just emphasize one point basically that executive director huish just asked about. if you're asked to make your calendar date available for a possible retreat, which would be an all-day affair, please respond because the possibility of getting it scheduled is very difficult. unless we respond, and we can plan accordingly, we don't know when we can all get together. >> yeah. i think the format you mentioned would be two sessions, like a friday afternoon or a saturday morning. we could break it over a tuesday or a wednesday. it's tough to go eight hours straight, but certainly, that's a possibility. we can do that. location wise, we want to generally get away from this building, but we're restricted to holding it in san francisco. we've had them in the past at treasure island, we've had them at the port, we had them at an italian restaurant one year down at the waterfront. we're a small group. we've had them at the art museum. >> how many -- >> generally, it's the board, guest speaker, and facilitators, under 20. generally, well attended by members of the board but no