and no one heard of osama bin laden until really the world trade center. but about a year, a year and a half before the world trade center, before the book came out i was talking about osama bin laden, you have to kill him, you have to take him out. nobody listened to me. and to this day, i get people coming up to me and they said you know what, one of the most amazing things i've seen about you is that you predicted that osama bin laden had to be killed before he knocked down the world trade center. it's true. most of the press doesn't want

osama bin laden was very big, but osama bin laden became big with the world trade center.is is a man who built a whole, as he would like to call it, a country, a caliphate, and was trying to do it again. >> director, the white house also took a photo of president trump following developments of the raid, okay, just as a photo shows barack obama watching osama bin laden's raid, a photo that you're in. what's your reaction to the killing of al baghdadi and to the president's handling of it? >> well, first, i mean, it is a good thing. it's a great accomplishment, and it's another testament to the professionalism of our special operations forces, and i'm proud to say the absolutely crucial contributions i'm sure intelligence made to this. so from that standpoint, great accomplishment. i really sort of loathe to get into the chest-beating about which terrorist we took down was the bigger. >> right. >> but i would have to argue that i believe osama bin laden had much more impact simply because isis was not responsible for the deaths of thousands of people in this country, which

osama bin laden was very big, but osama bin laden became big with the world trade center. this is a man who built a whole, as he would like to call it, a country. >> a bigger deal than the killing of osama bin laden who was the mastermind behind killing thousands and thousands of people. and that's not to discount the lives lost at the hands of abu bakr al baghdadi and all of the terror that he wreaked as the controller of isis. but still, pretty astounding to hear that from the president of the united states saying this is a bigger deal than the killing of osama bin laden. >> it also fits with the way we've seen president trump portray his policy and military victories as he perceives them over the last three years he's been in office. so much of what his administration has done has been to undo, unravel what president obama had done. while the former president is obviously no longer in office, in some ways he's still the shadow hanging over the west wing because president trump wants his legacy to be, in his view, the president who is better than barack obama. that, i th

of bin laden was a big thing but this is the biggest there is this is the worst ever osama bin laden was very big but osama bin laden became big with the world trade center this is a man who built a whole. as he would like to call it a country a caliphate. and was trying to do it again and i had not heard too much about his health i've heard stories about he may not have been in good health but he died a he died in a ruthless vicious manner that i can tell you. yes we have people that were taken we have many of the people died on the site but we have people who were taken us and the children we are we left them under care of somebody that week. understand you believe in 11 children 11 children how many adults. i'd rather not say i'd leave that to the generals but it's a small group. more dead than alive. involved with which special operations teams were involved. many of them and at the top level and people that were truly incredible at their craft i've never seen anything like it. it's 1st partnerships curves where there are any other forces involved where there's only american know

osama bin laden was big but osama bin laden became big with the world trade center. this is a man who built a whole, as he would like to call it, a country. >> president trump there taking a victory lap this morning with the announcement that the leader of isis is now dead. joining me now is phillip reince, co-host of podcast unretracted and susan del percio, an nbc analyst. what were your takeaways from the president's remarks and what's your reaction to all of these developments? >> he should have stopped after he read the teleprompter comments and addressed the nation and left it at that. once he started taking questions, it was a complete disaster. i think when he has to prove himself and compare himself to others, it belittles the men and women who put their lives on the line. i think the fact that he said i could not trust the speaker of the house with notifying her is a bad day for america as well as the world is a safer place because of the actions of this country. the president, once again, hurt our nation by dividing us further. >> i'm curious, your thought

osama bin laden was very big but osama bin laden became big with the world trade center. this is a man who built a whole, as he would like to call it, a country, a caliphate, and was trying to do it again. i have not heard too much about his health. i heard stories about maybe he may not have been in good health. he died in a ruthless, vicious manner. that i can tell you. >> were there any adults taken? pres. trump: yes, we have people that were taken. many of the people died on the site, but we had adults taken. the children, we left them under the care of somebody that we understand. 11 children. >> 11 children, how many adults? pres. trump: i would rather not say. i will leave that to the generals. a small group. more dead than alive. >> which special operations teams were involved? pres. trump: many of them. and at the top level. people who were truly incredible at their craft. i've never seen anything like it. >> as far as partnerships, were there any other forces or was this only american troops? pres. trump: only american forces. only american forces. but we were g

