but, the maliki government, specifically maliki, said no. you see how good a leader he was for the iraqi government. finally he's gone. >> because senator mccain says that maliki would have been ready but it was president obama and the obama administration who really didn't try. they wanted to leave maybe 1,000 or 2,000. maliki says he wanted significantly more, 5,000 to 10,000 u.s. troops remaining and only a thousand or 2,000 wasn't good enough and he wouldn't give immunity to u.s. military person whole remained in iraq as part of a new status of forces agreement. what do you say to that? >> it's all evolved around the status of forces agreement, whether or not there would be liability as to the number of troops that we wanted to be left there, i think it was the higher number, not the lower number. >> that's what the u.s. -- i know the military wanted 5 to 10,000. the question is, we'll check this, how much did the obama administration as a whole want to keep there. and you're right, the nuri al maliki refused to provide immunity to any u

the guy never really a maliki -- nuri allow maliki systematically dismantled what was a formidable regionalce, the iraqi army that existed in december 2011.. is it possible to put that army back together? >> a clearly is. we have fix the leadership that al-maliki disassembled. we have to get a telescope into iraqi units. this is somethg g i picked up in afghanistan. 10 man teams in the battalion, reporting back to how the leadership is going -- those are critical. that is what we need to get into the iraqi units right no u.s. was the first overall commander rebuilding the iraqi army. significant parts are going to be broken for the long-term. i think the assessment teams have ented a pretty good actor of what is possible. a number of units are still relatively sound. >> i do not disagree with that. i think it is goining to be harr this time around than it was the first time, if only because of our own actions in the p past. it is not something that maliki took apart, the iraqi army he inheriteted. essentially, what amounts to a a shiite republican blog -- republican guard. we have seen that

we're in touch with maliki as well. but maliki's approach was different. he did not establish a national army in iraq. he established a shiite army. and about 95, 98% of the army was made up of the shiite, that cannot be a national army. and that lead to internal clashes. and it lead to many problems in iraq. i hope now that this government in iraq is aware of all these factors. and they will move swiftly in establishing a national army as they have worked to establish this government. >> but as you said the biggest problem is not iraq, it is syria. >>> as i said to president obama, one cannot only look at iraq. that would be wrong. iraq and syria both have to be taken into consideration in determining what to do with the region. and on that wednesday, that speech he made on that wednesday, president obama did-- res the situation in both of those countries, in iraq and syria. and i think this was a correct observation, correct assessment. and we, i think that we have to do whatever is necessary based on this overall assessment. and i said this to secretary

maliki's approach was unfortunately never positive. maliki put a lot of pressure on his people. i said this to president obama and when i was talking to vice president biden about this. we told them about the situation in the region and unfortunately, the steps were not taken to deal with it. people in our country are able to go back home. >> do you think your effort to overthrow and see assad leave as head of government in syria allowed you to overlook the threat of the radical jihadist in syria? you were so intent of seeing assad overthrown that your support went to the wrong groups? >> well, let me say very clearly that regarding these terrorist organizations, we have to think of how they happened. how they came about to these terrorist organizations. were they there when assad was there or was isis there or was al qaeda there? i was prime minister for 11 years and i kept going to syria. i visited regularly and those organizations did not exist at the time. the issues always came back to assad himself. i kept telling him that he should move more quickly to democracy and it wo

there was no one advising prime minister maliki, no one watching prime minister maliki as he systematically replaced all of the competent military commanders with his own cronies. we saw what happened, the iraqi army collapsed when pressured by isis. >> let's talk about the iraqi army collapsing, because, you know, part of the president's plan includes training the iraqi military. but didn't we already do that? >> yeah, we did and spent a lot of money doing it, a lot of

it's clearly an embarrassment for the government of prime minister nouri al-maliki. it's more proof that the maliki government has been unable to take back iraq's second largest city or any territory from sunni insurgents. >> what does it mean to millions of syrians and iraqis in isil-occupied territory to be under the newly claimed leadership of a man who claims to be a caliph. there has not been a caliph for nearly a century. what does it mean for al baghdadi to claim that title. joining me, my guests. let me start with you. from the time the united states forces let him go until last friday do we know anything about where he's been, what he's done, his m.o. or how you enup in this position? >> we know very little about where he was except to assume, i think it's a safe assumption that he was always in iraq, and then he was rebuilding the movement, which threatened to fall apart when zarkawi, his meant for-predecessor was killed in 2006-07. there he was. i think he had to rebuild. he has a reputation as being good security, good at military planning, strategic plan

