to an indictment or nonindictment, about it being a peaceful protest. and it is important to know he is using his force for good and he's trying to argue for his client using the facts that he's presented and that he knows. >> thank you very much to all three of you. "outfront" next, when the president will take executive action on immigration. that report come up.

i think that ben crump described what a lot of people are saying, lawyers are saying. when you review the grand jury transcript, it does appear like the process was less than -- wasn't a normal process. people are disappointed with the result. and he is giving, i think, another version of this outcome, of what people think happened here. we heard from mcculloch yesterday. and he sounded very much like someone that was indicting the media, indicting the coverage, indicting michael brown. and i think we're just hearing the flip side. there are two sides to this story. >> absolutely. but when you have a grand jury return no true bill and you do hear from a lot of people as well that, hey, if this didn't get so much celebration in the media, it would have never gone to a grand jury, it would have gone nowhere, it would have been reviewed internally, they would reviewed the shooting and then if needed, handed it over to a prosecutor and maybe this got extra attention in the legal setting because of all of the outcry. >> i'm glad you brought that up. that's the problem with

ben crump represents brown's family. >> if you've got a blowout, a fracture to your eye socket, you're not just going to be walking around not holding your eye. >> reporter: new police radio tapes include officer wilson calling for assistance minutes before the shooting august 9th. after the shooting, another call from a different officer comes through. >> get us several more units over here. there's going to be a problem. >> reporter: police here say they have undergone thousands of hours of additional training and have reached out to build strong relationships with the community. scott, we will soon see if that effort is successful. >> pelley: dean, thanks very much. dean mentioned the 25-degree temperature in missouri today. for the second time in two weeks, a mass of arctic air is sending temperatures plunging. freeze warnings are up across exe south from texas to georgia. and that sea of blue and purple is where temperatures will be well below freezing tonight, including 15 in kalamazoo, michigan, and minus seven in aberdeen, south dakota. in the florida panhandle, the temperature

briefly f there is no indictment, talk about ben crump said it could become a civil matter.lity of a federal investigation. what happens next, including for officer wilson in the event there is no indictment? >> well, if there's no indictment, he remains free. he remains free to go back to work. there have been some speculation he wouldn't go back to work. certainly a civil case would be appropriate. of course, that's only for money damages. at the end of that thing you're not getting real justice, which would be incarceration of a killer. you can certainly control a civil case. that's why i do civil cases in this field, because the family has control. you have control over when it's filed, over the depositions, over the discovery, over the witnesses that are subpoenaed, over the evidence that's reviewed, over the experts, over the trial itself. so, that's a tremendous advantage. and i think a civil case would be appropriate. of course, yes, a federal investigation. you know, many people were so delighted when eric holder went out there. i'm, frankly, less enthusiastic about

there are answers, as ben crump says, indict the whole process. the whole process does not work. it has to be indicted and changed. they are the ones to lead it. we have to follow them. >> is there a movement - we know the federal investigation is continuing into the civil rights complaint. is that something that would move progress. is that an area in which difference can be made, where the community can see some satisfaction? >> that would be fantastic if there was really reason to believe that the department of justice would come down with an indictment. you have to look at this contextually. the department of justice has been in stanford, 2.5 years. they don't have indictments there. the likelihood na the department of justice will get an indictment in ferguson, given the fact that attorney general eric holder will lose office and this case and others will be the responsibility of loreta lynch, i don't think it's likely. if it was accomplished. that would be great. i don't necessarily think it's all that likely. >> appreciate you being with us. thank you both for joining us t

reverend al sharpton and the brown family ben crump both concede that the outbursts were not appropriateg it a result of agony. >>> the attorney for michael brown's family also addressing the violent outbursts with the victim's stepfather. benjamin crump told cnn last night there's no way louis head's words played a role in the violence that sparked in ferguson after the decision to not indict officer wilson. >> without question, number one we know that was raw emotion. however, those comments were completely inappropriate and unacceptable. however, i have not seen a witness who has tied that comment to any of the violence placed that night. and i think just to say that, to make the overture that it was related i think is not there. >> attorney defending the family. he also went on to criticize anyone who might judge brown's parents for their emotional response. >>> much more on our breaking coverage of the protest in ferguson and across the nation. plus, yerngs it seems to be coming. a winter storm expected to wreak havoc for a lot of folks traveling for thlg. and now technology gives y

let me show you ben crump, the family's attorney. >> i would hope that they got to see this video and in america is asking today. where's his blown-out orbital eye fracture, why are the police two hours later walking around normally? why isn't he at a hospital saying, i can't see? you don't have any of that. it's troubling to michael brown's family. >> but the question is we don't even know if that video was shown to the grand jury because you don't know what is shown and not shown in a grand jury proceeding. >> but we do know what the prosecutor did say in the beginning, and that was he was going to present all of the evidence to these jurors, put it all in and let them make a decision. presumably if he did that then this video was shown. whatever happens in the grand jury, they choose to intight or not to indict. the argument can be made this is not just a grand jury's decision. it's the prosecutor's decision, too. because it's the way he presents the evidence in the case. the prosecutor can't hide behind the grand jury completely saying this is their decision and we have to just go