gillian: why do you think the comparison of osama bin laden is relevant? >> you and a lot of folks, the instinct to go back to that operation, you know, why sort of strategically is that -- >> the killing of osama bin laden was retribution and this was strategic. president trump when he came to office he brought senior officials together, senior national officials together and said, we are going to do whatever it takes to kill al-baghdadi and this was the culmination last night in president trump achieving key victory, a big moment for his administration, big moment for our country and big moment for our national security. gillian: were you disappointed that the president didn't brief more of your colleagues, not even necessarily during the runup but in the immediate after math? >> i don't blame the president one single bit, that's the disappointment of the impeachment, ridiculousness of the impeachment and i know that the president did reach out to senate burr and brief others in congress, the statute from 1947 is very vague on who the intelligence commit

that's how osama bin laden ended up hiding as well, but he wasn't regarded like osama bin laden. >> reporter: no, in fact, natalie, when we spent two months in eastern syria for that final battle against the so-called fiscphysical caliphate spoke with dozens of isis fighters who had been captured. we spoke with isis women, the wives of those fighters, their children, and very few actually even mentioned the name of abu bakr al baghdadi. their affiliation, their loyalty was to what they said "the islamic state." abu bakr al baghdadi appeared just once in public in 2014 in that mosque in mosul, and after that he was largely absent. he was not for instance like osama bin laden whose fame goes back to the 1980s when he led the so-called area knmujahideen. abu bakr al baghdadi was largely unknown in iraq itself, his native land. when he appeared in that mosque in 2014, in mosul, many people had no idea who he was. and so there's sort of a large difference here in the sense that in the western media, particularly the american media, we tend to focus on leaders. but, if you go back and look at the

they took a body blow with the death of osama bin laden. a death, frankly, is storied by hollywood movies now because of the complexity and the daring of that operation. that was a definetive point in the decline of al qaeda. it certainly be a pivotal moment. you see the caliphate to iraq. that had his own way to gain revenue. one told me they had seen physical things, exported to raqqah. it was a basis of operations to some degree. and using the syrian kurds who fight along to kick isis out of that territory, reducing the towns they had taken over to rubble in that fight. they were squeezed back to a tiny river of syria. in the early parts of this year. that particular bloody final defeat anything they could call their own in terms of territory. they still existed in people's hearts or souls who sympathize with them. they have children and wives in if shelters. people were wondering what that might have been. they may be able to regroup. now, if that manages to happen, instead because of the decision, they will do that without their leader

osama bin laden was very big. but osama bin laden became big with the world trade center. this is a man who built a whole -- as we should like to call it -- a country, a caliphate. he was trying to do it again. >> you might recall this 2012 tweet from donald trump after bin laden's death. stop congratulating obama for killing bin laden. the navy s.e.a.l.s killed bin laden. >>> it's not slowing the pace of house democrats' impeachment probe. the testimony set from a half-dozen national security and state department officials. much of the intrigue hovering over whether today's witness will even show up. >> charles cupperman was the national security adviser for john bolton. he listened in on the july call where president trump wanted ukraine to investigate joe biden. the democrats are standing by the subpoena requiring cup kuppn to testify. zach wolf in washington. >> what is a former white house official supposed to do? the new chapter in the ongoing standoff in the trump administration, and democrats in the house went to a third branch of government on friday. kupperman la

and i'm saying to people, take out osama bin laden. that nobody ever heard of. nobody ever heard of. i mean al baghdadi everybody hears because he has built this monster for a long time. but nobody ever heard of osama bin laden. until really the world trade center. but about a year, you will have to check it, a year, a year and a half before the world trade center, the book came out. i was talking about osama bin laden. i said you have to kill him, you have to take him out. nobody listened to me. and to this day, i get people coming up to me, they said you know what, one of the most amazing things i've ever seen about you. is that you predicted that osama bin laden had to be killed before he knocked down the world trade center. it's true. i made a prediction. and let's put it this way, if they would have listened to me, a lot of things would have been different. >> of course, bin laden was not unknown before the 9/11 attacks and quite well known, especially within the intelligence and military communities, in fact, he was widely responsible for the 1998 bombings

