that if metadata then we're done. or if they're -- these are both factors that goes into a calculus of reasonable expectation of privacy. once you start thinking of that as a calculus you can see in riley the court said just because you can get a small amount of information from somebody's pocket doesn't mean we have to be blind to the much, much larger information you can get from somebody's smartphone. we can think about those differences. we can think of the information in jones. the concurrences in jones say we are not stuck in the small box of smith vs. maryland. we can look at the big difference of the amount of time that somebody's location being tracked might make. where at a single point in time maybe no reasonable expectation of privacy. at some point between that and 28 days, a reasonable expectation of privacy, that's what justice alito's concurrence and justice sotomayor's concurrence. >> jones involved what otherwise might be -- i'm talking about concurrence. what otherwise would have been public knowled

that if metadata then we're done. or if they're -- these are both factors that goes into a calculus of reasonable expectation of privacy. once you start thinking of that as a calculus you can see in riley the court said just because you can get a small amount of information from somebody's pocket doesn't mean we have to be blind to the much, much larger mfings you can get from somebody's smartphone. we can think about those differences. we can think of the information in jones. the concurrences in jones say we are not stuck in the small box of smth vs. maryland. we can look at the big difference of the amount of time that somebody's location being tracked might make. where at a single point in time maybe no reasonable expectation of privacy. at some point between that and 28 days, a reasonable expectation of privacy, that's hat sdwrs alito's -- justice alito's occurrence and justice soto mayor's occurrence. >> jones involved what otherwise might be -- i'm talking about concurrence. what otherwise would have been publi

the metadata is defined by the fisc court for purposes of this order, telephone and metadata includes comprehensive communications, routing information, included but not limited to session identifng information, for example, originating and terminating telephone numbers, international mobile subscriber identity. see, the government would like you to think they don't get into identities but they do. >> i'm sorry, the identity comes from the phone number, right? >> that's correct. sorry, your honor. >> as in smith, right? >> that's just one part of the metadata. from that, as expert felton testifies to, a computer expert at princeton, from that you can derive virtually every aspect of your personal and professional lives. who you met with, the duration of the call, that's not, of course, an issue which would be involved in a pin register or trace and trap. >> doesn't your standing theory really turn on a kind of telescoping and elimination of the imminence requirement? because the harm you're concerned with is what follows, not merely from the so-called querying, but once the querying i

the possible uses of the metadata when we do know because of what has been released, though limitation the court has imposed on that, and these questions is there any possibility that information about these plaintiffs's phone calls would be reviewed by any person and that's program, the kinds of cases the supreme court decided highlights the lesser interests in privacy here because unlike in smith and miller and criminal cases the supreme court decided the government is not using all this information in order to go after individuals. >> that reiterates the government, evaluation in obtaining of data in and of itself is not a fourth amendment violation. >> absolutely and one of your questions earlier reminded me of an important point in that aspect. >> soldiers goes through your papers but don't do anything about signing the papers, the fourth amendment has not been violated. >> the supreme court recognized that. it is the different question when individual affects or property interests have been invaded. >> property is what is protected in the fourth amendment, the historic basis. it

it is just the metadata.then the next problem has been, well, the government shouldn't hold the metadate aadata. and this essentially is the big change that this bill makes. we voted out of our committee by a vote of 12-3 a fisa reform act. however, that bill is not going to pass, in my judgment. the presiding officer: the senator's time has expired. mrs. feinstein: may i ask that my time be extended, please. the presiding officer: is there objection? without objection. mrs. feinstein: thank you very much. we -- i talked with the house and here's what i got. if we didn't pass the house bi bill, there were members that wanted to end the whole program. i do not want to end the progr program. i'm prepared to make the compromise which is that the metadata will be kept by the telecoms. senator chambliss and i wrote a letter to the four big telecoms and we asked them if they would hold the data. the answer came back from two, "yes" and the answer came back from two "no." since that time, the situation has changed,

