we have the safest system and the world with wonderful faa and ntsb involvement. our investigators are the best and they come up with the causes and we have learned from those causes and have made the adjustments by the faa through the years. i take we are a safe aviation and country. but we should be saying let's take another look and see where we need to be more stringent with more oversight just to ensure bree doing everything possible. i know their people in this audience whose lives are affected by these tragic accidents. i appreciate you are holding the hearing i do have a conflicting hearings because i cannot stay but will get the testimony and when we are into the reauthorization and safety standards i will be very active and i want to have the input i will look at everything you have said and we both work together and what is in all of our interest. >> senator hatch and thank you for your work on this subcommittee. senator rockefeller is not able to be with us would you like to make a one minutes opening statement i would be happy to recognize you. >> jus

however the-- does not require faa records a failed flight checks. the board is recognized that additional data contained in faa records including records of flight check failures and rechecks would be very beneficial for a potential employer to review and evaluate. therefore in 2005 the ntsb issued another recommendation to the faa to require airlines considering an applicant for private physicians to perform a complete review of the airmen records, including any notices of this approval for flight checks. in response to the ntsb's recommendation the faa's stated notices of this approval for flight check certification and ratings are not among the records explicitly required by 1996 and therefore demand air carriers obtain such notices would require law making or change in itself. to the credit of the faa november 7 of 2007 and advisory circular was issued in forming carriers that they can ask pilots to sign a consent form giving the carrier access to any notices of this approval. the recommendation is currently classified open acceptable alternativ

i wasn't with the faa then. we were critiquing the faa, and it was pursued. it was pursued by the ig and it seemed to us at a time that it was handled in accordance with what we should do. having said that, i will tell you that i want to make sure that those procedures, there were a number of steps set forth in that report. and i want to make certain that those steps are followed, that we do actively pursue and make certain that no one is subject to retaliation, or is ever inhibited from raising a safety questions without fear of reprisal. >> thanks, mr. chairman. thank you. >> mr. lautenberg, thank you very much. >> thank you very much, mr. chairman. mr. babbitt, we have tremendous confidence in you. i was very impressed with our meeting before your confirmation and appreciate you taking on this responsibility. you certainly have the record and the training to be a quality administrator of the faa. smack that you, sir. >> my understanding is faa requires that all pilots have adequate rest before they fly, is that correct? yes, sir. >> they are the ones that

has this ever been discussed at the faa? has there ever been an effort to decide, does this contribute to fatigue in a way that is significant enough to want to do more than just as people, you are on your own. we are going to expect you to have adequate rest of land that is about all we can do. is there something more than that that exists? because it starts with the question i asked at the front end of this hearing. was this circumstance in this cockpit a complete anomaly or is it referencing symptoms that we should be concerned about? >> well, i think it is clearly based on -- i'll assume some factual locations of where people live. i wouldn't -- i think what we are focused on here is people who didn't professionally deal with what they should have. in other words, they did not have the adequate rest that the professional would suspect they should. it doesn't mean that those people -- most of them weren't doing it the right way. they were coming in the night before. i don't know. >> is that the key? >> we don't know. ridg

it has been a very difficult -- to the information is difficult to come by from the faa in.i have not -- i don't think prior to rise looking at this issue and i don't think the american flying public realizes to what extent maintenance has been outsourced in an effort to cut costs and one of the problems is in many of these places there's not even alcohol and drug testing. it seems weird to me that we have a domestic certify the repair stations and because we don't have as many of them anymore because some of our outsourced, there are faa inspectors that hang out there that are really looking over the shoulder and then you travel to indonesia and if there is ever faa inspectors that show up, by the way the u.s. pays for that, the taxpayers pay the cost of the faa inspectors to go look at foreign repair stations, not the airlines, so the taxpayers are underwriting this outsourcing. they are even doing drug and alcohol tests and as we talked about in this hearing before there are actually locations that have been on the state department's watch list for terrorist activity or t

has this ever been discussed at the faa?here ever been an effort to decide does this contribute to fatigue in a way that is significant enough to want to do more than just ask people, well, you're on your own. we're going to expect you to have adequate rest and that's about all we can do? is there something more than that that exists here because, again it, starts with the question i asked at the front