i was talking about osama bin laden. i said you have to kill him, take him out.istened to me. today people came up to me and say you know one of the most amazing things i've ever known about you is you osama bin laden had to be killed before he knocked down the world trade center. it's true. >> cnn reporter daniel dale is now with me. let's start there. he did mention him in his book. >> it was not a prediction of anything and it was not a declaration he be killed. what's in the book is a passing reference in bin laden. trump said "one day we're told a shadowy figure with no name, address, osama bin laden, is public enemy number one and a few cycles later it's on to a new enemy and new crisis." that was it. trump did say he expected a major terrorist attack to hit the u.s. but he did not tie this to bin laden nor al qaeda and so this is all nonsense. >> you're noticing the president's nair 'tirratives ar becoming more and more public all the time. >> i had ranchers, farmers and home builders behind me and these are tough people. they were strong, tough men and wo

he was no osama bin laden.ut of course, as ben was just saying, people that follow isis will continue to do so even without him. but what is the significance that finally special operations were able to catch up with him apparently? >> i think ultimately of course he's the only person who served as a figurehead here. so when we are looking at him as a human being, he was seen by his followers as having a religious tphepgz and practical leadership dimensions, except he didn't come to the forefront that much. he was a little bit of a ghost. he may have, to some extent, undersold himself. to some followers he had a high and lofty almost religious stature. to other people he wasn't that present. meaning that the concept of the state that he built was almost stronger than his personality. his loss will be a big blow, but it is not going to be a bigelow. there's still a lot of banter back and forth on the internet in countries. it does mean they are losing clearly a rallying point. and intel analysts will be asking h

i was talking about osama bin laden. i said you have to kill him. you have to take him out.obody listened to me, and to this day i get people coming up to me, they say you know what one of the most amazing things i've ever seen about you is that you predicted that osama bin laden had to be killed before he knocked down the world trade center. it's true. i made a prediction and let's put it this way. if they would have listened to me, a lot of things would have been different. >> of course bin laden was not unknown before the 9/11 attacks but indeed quite well-known as a global terrorist, especially within the intelligence and kmil te military communities. as the a.p. noted when trump first made similar claims about bin laden. trump's book did not foreshadow a bin laden attack. that was incorrect. they wrote in part, quote there was nothing original or clairvoyant in the reference to bin laden. nor did it call for further u.s. actions against bin laden or al qaeda. >> almost did not happen due to one of his most widely criticized foreign policy decisions. multiple military an

osama bin laden was very big, but he became big with the world trade center. this is a man who built a whole, as he would like to call it, a country, a caliphate. .nd was trying to do it again i had not heard too much about his health. i had heard stories that he may not be -- had not been in good health. but he died in a ruthless, vicious manner. that i can tell you. >> [inaudible] >> yes, many of the people died on the site, but many were taken. the children, we left them under care of somebody that we understand. 11 children. >> how many adults? i would rather not say, i will leave that to the generals. a small group. more dead than alive. >> which special operations teams were involved? >> many of them. and at the top level. people that were truly incredible at their craft. i have never seen anything like it. go,s far as partnerships were there any other partnerships involved? >> only american forces. only american forces, but we were given great cooperation. we told the russians that we were coming in. we had to go over there. they were curious. but, but,

osama bin laden was very big. became big with the world trade center in fact checkers called out some of his comparisons the associated press saying a number of trump statements were simply not true nobody ever heard of till really the world trade center when in fact the central intelligence agency operated a dedicated unit to tracking bin laden which went back to the mid 1990 s. and he'd been on the f.b.i. most wanted list for years trump went on to say about a year you have to check out a year year and a half before the world trade center came here the book came out i was talking about osama bin laden i said you have to kill him you have to take him out nobody listen to me and. to this day i get people coming up to me they said you know what one of the most amazing things i've ever seen about you is that you predicted that osama bin laden had to be killed before he knocked down the world trade center it's true in one of his books released in 2000 trump mentions osama bin laden once as one of many threats to u.s.