>> no. >> the information you get is metadata. doesn't contain pii in that metadata? do you store the pii to? >> because, again i would have to talk to war but you could argue i get a phone number is pii. of course, the challenge is, not the challenge but we get the number, not a name. >> so there's no names, no addresses, information of which are collected and used that as an analytical tool. do you believe that that information is valuable in any counterterrorism effort that the united states undertakes? >> yes, i do. >> do you have personal knowledge of that information has led or assisted in any counterterrorism investigation counterterrorism investigation to help defend the to? >> yes. i think it has been a value to our efforts. >> i just can't make sure, this is really important to me. no content is collected under section 215. you get a review by the court every 90 days, meaning you to go back every 90 days with what you done with it and how your processed it and how you've handled it. and if you want to go for another 90 days you have to make the case? >> yes,

for example the metadata. i want you to now go to the court and use your own authori authority.now i want to go to the fisa court. he also directed we used to be able when we went into those instances when we went to the data we used to be able to do what we call three hops in the amount of time could follow the string so to speak. the

i don't like the term metadata because it encompasses too much. we should talk about what we are talking about. there's a broad range of data that is what did or even created or inferred to use of online service. some of it is benign. we call things, put a metadata label on things like the amount of storage you are using in your online storage or the average file size. but even that has implications and we embraced the idea of transparency and consent, and all of that data. as you go up the scale with may be content being the end, the most private, the stuff that people have the highest expectation of privacy around. but other things about new york communicating with our right up against content. in terms of what that can reveal about people's relationships, associations, thoughts, beliefs, et cetera. there's very important privacy locations around the. >> you mentioned transborder issues and the fact that people around the world recognize privacy as an interest, in many cases a human rights. where'd we stand, what are you aware of or what do you

it is just the metadata. then the next problem has been, well, the government shouldn't hold the metadata. and this essentially is the big change that this bill makes. we voted out of our committee by a vote of 12-3 of fisa reform act. however, that bill is not going to pass in my judgment. may i ask that my time be extended, please? >> without objection. >> thank you very much. i talked with the house, and here's what i got. if we didn't pass the house bill, yet there were members who wanted to end the whole program. i do not want to end the program. i'm prepared to make the compromise, which is that the metadata will be kept on the telecoms. senator chambliss and i wrote a letter to the four big telecoms and we asked them if they would hold the data? the answer came back from to, yes, and educating back from to, no. since that time the situation has changed. not in writing but my personal testimony from two of the companies that they will hold the data for at least two years for business reasons. now, here'

one report finding that the 215 metadata program was, in fact, illegal. and that it was also ineffective, and in a report by the president's review group that was specially appointed last year to review intelligence programs that made a similar finding about effectiveness and made other significant recommendations. so there's been a lot of reporting going on. and a lot of transparency there. there's also been a battle between internet service providers that are subject to these authorities, and the government, over what they can release in their annual transparency reports. so a number of internet service providers, including google, and yahoo! and the like actually went to the fisa court and brought their own declaratory suit seeking the permission of the court to release the aggregate numbers of their -- of the fisa orders that they had received, and the government sort of responded, and they had a litigation and they actually settled out of court in that case with a new sort of set of rules and principles that those companies can follow that allow them

the information you get is metadata that contains pii in a? do you store the pii? >> i would have to talk to a lawyer but i guess you could argue a phone number is pii. the challenges we get the number and not a name. >> so there are no names and no addresses and no information for which you collect any use that as an analytical tool. you believe that information is valuable in any counterterrorism effort that the united states undertakes? >> as i do. >> to have personal knowledge that information is lead or assist in any investigation to help defend the united states? >> i definitely think it's been a value in assistance. >> this is really important to me. no content is collected on any of those will phonecalls under section 215. you get a review by the court every 90 days many have to go back every 90 days with what you are done with it and how you have processed it and how you have handled it and if you want to go for another 90 days -- there is some notion that we shouldn't be participating in this and i think it was a bit confusing here. i think we are trying

it doesn't make sense for us to continue the collection of metadata. you're not legally required.o and there's no reason not to move to that model and begin that transition now. > thank you, mr. chairman. thank you admiral for being here today and for the work that you and your team are doing at n.s.a. it's important work to the country. so we had a discussion just a few minutes agoability the types of things we're seeing in terms of cyber intrusion. the american people have seen a certain number of sishe related incidents including the state department, the white house, e national oceanic atmospheric administration, the the ostal service, and control systems on malwaer. they come on the heals of major attacks or intrusions such as j.p. morgan chase, michaels, the south korean banking attacks. on "60 minutes" last month, the f.b.i. director said there are two kinds of big companies in the u.s. those who have been hacked by the chinese and those who don't know they've been hacked by the chinese. and i was the other states are doing it. so today we've seen these incidents nearly foc