the faa does not have data on this. they admit they do not know. >> we will get you all the information. >> same question to you for the national carriers. can you give me any kind of figure of what maintenance is being done and certified vs. non certified -- >> i do not have that on hand, but i will be happy to provide it for you. >> none of this is being outsourced beyond the united states in terms of the regional characters. i am confident it is being outsourced be on the united states for the large commercial carriers. does your association have a number of what percentage of that maintenance is being outsourced? >> i am sure we have the answer to that. i would be happy to provide it for you. >> if you have it, that would be terrific. it has been a very difficult -- the difficult -- the information is difficult to come by from the faa. i did not think they have prioritize looking at this issue. one of the problems is, and many of these places, there is not even alcohol or drug testing. it seems weird to me that we h

there has been a recent proceeding on alto line flying that the faa has done. it was science -based. plenty of skilled people available to do that. i think we probably ought to incorporate, the chairman has raised this issue of commuting. i think we ought to incorporate that into the process. and so we would strongly endorse a process being established by faa to look at flight duty time, current standard. how they might differ for regionals, for example, with lots of takeoffs and landings versus long haul. all that needs to be put on the table to my time is definitely up so you can be very quick on that response. >> i totally agree. and we believe there's been enough study, we are ready to move forward with a. we do believe there's enough science on the record. we're going to make our recommendations directly to the faa and work with the associations to move the process forward. >> can you share that with the committee when you do that? >> of course. >> thank you there and much, mr. chairman. thank you for having this hearing. the tragedy of the flight brought

but we have made recommendations to the faa concern and fatigue. fatigue is a very insidious condition and many times people will not even know they are fatigued on till one fortunately it is too late. so we are hoping that dfa will be taking recommendations and incorporating them into some regulations, and we believe that if implemented it will go a long way of reducing the insidious effect of fatigue. >> what% of the flights in the country are by commuter carriers? >> about 50% of the flights representing 20% of the passengers. >> 50% of the flights by commuters. do you have data that is accessible with respect to accidents in the last ten years, commuters forces major carriers? >> i don't have that handy. we could get that if you wish and supply that to you. >> the reason i ask the question is my understanding it is around seven of the most recent nine accidents were accidents with commuter carriers. does that sound reasonable to you? >> that may not be including the three accidents we are investigating right now which include the hudson river,

i think it makes sense that we work to ensure the faa inc. in more accurate picture of eight prospective pilots' flight history when it -- i think it is important at the faa incorporates a more accurate picture of perspective pilots. it i think there is more congress can require when it comes to updating the pilot improvement act and i hope will make some of those changes. that clearly came into play in this tragic incident. thank you for holding the hearing and i want to thank our panelists and i look forward to hearing from you. >> as several of my colleagues mentioned, we look at these issues through the lens of tragedy, regrettably, but in many cases, we hope that what we learn will save all their lives and improve airline safety. all of us i think would embrace that goal. with that in mind, we have four what is this. i want to call on jim ma first. we have discussed all of the issues this morning, the same as the case with mr. cohen. let me say to all four of you, your entire segments will be made part of the permanent record and we ask

enacted on jointly by the faa and the ntsb. we must learn from accident so we can prevent future or current. my wife, terri, my son christopher, and lord boyfriend kevin miss her every minute of every day. i will not have the opportunity to walk my daughter down the aisle and give her away in marriage. she will not experience the joy of a growing child within and raising a loving family as we did. our traditional christmas eve visit to new york city for some last minute shopping and taking in mass at saint patrick's cathedral will probably come to an end this year. it will be too painful to make that trip without lauren. many of my fellow crash victim families sitting behind me also have similar stories and similar losses were so now it's up to you to make a difference. everyone in this room today, and those who were here last wednesday, expressed that they have come before you to make the necessary changes in safety. winter is coming. if we do not implement critical safety changes before then, and another accident occurs, we c

meanwhile, an opposing view from the faa. they write, the faa is carefully examining fatigue, training, and other regional issues. we will continue our vigilance, is there headline. we at the faa more and the tragic loss of the colgan air flight 3407 deeply. this is an agency dedicated to aviation safety. any loss is felt keenly by us all. in the mid 1990 -- 1990's, the faa revised its regulations on air carrier safety standards to reflect one level of safety, requiring regional air carriers to operate under the same rules and at the same level of safety as the major airline counterparts. we want to ask your thoughts on airline safety in particular with -- excuse me -- with regional carriers. the associated press reports this morning in the wake of the iranian election, the iranian embassy in moscow said president mahmoud ahmadinejad has put off a visit to russia. and it is unclear whether he will come at all. again, we will get to your phone calls in just a moment. a couple of other stores to look at from the front page this