we said it was brown family ben crump who told don lemon that outbursts played no role in ensuing arreststhat was incorrect, it was a different attorney for the browns, darryl parks, we apologize for the misstatement. >>> much more on the breaking coverage in the protests in ferguson and across the nation. >>> plus, we're going to look at a winter storm that are going to create headaches for millions of people who are now told that their planes aren't flying heading out for the thanksgiving holiday. what you need to know. asian debt that recognizes the shift in the global economy. you know, the kind that capitalizes on diversity across the credit spectrum and gets exposure to frontier and emerging markets. if you convert 4-quarter p/e of the s&p 500, its yield is doing a lot better... if you've had to become your own investment expert, maybe it's time for bny mellon, a different kind of wealth manager ...and black swans are unpredictable. ♪ (holiday mhey! is playing) i guess we're going to need a new santa ♪(the music builds to a climax.) more people are coming to audi than ever before. s

i think for the brown family, ben crump has made it very clear that they are still positive about the potential outcome of the justice department investigation. there is still that investigation ongoing. they also have civil remedies. we've seen in many cases where you may not get the result you think is just in a criminal case. but you can avail yourself in a civil case. we saw it in the o.j. simpson case and countless other cases. i think this is the beginning of the conversation. unfortunately we saw what we saw last night -- >> i'm worried about tonight. the message coming out is, this was wrong, not just we're dissatisfied, it's that it was illegitimate. i want to get back to ashleigh. thanks so much, sunny. back to you in new york. >> remarkable work to you and all of our colleagues who went through the night and endured some extraordinarily difficult conditions out there. chris, thank you for that. i want to bring in my legal experts here as well. there is just so much that came out last night in roughly 200 hours of grand jury presentation. all of the evidence that this panel

louis county courthouse today, brown family attorney ben crump addressed questions about whether or not's hands were, in fact, up. >> there is evidence that shows michael brown had his hands up, yes. no doubt about that. and that is not in regards to his testimony. that is in regards to what we know based on our review all the opinions, his and others. >> and forensic evidence as well. >> yes, absolutely, forensic evidence. and dr. baden is basing his testimony on science and nothing more. >> dr. cyril wecht is a forensic pathologist who has been a consultant in several high profile cases. thank you for being here. >> nice to be here. >> i want to start with the question of whether forensic pathology is definitively determine the position of this young man's hands at the time he was shot knowing where the injuries were on the inside of his arms? >> i believe in this case, joy, we can certainly reconstruct things to a definitive degree. that doesn't mean that it's absolutely final. it doesn't mean that other people can't come up with other interpretations, but let me just tell you that w

policing, we talk about body cameras and stop and frisk and other sorts of things, we played sound of ben crump earlier this hour saying that folks want this child's death to not be in vain. they want changes to the system. do you think we can really get a different relationship, a changed relationship, with the american police force? >> i'm deeply skeptical of that. i would hope so but this has been going on for hundreds of years in terms of the sense -- certainly among african-americans that people in law enforcement and larger authority figures don't care about us. and don't care about the fact that our -- you know, don't care about our lives. and i think that this larger -- i think you're seeing in this country a growing sense among everyone that there's this deep frustration with institutions. police, government, et cetera. this is something that african-americans have been feeling for years and years. so, i would hope so, but, you know, i just haven't seen a real commitment by folks from -- across the country to really deal with it on a long, sustained basis and not just deal with a crisi

and so i am somewhat surprised at what ben crump told me, and i'm not surprised that the family seems to be very upset with how the process is going. and ben also said they don't trust the process. >> mark, i should point out that the prosecuting attorney fired back in a statement saying that he'd been in touch with their legal team and at their direction, he was told, that all contact be made with the family through one of their attorneys, mr. gray. it seems like there are two differing accounts. frankly, one doesn't jib jive with the other. >> someone is posturing. if mccullough said what he said and it's untrue -- because he said he had ongoing communications with mr. gray, and that was not true, that type of pr of posturing is abhorrent. >> mr. crump said, just for accuracy, that he was told that there would be a federal victims advocate that the family wanted, not one from the state. is that your understanding as well? >> it is and that's also what happened, in part, in the zimmerman case as well. they focused more on the doj involvement. as long as mccullough made the inquiry if

ben crump is the brown family attorney. >> if we continue to have local prosecutors who have a sim simnic relationship with the local police department, they're the ones deciding to indict or not then we're crazy to expect different results. >> reporter: officer wilson released a statement through his lawyers, he said that he followed his training and followed the law. he also thanked his supporters. he got the grand jury decision that he wanted but his career as a ferguson police officer is probably over. norah. >>> protests spread beyond ferguson to cities across the country. seattle police battled protesters keeping them from blocking interstate 5. and look at this protesters in oakland jumped on another busy street. >>> in chicago, after the grand jury announced, hundreds of angry people gathered at a downtown area to protest. hundreds more marched through times square. >>> >> mounds of evidence presented to the grand jury are available to the public this morning. it includes testimony of officer wilson and pictures of him in the hospital just after the confrontation. wilson told t