metadata much of the that is collected by the nsa -- how much is helpful?uest: there have been estimates. there was an estimate where a fairly sizable percentage of the debtor was somewhat useful in datang people -- of the was somewhat useful in helping people attain knowledge of what the terrorists were up to. it is almost like a cop on the beat. the virtual worlds and the real ,orld's, the physical worlds they are becoming very intertwined. in order for us to have an understanding of what is going on, we, as the u.s. government or the u.s. nation, we need to have an understanding of what the internet is actually doing -- what is actually being said out there. when that happens, it is similar doingt a cop on a beat is in a town where they are walking down the street. ,hey are not going after anyone per se, but they are making sure public safety is assured and that is generally accepted in american law-enforcement. it is somewhat analogous to an intelligence perspective -- find what is normal to determine what is abnormal. that is how these structures work

cannot be one single case pointed to by anybody who can show that as a result of the collection of metadata rights breached. it simply has not happened. it will not happen if we keep this program in place. >> ifill: president obama had proposed curbing the n.s.a.'s data gathering, and the houseç approved its own, weaker version of the bill in may. the white house supported the senate version in part because the law authorizing the entire program expires next june. joining me now to discuss what comes next for n.s.a. reform in congress is democratic senator from vermont patrick leahy. leahy, who is chairman of the senate intelligence committee, co-sponsored the legislation that failed last night. we reached out to several republicans who opposed the bill who were not available tonight. senator, part of the debate last night was whether your solution to this issue went too far or didn't go far enough. where did it land? >> well, weç got 58 votes out f 100 senators. normally that would be enough to pass a bill, but the republican leaders wanted it filibustered and wanted it blocked, did not

i don't like the term metadata because it encompasses too much. we should talk about what we're talking about and there is a broad range of data that's collected or created or inferred through the use of online services and some of it's fairly benign. we call things, the -- put the metadata label on things like the amount of storage you're using in the online storage thing or the average file size and -- but even that has privacy implications and we embrace the ideas of transparency and consent and all of the phipps around that kind of data, too. but as you go up the scale with maybe content being the end as the most private, the most -- the stuff that people have the highest expectation of privacy, but other things you're about who you're communicating with are right up there. right up against content in terms of what that can reveal about people's relationships associations, thoughts believes, et cetera. and there's very important privacy implications about that as well. >> you mentioned the transborder issues and the fact that people around the

the nsa is strictly an intelligence agency. >> how much of this metadata is ?elpful to national security >> there are various estimates. there have been a lot of statements. the previous director had an estimate. fairly sizable portion of data in helpingt useful people obtain a good understanding of what terrorists were up to. use ific analogy i would it is almost like a cop on the worlds and theal physical worlds are becoming and or twine. in order for us to have an understanding of what is going on, we need to have an therstanding of what internet is actually doing, what is being said out there, and when that happens, it's very similar to what a cop on the beat is doing in a town, where they are walking on the street. they are making sure public safety is assured. acceptedenerally practice in american law enforcement. this is somewhat analogous from that standard. that is how the structures work and what they are designed to do. in terms of the percentage of what is effective, my personal view is the vacuum cleaner approach to collection operations is not nec

the letter said the act would prevent the bulk collection of internet metadata and make the government's demands for user information a lot more transparent. here's a look at the letter that was submitted. the tech giants said the act does not go far enough. they want to prevent data requests without a proper legal process. >>> open enrollment is under way for health insurance coverage under the affordable care act or obamacare, and 7 on your side's michael finney is standing by our phone bank with a panel of experts ready to take your calls. i know a lot of people have a lot of questions about this. >> boy, they do. they are busy here. as you said, this year you only get three months to sign up from october 15th to february 15th. so you need answers to your questions now. that's why we have this hotline set up. give us a call, 415-954-7621. joining me susan fipfeiffer wit the chamber of commerce. >> we are getting questions about what are my options, how do i sign up. >> medicare has been expanded. explain that. >> it is actually medical which has been expanded to cover 400% of the pove