we have the safest system in the world, and we have had wonderful faa and ntsb involvement. our investigators are the best, and they come up with the causes and we have learned from those causes and we have made the adjustments by the faa through the years, so i think that we are a safe aviation country, but we should be now staying, let's take another look. let's see where we need to be more stringent and have more oversight just to insure that we are doing everything possible because i know there are people in this audience whose lives have been affected by some of these tragic accidents. so, i really appreciate that you are holding the hearing. i do have a conflicting hearing so i will not be able to stay but i will give the testimony and when we are into the faa reauthorization and into the safety standards, i will be very active and i want to have the input. i will let get everything you let said and we will work together in what is in all of our interest. thank you. >> senator hutchison's thank you in thank you for your work on this subcommittee over the years. senator

we have had some good conversation in regards to faa and your new role. you have come in with a fire hose. but i want to make sure i understood what he said. then i saw your body language. i'm going to try to connect the two. i can't imagine you would make recommendations that are not necessarily recommendations you are looking to have implemented. i want to make sure i heard you right. that is, if the ntsb is making a recommendation of my assumption is you want to see elements implemented, yes or no? >> that is correct, sir. >> what i heard you say was not all of them are they looking to have implemented. i don't think he meant that. i want to make sure i'm clear because as soon as you said that i saw i don't want to say recoil. i saw movement. can you just clarify that and make sure we're on the same page here? otherwise they shouldn't make the recommendations of the not going to be implemented. >> that is a valid clarification that you seek. i have spent time, as i mentioned, for four months. there is of former chairman of the ntsb there. and in our di

the faa's power and navigation systems and to modernize the air traffic facilities. as this committee is aware, the recovery act sets forward very specific timeline for project completion and for faa, actually more than half of the $1.1 billion made available for airport grants, that would be 550 million, which would require to be awarded out within 120 days of the act. that was last wednesday, june 17th. on behalf of the president and secretary lahood and the hard-working f.a. airports staff i am pleased report for not only met that milestone, we have exceeded the milestone and actually have awarded over 800 million, almost 70% of the money allocated has already been set out, past ahead of deadline. there's an estimated 240 recovery act projects currently underway or will be started in the next 30 days. this funding is going directly into the economy now in making a difference in both the short term, supporting by our estimates close to 8,000 jobs as well as the long term with high value of infrastructure improvements. dfa's internal objective is to have at least 90

there is a long open nprm and training at the faa. i think it would be wise for the faa to implement -- take a hard look at aqp programs, advance qualification programs that have been developed by mainline carriers. they could be mentored and transported to regional carriers to improve safety in terms of training. number four, i think you need to take -- direct the faa to take a hard look at how they could better enforce the sterile cockpit rule. we recognize that their privacy issues involved here, but i think there needs to be some kind of monitoring of cockpit tapes on a frequent basis. >> just random auditing? >> at some point, and ice suspect andprater would acknowledge, as long as we protect the privacy of pilots, that could be done. next, i think you need to have a very specific program promulgated by the faa on records, so that when a carrier goes out to hire an individual pilot, that have access to all of that pilots' records in the same place and in the same format so that they can have a complete look at what has gone on th

the faa is proud for what we have accomplished to date. we are having millions of dollars in bids received lately. -- received daily. we are actually able to undertake more projects and plan and found more projects than originally anticipated. we thank you for your support in this effort. we will keep you informed on our projects. i will answer any questions you might have at the end. >> again, congratulations on your designation, on clearing the senate. we are glad to have you here. we know you have a long record of experience, hands on experience in real ribbing. welcome to larry hearing. it will be the first of many will have before this committee. >> thank you, mr. chairman. certainly, it is an honor to sit here before you today to discuss progress in implementing the american recovery and reinvestment act. in addition to putting people back to work, the recovery act also sets the stage for one of the most significant new initiatives of president obama, vice president biden, and secretary lloyd. that is high-speed rail in america. -- s