ben crump is the brown family attorney. >> if you gotta blowout fracture to your eye socket, you're not just going to be walking around not holding your eye. we don't see him holding his eye anywhere in that video. >> no justice, no peace! >> reporter: on sunday protesters braved the cold and snow on the streets of st. louis. >> this is what democracy looks like. >> reporter: lying down in chalkout lines of bodies and blocking traffic, to commemorate 100 days since michael brown's death. >> we just wanted them to know if the weather's good bad, ugly, we'll be out here because it means that much to us. >> reporter: the protest, a far cry from the turmoil that shook the nation only months ago. there's fear violence could resurface as a grand jury decides whether to indeedict the officer responsible for the shoeing the unarmed team. >> there have been several days for training at every level. we have multiple police jurisdictions that are trying to understand what they can and cannot do. >> reporter: ferguson police chief tom jackson says that if the grand jury does not indict officer darr

his father participated in our press event with ben crump who is representing the family and i know those statements were inappropriate. but certainly borne of the emotion of the moment. so if he backtracked on that, that's good. because i believe that michael brown's father with wh, with wh he lived, made it abundantly clear that the way to remember the memory of michael brown is not to engage in violence or the destruction of property, not to engage in any of those activities. and i think the reverend certainly knows because she's been a part of the effort to organize and prepare people for a peaceful, organized appropriate response to the grave disappointment surrounding the grand jury decision. we've got to continue with this advocacy of justice because of the grand jury federal investigation that is impending and this is just a step along the road. i'm hopeful and let me be perfectly and abundantly and absolutely clear, the urban league, those civil rights organizations who have been involved, community-based organizations that have been involved out here, disassociate themselves wit

on the line is ben crump, one of the lawyers for the michael brown family. mr.r joining us. i know you've been in touch with michael brown's parents, family members, other attorneys. have they been notified with what the grand jury decision is yet? >> we have not been notified what the decision is, wolf. we are waiting to hear from the prosecutor's office. >> do you expect to get word in advance of a public announcement? >> well, that's what they told us, they're going to give it to us before they announce it publicly, so we will wait to see. >> how did you learn that a decision had been reached? >> well, unfortunately, michael brown's parents found out that a decision was pending today from the media. and then they were notified later by the prosecutor's office that there is a decision coming today. and it was very painful, wolf, on top of everything else that they're dealing with. >> so just to be precise, the media, i think we were first here on cnn, evan perez, our reporter there in ferguson, in clayton, he reported'9", and then everybody else confirmed'9".

. >> one thing that robert mccullough, al sharpton and ben crump all agree on, this grand jury process60 witnesses, some 70 hours of testimony. mccullough said that he did this in the interest of having fairness, transparency. then, he went a step further and took the unusual step of releasing all the documents or many of the documents and transcripts of testimony that the grand jury considered. so he said he did this in the interest of fairness. his critics are saying he did it in an attempt to twist the process. there is, perhaps, another legal fight to be had here. i also want to say that i don't think anybody here. many people here are surprised by the outcome of this. i don't think anyone, many people thought that officer darren wilson was going to be indicted in this process. mccullough basically said that the witnesses were inconsistent. the key, one of the key issues was, did michael brown, have his hands up at some point in this altercation trying to surrender? that's what people took to the streets arguing and mccullough's conclusion was that there were witnesses who said he

crump joins us. good evening, sir. >> good evening, greta. >> ben, have you spoken to the family in the last couple hours? and, if so, how are they doing? >> as you said, they are very nervous, greta. they are on pins and needles waiting on the decision. and an emotional roller coaster. >> you know, this has been tough for everybody on both sides of this. sort of interesting that michael brown senior issued a public service announcement calling for calm. >> yes, ma'am. and they are trying to find positive things to deal with such a negative situation. and as attorney williams just said, the people in ferguson are trying really hard to put on their best face and hopefully we have learned from three months now dealing with this. >> now, governor nixon, governor of missouri says he doesn't know what the verdict is of the grand jury. what they have decided to indict or not indict. do you have any information, does the family have any heads up or any information? >> no, ma'am. greta. we are going to be notified by the prosecutor. his office said, before they make the announcement publicly. >> and did they tel

. >> attorney benjamin crump is representing brown's family and he is live in tallahassee, florida, with us this morning. good morning, benyou just heard from this ferguson resident. how concerned are you about more violence if officer wilson is not indicted? >> well, the parents and our legal representatives put on record, randi, we want people to be able to exercise their american constitution first amendment rights but we want them to do so in a non-violent, construct tough way, but we do expect people to react as americans, not just african-americans, but all americans, because this process certainly needs to be fixed. >> the prosecutor meanwhile is saying that he is unlukely to file charges on his own or convene another grand jury if this one does decide not to indict. how do you feel about that? >> that's what i was saying, i say this process needs to be fixed. there is a problem with this process that is toward pliolice officers with alleged brutality on people of color. that's why michael brown's parents were in geneva testifying how their child was executed in broad daylight and had his hands up in the universal