that book about a year before the world trade center was blown up, i said there is somebody named osama bin laden. you better kill him or take him out. something to that effect. he's big trouble. now, i wasn't in government. i was building buildings and doing what i did but i always found it fascinating, but i saw this man, tall, handsome, very charasmatic, making horrible statements about wanting to destroy our country and i'm writing a book. i think that i wrote 12 books, all did very well, and i'm writing a book, world world world trade center had not come down and maybe it was about a year before the world trade center came down and i'm saying to people, take out osama bin laden that nobody ever heard of. i mean, al-baghdadi everybody hears because he's built this monster for a long time, but nobody ever heard of osama bin laden until really the world trade center, but about a year, you'll have to check it, year, year and a half before the world trade center came down the book came out i was talking about osama bin laden and i said you have to kill him and take him out. nobody liste

so osama osama bin laden, before he was killed in 2011, said — his advice to jihadists in the syria own, maybe years ahead. but now is not the time because you present a target to your enemies." and sure enough, that is exactly what happened. al—baghdadi overreached himself, making two big fundamental errors. they advanced eastwards towards the kurdish capital, where there's a lot of oil and us interests. so they enslaved the yazidis, horrifying the whole world, and they beheaded western aid workers and journalists in those horrific snuff videos. and that basically led to a five—year military campaign that saw the end of their caliphate. let's speak now to dr karin von hippel who is director—general of the royal united services institute, an independent think tank on international defence and security. she served in the us department of state as a senior adviser in the bureau of counterterrorism. and we can also speak to christine wormuth in washington. christine is director of the international security and defence policy centre at us think—tank rand. she was under—secretary of defence

osama bin laden was big, but osama bin laden became big with the world trade center. this is a man who built a whole -- as he would like to call it, a country, a caliphate, and was trying to do it again. >> i want to bring in cnn national security analyst james clapper with us. he served as leader of intelligence under president obama. he was in charge of the raid that killed osama bin laden. what do you think of the comparison the president makes comparing it to baghdadi? >> i wouldn't agree with that. there were 3,000 people killed in the united states, and it was more than the world trade center. i would think taking down osama bin laden had a lot more meaning than this. >> do you think that it's a point that should even be entertained in being made by the president? >> i think from his standpoint, it is a big deal and it is a major accomplishment, no question about it, and as usual, great professionalism with the special operations forces and intelligence community kind of shown through here. but in terms of racking and stacking here, i think the osama bin laden t

osama bin laden became big with the world trade center. this was a man who built a whole, as he would like to call it, a country, a caliphate, and was trying to do it again. and, uh, i had not heard too much about his health. i've heard stories about he may not have been good health. he died in a ruthless, vicious manner, that i can tell you. [ inaudible question ] yes, we have people that were taken. we have -- many of the people died on the site. but we have people who were taken, yes. and the children, we are -- we left them under care of somebody that we understand. 11 children. >> reporter: 11 children, how many adults? >> i would rather not say. i'll leave that to the generals. a small group. more dead than alive. >> reporter: which special operations teams were involved? >> many of them. and at the top level. and people that were truly incredible at their craft. i've never seen anything like it. >> reporter: as far as partnerships goes, were there any other forces involved or only american troops? >> only american forces. only ameri

he said, quote, osama bin laden was very big but osama bin laden became big with the world trade center. this is a man who built a whole, as he would like to call it, a whole country, a caliphate, and was trying to do it again. yesterday the president said another president should have gotten bagdadi years ago. is yo comments, suggesting that this is a bigger deal tha and suggesting that this is something you and president obama left to him to do? >> oh, my god, this man is amazing. look, bagdadi was a bad man, no redeeming value. he killed a lot innocent people. and he's responsible for more killing. to compare one to the other -- the things i compare are the incredible special forces we have and the risks they take and their incredible capacity. these -- the thing i do know, andrea, whether it's baghdadi or bin laden, it takes months and months of detailed planning. and the idea in the reports that are coming out now that in light of the fact that this was going on, that they were getting ready to move against baghdadi and the president of the united states precipitously withdraws tro

it's that raid on osama bin laden and the collective relief around the globe that osama bin laden haded. for donald trump this would be quite a foreign policy moment, an epic one quite frankly, if this turns out to be true. >> oh, yes. absolutely. and just like at the time president obama, at the time of the osama bin laden raid, president obama did reap a lot of benefits from that in a political sense, and i think it probably helped assure his re-election, the other thing that donald trump has to look forward to is certainly a bounce in that sense in terms of his foreign policy credentials or chops in this case. of course the people that really did the work are the intelligence agencies and the military raiders that actually performed this mission. so that's -- it was good on him if this turns out to be correct that he directed this raid and that it was successful. it certainly beats any type of unsuccessful situation which we've had in the past such as the raid to try to free the iran hostages way back in 1980. and those are the kinds of things that can make or break a u.s. presiden