chairman, the faa is proud of what we've accomplished to date. we're in the midst of millions of dollars of bids being received dale daily. the bid process is robust and the savings resulting from excellent bids are allowing us to stretch the dollars. we're able to undertake more projects than we had originally anticipated. so we thank you for your support in this effort. we continue to keep you informed on our progress. of course, i'll be happy to answer any questions you might have at the end. >> thank you very much and congratulations on your designation. i'm clearing the senate and your appointment. i'm clearing the senate to the administrator of fail road railroad administration. glad to have you here. i know you have a long record of experience. hands-on experience in railroading and welcome to our hearing, the first 06 many you'll have before this committee or subcommittees. >> thank you mr. chairman and ranking member micah and members of the committee. certainly it's an honor to appear here before you today to discus the faa's progress i

at the time and i think it remains correct that the faa needs to be the principal enforcer. we have openly said here today and will continue to say if we need to change those standards, and upgrade them, then that is something that we are to look at doing. by the same token, i think the enforcement needs to rest with the faa. >> well, you know, i was just in another committee earlier this morning and described federal agency that was willfully blinded cheerfully ignorant for about 10 years. and i don't describe that to the faa except to say that i had a belly full of enforcement requirements by certain agencies that have completely neglected the opportunity. the faa as we said to randy babbitt the new administrator last week, we need new diligence here, a new level of interest in making certain that we have one standard that passengers can rely on one standard when they board an airplane. and i think that's going to require some effort by the faa and may require some effort by this committee. senator rockefeller and senator hutchison, myself, senator demint and others are go

we look for to being in days with the faa and other interested stakeholders in this vital work. now, i don't believe that any topic should be off the table in the call to action. we need to have a full and frank discussion about safety and a practice that contribute to its. and there are disparities between main line and regional safety programs, if so they should be closed and close quickly. let me suggest six or seven steps that need to be pursued right now today. first, i think we need to apply five operational quality assurance programs used by major carriers to regional airlines. it works, the collection and analysis of data recorded during flight safety improve safety. second applied aviation safety action programs which encourage voluntary reporting of safety issues and events that come to the attention of employes to those regional airlines that don't currently have such a program. third, identify advanced training best practices of mainline carriers to be used by regional carriers. is in a kewpie program in the jargon. fourth, we need to have a centralized database of p

>> we could have greater enforcement and if the committee and the faa shoes, you could even change the parameters. we have suggested programs required as part of the base. you can use programs on training. there are a number of issues on pilot records that you can resolve. all of those things can be done to improve the environment. >> as i indicated when i started this hearing, i want to invite the folks that run the carriers themselves to come to the table. we made some invitations and apparently have not had acceptance of those invitations but we make them fully understanding will be accepted and have another hearing. >> you have our commitment, whenever you walk, we will provide. >> thank you very much. senator demint. >> we need to get a little more specific. mr. may, i appreciate you mentioning specifics about what we can do with training, but what i am not hearing today are specific ideas about what do we need to change to prevent something like this from happening again. there have got to be things that come to mind that we need to change. we obviously have some situations of vi

that is the whole issue of downtime and faa's minimums that they currently have. i know each of you have mentioned that. do you think the minimums are too low? for downtime as well as other training and other issues -- do you think they are too low and need to be raised up? >> i assume you are talking about flight and duty time now. i think they are probably appropriate. no. 2, we made a commitment at the faa's action on monday to enter into a science based study to determine whether or not they are currently opprobrium or not. there has been a recent proceeding on all prolong flying that the faa has done that was science base. plenty of skilled people available to do that. we probably ought to incorporate the issue of commuting. we ought to incorporate that into the process. we would strongly endorsed a process being established by faa to look at flight and duty time, current standards, how they might differ for regionals with lots of takeoffs and landings versus long haul. all that needs to be put on the table. >> if you could be very quick on the response. >> w

we want to ensure the faa and the airline that doing what they can to improve the safety record when comes not only to regional airlines but all airlines, and i want to home in on something we discussed last week, mr. chairman, that is the need to incorporate more information regarding the background of pilots. it makes sense that we work to ensure the f a incorporates a more accurate picture of a prospective pilot's flight history when an airline is looking to make a hiring decision. voluntarily requesting this information isn't good enough. there is more that congress can require when updating a pilot's record improvement. we can work on that in this committee to make sure those changes, clearly that came into play in this very tragic incident. thank you for holding the hearing and i want to thank our panelists and the look forward to hearing from you. >> thank you. as several of my colleagues have mentioned, we look at these issues through the lens of tragedy, regrettably. but in many cases, i expect mauer is here, we will improve lives and improve airline safety and all of us wou