did not, or undo what nouri maliki did?is a really big question. i think people hope he is not as sectarian as nouri maliki. but when you look at what he faces. i mean, he lost a third of the country. and the iraqi army is in no shape to go in there. >> they just lost a base 25 miles from baghdad that they could not re-supply. >> right, and you have tens of thousands of iraqis just disappearing. and they have not come back. the other thing they have to do is keep the kurds in the country and they want to leave. so just to kind of hold it together, like what he has inherited, that is going to be hard enough. >> bob, what about you? the people you have been talking to, this is the guy from the same party as nouri maliki. it is not as no he came from some other place. a lot of people say he is cut from the same cloth. >> anderson, i talk a lot to the sunnis, the tribes in anbar and a variety of provinces. the four major tribes there told me explicitly, they think that haider al-abadi is just as difficult as nouri maliki. they

maliki. and in fact the kurds and many sunnis have made it conditional for their collaboration and efforts to on the removal of mr. maliki. so everybody knows that. mr. a baa day is in a hurry to form the government and hasn't been resting for the last week or ten days. he's been working 24/7 around the clock trying to negotiate with everybody. it's really a difficult task for him. and he promised to form the government as soon as possible. he gave 72 hours to various plit u call leaders to nominate their ministe ministers, so his deadline is tomorrow. for him and for iraq as well as the international community, failure is not an option. it will be disastrous on stake holders and then again, failure is a real possibility. there are those who are working on making it fail. there are those who are actually making it difficult for him to progress given the type of conditions and preconditions that they put forward. but so far the negotiations have been going relatively well. and only yesterday t

to maliki for some time.e had made some strides but he still hasn't filled the key position, interior and defense positions which are the ones disputed over. you can debate about the policy in iraq, but the fact is in syria, the administration made a decision over the recommendations of some of the president's own cabinet secretaries not to get involved in syria earlier. and i will tell you what intelligence officials tell me. they say that until now syria has been an effective intelligence black hole in large part because of that. that's changing now. you're flying surveillance flights, but the policy decision made a difference on the intelligence certainly in syria you can debate it to some degree in iraq. i will tell you that i also know from intelligence officials that had the u.s. had a military presence there, they would have had much better intelligence than they had otherwise. >> jay carney, appreciate, jim sciutto, eli lake as well. >> thank you. >> there's a lot more on this story and others at cnn.

al-am hussein or nouri maliki? guest: put me on the spot, i think maliki is better than saddam. sunni, butein was a he defined himself as a secular baathist. of the mostruly one evil figures in the 21st century. he brutalized the iraqi people. he was a threat to his neighbors and to the united states. -- as as malik he was maliki was -- i use the phrase she is saddam because of his -- the phrase his saddam because of consolidation of power, but it did not reach the level of her barbarity of -- of pure barbarity of saddam. host: you can find his latest piece at thedailybeast.com. guest: thank you for having me. host: up next in our weekly "your money segment, we look at the portion of the budget that looks -- that deals with counterterrorism operations. we will be right back. >> high, we are excited to announce that it is launch week for the 11th annual student cam -- hi, we are excited to announce that it is launch week for the 11th annual studentcam contest. this year's theme is the broadest ever. it is the three branches and you. tell a story that demonstrates how a policy, la

clearly was opposed. >> maliki needed a larger force.d a large force from his standpoint to protect himself against the sunnis. they needed a large stabilizing force to protect themselves from the shia. so it was in the able to trust building process to go forward, when we pulled out, trust was broken. maliki broke it and so we'll have to rebuild that trust that took a long time in 2007 to build. we're right back to ground zero and probably worse because the trust was broken once and it will take a long time to rebuild that trust, but if we step back. >> can you do this without u.s. forces on ground? >> do you think it's inevitable -- >> if the goal to defeat isis. >> it will take years. >> i don't see how we can do it any other way. >> thanks very much. ron johnson, "the lead" with jake tapper starts now. >>> president obama tells the world there is no nice cure for the cancer of islamic extremism. i'm jake tapper. this is the world lead. >> the only language by killers like this, is the language of force. >> president obama selling isi

force him to do the right thing as well. >> pelley: nouri al maliki was the elected prime minister.ia sect of islam, he nursed a grudge against the sunni branch of the faith. he'd been a thorn in america's side for eight years. president bush, in an off-camera conversation with us in 2007 said, “that maliki is a son of a bitch, but we have to deal with him.” >> panetta: prime minister maliki, who had the opportunity to kind of hold all of this together, just turned on the sunnis, fed into the historical sectarian divisions that have marred that country for centuries, and basically undercut and undermined the security force in iraq and created, i think, the very ingredients that led to what we see today in iraq. >> pelley: maliki, in your estimation, dismantled what weilt? took the sunni military officers out and replaced them with shias? >> panetta: we gave them a chance. i mean, you know, nobody can guarantee that iraq would be able to go in the right direction. but we gave them a chance. we gave them the tools. but instead, he turned to vengeance. and vengeance never pays off. >>