i don't like the term metadata because it encompasses too much. we should talk about what we're talking about and there is a broad range of data that's collected or created or inferred through the use of online services and some of it's fairly benign. we call things, the -- put the metadata label on things like the amount of storage you're using in the online storage thing or the average file size and -- but even that has privacy implications and we embrace the ideas of transparency and consent and all of the phipps around that kind of data, too. but as you go up the scale with maybe content being the end as the most private, the most -- the stuff that people have the highest expectation of privacy, but other things you're about who you're communicating with are right up there. right up against content in terms of what that can reveal about people's relationships associations, thoughts believes, et cetera. and there's very important privacy implications about that as well. >> you mentioned the transborder issues and the fact that people around the

metadata say sharing or data about information to help stop attacks, sharing that at network speed isng to be very important. if one of our critical industries is attacked, the government may not see it. the industry has to be able to tell the government at network speed, i have a problem. that type of information should be shared at network speed broadly across the department of home insecurity, the fbi, nsa and cyber command. >> the collection of metadata still alarms are a lot of people. what are the kinds of threats you have seen from inside the nsa? can you still be a civil libertarian? >> absolutely. it is not an either or. datau are going to use the , what are the safeties we have around it to protect our civil liberties and privacy? that has never been fully explained. we did a terrible job of explained that. that needs to be explained on the cyber security side. put it out there and let people understand. some type oft for attack to occur and then say we should have done this. we already know. you brought it up. we saw it in 2012. is there a certain industry you think is most

i am told they must convert from the metadata formal to a standard version. other committees would likely get them in the new year after the agency has a chance to redakt them. >> the grand jury meeting in ferguson as they answer whether or not to charge officer wilson in the shooting death of black teenager michael brown. we don't know when they will reach the decision. the process is taking a long time because the grand jury isr witness. >> and the deadline for reaching a deal on the iran nuclear program is here with no agreement in sight. where do the negotiators deputy from here? now the snow and now the big melt. what folks in buffalo could be dealing with as all of that snow could turn into water. >> we hope that it doesn't flood our house or anybody else's. we don't want anybody flooded. we are asking everyone to keep a watchful eye on their homes. s with the opening bell. and the rush i get, lasts way more than an hour. (announcer) at scottrade, we share your passion for trading. that's why we've built powerful technology to alert you to your next opp

the most important things that has declassified is the original opinion authorizing the internet metadata program. it was issued in 2004. this is the seed opinion for all of the bulk collection. what essentially happened -- another thing that's been rereleased this year in a case that my organization brought is the memorandum of the office of legal council written by jack goldsmith and others that preceded the metadata opinion. it was the analysis said it's legal if the court -- they sought approval from the court. what really happened in terms of the time line is that this -- these programs were in development and ongoing since 2001, right after 9/11. but they were conducted within the bush whitehouse and within the nsa in secret for a number of years. then there was a revolt within the whitehouse and the department of justice over authorization of the programs. they were subsequently transitioned over to the fisa court under the pen register provision. in 2006, they applied for the first business record call meta data order from the court. that court granted it without writing a opinion

the government gets telephone metadata, what has more regulation? the private entities collection or the government likes and from the private entity? >> i don't think i can answer that. and you'reormation in contact with that -- contract with that company. problems with the metadata program is there was no reading of the contract or the section of the patriot act that would've enabled any person to know what they were consenting to and at their information would go to the nsa. >> the answer is both? >> there is contractual regulation. there is the fourth amendment and all matter. there is lots of regulation everywhere. private companies have no incentive to coerce or imprison risks ofhat is why the injury might be greater from the government than from private companies. does that take into account the homeland security prison industry? they could not do it they do without 484 contractors. are there risks inherent in the increasing commercialization of national security? >> problem's can come from anywhere. they are not inherent things that could be

this program, the one we're talking about, the metadata program of american telephone records, that programecifically designed to deal with that kind of threat. i think we need to have a mature debate about this. this isn't lame duck session of congress business. this has to be handled in due course and in regular order. and if we decide not to do the nsa program, erin, i understand that. but we all have to embrace the increased risk that we are accepting, if we decide to reject this tool. >> pretty powerful words for those who sponsor it. i know including some senators on the republican party, very prominent ones. thank you very much, general hayden. >> thank you. >>> next breaking news. with ferguson on edge, new video of officer wilson in an angry confrontation with another citizen. we'll show you the video. >>> and as he faces new allegations of rape, bill cosby has two major entertainment deals and whatever happens, he will make a ton of money from it. that is ahead. ameriprise asked people a simple question: in retirement, will you outlive your money? uhhh. no, that can't happen. that