the faa. >> well, you know, it was just another committee early this morning and described a federal agency that was willfully blind and cheerfully ignorant for about 10 years and i don't ascribe that to the faa except to say that i had a bellyful of enforcement requirements by certain agencies that have completely neglected in the opportunity or the requirement to do so. the faa as we said to randy babbitt the new administrator last week, we need new diligence here. a new level of interest in making certain that we have one standard. >> is this hearing concludes we take you live now to the u.s. capitol as the senate convenes. we expect general topic speeches this afternoon and a measure to encourage foreign travelers to visit the u.s.. senators plan a vote on moving forward with an amendment to the bill at 5:30 p.m. eastern time. five senate coverage on c-span 2. the presiding officer: the senate will come to order. the chaplain, dr. barry black, will lead the senate in prayer. the chaplain: let us pray. eternal god, we come to you today because we need you. we can't work well witho

babitt, congratulations on your nomination and i look forward to working with you closely with our faachnical center. i have a question for you, mr. babitt about -- you talked about $200 million in the f & e account and it was going to go to three towers and 18 different centers, i believe. would you be able to, if not today, at some point let us know who's on the list? be curious to know who's going to be receiving the funding and very specifically, of course, i have an interest in our faa technical center, the atlantic city airport, which mr. overknows i'm very fond of saying is the premiere facility in the world for aviation research and development for safety and security. i'm just curious whether they might be in line for any rehabilitation funding for the labs or any other facilities there? >> first, thanks for and congratulations i look forward to working with you as well. candidly, i don't know the specific breakdown. but i certainly can get that information to you. i share your view and i recently visited one of our technical centers. we'll call on them for some of the advance

standards and he met the standards that their employer had sat as required by the faa. >> is of the testing, the training for a regional pilot to the same as it is foreign pilots in the major airlines? >> this is senator. >> is. do the regular airline companies come aviation companies pay as little as $20,000 a. put someone even along side and the trained capt. and the cockpit? >> senator, as a practical matter, the pilots that are hired by the mainline have significantly more seniority on average and are paid at a higher level. pay is a function of collective bargaining and it is generally also conditioned on number of hours, number of hours in a particular type of aircraft, whether or not they have been a pilot in command, whether or not first officer so there are a number of factors involved in pay, but it is effectively the exclusive jurisdiction of collective bargaining in seniority. >> before some and achieves the status of capt., is there a requirement in the regionals that day and apply in particular number of hours flown, a particular number of hours, mr. cohen. >> they req

committee's decision to distribute $1.1 billion in stimulus funding using the faa process is proving to be successful. and explains why the faa was able to report on june 5th of all the $5 million of $1.5 billion is authorized. vice president biden noted in march this money will create new jobs now but also investment in long-term safety at airports in their economic viability. at the allegheny county airport and $2 million in stimulus money will be used to renovate taxiways and reconfigure aircraft to do air coming this facilities in the rams' based. construction is scheduled to begin the week of july 20th and when completed will be able to make states available for construction of mass -- much needed facility so we are trading ford -- for the construction jobs now we're also setting the stage for future jobs and aircraft maintenance operations. the $10 million a nose package will rehabilitate runway 1432, won over four runways used by military and commercial flights. this will be utilized to rehabilitate airfield pavement, make rating improvements, uptake pavement markings, and lig

