i think gwen was referring to this. she'll need to have time to strike a jury, get the jury in the box and start a case in time to avoid the penalty that georgia's speedy trial act would impose if she fails to meet that deadline. but what we've seen here i think regardless of what chesebro intended to elicit here is a remarkable show of strength by fani willis. all those months where people were complaining that she was taking too long to get this case indicted, we see what was going on during that time period. she was lining everything up. she's ready to go to trial. >> amy lee copeland, do the other defendants and the other defense counsel see an advantage to them in having at least one defendant, one other defendant get a speedy trial so that they can see what the prosculator has and how the prosecutors intend to prosecute these cases? >> absolutely, lawrence. i suspect that if the trial goes forward on october 23rd you'll look at the audience and you'll see 18 attorneys with note pads and pens scribbling furiously a

to gwen's point about proving mens rhea, that is critical.metimes you don't have that at all, but if you have somebody's gonna be on the stand saying, oh he was told, if you do this you are going to be crossing the line, it's like game over. >> we're gonna squeeze in another quick break here. when we come back we will hear more of rudolph giuliani's defenses, and they will be a little more substantive than him saying i am a friend of rico. we'll be right back. ♪ there it is. that feeling you get... when you can du more with less asthma. it starts with dupixent. dupixent is not for sudden breathing problems. it's an add-on treatment for specific types of moderate-to-severe asthma. and can help improve lung function for better breathing in as little as two weeks. dupixent helps prevent asthma attacks... and can even reduce or eliminate oral steroids. can you picture it? dupixent can cause allergic reactions that can be severe. get help right away if you have rash, chest pain, worsening shortness of breath, tingling or numbness in your limbs. te

more on that, next with gwen keyes fleming and andrew weissmann. ew we my a1c was up here; now, it's down with rybelsus®. his a1c? it's down with rybelsus®. my doctor told me rybelsus® lowered a1c better than a leading branded pill and that people taking rybelsus® lost more weight. i got to my a1c goal and lost some weight too. rybelsus® isn't for people with type 1 diabetes. don't take rybelsus® if you or your family ever had medullary thyroid cancer, or have multiple endocrine neoplasia syndrome type 2, or if allergic to it. stop rybelsus® and get medical help right away if you get a lump or swelling in your neck, severe stomach pain, or an allergic reaction. serious side effects may include pancreatitis. gallbladder problems may occur. tell your provider about vision problems or changes. taking rybelsus® with a sulfonylurea or insulin increases low blood sugar risk. side effects like nausea, vomiting, and diarrhea may lead to dehydration, which may worsen kidney problems. need to get your a1c down? you may pay as little as $10 per prescription.

so i agree with gwen and others. defendants often want to sever cases, and they want to be able to say, it's the people who aren't here that did it. it's not necessarily easy, and i think the speedy trial motion really could be thought of as a sort of de facto way to sever his case. what he really got, yes he's gotta roll the dice because she may say, okay, i will see you october 23rd, but he gets to be on his own, he gets to be first, he gets to tell his story. and his story is sort of in the background feeding some information. yes, that one memo which also figures and jack smith's indictment as a sharp departure is gonna be tough. but he gets to try to tell his story without others dirtying him up. he thinks that's his best shot. >> all right, we're gonna squeeze in a quick commercial break. what i think is maybe the first commercial break of this network of the evening. the crew is very grateful for that. everyone, please stay with us, there's so much more legal ground to cover that happen just today. we'll be ri

i'm back with greg, joyce, and gwen. this is amazing. gwen, i'm going to start with you.donald trump. he's talking here about the fact that, you know, under no circumstances is he going to take any sort of plea deal. i want you to sort of give us your thoughts on how that would even work in a case like this. >> is there any chance you would take a plea deal in georgia? >> no plea deals. we did nothing wrong. we don't take plea deals. it's a wise guy question. you're just a wise guy. we don't take plea deals because i did nothing wrong. it's called election interference. >> i mean, could he even work out a plea deal with fani willis at this point? because it seems unlikely. but what would even be a possibility at this point? >> well, let's first start off with the premise that everybody is innocent until proven guilty. and obviously, everybody is entitled to counsel. so that would be a strategic decision any of the defendants would have to make with their own counsel after evaluating the facts and evidence that the d.a. would be poised to present. so it's difficult to even