and no one heard of osama bin laden until really the world trade center. but about a year, a year and a half before the world trade center, before the book came out i was talking about osama bin laden, you have to kill him, you have to take him out. nobody listened to me. and to this day i get people coming up to me and they said you know what, one of the most amazing things i've seen about you is that you predicted that osama bin laden had to be killed before he knocked down the world trade center. it's true. most of the press doesn't want to write that but it is true. if you go back and look at my book, i think it's "the america we deserve." i made a prediction -- let's put it this way, if they would have listened to me, a lot of things would have been different. reporter: can you talk about some of the difficult decisions you had along the way here in this operation, anything that weighed on you or that you had to -- president trump: just death. i'm sending a large number of brilliant fighters. these are the greatest fighters in the world. i'd rather le

this announcement he repeatedly underscored that he believed this was even bigger than the killing of osama bin laden under his predecessor barack obama highlighting in his view that this was a leader who had overseen its height norma's caliphates and that he felt this was prominence he wanted to inject this into the headlines we should point out the timing of this coming the very important closely watched sunday chat shows here in the united states the u.s. president dominating much of that time and obliterating their news rundowns in order to get his message into the news cycle kimberly he also did kind of broaden it out to what his his policy is and syria and in turkey he was pushed on that how would you characterize how he what he had to say about that. there's no question this is a president who is trying to counter criticism this is a president who is trying to make the argument look at despite the criticism of my syria strategy despite the fact that it didn't turn out exactly like i said it would it's not a withdrawal it's a repositioning of troops he's saying that this is working th

osama bin laden was very big. but osama bin laden became big with the world trade center. this is a man who built a whole as he would like to call it a country. >> big with the world trade center. isis hadn't executed anything on 9/11 on the u.s. soil. a question of personal credit. repeating ababsurd riff in a written book. >> one of the most amazing things i have seen about you that you predicted that osama bin laden had to be killed before he knocked down the world trade center. it's true. if you go back, look at the book. >> we did. it's not in the book. president deserves credit for decisions they make. but of course the real credit belongs to the troops that directed the raid. the intelligence community and military leaders who have been working on this for years. when harry truman announced the death of hitler, he did it in a western understated manner. president lincoln, near the front lines at the end of the war and after the surrender at the appotomax. he said, no part of the honor plan or execution is mine, to general grant, a skillful officers and brave men all

terror like a scene reminiscent of the raid ordered by us president barack obama an al qaeda leader osama bin laden in 2011 truck watched the mission from the situation room of the white house he was surrounded by the u.s. vice president defense secretary national security adviser and the u.s. military's joint chiefs of staff president trunk claims the death of isolator al big daddy is even more significant than president obama's killing of the leader osama bin laden it's a headline trunks likely to play up as he campaigns for reelection 2020 kimberlee help hit al jazeera the white house. joins us live from turkey syria border. do we have a successor yet. well peter that's the $1000000.00 question that everybody's asking about this radical group that now that the head has been severed from its organization who is going to replace it there are several names under consideration including who was announced in august by the propaganda wing of eisel but again we don't know yet of how much of the inner circle the shura remains if still alive whether there is any infighting and if there is going

to amy's point about osama bin laden, that happened in april of 2011.esident obama saw a pretty significant bump in his approval rating, about five points. by the time june rolled around -- so it was late april, may. by theol time juned around, his approval was back where it was before the bin laden raid. in oth words, this polarization we had today was just as significant and011. even what we think of game changing events, the assassn of osama bin laden, even that did little to move public opinion for long. majudy: ihave a temporary effect. and the timing of it is interestg, because it is asth house of representatives continues the impeachment inquiry. they have announced they will take a vote this week on thursday. i interviewed vice president mike pence, you heard him, say that the american people don't care about this, they want the congress and the president to focus on what matters for the american people. does he have a point? >> this move by house democrats is the next phase in the part of what they will be voting on is public hearings, having p

it was obvious he was trying to outdo barack obama, who got rid of osama bin laden.s this a comparable achievement? did refer to that raid .n 2011 because trump always has to be better, he claimed al-baghdadi was the bigger catch and said because he built a whole onlyhate where bin laden became big because of the world trade center. the fact is isis never mounted an attack anything like 9/11 on u.s. soil. isis is a different organization. it decentralized. it inspires individuals to commit attacks around the world and it then takes credit for those attacks. it is very different from directing a complex plot out of afghanistan, as was the case in 2000, 2001. did not have the global residence or name reckitt onance andres recognition as osama bin laden. trump agreed to the term pershing --- agree to the turkih offensive, meaning some isis fighters have escaped and regrouped. that could mean more terrorist attacks in the future. you can see how trump is using the killing of baghdadi, it is obvious from this statement. somber in the beginning and it veered into this camp