[laughter] well, look, obviously if there's an incident at airlines and the faa -- thank you very much. [laughter] airlines and the faa need to look at every single instance, see what lessons can be learned from them. i think fundamentally, you know, most domestic airlines and most international airlines are extremely well run. at virgin we are proud of the fact that, you know, we've run an airline for 25 years without incident, and i think you ought to be able to run airlines unless you have extremely bad luck without incident. it's the safest form of air travel today. >> what do you think contributes most to your clean record? >> which clean record are we talking about? [laughter] >> the safety one. [laughter] i haven't looked at your -- [laughter] >> no, look, i mean, i think the most important thing if you run an airline, one talks about competition, one talks about customer service. obviously, the most important thing if you run an airline is safety, and people need to be absolutely sure when they get on board that that airline has an impeccable safety record, and so we pride ours

who is going to be receiving the funding, and very specifically of course i have an interest in our faachnical center at the atlantic city airport which mr. oberstar knows i am very fond of saying is the premier facility in the world for aviation research and development for safety and security. and i'm just curious whether they might be in line for any rehabilitation funding for the labs or any of the other facilities there. >> first, thank you for the congratulations. i look forward to working with you as well. candidly, i don't know the specific breakdown, but i surely could get that information to you. i share your view on the technical center. i have recently visited one of our technical centers. we're going to be calling on them for some of the advancements we are make in right now. we have a lot of new technology that we are trying to deploy, and the technical center is the birthplace of much of that technology. so i share your view and i will certainly get you that information. >> okay. appreciate you getting back to me, and began looking for to working with you. thank you, mr.

babbitt is when to report on successes at the faa. i know they're trying. but their main problem

i look forward to meeting with you in the near future and working with you very closely with our faa technical center. i have a question for you, mr. babbitt. you talked about two hundred million dollars in the fnf &e account. would you be able to let us know who is on that list? i would be curious to see who would be receiving the funding of course, i have an interest in a technical center at the atlantic city airport. i am very fond of saying that it is a premier facility in the world for aviation research and development for safety and security. i am curious as to whether they might be in line for any rehabilitation funding for the lab or any other facilities there. >> first, figure for the congratulations. i look forward to working with you as well. candidly, i do not know the specific breakdown. but i certainly can get that information to you. i have recently visited one of our technical centers. we will be calling on them for some of the advance as we are making right now. we have a lot of new technology that we are trying to deploy. the technical center is the birthplace of mu

babbitt, the recovery bill provided faa with a $2 million to hire additional staff to work grants and provide grant oversight. how is that going? have you spent the money? have we wrapped up in that regard? >> yes, sir. i can get you greater detail, but we have begun deploying that. we are looking at several things. one of which is, you know, they're some sophisticated ways that you can look at higher risk projects and, you know, analyze at risk for better oversight. and so that's where we have put some of the money. my understanding is we have about half of it in gaged already, and looking to the point arrest of it as these projects go forward. but i can get you very detailed information on the exact projects and the exact allocation. >> that would be hopeful. thank you, mr. chairman. >> mr. boozman, your question about jobs created, and job saved, that is an accounting that we will specifically receive in the next 30 day report. we thought initially that in this second report that the berries motormen ministrations would be able to report on those job figures, but it turned out to b

jose international 5.2 million project is part of a larger effort to rehabilitate tax uaw which the faa regional safety analysis team recommended it be interested to potentially unsafe general movement. this funding has move the project for by four years trading 83 new jobs. the fresno yosemite airport national will create jobs when work begins on a $2.2 million project to reconstruct to 19 taxiways. the recovery and to send a private activity bonds from the alternative minimum tax. airports rely on bonds to finance 53 percent of their capital needs for safety, security and infrastructure projects. last august the bond market dried up in this change, the metropolitan national airport in miami dade airport have sold bonds for internal projects and metropolitan washington airports authority sold bonds to assist capital construction program. in terms of airport infrastructure there is no doubt the amt provision is stimulating impact on short and long term projects. in closing the $1.2 million project -- $1.2 billion appropriated for airports in the american recovery and reinvestment act an

there's no excuse in my judgment for the faa to wait another month to begin will making to make certain all the records of a pilot are available immediately and now to a potential employer of that pile. that ought to happen now and i will ask you the next time you are here whether the rule making has started and i hope he will consider that a priority. >> if you don't invite me back for a week my answer will be yes. >> thank you. let me thank the four of you. as indicated next week we will have a discussion with airlines and some other witnesses in addition to the airlines. this is, as i said, a very serious subject in many ways as is probably always the case these subjects are most aggressively often discussed when they are born of tragedy and our heart goes out to those involved in the tragedy and though this who love them and we just hope through these discussions we will make progress in protecting others and i want to end the way i started to say that we have an unbelievable safety record in this country with air travel book that ought not suggest i know studying this there's a lot