i'm the foreperson of the 2013-2014 civil grand jury. i do want to thank you for a having a special meeting to talk about the grand jury report we put a lot of time into the report i deeply appreciate you've set this aside can i ask do you want to hear from the grand jury separately or am i riektdz to the 3 minutes how do you want to handle the subcontractor with the grand jury members >> i'd be expose to let you as the spokesperson for the grand jury is that what you're asking you want more 3 minutes. >> i can do mine in 3 minutes but i think rob who is the main writer probably going could go longer 3 minutes it depends upon how i want to do that. >> i'd be prepared to let him have more time. >> i'll justify my prospective on the report since i was the foreperson of the whole jury and deeply involved in the aspects. we began to look at our charge is to be the citizens watch dubbing dog of local government we looked at the ethnic and got a complaint and figured out what exactly was going on the thing we found that was probably the most in

in complete confidentiality the whole history of grand juries and the grand juries do thing is much different to attempt to equality the work of the grand jury with the city commission and the way the grand juries operate themselves and back to the code therefore to use that as a justification is a little bit dwrand i don't say and it's not comparing two things because jngz operate with confidentiality so i just move to strike it sentence where the commission knows that the grand jury operates in complete confidentiality it's a comment that says nothing >> anyone on recommendation one? >> no wyoming that would be saying much my comments to the language and number one mr. chair. >> any commissioners have any other proposed amendments other than number one. >> as amended i take you, you move we adapt the response to finding and recommendation number one with the ability to change that sentence. >> yes. >> do i have a second. >> all in favor, say i. >> i. >> i. >> does anyone want to comment on you're taking it out? i thought you were going to ask us to comment on all of one >> go ahead

reports each time each department is looked at by the civil grand jury there are a couple of responses that sort of incity council's occur one the defenseness that automatically takes place their krisz us they're saying we're bad therefore we have to reopened in some way to show they're wrong. i think that that is a totally unproductive way to address something like the civil grand juries effort in my efforts in this situation that's not how i'm going to address it. in regard to some of the comments that were made preliminary related to our proposed draft i agree with the comments the draft itself i'm going to ask it be substantially modified there is in the draft some of the semidoctrine i've talked to be defensive and take on the grand jury about seismic things the grand jury is said that's totally unhelpful i'm sure you'll agree much of your recommendations are things that we can agree and should agree on others we'll have discussions about the manner but for the most part i want to commend all of you for your work it's outstanding. the citizens of san francisco owe you

. >> the finding is that the ethics commission the finding by the grand jury is that the ethics commission lacks the resources to handle the major enforcement cases goes ton to include examples of misconduct. i mr. chair, i would strongly recommend that we not use the language in our response whereas, to that finding number one we say we disagree. and for one thing what we have been saying many times in regard to this commission and this commissions resources and the ability to handle many of the things we want to handle we are hamstrung because of the lack of resources. and in regard to where we respond to this finding it is almost like someone is living in a parallel world rather than addressing something different and what this commission has been saying all along first of all, the grand jury cited no instances where there's is clrtsz where the ethics commission failed to act due to a lack of resources. i think it's eir respect whether the grand jury came up with specifics or onerous burden of proof on their point where we failed to do something we should have done. we generally acknowl

i serve for 2 and a half years as the grand jury presiding judge of the san mateo county civil grand juries 11, 12, 2013 years ago i brought a lot of grand jury reports the first point this is probably as well written the court: well, analyzed as my grand jury committee report and grand jury report as i've ever seen if you haven't read it, it's understandable reading don't be deferred by the length. secondly, i oppose the creation of this commission has history records because there was a day when the city attorney and the district attorney's offices between them policed the ethnical of local pub officials in san francisco. it's not necessary it's an unnecessary commission with a budget over $2 million which could be conserved or transferred to the zake or district attorney's office. the district attorney has speeding called the integrity session that announced two-bit cases during the last fiscal year 2013-2014 but that's the repository of enforcement of laws. secondly, or thirdly, and lastly the essential recommendation of this report is get out of business. transferred to the fair