mimi rocah and gwen keyes fleming, thank you both for your time tonight.there is still much, much more to come this evening, including what may have happened to the leader of the russian mercenary group who led the revolt against vladimir putin exactly two months ago and who might be behind it. but first, oath keepers -- stewart rhodes was convicted of seditious conspiracy in november for breaching the capitol. but today we learned that stewart rhodes might have had the support from people who want to protect the white house. that is next. >> so, if you have spent some time with special counsel jack smith's's recent court filing his prosecution of 2020 election interference, then you might have discovered an interesting little tidbit. mr. smith says, in the discovery evidence that is part of his case, that he has about 3. 1 million pages of material from the secret service, including emails. so, it appears that the secret service is of interest to jack smith. we even know that as many as six secret service agents had testified before his grand jury in this

tonight ---- gwen s stefani auauthor grantnt morrison.n. an all-new "closer look.turing the 8g band with raghav mehrotra. ♪ [ cheers and applause and now, seth meyers >> seth: good evening. i'm seth meyers. this is "late night. we hope you're all doing well. and now, if you don't mind, we are going to get to the news at the white house ceremony for the unveiling of former president obama and first lady michelle obama's official portraits, president biden said obama was one of the, quote, "most consequential presidents in our history." "that is true," said the consequence. [ laughter ] new york governor kathy hochul announced yesterday that masks will be optional on public transportation this comes almost 18 months after passengers made the same announcement [ laughter ] "what? starting today okay." former trump strategist, steve bannon, turned himself in to new york authorities today to face state criminal charges. well, the good news is, i'm positive this man knows how to make toilet wine [ laughter ] the white house announced that president biden will travel to b

mimi rocah and gwen keyes fleming, thank you both for your time tonight.there is still much, much more to come this evening, including what may have happened to the leader of the russian mercenary group who led the revolt against vladimir putin exactly two months ago and who might be behind it. but first, oath keepers -- stewart rhodes was convicted of seditious conspiracy in november for breaching the capitol. but today we learned that stewart rhodes might have had the support from people who want to protect the white house. that is next. is next my a1c was up here; now, it's down with rybelsus®. his a1c? it's down with rybelsus®. my doctor told me rybelsus® lowered a1c better than a leading branded pill and that people taking rybelsus® lost more weight. i got to my a1c goal and lost some weight too. rybelsus® isn't for people with type 1 diabetes. don't take rybelsus® if you or your family ever had medullary thyroid cancer, or have multiple endocrine neoplasia syndrome type 2, or if allergic to it. stop rybelsus® and get medical help right away if you ge

and gwen, let me begin with you on a point that we were working on last night and that is the question of mandatory minimums. in the georgia law, the rico law, there appears to be a mandatory minimum sentence of five years but there are indications that there is still discretion left to the judge to not necessarily impose prison time and that could be done through probation. what is the real mandatory minimum? let me put it this way, is there a mandatory minimum of confinement of some kind in the georgia law that applies in this case? >> last night you heard d. a. willis say yes. there was. and the way i read that statement is, as a prosecutor, and again, this is very early in the stages. all defendants are it is until proven guilty. but if and when we get to the conviction of any one of the 19 for a rico charge my sense is that the dea herself will seek the mandatory minimum of five years in jail, not on probation. now the way the statute is worded, it simply says no less than five and up to 20 years imprisonment. there are other statutes that indicate that can be, that term can be pr

gwen keyes fleming it's also with us, a former district attorney in dekalb county. and -- former prosecutor in georgia is joining us again tonight. andrew, let's begin with you, since you have been helping us cover all of these prosecutions of donald trump. it is so uncharacteristic of him to get hit with this indictment own stock all of the previous reactions that he has had to all of the previous indictments and that he just randomly has. now we see the lawyers convincing him or him claiming the lawyers have convinced him to shut up about it on monday. who knows how that really happened. he had nothing to say on monday anyway. this may be temporary. it may all explode tomorrow. but today is a different day for donald trump. >> i had the exact same reaction. it is the fact that he has for criminal cases that cannot be easy. that has to weigh on you. i think it's something more. of course he wants to try his case in a place where, in the court of public opinion and not in the court of law, where facts and law matter. but there are two big things that are coming up.