i think part of -- one of the problems that with the metadata program is that there is no reading of the contract or the section 215 as patriot act that would enable any person to know what they are consenting to and know that their information goes knot sa. to the nsa. >> so the answer is both? >> both tp just different types of regulation. contractural regulation. story communications act is government communication act and from the government the fourth amendment and all of the matter of law. so lots of regulation everywhere. >> okay for you dan. private companies have no incentive to coerce or imprison people, that's why the risk might be greater from the government than from private companies but the rider act, does that take into account the homeland security and nsa couldn't do what it does without 484 contractors providing it technical support. are there risk in the increasing commercialization of national security. >> yes. problems can come from anywhere. i don't think they are inherent things that can be said about various things about where problems could be caused. they h

a reference to the intrusive nature of collecting metadata -- details like which phone numbers were involved in a call and how long the call lasted -- was spiked. brazil's deputy ambassador to the u.n. said the measure could have been stronger. >> the consensus was reached, but it is important to recall the compromises that were made to achieve such an outcome. references to the principles of necessity and proportionality or not as strong as they should have been. surveillance programs, as in the activity that poses a threat to human rights, should be necessary and proportionate to the pursuance of legitimate names. as some members were not in a position to acknowledge these basic principles of international law, we could not affirm them in the strongest of terms. >> the obama administration is releasing new limits on ozone, the most widespread form of air pollution, and the main ingredient in smog. ozone, which is formed through a reaction of pollutants from power plants, factories and cars, has been linked to asthma, heart disease and premature death. u.s. restrictions imposed under presid

similarly, phone call metadata, when collected and analyzed in large volume, has been shown to enable predictions about social status, affiliation, employment, health, and personality. the second implication is the data handling systems have gotten much more complicated, especially in the merging and analysis phases, that is the phases after collection. the sheer complexity of these systems makes it very difficult to understand, to predict, and to control how they behave. even the people who build and run these systems often fail to understand fully how they work in practice, and this leads to unpleasant surprises such as compliance failures or data breaches. complexity frustrates oversight, it frustrates compliance, and it makes failure more likely. despite all best intentions, organizationings will often find themselves out of compliance with their own policies and their own obligations. complex systems will often fail to perform as desired. complex rules also make compliance more difficult. it's sometimes argued we should abandon controls on collection and focus only on regulating

gerri: what we're talking about here, really is metadata, right?ou and i driving around in our cars every day drive around in ton of information that can be sold. insurance companies. could be sold into divorce attorneys, pizza maker down the street and wants to know passing by the shop. it's a treasure trove for a variety of folks out there. tell us, how is this changed? how is it different? is it so transformational that the powers that be will be so entrenched that no way we could bring information to ourselves. >> you bring up a good point. we're in environment of wholesale information collection. not just met that data. where you are, where you've been, where you're going, direct information like your name, your address. even credit card information if you are subscribing to a certain service. auto manufacturers are even interested in biometric information. gerri: oh, lord. >> congress is actually -- gerri: biometric? >> biometric information. gerri: tell me, how does that help them? >> ford for a while has been in the research stages of colle

here's a picture of metadata number batch -- benedict c umberbatch.lly took out an ad in the old-fashioned way to announce his engagement. anti-technology thing to do. he put it in the newspaper. that it became a twitter storm. andle started to tweet leslie that he was going to get married. i thought this was an amazing start of old meets new media. two minutesing for every day at midday. why? traders,he day brokers, and jobers got two hours for a nice, boozy lunch. this is about to counter that preference for trading off exchange. this will effectively be what traders call dark pool light. they will have intra-day -- stocks traded. you could scarf down a tuna lunch. >> i had lots of lunches. drafty. shock. of 29-year-old hanging out with silvio berlusconi. it caught our eye. she is on a harley davidson. she sort of was worried about the age difference. i like the harley davidson. >> i like that she was at all the parties. >> wow. >> what a revelation. "countdown" continues on a slightly more serious note when we come back. we will talk about the rate