>> the jury took only 35 minutes to agree on a verdict. >> the jury files back in, whenever a jury comesback, you're looking at every juror trying to look for some hint. and it seems like an eternity, and the heart is racing faster and faster and breathing is becoming increasingly challenging. >> this was the most ago onnizing moment either of us have had in our careers. and the judge that the verdict be read allowed. [ female announcer ] we help make secure financial tomorrows a reality for over 19 million people. [ alex ] transamerica helped provide a lifetime of retirement income. so i can focus on what matters most. [ female announcer ] everyone has a moment when tomorrow becomes real. transamerica. [ female announcer ] everyone has a moment when tomorrow becomes real. it's the trusted resource. and now, kbb.com has a whole new way to help you decide on your next new car by showing you what really matters. use 5-year cost to own to compare the long term cost of maintenance, insurance and gas. read reviews. woman: gas milage is awesome. from actual owners and kelley blue book experts.

the act of the grand jury. in naming the president as an unindicted co-conspirator and i was trying to lay before the court the entire situation that warranted that action. >> mr. jaworski, as i understand your brief you have gone beyond your brief what you've addressed so far. i think you say that the mere fact that the president was named as an unindicted co-conspirator forecloses his claim of privilege. >> we certainly make that as one of the points which i intend to discuss at a later point. >> does that reduce him in and of itself to the status of any other president accused of a crime? >> i don't say it foreclose. it present as situation here that should not make the application of executive privilege appropriate. we do say that. >> without provocation? >> provocation. >> but when you get tissue of balancing interest, we do feel that particular situation is a factor that is important, and this is why we lay stress on it. the court's order, of course, was to deliver the court the originals of all subpoenaed

no matter how this case goes in front of the grand jury. he's tried very hard we can't make it transparent now. here's the problem. you release the physical evidence now, then you don't have a way to check the credibility of witnesses. witnesses start conforming their testimony to what they know the physical evidence is. so as the fbi -- and by the way, fbi is canvassing for witnesses. 40 fbi agents. they're taking a lot of these statements. the fbi is going to look at these statements, check them against the physical evidence, that will give us a lot more information about who is credible and who is not. >> senator mccaskill, as we've watched this unfold, the big question is how can the cycle be broken where some provocateurs, and it seems like a small number each night that this has happened, provoke the police into a response that then outrages many people in the communality who were not part of that provocation group? >> by the way, i think there are only four people arrested in the last few days from ferguson. if the people in the commu

the jury, the grand jury will do what they are directed to do by the prosecuting attorney's office. they will base their decision based on the evidence that he presents to them. so it doesn't matter what color they are. it doesn't matter what gender they are. they're going to have are to make a decision on what bob mcculloch chooses to put in front of them. we can't be distracted about the issue of, well, there is an african-american prosecutor and a white prosecutor that's in front of the grand jury. because they are not going to make a decision. they're not going to refuse to indict or indict based upon what bob mcculloch says. if bob mcculloch tells the prosecutors, "i want an indictment," he'll get one. if he says, "i don't want an indictment," he won't have it. >> sounds like you don't think he'll instruct them to get an indictment if the evidence is there. >> absolutely not. >> what do you think, courtney? do you think the makeup of the jury -- gender and race -- is material? and do you think mcculloch will be, as clearly lizz brown is saying, saying no, i don't are want an in

we'll take a 5 minute break. >> we're back in session regarding the grand jury report. when we took the break were were on finding number 3. commissioners any comments >> yes. mr. chair this is another one i don't understand why we're answering it is way we're answering it i would change to we agree a broad citizens right to enforce those lose will make sure the laws are enforced this is an apple pie motherhood type of statement we disagree that's our answer why do we disagree that with a broader citizens statement that the laws will be enforced any kind of broadening of the power to enforce ethnical aforementioned in our socket to the good whether by a right of action to citizens or anyone we should agree. the recommendation that this can be done by the board of supervisors enacting a particular version that gives the folks the right like a private attorney general action to enforce the award of attorney's fees that's an incentive for citizens to help out in ethnical matters and if the jury has found that is good and that the board of supervisors should be asked to do t

>> members of the jury had he reached a verdict? >> we have. >> very good. will the defense attorney dinesh d'souza please rise and face the jury. >> here we go again. [laughter] >> madam four-person please read your verdict. >> yes we the members of the jury find the defendant not guilty. [applause] >> yeah oh no you did. you are totally undefeated. you are likely floyd mayweather freedom fest. mr. d'souza you and your hot friends have been found not guilty and therefore you are free to go and enjoy at night in the city of las vegas the most insidious entertainment center in the world known as sin city where you are free from the taliban. you may enjoy life, liberty and the pursuit of happiness in its many forms. congratulations. case closed. thank you all very much for attending and thanks to both of our attorneys. >> journey you are excused. [applause] >> yeah sorry, there's a cockroach on here. poet richard blanco spoke at person a promise that cannot duration. at next he talks about his memoir of growing up in miami. from bookexpo america in new york cit