within six months, and that's exactly what we are singing. >> on the speedy trial law in georgia, gwen, a speedy trial, a defendant has a right to it in even less than six months, isn't that the law is written? >> yes. so the way the law is written in georgia, a defendant can file a speedy trial demand in the term of court, which is a two month period, in the term of court that he is indicted. here she is indicted. then he has to be tried either in that term are in the succeeding term. so it's either in the first two months, where the indictment is filed, or the following two months. what interesting, that could be a total of four months or, if a defendant filed the motion, say, in the second month of a term. so if you have a july, august term, if any motions are filed this week were before the september terms starts, then the trial must be completed by the end of october, which is the end of the next succeeding term. it could be as much as four months, it could be three, it could be two and a half, depending on when the motion is filed. >> gwen, i remember many months ago you explaini

gwen got second place. rachel: it is so perfect for the moment.all the men are getting in the sports illustrated. all the makeup contracts. it is perfect. pete: it is happening in our house too. pete: gwen was like she was doing her girl thing. rachel: the guy won. this is what it feels like to be riley gaines. pete: taking everything to the next level. will: glad you are here. thanks for being here this morning. we start with this. donald trump hits the campaign trail in alabama breaking records of attendance and fundraising numbers, slammed protectors of president biden for what he says is direct interference in the presidential election. rachel: he says the indictment was ridiculous and an act of desperation. pete: alexandria hoff joins us with the latest. >> reporter: the former president's campaign and court calendar filled up hours after pleading not guilty to his third indictment in four months. he will travel to alabama delivering remarks at a dinner hosted by the same party. will: this ridiculous >> this ridiculous indictment is an act of

neal katyal and former georgia district attorney gwen keyes fleming. and they will tell us if they've ever seen a criminal defendant give a judge a deadline. i have never held and motion in my hands in which a criminal defendant gives a judge a deadline of five pm on the day the motion was filed. or a deadline of anytime, and for. criminal defendant, giving the judge a deadline. not surprisingly, judge steve jones ignored jeffrey clark's deadline. and as crazy as it sounds, to give a judgment headline, jeffrey clark's raisin stated in writing, for the deadline, is the single most childish thing, maybe the only childish thing, i have ever seen in a criminal defendant put in writing to a judge. jeffrey clark's motion says he was given the judge a deadline of five pm today because, quote, mr. clark would not need to be put the choice of making rushed travel arrangements to fly into atlanta or instead risking being labeled a fugitive. i'm sorry, but i didn't write that sentence as written. it seems to be missing a word. possibly the word through, as in, mr

the fulton county da's office sara fleck and former district attorney in neighboring dekalb county gwen both of you this morning. i want to start with you, sara, on something that i have been thinking. confirmation of the two big political stories of the day. one that trump will be turning himself in on thursday in this casened also that he's not going todebate. this is not a political question. are there specific exposures legally to trump participating in these debates? you have two former u.s. attorneys who doesn't think he should be the nominee, asa hutchinson and chris christie. is he exposes in some way by talking about the case in some way during the debate that could spill over into the case? >> oh, absolutely. i mean, it doesn't matter that he is the former president of the united states of america. right now, he is no different than any other criminal defendant charged in fulton county. so anything that he says can and absolutely will be used against him if fani willis can use it against him in his criminal prosecution. >> gwen, one thing -- >> there's no question about it. >>

gwen, let's turn to the latest trump indictment, which is georgia.ng about the indictment. seemed to suggest that he doesn't think that this case could come to trial that quickly. let's watch. >> i'm sure i will be a witness in whatever goes forward. i can't say much about the indictment. regardless of what you think about the indictment, when i came out two days ago now and tweeted the election wasn't stolen here and we needed to stay focussed on the future, one thing is certain about these indictments, in my mind, in my opinion, this trial, despite what dates anybody is asking for or anything else, it's not going to happen before the election. >> what do you think about that, gwen? >> i think we need to wait and see what judge mcafee decides to do. like you saw in the january 6 matter, where the prosecution put forth a schedule and the defense team put forth a counter schedule, those are far apart, you could expect to see a similar thing in the georgia case. the point is, every district attorney bears the burden of proof to establish or prove their