and the potential is here it's not just metadata, it's actually conversations.d tell you they have to get a court order and a warrant. so that's the tradeoff here. how much privacy are people willing to give up in exchange for the effectiveness of some of these law enforcement programs. >> okay. all right. thank you. >> you bet. >> see you later. >>> the golf equipment market in the rough a little bit. adidas latest results feeling a weakness. its taylormade line. dominic chu is with the company's new ceo who's unveiling the 2015 product line. dom? >> that's right. so, joe, taylormade adidas golf is part of adidas, the apparel giant. they've been one of the underperformers and needs to right itself. the guy who's going to do it is my guest now. ben sharpe, the ceo of taylormade adidas golf. thank you so much for joining us here on "squawk box." can we talk a lit bit about equipment? because you guys are the big gorilla, if you will, in this business. what is it about this new equipment line that makes you think you can get golfers to go out and buy and spend the

she took abuse on a phone like this, an iphone, but there is this amazing metadata, it's digital informationre you take the picture, when you took the picture. >> and what time you took the picture. >> exactly. it doesn't exactly match the story she tells, in fact, it tells a different story. >> alabama las a stand your ground law. did she use that? >> actually, again, i thought that would be interesting. no, she had actually got an restraining order against him because she said of his prior abuse, but to go down and shoot him, she actually violated her own order, she can't use stand your ground. >> tomorrow night on "48 hours" at 10:009:00 central on cbs. coming up, our conversation with the one and only tom hanks. >> tom hanks, where is your insecurity? so many actors are so insecure, where is yours? i don't see it, honest to god. >> do you see how charming and witty i am? this is purely a self-defense mechanism. this is purely to get good somehow. >> a man who is one of hollywood's most bankable and nicest actors you will ever meet. >> a good question, a good answer. >> yeah. merry christ

i think they're for issa and metadata revelation which was the one that showed all of grisons customershad their core records handed over to nsa. i think i was very surprising in the very first one that came out where people were scandalized. and i think justifiably so. i think it was probably poorly understood that the nsa's ability to spy on u.s. soil. i also think we involvement of silicon valley with the state intelligence apparatus was also something that, i mean i think one of the reasons this could be surprising to someone like me who has been the security industry for a long time is because in many ways these have the technological capability. i was certainly surprised about the amount and scope of data that was being harvested from u.s. companies for intelligence purposes. >> that points to one of the key points of contention that i think it is rebuilt which is the relationship between companies between the industry and the government. the government we hear over and over and the fbi saying cooperate with us. you can only fight cybercrime and cybercybersurveillance that if we w

indiscriminately spying on massive amounts of people to say i don't know what airport that was in to get the metadatan we had an exercise in the commissioner said those laws were broken. suicide becomes a quintile that csec is buying on canadians because they are forbidden by law. so can we anticipate that kind of revolution? >> i was telling you that we need your own canadian edwards noted that despite that to take the documents that you are eager to you looked at to make them public through a journalist or another way. i hope that happens. >> if you're out there canadian headword is noted reach us at our e-mail. [laughter] so i do think is that he will inspire other people to be partner countries to come forward. i've learned a lesson and a long time ago i will not preview what we're doing because then if i pre-be reporting to say yes the have these documents from the time i get back until the day i die i will be get e-mail saying where are these documents? you want to make sure what you are reporting is truce flyweight for the reporting to happen but there is as juneau's stories and though works o

of some of the surveillance that was occurring on american citizens and i think that the verizon metadata showed all of the verizon customers have the core records and i think that was very surprising to people and that is the very first one that came out but were scandalized and justifiably so. i feel that it was poorly understood in the ability to spy on the u.s. soil and i also think that the present resolution and the involvement of silicon valley with the state intelligence apparatus is something -- one of the reason this could be surprising piece of writing to someone like me that's been in the industry for such a long time. one of the key points of >> one of the key points of tension is the relationship between companies, between industries and the government cooperate with us. we can only fight the crime if we work together. >> this is a difficult double-edged sword. i think that there are instances that are paid with taxpayer dollars. they are paid online and that sort of thing and worry about spying and so forth. what is noticed as an economic impact. i used to work for google a