, payments by maliki stopped to them. general petraeus in 2006, 2007, you were there. that was part of what was integral to the sunni awakening. how do you see that actually occurring? i mean, if that is essential for success to peel away the sunni support for isis, how do you go about doing that without large numbers of u.s. personnel on the ground if the iraqi, you know, leadership, which is not shown a willingness to do that in the last couple of years even though there's been a change in leadership, how do you see that happening? >> well, i think you've just struck to the heart of the matter. the boots on the ground that are the most important are the sunni tribes of the provinces and other places in northwestern iraq. and then even in eastern syria. it's imperative to bring onboard. once they turn on isis, isis' days are numbered. it's not going to happen without some sort of political accommodation to bring them on board whether that's increased federalism, you know, their own administrative state within a larger ir

maliki was just too fearful of the political consequences. most iraqis wanted us gone, closed quote. senator udall. >> thank you, mr. chairman. good morning, gentlemen. it is very clear that isil presents a very series of threat to u.s. interest and allies in the middle these and the groups actions have left no doubt that it's going to take both brains and brawn to defeat them. we've got to hit them hard. we got to deny them safe haven and we have to bring strategic capabilities of the united states and a committed international alliance to bear against them. we need to work with our partners on the ground to eliminate the conditions that allowed this cancer to spread so quickly and the rise of isil should serve as a warning to lead throughout the middle east. i would urge as i think we all have a new iraqi government must take immediate steps to move past the shortsighted and harmful policies that have contributed to the current crisis. this is going to take a best effort. i know we have it in us and we do need to get right. general dempsey,

so it wasn't the united states dictating that maliki stay or not stay.et's not forget that iraq is a sovereign nation. it has elections. we may not like the outcomes, but it is a sovereign country. that was the entire point when general -- when president bush signed the december, 2008, agreement to leave iraq. it was a sovereign nation. so the united states didn't force or push through some new system of influence it was the people that made that decision. >> i want to touch on the issue of the shiite militia. as we looked at the surge, one of our successes in the surge was certainly our ability to bring over moderate sunnis. that was noted at the time and talked about a great deal about our ability to finally get the cooperation of a lot of moderate sunnis. clearly the sunnis have thrown in with isil because of the political problems they were thrown in this terms of exclusion from the iraqi government. so the clerics put out the call to rappel ie still to the shiite militias and they have been partially responsible for the successes that have occurred

. >> did the maliki government screw kurdistan? be frank here.the maliki government screwed the sunnis who were loyal to the iraqi government? >> there is absolutely no doubt about that. maliki alienated the kurds and margin allies marge listed the sunnis. today we have 1.4 million refugees in our town consisting of christians, yazidis and others who have sought refuge in our area. maliki cut off our budget since the beginning of the year totaling upwards of $9 billion. and we have not received a budget. and we are faced with an enemy fighting 600 miles long. no sovereign country can defeat and protect such a large territory. absolutely no doubt that maliki held the political system hostage. >> can isis be stopped? >> absolutely. initially isis played good cop/bad cop. now the people are realizing that isis is not what they had portrayed and thought isis was going to be. what is happening within the population they're uprising and taking out isis militants when day have the opportunity. they are determined in carrying out this fight. they are pro

i think by maliki and by president obama.hink that the failure-to-maintain suit any kind of u.s. military support for the iraqis was critical. among other things, it's misleading to say that the iraqi army was actually properly equipped. it wasn't. it hadn't been designed to stand on its own. it didn't shall it had no air support of its own, no ability to police its own airspace testimony had a variety of lax and intelligence surveillance and reconaissance that everyone expected the u.s. would continue to provide. so when we pulled out in 2011, it wasn't just about pulling out our ground forces, it was about withdrawing from the iraqi security forces, enablers that they thought they would continue to have. and leaving them in a bad condition to deal with the fight that they fasd. >> woodruff: what about the point that frederick kagan, that the president went on to say. he said this before. he said this can't be a u.s. military operation alone. in essence he was saying it's got to be something that the iraqis want or how can t