. >> gwen, i want to ask you about fani willis, who you know so well.e increasing with the spotlight. you know her so well. describe how she'll deal with this and deal with the defendant, donald trump, if this persists i've said before the d.a. seems to be called for a time such as this. she is a very knowledgeable, very tough and experienced prosecutor, and however this may be wearing on her personally, you will not see that. she is focused, she recognizes the obligation and opportunity that serving as the elected district attorney presents in this moment, and she is not going to let the citizens and residents of fulton county down. she and her team are focused, but they are focused on the facts and the law and understanding what they need to do to be able to put this case together and present it to an ultimate jury at some point in the future. so, again, unfortunately many of us who had had high-profile cases have had to deal with attacks, certainly not anything to the level that she's dealing with, but sadly that has become part of the job. and the b

other than an appeal. >> gwen keyes fleming thank you for teaching us, as you always do.joining us tonight. >> my pleasure. thanks for having me. >> coming up, there is an obvious problem with members of congress, especially senators, staying in office longer than they are physically able to do the job. but there is an even bigger problem at the other end of the age spectrum. not enough young people in congress and state legislatures. our next guest wants to solve that second problem, which is why david hogg has created an organization called leaders we deserve. david hogg joins us next. d hogg joins us next astepro allergy, steroid free allergy relief that starts working in 30 minutes, while other allergy sprays take hours. with astepro's unbeatably fast allergy relief you can astepro and go! i was stuck. unresolved depression symptoms were in my way. i needed more from my antidepressant. vraylar helped give it a lift. adding vraylar to an antidepressant... ...is clinically proven to help relieve overall depression symptoms... ...better than an antidepressant alone. and

donald trump's vile attacks on twitter to district attorney fani willis have reached a new level and gwen --, her friend is going to join us tonight. she used to be the district attorney of the neighboring county i. want to get her reaction to this. this is something we've never seen before in the history of american prosecutions. georgia has never seen it, and i just want to get her feeling about what the impact of it is. >> yeah, i mean, fani willis is not issued an indictment against on trump and he's already using everything at his disposal to undermine her and threatened her. so this is absolutely tara incognito it should not go under noticed or under discussed. i will be watching. >> thank, you alex. i want to begin tonight with a special word to and about don trump's criminal defenders, all of whom are offered a standing invitation to appear on this program at anytime. all of donald trump's defense lawyers have failed more spectacularly in the representation of donald trump than anything they have ever done in their professional lives because they have all failed at the most basic

i think it's ambitious that they will get this done in one day. >> gwen, i'm sure you heard the former new york city mayor talking before he left new york, when he came out of his apartment building, about the fact that now the prosecutors are going after lawyers and it's a new day and it's a disgrace and all of those arguments. you are a lawyer, but you also are somebody who understands georgia law. how do you think that the judge and ultimately a jury is going to look at and maybe absorb those arguments? >> so, obviously, lawyers are a critical part of the criminal justice system, and they are bound by ethics in every state. however, our laws do recognize that even when lawyers cross the line and commit ac constitute a crime or constitute a conspiracy or are part of the rico indictment like we see here, they can be charged. it will be up to a jury based on evidence from both sides, but particularly the d.a., to demonstrate how far across the ethical line or criminal line any of the lawyers that have been charged actually went. so she bears the burden of proof, but i think you heard f

i'm gwen jackson and i'm the daughter of the late doctor jackson. i hoped that from what you remember. but i was able to i wanted say good afternoon to all. i'm kind of nervous. i'm trying to stand up. okay. i think you received a calm of a document. that was goin mean by -- kelly at the time. he asked me to help facilitate because they wantedmented i will read it because i'm nervous and i don't want you to buzz me out. okay this . is what he says. as we discuss today as the it san francisco public commission. committed to the litigation connected with the southeast treatment plant. i want to address a myth. and a rumor that there is not a plan or desire to the dem oat 1800 oakdale in eliminate the southeast commission. okay. i received prosecute prileft my phone there? >> i was -- i was at -- received -- messages from the community and they was saying they heard the puc was going on demo the building and i don't know if this is true. my family was wondering why was supposed to get the educational building that puc. okay. you can finish. get an educ