normally the defendant the target of the grand jury does not testify at the grand jury. there. >> thank you for your time. let me bring in john conyers of michigan. one of the three congressman who wrote a letter asking for a hearing on the use of excess of force saying the recent events in ferguson are, quote, deeply troubling. thank you for your time. let me get your reaction to somewhat of a better night, if that's a proper word to use, out of ferguson yesterday. >> congressman conyers, are you able to hear me, sir? >> yes. i do hear you. i think -- >> go ahead. >> i think things are moving along. i've asked the chairman of the house judiciary committee to consider holding hearings not to assess fault or responsibility, but to understand where deep l causes that can create other fergusons around the country. i think we can have a very important and constructive hearing in that regard. >> when you say causes that create another ferguson. what are you speaking of specifically? >> well, i'm speaking of the racial tensions that arise between aggressive police action, somet

it didn't happen by itself. >> now adam and his twin brother and family all watched as the jury left berate. >> i just wanted a fair trial. because i knew once all the evidence was presented that there's no way that 12 people can sit there -- i don't care who you are. >> they were gone. nothing you could do about it. >> jurors said they were ready for the task ahead. jennings is a court certified mediator, he became a natural choice to be foreman. >> did you call for a vote right away? >> not initially. we took time to go through each piece of evidence and deliberate, deliberate. >> here, with permission of the court is the actual jury room where we would see how they literally weighed the evidence. >> i drew try scales on the chalkboard. to the right would be broken as innocent and broken as guilty. we tried to fit everything in that to come one a decision. >> they paid close attention to the conflicting testimony from those different medical examiners. but more than anything, the jurors were determined to listen to that 911 call one more time, very carefully. >> it's much easier to

here's just a taste of what the jury heard: it went on like that for more than 15 minutes. the lyrics don't mention anything about the specific shooting or the actual victim-- they were, in fact, written months and years before the crime occurred-- but prosecutors introduced them and a judge allowed them in order to demonstrate skinner's alleged motive and intent to commit violent acts. amar dean is a philadelphia- based rap producer and vonte skinner's brother. he says he was in the courtroom when the lyrics were read to the jury, and, just by watching their reaction to those lyrics, he knew his brother was going to be convicted. >> when they started doing the lyrics, people started frowning their faces. you know, body language speaks volumes. a lot of their faces were in shock-- "whoa, did he say that? did he do that?"-- but it had nothing to do with the case at all. >> reporter: skinner was found guilty of attempted murder and sentenced to 30 years in prison. this trend of introducing rap lyrics as evidence in criminal proceedings is spreading nationwide. there are some c

de sousa, please rise and face the jury? >> here we go again. >> madam foreperson, please read your verdict. >> yes, we, the members of the jury, find the defendant not guil guilty. [cheers and applause] >> you're totally undefeated! you are like the merryweather of freedom fest. you and your hawk friends have been found not guilty, and therefore you're free to enjoy a night in the city of las vegas, the most secular entertainment city in the world known as sin city where you are free from the taliban. you may enjoy life, liberty and the pursuit of happiness in its many forms. congratulations. >> thank you.5r5r5rìáhp &hc% thank you. thank you all very much for attending and thanks to both of our attorneys. >> jury, you're excused. >> sorry, there's a cockroach on here. >>> while congress is on its summer break, we're showing book tv programs normally seen weekends on cspan-2. coming up, inaugural poet richard blanco on growing up in miami. that's followed by "finding the dragon lady." that's by former first lady maggie nu. th

how will he safely be brought into the grand jury, you think? >> well, i am sure that the justice department is involved in those security and safety procedures. i'm sure captain johnson and the missouri state highway patrol is involved in that. they'll do every precaution they can to protect him, and let's be honest, even when we have people that are labeled as defendants, which he is not yet, but even when we have people labeled as defendants, law enforcement goes at great lengths putting bulletproof vests on them, et cetera, transporting them by various routes and dark vans. they do all sorts of things. look at all the protection they did for casey anthony when she was released from jail in orange county, florida. they'll take all the steps they can to protect darren wilson as they would protect anybody and they should. >> there are plenty of people who are rallying behind officer wilson. i want to read you part of an op-ed written by an officer at the los angeles police department. "even though it might sound harsh and inpolitic, here is the