it's been reported that nouri al-maliki is in the running for vice president. troaivecontroversial candidate for are prime minister, objection to any of the candidates may mean the entire list is discarded. jane arraf is live for us in baghdad. what are you hearing about the whole process, jane? >> reporter: welt, as we speak -- well as we speak some of the members of parliament, including former prime minister ibrahim al jaffray, are starting to arrive. question is will they take a vote? it doesn't mean if they vote today or tomorrow, but if it goes beyond tomorrow that is beyond the constitutional deadline. they are expected to endorse this cabinet but haven't officially done so, jane. that means the kurdish members can't participate in the vote. that's what we're waiting for. the kurd in theory are on board, but they haven't gotten forward on the vote. >> what does the new government look like and do you think it will make a difference? >> reporter: well, it's an interesting one. it brings together a lot of political heavy weights who have played a role for

time the president said there must be a new government in iraq to replace the government of nouri al-maliki, and if they want more american help beyond what we with're doing, there has to be a political solution to the iraqi political crisis and i would say those elements, mr. president, are good elements, let's take them and apply them into syria. >> charlie: we continue with retired general anthony zeny. this is a crucial moment. the direction n.a.t.o. takes, the definition of what n.a.t.o. is something we haven't dealt with since the end of the cold war. we conclude with an appreciation of joan rivers who died this week at age 81. >> i wanted it more than life itself. >> charlie: why more than life itself? >> i never wanted anything else. the minute i could put a thought together, it was show business. i never wanted anything ever in my life. >> charlie: robert ford, anthony zeny and joan rivers, when we continue. >> charlie: we begin tonight's program with the ongoing conflict in syria and iraq. earlier today the obama administration announced it had formed a ocean to combat the sunni m

this is a government for which nouri al-maliki was forced out.o people see that this is the inclusive government that many of the factions who feel slightly dismarginalised have been waiting for. >> i think they are hoping that is the case. they are really giving a time limit on it. certainly the kurds said that they will join in and be part of the government, but for just three months, to see whether the demand they have have been agreed upon behind closed doors, whether they come to fruition, and the kurdish representatives said their demands were to do with oil, as jane said, and looked to see that the former oil minister has been demoted to education, and a new mp brought in, makhdi and is sympathetic to the kurds to have more of the gas and oil revenue. they want weapons for the peshmerga, more to come up from baghdad, and the salaries of the peshmerga fighters paid. one other area - i suppose the area that involves the sunni arabs, because those key groups want decentralization, money put into a local pot to make their own decisions. they h

supported maliki, did we not? >> the first time around he was duly elected. the second time around, alawi alawi--here we had maliki for another four years, huge geo political mistake on our part to allow that to happen. >> general keane, i'm like you, i don't have a lot of confidence in the free syrian army, and a year from now when they're finally training and they can stand up against the threat of it's si is isis, i think it will be too late. i know we drew the red line ant didn't enforce it. he's a brutal guy and i get it, he murdered a lot of people. but he shows no after tight for power outside of that region. so why not try and cut some kind of deal with assad? i mean if we're launching this brutal air strike, the only way as you point out to gain some of that territory back is if the kurds or assad's army, the syrian army take that back. is that a possibility at all? >> i think you have a moral imperati imperative, this is a brutal dictator that's killed 100,000 of his people. >> so was stallen. >> there's

we were a big part of al-maliki leaving. shia mullahsthe and others, and this did not just happen. we have been working this for some time. it appears that the new prime minister is more open, but this is iraq. this is still iraq, and the .ectarian divisions are deep sounded quitey positive today. i do not think we should have any illusions that we're going to have thomas jefferson in baghdad. i think it sounds like we have somebody we can work with. he has embraced the key elements here, which is an inclusive government, trying to reform the military, trying to build some kind of a national guard in the sunni areas to protect the sunnis. the sunnis are definitely afraid of being wiped out by the shia militia in iraq. they are almost as afraid of that as they are of isis. we have to reassure the sunnis in iraq that they can work with us to push isil out. >> the main thing is defeating this enemy, but there is this issue of aggression approval. a key observer of this. it seems to me that the president is not going very far in saying he will fight for a resolution. he will take suppo