. >> gwen you know very well the way the courts work in georgia. how fast is this?s this the norm? >> first of all, i think it's important to understand that anytime a defendant files a demand for speedy trial, the prosecutor has to try that case either within the existing term of court, which would end at the end of august, or the next term of court, which ends at the end of october. so by receiving this motion, the d.a. really does not have any other option other than to attempt to schedule the trial before the end of october. a jury must be sworn by the end of the succeeding term, from when the demand was filed. so in that sense, the timing is the norm, when a d.a. is presented with this type of motion. obviously this is the type of case that is complex. we will wait and see the extent to which other defendants may now file motions to try to sever their cases from mr. chesebro's case, but all of those decisions will be up to the judge. and again, this is a prosecutor that is pursuing a rico charge. i believe it would be her preference to try even together because

apple does not fall far from the tree when it comes to top pop star gwen stefani.music debut this weekend with a little help from his country superstar stepfather. ♪♪ >> yeah, you're listening to kingston rossdale. he's singing a few rock ballads at blake shelton's bar. he introduced the guy saying he's an artist and he's the real deal. it didn't take long before gwen joined the stage as well. ♪♪ ♪ stop explaining ♪ ♪ don't tell me cause it hurts ♪ >> that's the best karaoke song. >> especially when she sings it, right? >> you can catch gwen as a coach on the new season of "the voice" this fall. >> i wonder what the dad thinks because he's a performer, too. >> i'm sure they're all very proud of kingston. >>> san francisco's outside lands has come to an end, putting its 15-year anniversary in the history books. hundreds of thousands of people there coming out to enjoy the music. of course the food and vibes all over the place. but this year there was some minor trouble. on friday night organizers had to shut down the soma tent after the stage partially collapsed. it

joining me is gwen keyes fleming, former d. a. for dekalb county in georgia.is customary in the state of georgia for the names of grand jurors to be included in an indictment. >> the simple answer is that it is required by georgia's code of criminal procedure, a specific statute saying that the grand jurors selected, chosen, and sworn in the county of here, fulton, to wit, and in every indictment that i have seen in my 17 years as a prosecutor, you then go on to list the names of the grand jurors who heard the matter and you cross off the names of anyone who was not there that day or didn't hear that evidence. this is required by the code. the only instance that i have been able to find where it is not required is when the grand jury is investigating a use of force case by a peace officer, a use of deadly force case, and after hearing evidence they decide not to return an indictment. that is not the case that we have here. so it was required by law that these names be listed, and it is unfortunate that some apparently, have taken it upon themselves to provide

. >> gwen, we know there was a special grand jury that did the investigative work over the course ofmy understanding is this grand jury has been presented with their conclusions and the key evidence. can you expand upon that? take us inside the courtroom leading up to a vote on potential charges. what's going to happen? >> sure. let me first explain, the special grand jury was just investigative. they could not return any kind of indictment. their job was to collect as much facts and evidence as possible and come up with recommendations. now that da willis has that, most likely she will have one or two or more of her investigators summarize that evidence and also supplement it with actual testimony from the witnesses that you just talked about in terms of the former members of the georgia house and the georgia senate. so what will happen, each of these witnesses, including her investigators, would be sworn in. they would have the opportunity to describe what they know, usually in answers to the district attorney's questions. the grand jurors themselves will be able to ask any questio

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geoff: gwen keyes fleming and stephen fowler, thank you both for your time this evening.k you. guest: thank you. ♪ >> i am vanessa ruiz in for stephanie sy with newshour west. here are the latest headlines. the property manager at former president trump's mar-a-lago estate pleaded not guilty to four criminal charges in the classified documents case. carlos de oliveira arrived at a federal court in fort pierce, florida. the special counsel has accused him and mr. trump of conspiring to hide security footage from investigators. the confirmed death toll from the wildfires in maui has now growing to 99. so far, crews have searched about a quarter of the disaster zone in lahaina. officials fear more bodies are among the untouched piles of ash. meantime, long lines of cars formed outside lahaina, as residents tried to return home. many, contemplating their uncertain futures. >> it's our home. we've lived here for 30 years. our kids were born here. we just don't know the next steps. >> we are just camping out of here, just waiting for them to give us the ok to go back in, and he

