crossfire today, nara tanden, one of the architects of obama care, and one of the law's main opponents, matt kibbe. matt, this question goes to you. isn't this insane? don't we know how this is going to end? >> i think the budgeting process is insane. i think the fact that everybody in this town agrees that this law's not ready for primetime and yet they're going ahead suggesting to fund something that nobody thinks works. that's insane. i think the american people had a great victory today. and i think we got to keep pushing because there are some republicans and there are plenty of democrats that don't want to acknowledge that they made a mistake. >> well, that's not how it played out in the vote today. >> the same thing to do would be to say, you know what, we screwed this up. it doesn't work. people are dumping their employees. >> the american people haven't said that. they didn't say that in a national election. they didn't say that when the law was passed. the supreme court didn't say that. and nothing has changed in every 42 times now that the house has tried to do this. so i'm not sure wha

this historian, carl richard, and matt kibbe fights the government. matt, are we becoming rome?> i think that we are. i think that the parallels are quite ominous. the expansion of foreign policy, the arrogance of executive power taking over our country. but i do think we have a chance to stop it. >> i believe that their similarities with the fall of rome and the republic they are in engagement of political leaders and so on. i see some of that. john: corruption, etc.? >> it is sort of under the table corruption. but it doesn't bother me as much as the over things. for instance, the roman constitution had a to permit limited to one year and people just kept voting for th unconstitutional leader. john: now we have congress passing laws that haven't read. >> that's right, we had presidents of both parties saying that i am not for certain about these laws. taking property, selling it to someone else, and yet you can always find parallels. but the fact that we are meeting come i think it shows the antidote is coming about. we, the people, we have not gone the way that the romans did

this historian, carl richard, and matt kibbe fights the government. matt, arewe becoming rome? >> i think that we are. i think that the parallels are quite ominous. the expansion of foreign policy, the arrogance of executive power taking over our country. but i do think we have a chance to stop it. >> i believe that their similarities with the fall of rome and the republic they are in engagement of political leaders and so on. i see some of that. john: corruption, etc.? >> it is sort of unde the table corruption. but it doesn't bother me as much as the over things. for instance, the roman constitution had a to permit limited to one year and people just kept voting for this unconstitutional leader. john: now we have congress passing laws that haven't read. >> that's right, we had presidents of both parties saying that i am not for certain about these laws. taking property, selling it to someone else, and yet you can always find parallels. but the fact that we are meeting come i think it shows the antidote is coming about. we, the people, we have not gone the way that the romans

. >> thank you carl, matt kibbe, steve forbes. gladiator currency growing welfare state, other ways america is just too much like rome. (applause) [ male announcer ] centrum has been a leader in multivitamins for over 30 years. and it's now the most doctor recommended, the most preferred and the most studied. so when it comes to getting the most out of your multivitamin, the choice is clear. centrum. at humana, our medicare agents sit down wh you and ask. being active. and being with this guy. [ male announcer ] getting to know you is how we help you choose the humana medicare plan that works best for you. mi familia. ♪ [ male announcer ] we want to help you achieve your best health, so you can keep doing the things that are important to you. taking care of our customers. taking care of her. and the next thing on our list is bungee jumping. [ male announcer ] helping you -- now that's what's important to us. like carpools... polly wants to know if we can pick her up. yeah, we can make room. yeah. [ male announcer ] ...office space

thank you, matt kibbe, thank you, john fehr for coming on to debate the right versus the center right why some politicians survive sex scandals and others certainly don't, like that fella. this is "hardball," the place for politics. >>> why can some politicians get passed sex scandals while others certainly can't. morhardball, coming next. >>> we're back. and 2013 was shaping up to be the year of political comebacks, but as it turns out, only one of three public redemption seekers was victorious. mark sanford won back an old congressional seat by appealing directly to voters by forgiveness and it worked. tuesday night, however, this week, former congressman anthony weiner and former governor of new york, eliot spitzer, failed to replicate sanford's success. are there reasons to be learned here? politico's maggie haberman wrote a great piece this morning, the so-called dance of the honest man is necessary, even if you have to fake it. a great line, a little cynical. joy reid and steve mcmahon, we have a male and that female commentator here. perhaps that evens it out. i may have a tota

thank you, matt kibbe, thank you, john fehr for coming on to debate the right versus the center righte politicians survive sex scandals and others certainly don't, like that fella. this is "hardball," the place for politics. \ with the spark miles card from capital one, bjorn earns unlimited rewards for his small business. take these bags to room 12 please. [ garth ] bjorn's small business earns double miles on every purchase every day. produce delivery. [ bjorn ] just put it on my spark card. [ garth ] why settle for less? ahh, oh! [ garth ] great businesses deserve unlimited rewards. here's your wake up call. [ male announcer ] get the spark business card from capital one and earn unlimited rewards. choose double miles or 2% cash back on every purchase every day. what's in your wallet? [ crows ] now where's the snooze button? >>> some survive sex scandals while others certainly can't. more "hardball" coming next. [ tires screech ] ♪ [ male announcer ] 1.21 gigawatts. today, that's easy. ge is revolutionizing power. supercharging turbines with advanced hardware and innovative softwar