room and denied access to the grand jury. evidence has been taken out of my file and mailed back to me. i have a box that is on open with my evidence. >> you have to have a question for the panel. >> .. this is not an ambush. we are not behind this. a system of due process. it seems to meet the defendant is entitled to know. it is usually conviction. most defendants say never mind. all complete. the prosecutor may not understand. the prosecutor's job is not to figure out what is good for the defense. so it's simple. we have a piece of legislation produced by senator murkowski co-sponsored by another senator. >> six bipartisan sponsors. but of course she introduced the fairness and disclosure of evidence act. and then the integrity act. you pass laws and then prosecutors live by them. and if you shine a light on what is hidden in prosecutor files then you will have a much better chance. you don't count on people being on a store count on people being fair. it's just there. so i would suggest we have legislation pending. it shou

of the grand jury. he prosecutors should not be making that information public. >> but here now, i hope, is what the governor said last night. look. >> we have a responsibility to come together and do everything we can to achieve justice for this family. once we have achieved peace in ferguson and justice for the family of michael brown, so i ask that we continue to stand together as we work to achieve justice for michael brown. >> justice for the family of michael brown. justice for michael brown. it may turn out a jury of his peers may decide that michael brown's family needs justice, or it may decide that the police officer's story that michael brown came to his car, reached for his gun. the gun went off. michael brown went running, turned around and came charging at this police officer, and the police officer shot him because he was being charged and feared for his life. that's called justifiable. i don't have any idea what happened. i wasn't within 1,000 miles of there. but neither does governor nix

. >> ray for open government i support the change foot recommendation or is responded to the grand jury i commend sxhoourg ever putting a deadline seeing specific date on beginning 2015. the sunshine ordinance included a position that that mandated has neutron and computer systems were in the department an ability to have citizens to access public records i've argued this over a number of bodies from a statement you've repeating raised is economics if i can go on line to get documents that are matter of public record it could save the staff time and they complain it tops time if i could print them at home it saves money. there are advantages ever having these things since is sunshine ordinance said over 12 years this should be the case and having them searchable is appropriate that way the utilization of the computers is maximum missed those things should be done a a long time go and put in a recommendation it's difficult otherwise, it will slip away. and the bottom line is the citizens of the city don't think access to public records i'm going to by the labor this point you have city e

but after a mere three hours, the jury is back. >> we, the jury, find the defendant -- pedro bravo in guilty of murder in the first degree. >> reporter: bravo, stonefaced after being found guilty of all charges. the aguilar family, always respectful inside the courtoom, takes to the hallways for a rare moment of catharsis. alexander, how do you feel? >> i don't know. i can't really describe this. >> reporter: the judge said this is your day of reckoning to bravo. do you think life in prison is enough him? >> i think that as the maximum that he can pay for the life of my son. >> reporter: later, they return to remind the judge of the toll this case has taken on them. >> i can't tell you or quantify the pain we've gone through. >> reporter: their brief moment of victory comes to an abrupt halt as and the killer gets one last twist of the knife. >> i know in my heart and my actions, and i know god as well knows that i did not kill christian aguilar. i will tyke we are sentence you decide to give me. >> you know this was a person we knew. >> this was your friend. this had been your former

>>now three live looks on the streets but action is in a grand jury room the grand jury will decide whetherge the police officer who shot and killed michael brown. so how does it work? here is how it works in st. louis county, missouri the grand jury is made up of 12 people. there are alternates but it's not a yun man news thing here. takes nine out of 12. and those jurors can meet weekly. could take a while this, is important. prosecutors present evidence behind closed doors there is no judge in there, no media at all. none of this supposed to be open to the public. on our wall some very important things to keep in mind. the prosecutor can instructors on a murder charge if they want this, is whether to charge him, the grand jury cannot convict him of anything. analysts say the process gives prosecutors a lot of power, that a grand jury will usually do whatever the prosecutor wants. there is a saying a grand jury can indict a ham sandwich if that is what the prosecutor asked for. if the officer does testify, the lawyer can't be in the room. anything the officer says can, and will be used ag