. >> and so, gwen, how strong do you think is meadows' argument to get this case moved?me of the arguments that you saw in the d.a.'s reply brief are salient. in particular, elections are squarely within the state purview. they do not fall within the roles and responsibilities of a president of a federal -- of that president's chief of staff, and largely not part of any federal officers' responsibilities. in fact, there are specific laws and rules that prevent federal employees from engaging or using their federal office in any way to support a campaign. and so i think those laws may present some challenges for the meadows team. but obviously it comes down to the evidence that they choose to present. it is also important to note that mr. meadows -- let me back up. it is important to note while the d.a. bears the burden of proof for the charges, and she must prove the charges beyond a reasonable doubt in state court, for the purposes of this federal court hearing, the burden shifts to mr. meadows and he only has to meet the preponderance of evidence standard, a much lower

now. joining me for more is gwen car. yeah, and he's a visiting fellow at the i s s. use of instruct institute in the single mr. glenn austin and china. i have been discussing a code of conduct in the south china sea for at least 21 years. why don't we have a legally binding court as yet as well? i think it's very important to know the motivation at interest of the different policies in this i think for, you know, a cart on got a boss and 3 things really want to have a binding correspondence in south tennessee to prevent country, you know, to escalate onto you spend the, to the power to transfers out the country. but for countries like china, you know, the single most powerful state in the reason. there is no point for them to, you know, create this by the core content. so the content of actually follow the effort to be well because i ration on vmc. oh, which was fine. and so, but this one was a, you know, not biding. so all the countries of the states. yeah. really wanted to view a legally binding document which is called content. and they have been trying to, these

thank you, gwen to ben for your heard work. and i gotta say, usually the mayor never thanks the board of supervisor budget and legislative analyst because usually they are taking all of the money. i know this harvey rose and his team took all the money that they could. you are losing your touch i did not hear shouting or anything. so, we must have been knead too easy. next year don't worry. we will make it real hard and your blood pressure will boil and you will be able to yell at people. looking forward and thank you, harvey rose, for being with us today. to our various department heads, boy. you guys gave them the blues i had a resignation and begged them to stay with the promise i will be nice. thank you to the department heads for your work and fight and all of your you know, what we will do to help get this budget to be of use to the people and the city and county of san francisco. it has been a difficult couple years. more recently, i have been out in the community meeting with accidents. talking to people. and reminding

but this also may remind you of the scenes that we saw and rust off when don gwen precaution and he's fighters were leaving the seed after that one day mutiny. so they would cheer done by local residents, appraised as heroes. so apparently there is this part of society which definitely the seas up regarding as a hero, who was of, you know, have just fights and corruption in the russian that leads and was trying to do good for the country as they see it. but also at the same time, we don't see the numbers large enough to suggest the depths of the majority of russian supports him. and would say that the absolute majority of russian still chooses not to make any public statement on the war and ukraine and whatever the kremlin does to tell you is dimitri, when you haven't. dimitri, really great to hear insights. thank you. t, as in bob way now, where the main opposition leader nelson shaneesa has alleged major fraud in the countries presidential election. you may have the statement after incumbent president emerson and gone while i was declared the winner securing 52 percent of the vote.

. >> gwen, let me bring you in on this. we are watching district attorney fani s through her filings, through her efforts and the picture is consistent with the one you've painted for us over the last many months direct, responsive, and pretty steely. i don't think i'm playing too much into what i'm seeing. her response to chesebro was quick, it was decisive. i believe it was october 23rd. i misspoke when i said october 25th. let me ask you what are the chances that anyone goes on trial on october 23rd? is there ever a case where some people are separated out from the criminal enterprise? >> well, that's always possible, but i think it's important to note that d.a. willis was acting in response to response what georgia law says. anytime a defendant files a motion for speedy trial he or she must be tried either within the term the motion is file or within the succeeding term, the next term. this term ends at the end of august. that means mr. chesebro or any of the defendants must be tried by the end of september. issue must

thought that was not an obligation. grandmother chevy would have it is joe, look, that's not the case gwen. which one can hope to explain? you're going to, you still go into your into your lock is hurting to expand it to move them with you just hear you loud. we are always open for our discussion as to the 3 z we maybe just goose to reply. we called your discussion to the stories and ultimatums to the black nail. good. so right. so just that is not something that we plan to do, but the so easily common sense would not prevail, felt they'd say themselves you, we must leads roster of the battle to the owners of what he should wage, what the rush of the frontier digital display it was the end of battle, and they all use nurture. so that's why they have replaced common sams waiting for them. and that's means, that's the feel we are going to engage with them, but not in the field of diplomacy, but you pick it up from the battlefield, especially as the engine light. they are perfectly aware is nice, but they can not say it out loud because they are for being an issue with them. they understand p