you wrote today al baghdadi's death might be more signtnifi than osama bin laden's death. is that? >> i do think soc beause, when -- you know, by the time n laden was killed in 2011, he had already en far remed from the day-to-day reality of al quaida. he wasn't as relevant as baghdadi before he was killed. baghdadi was commanding an organization that was determined to return an vive its savage caliphate, and he was pretty much on thground, meeting his lieutenants. and he was basically hands-on. so the impact of his killing could be far more -- more far reaching than the killing of osama bin laden in 2011 which happened a decade after 9/11. >> reporter: mike, bagadi not only ran i.s.i.s. inside iraq and syria but i.s.i.s. became synonymous with global rrorism. does the risk of global terrorism change at all now that baghdadi is dead? >> i thie it may b in the short term. i think hassan makes an excellent point that baggedy unlike osama bin laden in 2011 iseeply -- was tied deeply to s.i.s. operational plnning. so there will be a hiccup there. but i don't think the threat o

osama bin laden was very big, but osama bin laden became big with the world trade center.he man who built the whole, as he would like to call it, a country, a caliphate, and was trying to do it again. >> trevor: what are you doing? ( laughter ) you don't stro pretend this guy is a bigger get than bin laden. first of all, it's childish. secondly, he's not. it's not going to change the entire world forever. it's 18 years after 9/11 and i still can't take four ounces of owns on to an airplane. i go on vacation and my skin is dry as (~bleep ). that's how bad a terrorist bin laden was. all these guys are bad. you don't have to weigh them out! but once again, trump has managed to turn a nonpartisan victory into a political fight -- who deserves more credit, trump or obama? do presidents even deserve credit for military victories? the whole conversation is ridiculous because we know who really made this thing happen, it was that k-9. ( cheers and applause ) or, as i call it, a dog. ( laughter ) that dog deserves the highest honor america has to offer, which is its own movie. so w

be guaranteed that most iraqis are simply saying good riddance to their fellow iraki just as with osamabin laden and al qaeda the death of baghdad he does not necessarily mean a dissolution of eisel although of course it is in a weakened state there believed to be eisel sleeper cells across iraq they have been launching attacks i spoke to the top general of the u.s. led coalition to defeat eisel here in baghdad over the summer and he says that eisel has done a very good job of adapting and becoming a nimble insurgency that he says is resurging here in iraq and syria he says the fight against isis is far from over we've been speaking to some analysts today who say this will certainly be a big blow to the group and their followers from a morale standpoint here in iraq the iraqi government is highlighting its historic intelligence gathering and cooperation with the u.s. military the government here is in a fight for survival in october there have been anti-government protests across the country one analyst says though that the government will try to portray baghdad his death as a big victo

this is bigger than osama bin laden, according to the president. >> reporter: the difference betweenama bin laden and abu bakr baghdadi ran a country, what was essentially a country, iraq and syria. it was the size of great britain and ruled more than 12 million people. that state was created very quickly. this was a man who really knew how to run a terrorist organization and turn it into, albeit, a very briefly lived terrorist state. and for him to be eliminated, certainly it does represent an important milestone in the fight against isis. however, even the pentagon's inspector general in august came out with a report that said that between syria and iraq, there are between 14,000 and 18,000 isis fighters still on the loose. isis still operates through affiliates in west africa, in libya, in egypt sinai peninsula, in afghanistan, in the philippines. it has sleeper cells in europe that have carried out a variety of mass murders, terrorist attacks. yes, it's an important milestone, but nobody is under the impression certainly in this part of the world that isis is history. isis is dim