i mean, how many times i know michael mentioned that we are overusing this motion of metadata, it is meaningful when you see some encrypted data is being accessed a little bit more than the other. one could discern and learn things about it. once we start learning how to deal with this system, then we could maintain encryption and maintain stronger encryption and also deal with the cases where we don't have access to clear. i think our law enforcement and our government and i think our legal system, i think us as a society are in the process of learning how to deal with this new world where things that we knew in the past no longer apply. lastly, the new generation have figured it out. i think they're doing a lot better. they're figuring out that you cannot expect everything is going to be fully protected for you. they're figuring out ways to live in the world where they're posting a lot of of things on the facebook that -- us probably won't do. they're trying to learn how to deal with a system that you may not have the capabilities of asserting your privacy the way that our generati

i mean, how many times i know michael mentioned that we are overusing this motion of metadata, it is meaningful when you see some encrypted data is being accessed a little bit more than the other. one could discern and learn things about it. once we start learning how to deal with this system, then we could maintain encryption and maintain stronger encryption and also deal with the cases where we don't have access to clear. i think our law enforcement and our government and i think our legal system, i think us as a society are in the process of learning how to deal with this new world where things that we knew in the past no longer apply. lastly, the new generation have figured it out. i think they're doing a lot better. they're figuring out that you cannot expect everything is going to be fully protected for you. they're figuring out ways to live in the world where they're posting a lot of of things on the facebook that -- us probably won't do. they're trying to learn how to deal with a system that you may not have the capabilities of asserting your privacy the way that our generati

here we have a situation people could say i do know what airport that was then another with metadatathen one was just an exercise said the commissioner says nothing was -- no laws were broken so makes it, and denial because they're forbidden by law to do so so is there anything you can tell us? >> i would tell you that you did the canadian edwards noted and to take the documents to look at your journalist or another way. so if you grab their canadian edwards noted now the journalists could cover us. [laughter] thirty mail.com. [laughter] but i actually do think one of the most consequential aspects is they will spy on other people and a partner countries as well. i learned a lesson i will not preview the reporting we're doing because i believe you reporting live have documents that show xyz by the time i get back to my hotel room and tell the day i die i would get emails that say where are these documents? plus you want to make sure what you are reported hot -- reporting is true that as you know, there will be reported in good times even if you are such duchies you have been saying t

this was the law that would end bulk collection of americans' metadata, highly personal information aboutho they call, when they call, where they call, who they e-mail, when the e-mail, what websites they search. this was an opportunity to make real change. was it perfect? no. but i don't think congress ever comes up with perfect answers. this would have been a major positive first step to push this legislation forward and end the surveillance state. host: susan, you are next, florida, republican caller. rememberf you yo timothy mcveigh, we had a homegrown terrorist who attacked our own citizens and killed many innocent people. i do not know if this would have stopped it or prevented it. figured just of from what i gleaned in the world that there were always people that were, you know -- because of the way i have seen some of these court cases come out, how the heck did they get to the end, and it was not just through informants, if they were not already tapping phones and doing what they wanted to do anyway? guest: i think the caller makes a very good point. i do not think these programs

american people in the absence of legislation would address the concerns over the collection of metadata and concerns about privacy that despite the failure of the congress to pass legislation but you may be doing differently that would ensure their privacy is protected? q-quebec what we are doing differently as you heard in the remarks on the 17th of january he said while i haven't seen them violating the law were attempting to undermine the rights of the privacy of the citizens i am concerned about the potential therefore am going to overlay a couple different requirements, so for example on the metadata i want you to know go to the court as the director so to speak and go to the fisa court. we didn't use to have used to have to do that. he also directed we used to be able when we went into those incidences in the data we used to do three hops. the prison and came back and said i told you what i want to put another level of protection i only want you to do to hops. so we are not authorized now to follow as we used to be able to do. those are probably the biggest changes that we've deal

there's an argument about whether metadata which is the sensitive data which is where your enough camefrom and when it came into came from is covered by the fourth amendment of the constitution. if you wrote that data into datebook it would be covered by the constitution. the notion exist in electronic passports were some lawyers that it's not. i think that's nonsense. i think we overreach. i think this fear drove us to overreaching. we alienated our allies but the thing that's most important to deliver home as a message is this is the early days. this is the early days. every country in the world is going to look at the internet and say we can conduct offensive operations, we have to have new defenses, that there are new threats out there. just a couple of weeks ago we passed a big water mark in history of the world. that are now more cell phones than there are people. in other words, every human being on the planet is connected in a man-made system for the first time in history of the planet. it creates vast data flows that becomes mobile to this kind of attacks, either by criminals