maliki vowed to turn iraq into a big grave for islamic state fighters. the militants swept through the north in june, seizing territory and terrorizing residents. they've killed and raped those who won't convert to their strict brand of islam. they've been especially cruel to minorities, including christians and yazidis. united nations officials say over 1,400 people were killed in august alone. the vast majority of them civilians. nearly 4,200 died in june and july. but the officials note actual figures could be significantly higher. members of the u.n. human rights council say the islamic state has carried out odious crimes on an unimaginable scale. they agreed to send 11 investigators to iraq to document what they call massive human rights violations. german chancellor angela merkel says the suffering in iraq is immense. she defended a decision to send weapons to kurdish forces. opposition lawmakers argue the shipment breaks germany's policy of not arming fighters in conflict zones. >> translator: now we have a chance to save the lives of people and t

maliki was just too fearful of the political consequences. ost iraqis wanted us gone. >> good morning, gentleman. it is very clear that isil presents a very serious threat to u.s. interests and allies in the middle east. the groups -- group's actions have -- we've got to deny them safe havens and we have to bring strategic capabilities to the united states and a committed national alliance to bear against them. we need to work with our partners on the ground to eliminate the conditions that have aloud this cancer spread so quickly. the rise of isil should serve as a warning throughout the middle east. i would urge the new iraqi government must take immediate steps -- this is going it take our best effort. i know we do need to get it right. general dempsey in that spirit, let me direct a question to you. in order to defeat this enemy, we will need to be tough and smart. and you noted last month defeating isil will require all application of all tools of national power diplomatic, eeknomeck, information and military. could you describe how thes

what happened was when we did pull out and pulled out precipitously, the maliki government which had sided way too closely with the mullahs in tehran then started breaking all of the deals that the united states and the iraqi government had set up. they had been through multiple democratic revolution -- or

failures of the maliki government, u.s. troop presence was help sag part ing support t divisions between suni and shiaa in iraq. some how the troop presence was sole answer to that ongoing prob lechlt problem. i know senator mccain disagreed with senator obama on these policies. i don't find it look he thikely change his mind. what he is talking about now, senator mccain, what we need how to do, tracks closely with what the president announced tonight. >> just hypothetical. if the, nuri al maliki government agreed to status of forces agreement giving its troops immune fity from iraqi prosecution would it have made a difference, right now. would the situation in iraq be different. >> it is hard to know. the situation with isis arose out of syria and civil war in and the con flflict there. before migrating to iraq. i don't think the residual force that senator mccain is talking about or ween the oba ein the o administration were talking about would be the size and effectiveness to talk about what isis did when it moved into i

he didn't want to criticize nouri maliki. he said yes, i'm obviously much more inclusive. did make mistakes. >> thank you very much, christiane amanpour, i want to bring the panel from the ground in iraq. ben wider man, and ben, it is interesting to hear christiane, what she heard from the prime minister today. it is essential for the government in baghdad to convince kurds to convince sunnis to support the central government. and that they will reach out a hand financially, and in terms of power. >> yeah, and the question is, anderson, can he do it? there are so many divisions within southern iraq, within baghdad. between of course, the sunnis and the shiite and of course here in the northern part of iraq in the regional -- the kurdish regional government, there is support for the united stat states. this is really the one spot in the region where the americans have allies they can depend on. keeping in mind, of course, that during the entire time the united states was in iraq, not a single american soldier was killed in this part of the country. so they do have a solid s

we lost all influence over maliki when we withdrew. so the fact that we will be there, to a large extent, abadi's survival is going to depend on u.s. assistance. we'll have more of a say over abadi than we had over maliki over the last three years. i also believe that if we can get american forces, americaamericans embedded with the iraqi army, that will help coordinate operations between the peshmerga and the iraqi army. >> but you realize, congressman, that would be combat boots on the ground, which the president has ruled out? >> we already have almost 2,000 troops over there. that's three times more troops than eisenhower had in vietnam when he left office. we do have boots on the ground. i don't see right now the need to have combat troops in effect actually taking part in combat forces. but we'll have to be embedded for the purpose of leadership and coordination. and the president i think should be more upfront with the american people in telling them that. >> and this notion that as chairman dempsey testified today before the se

maliki he was in when dustin actions against iran.hey will say his personality is inclusive and that might be true plus he's under great pressure. the americans have said we will not do more in terms of the military operations unless you form an inclusive government and treat the sunni and kurds as participants. >> there is a split among people who come to this table about what our relationship should be with assad. >> i feel strongly about this. as a journalist i know you are not supposed to have strong feelings, but let's look at this for a second. you have more or less 200,000 people who have been savagely, brutally murdered over the course of three years by this man, this despot, this dictator. there has not been a huge amount of action from the international community. then isis comes along and within a really short time, a few months, we are talking about airstrikes. there is a huge sense of momentum. we need to address this issue and that's absolutely right. imagine now you are a sunni muslim. you do not support isis but you st

those disenfranchised sunnis and nuri al maliki who turned to isis and they loued them to walk into their villages.