be guaranteed that most iraqis are simply saying good riddance to their fellow iraki just as with osama bin laden and al qaeda the death of baghdad he does not necessarily mean a dissolution of eisel although of course it is in a weakened state there believed to be eisel sleeper cells across iraq they have been launching attacks i spoke to the top general of the u.s. led coalition to defeat eisel here in baghdad over the summer and he says that eisel has done a very good job of adapting and becoming a symbol insurgency that he says is resurging here in iraq and syria he says the fight against eisel is far from over we've been speaking to some analysts today who say this will certainly be a big blow to the group and their followers from a morale standpoint here in iraq the iraqi government is highlighting its historic intelligence gathering and cooperation with the u.s. military the government here is in a fight for survival in october there have been anti-government protests across the country one analyst says though that the government will try to portray baghdad as death as a big vict

osama bin laden was a bigger target and more well-known target. i would not expect a long-term .oost shery: what does this mean for islamic states now? --ros: its a setback is a setback for the jihadist group. of ainly in terms territorial threat, they are much smaller than they were a death of ago but the this leader could see retaliatory attacks. it could be a fresh motivator for people. the leader is dead but the ideology lives on. there are multiple attacks around the world. seems like there is a core of supporters who are more than turned off. are there any implications of impeachment inquiry -- for the impeachment inquiry? ros: i think this is a different land. -- lane. historically, it does not matter how well the economy is doing, it does not matter what other foreign policy moves are being made, once the is going on,rocess that is secondary. we have heard from democrats and adam schiff, the representative from california. there is no slowdown there. he has a very tight timeline he wants to adhere to. he basically said there could be publi

osama bin laden was very big, but osama bin laden became big with the world trade center.uilt a whole, as he would like to call it, country, a caliphate zp. >> the imagery was also similar, with president trump surrounded by generals. it seems to mirror president barack obama's. walking to the podium in the middle of the night to inform the nation that the master mind hiepd the 9/11 attack was dead. stark difference to sunday morning announcement and extended news conference and shows the white house may have an uphill climb as the president tries to convince the american public that this moment is, in fact, bigger than bin laden. joining me now from stanford, brett mcguirk, presidential envoy for the global coalition to defeat isis in an nbc news senior foreign affairs analyst. i want to start with you giving us context here. how important was al baghdadi to isis' overall operations? >> thanks for having me. bottom line, it's a landmark day for so many that made this happen. and i've worked very closely and put on a lot of hours and days and weeks out in iraq and syria, w

that's how it happened with swra carry and osama bin laden. they had high confidence going in the target with a whole lot of information. he blessed the mission, as all commander in chiefs do. but this has been percolating for days, weeks, or even months. . >> who makes the final call of timing? like we go tonight? we don't go? >> that's in cooperation between the commander on the scene, probably jsoc commander saying we have good intelligence that al baghdadi is at this location. joani, the hts commander, his enemy, an al qaeda operative may have been on the scene. early indicators were quite a few people were struck in the raid. the final go is from the commander in chief but comes from the commander on the ground saying we have high intelligence on this. we can strike without extreme danger to our troops. >> do you think turkey was involved in any way with this? >> good question, martin. what i'm concerned about, was turkey involved in the operation passing intelligence, or were turkish forces involved in the hiding of al baghdadi for sever

said on tv earlier today when he was asked what the protocol essentially would be, would it follow osama bin laden, who of course his dead body was put aboard a u.s. navy ship and that body was put into the sea in an undisclosed spot. the national security advisor said he expected the protocol would follow the same for baghdadi. i talked to another u.s. official who said that was the current word, that he would perhaps maybe most likely be buried at sea, so to speak. no confirmation by the administration yet. obviously they don't want to announce anything perhaps just yet about all of that. >> joining us now cnn military and diplomatic analyst and former pentagon press secretary retired rear admiral john kirby. admiral, the president said today that they had already identified baghdadi's successors. is his death more symbolic or is this a real turning point? >> it's more than symbolic. it's a significant blow to isis. he was a very active leader. he was actively controlling operations. there will be now several of these other leaders vying for power. one key thing for the u.s. particular

a lot of americans will equate this to the death of osama bin laden and al qaeda. they are not the same here, are they? >> reporter: no. bm osama bin laden was a well-known figure to the 1980s when he led the so-called group in the fight against afghanistan. he remained a prominent public figure. from back then to his death. baghdadi was a much more secretive person who had a very low public profile. he never really had the sort of personality that osama bin laden actually encouraged. and when earlier this year, we were in eastern syria for two months, we interviewed dozens of captured fighters, isis wives and their children, and very few of them had much to say about abu bakr al baghdadi, himself. their loyalty was to the islamic state rather than to the person who was actually leading it. >> which could be troubling in the days and weeks to come. ben wedeman, thank you very much. >>> other breaking news. overnight we know two people are dead and 14 have been treated for gunshot wounds after a shooting in greenville, texas. we are live on that scene for you next.