. >> larry bush from the civil grand jury we point out that the f p pc and the city of los angeles has a right to attorney's fees we have drafted that. in terms of the prop j the reference is to the fact it was approved by i did voters over 80 percent of the vote it was overwhelmingly positive when there was a rewrite of the provisions in 2003, there was no mention that the rewrite eliminated the right of action. >> as a people advocate i've expensed many - i have a lot of experience and some 20 or thirty years ago i remembered having an opportunity to question the heads of the departments from the board of supervisors as to how the conduct of their departments and it was certainly a experience that the citizens had a right to question not just the department heads or supervisors. but when the heads of the departments were defending their budgets to the citizens i had a recent experience in the last year of trying out the process of complaints or to correct something wrong in the senior citizens center on the walls there are forms which you can make a complaint to an unidentified perso

with respect to the grand jury, the grand jury could be 100% african-american, but they can only act on the evidence that is brought by bob. as your prior guest said, in a grand jury, you can bring in hearsay evidence. evidence that would not be michelle ed a missble in a court of law. and the fact that bob is allowing the perspective defendant to testify in the grand jury hearing, what that says is clearly there's no desire to obtain -- >> isn't that common? >> no, it is not. no, it is not that the defendant, the perspective defendant is allowed to testify in the grand jury? no that is not. that is a statement saying you know what? we kind of don't want this guy indicted. no prosecutor is seeking an indictment ever would allow a defendant to testify in the grand jury. he gets to plead his case and the challenge is we don't even get to see what he gets to say. they could bring in his father. they could bring in his priest, anybody to make the defendant look good. and if the defendant looks good, there will not be an indictment. >> and state senator, you've been critical of governor ni

the responses should be between the commission and the civil grand jury not by an employee of the commission to the civil generalizing. it's just a motivator of the prototype and adds to the unfortunate criticism that is often made which i don't agree with that by some members of the public i think they're totally wrong about this the commission is run by the executive director. that's not true we shouldn't do anything that foster any indication of that and certainly in terms of of a discussion between a body as important and as a sill grand jury regarding the business of this body i think the response should be by the commission. >> commissioner. the commission has been asked to respond to the large majority of those finding and recommendations but not all of them. in 13 cases they've asked for a response from the executive director i don't believe i have a choice of not responding when they ask inform a response directly from me. >> well, i disagree with that, i think. >> you disagree with who they ask. >> let me finish. >> okay. >> you'll get the answer. >> i'm sorry. >> i disa

they had removed all elements of criminal intent from the jury instructions. the prosecutor primarily responsible for the arthur andersen indictment and conviction is now the head of the criminal division of the department of justice. the co. prosecutor in the case became general counsel deputy director of the fbi. he went back from his days in the task force after convicting andersen and they turned to their sites to the executives on wall street and they wanted to send a message to wall street. they used the new york bankers as the wise guys on wall street nothing better than lobsters in suits, nicer suits may be but that was the basic attitude it was to bring down the merrill lynch executives. the distraction gave them an incredible power when they went to any other organizations because they believe they didn't cooperate fully in the prosecution that merrill lynch would receive the death penalty arthur andersen suffered, so he entered into the most egregious nonprosecution agreement i have ever seen. they agreed that their employees would say nothing public

the federal corruption case against former governor bob mcdonnell and his wife is about to go to the jury after a long day of closing arguments. i'm peggy fox. i'll have the story coming up. >> cold front approaches the metro area on sunday and we issued a yellow alert on sunday and labor day. we'll tell you the best time of day to cook out. >> good evening to you. i'm derek mcginty. >> i'm lesli foster. >>> the terror threat level in britain is now up to severe in reaction to the isis activity in syria, but here the obama administration announced it has no plans to raise the terror threat level. republicans are critical of the president after announcing that there is no strategy deal with an isis stronghold in syria. >> that may come as a surprise to some. but it is not a surprise to our allies and to our adversaries around the world. >> every element of his national security strategy is thought through. it includes a lot of important diplomatic work both with the iraqi government, but also with governments in the region. >> the white house clarified that no strategy comment later on by

chair, i would propose that were it is the grand jury is asking us to we provide written information as does every other city department in all of the other major languages that is also done by other city departments in the draft proposal we disagree and will not do this it is an unwanted search and been determined the demands for such services is zero pressor i find that had a right to building in the city of san francisco where every other city department we're told provides those information we're saying in terms of what we're doing what we're doing is insignificant and people speaking other languages don't connect about it we should provide the information in those languages. i would change our recommendation that the ethics commission shall make the materials available in other languages as in other city departments. >> other commissions from the commissioners. i did have questions as well. recommendation 7 in particular what the form is that the demand is zero? there's 3 different approaches that each agency can use that the city requires looking at whether there have been reque