saddam hussein or nouri al-maliki? guest: put me on the spot, i think maliki is better than saddam.saddam hussein was a sunni, but he defined himself as a secular baathist. saddam was truly one of the most evil figures in the 21st century.20th he brutalized the iraqi people. he was a threat to his neighbors and to the united states. as bad as maliki was -- i use the phrase she is saddam because of the phrase shia saddam because of his consolidation of power, but it did not reach the level of her barbarity of -- of pure barbarity of saddam. host: you can find his latest piece at thedailybeast.com. guest: thank you for having me. in in u.s. house gavels about 20 minutes or so. one vote, one of the four suspension votes on what they debated earlier. this one dealing with school certification programs. at 6:30 eastern, and after that the house will work on the remaining bills. we will have live coverage when they return at six: 30 eastern. at 7:15, the house rules committee will meet for the continuing resolution. this is a short-term stopgap measure,-- spending funding the government t

so it's al maliki.nd i hope maliki's read his history of vietnam -- >> do you think we're blaming al maliki for the mess in iraq because he's brown? is that what you think? >> i think we always blame our clients. that's what i'm saying. >> that's a generalization. do you think we're blaming al maliki for the mess in iraq because he's brown? >> i think we blame our clients. our clients happen to be brown. so i hope al maliki's read about vietnam. diem got a bullet in the head from kennedy because he had failed in vietnam. we hadn't failed. we were perfect. and the same is true in -- >> america has made mistakes. have made mistakes in vietnam, i think the iraq war in retrospect -- hold on a moment. in retrospect the iraq war was a mistake. but there's a difference between making a mistake and doing something inherently wicked. let me tell you by what i mean. anyone else who went into iraq and did this would have reimbursed themselves by taking the iraqi oil. instead we've spent all this money in iraq and

it took nouri al-maliki and made him the vice-president.e same bunchciy9 of people, te same ideas. it's a disaster. >> well, look, the jury is still out. i wouldn't rush to conclusions. initial signs, as you say, certainly aren't positive. but, look, the sunnies in iraq have to know -- have to have confidence that their future -- >> but they don't. >> is being looked after. >> if they don't have that confidence, but they don't have a government that gives them that confidence. they didn't have that confidence. we inept there last time. when they stood up and sew can stand down and now we're gifting involved in a civil war, that we clearly do not understand, and we don't have a government to back up anything if anything we do goes right, who is going to keep ill right? nobody. bashar al-assad on one side and nouri al-maliki and his cronies on the other. it's crazy. >> yes. i would say that -- again, don't want to paint too rosy a picture. >> that's good. >> i would say the two things that might be different this time than what happened after

maliki expelled us from iraq. maliki would not negotiate a, an agreement to keep our forces in limited numbers in iraq, past -- past -- i believe it was 2011. and -- george bush couldn't negotiate that deal with maliki and george bush had installed him. to blame the president for not being able to deal with the problem that had been installed in baghdad it, any way that is ancient history. i support the idea of using our air power to -- to, degrade and confine isis. what i don't want to see thousand of american troops on the ground. unfortunately with just air power. we will not be able to completely obliterate isis any time soon. >> uh-huh. want to play for you an interesting moment in saudi arabia today where secretary of state kerry was asked if in fact the u.s. is now at war with isis. here's what he said to that. >> i think that is the wrong term analogy. what we are doing is engaging in a very significant counterterrorism operation. it is going to go on for some period of time. somebody wants to think about

maliki excluded the sunnis and to a certain extent the kurds. the only way you're going to get the sunnis to reject isis and stand up and fight as if they feel they have something to fight for. again, remember that lady's story told you about, tell me what i'm supposed to die for the next thing is build coalitions in the region and internationally. why are we not at the u.n. now getting a resolution for the authorization of use of force? this allows us to build coalitions. under that it's easier to do. george h. w. bush before he went to kuwait to knock out saddam, which we could've done easily on her own, james baker went to the u.n., got a resolution authorizing use of force. we built a coalition in the region under all the muslim forces to work side-by-side with general schwarzkopf. we built another coalition with the british, the french, the japanese and others. all because we had the international legitimacy of the u.n. resolution. if it's necessary to strike into syria, and particularly at isis, i would do that. so these are the pieces tha