osama bin laden was very big, but osama bin laden became big with the world trade center.lt a whole -- as he would like to call it a country, a caliphate, and was trying to do it again. and i had not heard too much about his health. i've heard stories about he may not have been in good health. but he died -- he died in a ruthless, vicious manner. that i can tell you. >> were any adults taken -- >> yes, we have people that were taken. we have -- many of the people died on the site, but we have people that were taken. and the children, we are -- we left them under care of somebody that we understand. >> how many? >> 11 children. >> 11 children? how many adults. >> i'd rather not say. i'd leave that to the generals. but a small group. more dead than alive. >> which special operations teams were involved? >> many of them. and at the top level. and people that were truly incredible at their craft. i've never seen anything like it. >> as far as partnerships go, were there any other forces involved? or was this only american troops? >> no, only american forces. only american forc

to, one, the president saying that obama should have gotten baghdadi and, two, saying that osama bing of a deal until the world trade center happened? >> well, i don't quite know how to react to that, katie. of course, getting baghdadi was a priority for the obama administration and working in partnership with the iraqi forces and at a later stage in cooperation with the syrian kurds. take us into the current phase of the fighting in iraq and syria, it was always a priority. but tracking down these terrorist leaders is a metropolit meticulous, challenging bit of work. it takes a long time. and often once you come across a key piece of intelligence it seems to happen quickly. that seems to be what triggered the onset of this investigation months ago. i wouldn't necessarily think of it as legitimate criticism that we weren't going after abu bakr al baghdadi because of course we were. >> let me ask you this other question. the president was very forthcoming in describing how he said baghdadi died. he said he didn't die a hero. he died a coward. he was crying, whimpering and screaming an

. >> i think from a standpoint of symbolism and importance to the country, taking down osama bin laden had a lot more meaning than this. >> can we at least agree that the world is a better place without this guy in it? >> who? trump or baghdadi? [laughter] >> sean: as i said before, i'll say it again. president trump in this atmosphere, cured cancer, those on the left, in the media mob, the democrats would find a way to want to impeach him for curing cancer. if he gave a million dollars to every american they would demand his impeachment for that. why didn't he give $5 million? this is a psychotic rage and this it is for every democrat you have to suspend all intellectual honesty, all connection to objective truth, reason and god-given common sense to have this sick, psychotic rage. the democrats furious that pelosi and schiff were not notified in advance of the raid. really? the lack of self awareness should be shocking because after all, you have the compromised, corrupt, lying coward adam schiff among the most prolific leaders in washington in the swamp. no other president has had t

specifically alluding to the idea that baghdad's death was bigger than the death of osama bin laden? remember, trump at the time accused president obama of taking too much credit for obama's capture aend death. and last but not least, will this success have any impact on the impeachment investigation? in minutes, we'll answer those questions with my panel of political strategists. republican michael steele and michael star hopkins. but first let me bring in joshua gelzer who is a senior director of counterterrorism at the national security council and is now the founding executive director of the institute for constitutional advocacy and protection. joshua, what does this capture and killing really mean to the average person in america and in the -- in those nations where isis had become a serious problem and threat? >> this is a major counterterrorism achievement. isis built its mythology, its recruitment efforts around laying claim to a so-called caliphate. you can't claim a caliphate without a caliph. baghdadi was that caliph. he was often off screen not heard from, not scene. but

a more important personality in isis which is not true for course because osama bin laden remains you know the most will norton leader of al qaida you know compared to you know. so i think you know these words really matter in this region and then in metaphor for his followers for his for the members the emotions you know be he's a charismatic leader for his followers they follow him they care about him and this could be something that could really incentivize them for fear that action or to take revenge or retaliation in some way and so to photo to try to put things into perspective with what donald trump does and say is really difficult really matter. he was you know betraying the cords just a few days ago with leaving them withdrawing from syria and the day he was thanking them his me and live all in syria russia. was thanking the russians as well you know so the ok something to be expected from him we appreciate your insight good to talk to you as ever thank you thank you well as he was taking questions from the reporters mr trump said he notified russia about the baghdadi raid we