asville told the jury, if you have a reasonable doubt of the testimony of an immune witness, you must acquit. the day started with the prosecution's closing arguments. former governor bob mcdonnell had his own words turned against him in a brutal closing argument by deputy chief prosecutor david harbach. harbach told the story of bribery, lies and coverups walking the jury through the timeline of the alleged corruption. it begins with an april, 2011 shopping spree in new york for maureen mcdonnell and ends with the former first lady trying to allegedly obstruct justice after an interview with state police. harbach said bob mcdonnell knew exactly what jonnie williams wanted and used his official capacity as governor to deliver. he was on the jonnie williams gravy train harbach said. he said mcdonnell lied about that ferrari williams let him drive and showed the jury those seven pictures of bob mcdonnell driving the ferrari and wearing the rolex watch william bought for him which mcdonnell said he thought might be fake. harbach asked who poses like that in seven photos if you think the

by doing so that helps us convince the jury, well, no one else could have done it. be him. >> reporter: the defense is passionate, but in the end -- >> the motion for mistrial in the court's discretion is denied. >> reporter: the judge believes the state was guilty of nothing more than sloppy record keeping. but with the new evidence, the defense has a face for their intruder theory. was scott hall a jealous ex-lover? >> the defense tried to paint it to be as if she were in some type of relationship with an ex-boyfriend. and you know, could this guy have done this, you know, because that relationship wasn't moving forward. that was, i think, their presentation of a possible suspect. >> one of the things you talked about in these e-mails was other people not finding out about the e-mails, right? >> that's correct. >> and specifically you didn't want your wife to find out about them. >> of course not. >> let me ask you something mr. hall, is this the woman you dated for three years in high school, correct? >> that's correct. >> and these text messages are march 3rd, 20

the main point from the court's point of view said it will help the jury arrive at the truth. >> evan davis you served on the house judiciary staff back in 1974. as you look back 40 years later our audience listening to the oral arguments, what should they look for? >> they should look for the thinking of the judges and their attitude about whether the president deserves special protection. and if he deserves special protection how much special protection? so, i think as we listen to the argument you'll see that most of the justices thought the president deserved some degree of special protection. you'll see in their questions that they do not think the president should be treated just like any other

so whether it's that's called for or not if the grand jury thinks to some stent it is that makes sense >> any other comments from the commissioners on finding recommendation 10? finding and recommendation 11? i also want some clarification on 11. i don't know if the city attorney actually should talk about the upcoming case i'd like to know why we think it's maybe you want to change that >> sewer deputy director arnold i believe what the staff is proposing in terms of recommendation 11 in the reference for an upcoming superior court case involving the city and the bay whether e-mails sent concerning city business on the officials private e-mail account are subject to the private records act we're monitoring it internally but that's what is referred to recommendation 11. >> okay. and so we think it's depending on what the california supreme court decided this could affect other electronic communications >> that isn't about e-mail but to the take the opportunity extending stent an official can use private e-mails and text and otherwise and claim because its not on the public communicatio

so the jury has the afternoon off. and you heard there, bob mcdonnell saying he forgives williams. ery interesting first time we've heard him say that. jury has the afternoon off and this afternoon at 3:00, both sides are going to be arguing about the jury instructions. the judge is preparing his own and they'll come to a decision on what they're going to tell will t jury and that will be critical especial little in determining what is -- especially in determining what's an official act. and so the jury heads off this afternoon and come back tomorrow morning for closing arguments and have the closing arguments it goes to the jury. maybe a verdict tomorrow. maybe not. maybe they'll come back on tuesday after labor day. but we're going to be here and bring it to you live. i'm peggy fox in richmond. back to you. >> thank you peggy. >>> cbs news has learned another american has died fighting overseas with isis terrorists forces. and the mother of an american kidnapped by isis has released a video speaking directly to the militant group's leader. looking straight into the camera, she ple

grand jury, but the grand cases in front of grand juries get indictments. you can indict a ham sandwich. >> but danny, couldn't the prosecutor just have moved forward on this case by himself? he didn't have to send it over to a grand jury to begin with, right? >> right. and that may have solved a big problem, which is opacity. citizens have been complaining that this case, law enforcement, has been too -- they have circled their wagons and are not letting out enough information. so when the word came out this was going to be submitted to a grand jury, there were people, citizens, who said, oh, that's good. but wait until they find out what a grand jury is really all about. it's all about secrecy. they might have done better, possibly, by having a preliminary hearing, open probable cause hearing that would have been more open and less secret. in this instance, and sunny is righ right. if in theory, because it's so secret and entirely the prosecutor's show, in theory, a prosecutor who wanted to either punt it or