the islamist motivation is to be found in their perception of u.s. oreign policy is an attack on the islamic religion and its followers. this is a view held not only by those carrying ak-47s, but extend the polling by a delightful that nearly 80% of all muslims worldwide, young and old, moderate and militant men and women. no american must accept the islamist indictment of the anti-muslim intent of u.s. foreign policies. but to avoid military defeat, economic ruin and widespread domestic violence, u.s. leaders must have knowledge and explain to americans that this is the muslim world perception that u.s. security requires all of us to accept the hard truth that perception is always reality. and what are the policies motivating the bin laden islamist clerics i can do no better to u.s. policies bin laden and invited it in 96 and to which we would flee for the next 15 years. i would also go for the six policies motivate our foes in iran. according to bin laden, his declaration of war in islam is clear in the following facts. the u.s. military and civilia

the islamist motivation is to be found in the perception of u.s. foreign policy as an attack on the islamic religion and its followers. this is a view that is held not only by those carrying the ak-47s, but its extensive polling by reliable western pollsters as reliable by nearly 80% of all muslims worldwide, young and old, moderate and militant, men and women. nell minnow american must accept the islamist indictment of the entire muslim intent of the foreign policy. but to defeat the economic ruin and the widespread domestic violence u.s. leaders must acknowledge and explain to americans it is the muslim world perception and requires all of us to accept the hard truth that perception is always reality. and the policies motivating the london tv, then i can list six of its policies the mud and enumerated in the late summer of 1996 and to which he has held closely the next 15 years. also note four of the six policies motivate to a greater or lesser extent are the foes and saudi arabia. according to bin laden, america's declaration of war and islam is

did you support democracy in eastern europe and not in our part of the world we know that with the islamist arm of the nobody listened and nobody cared to listen to day with tunisia and egypt they are reassessing this situation but they did not think of this scenario that's why when you say they are unhappy to see a dictator leave because they didn't. they never imagined that one day it would be regular people who would take to the top because. democracy is running a democracy it's really quite again pathetic here i'd like to ask all three on the panel and i to go to villa first i mean again let's clarify here because i think this is i don't want to get c.n.n. and ask here just because there are democratic movements going on and it needs to be developing and when the countries that we're talking about expression egypt it doesn't necessarily mean they're going to be lovey dove the liberal regimes are going to be one to get in bed with the americans again considering what the americans and their allies have done to them for decades i mean we could have a democratic society that is democratic

for them to change this policy is it was very difficult because these dictators used the card of the islamist in order to get support from the west and that's one of the debates that are going on here in washington who are we going to support after mubarak and it was it is very difficult to convey the message that it's not a matter of who it's what type of system what what are the checks and balances we are not removing one ruler to replace it with one other we want to change of systems and this is what happened in tunisia and that's why the tunisian youth were in front of the prime minister's office for days and days and weeks asking for a change of regime so this new reality take some time here too in washington i mean to absorb and to understand because they never took seriously the population in the region many arab liberals were saying this limits are not the majority give us a chance why did you support democracy in eastern europe and not in our part of the world we know that with the islamist out of them nobody listened and nobody cared to listen to day with tunisia and egypt they are

it cuts across the divide between mainstream and islamist parties. u'll find people in the most liberal parties in pakistan that are debating this question. whether it's legitimate to do what the state will not do. and finally, it cuts across the class lines and the regional lines as well. so we'll wrap up with that. getting the questions right on islam and futurist lam is important. the last question is how political islam is going to be used in the eyes of the public. >> thank you, josh. >> thank you for having me here. i will talk social and political factors. i'm going to start with the demographic time bomb. pakistan's still going at a 2% rate. according to the mid range, the population will be 325 million in 2050. this population is young. the median age right now is 21. 2/3 of all pakistanis are under the age of 30 and in 2020s, the 15 to 24 age bracket is expected to swell by over 20%. to ensure that the 18 to 90 million pakistanis who are under the age of 20 find employment in the two decades, the gdp growth has to stand at about 9%. you alre

brotherhood they can speak to egyptian liberals but egyptian liberals have to find a compromise with the islamists all political forces also there is a quasi consensus in egypt that post mubarak egypt will not have a president with as many power mubarak or. or all egyptian presidents decrees of the power of the president so i think the new system that will emerge will have more power sharing among the political forces a stronger parliament a stronger government and with a head of state that's more neutral and with less power so that's why i don't have a lot of fears of one group hijacking egyptian society we have all colors in the political spectrum the muslim brotherhood yes it's the best organized the position but it's not the majority the majority are sailing on this i really believe there is a very good jump and go ahead it's not the most organized group i would contest that it's there are many many divisions within the muslim brotherhood and it's not a monolithic bloc as you would like to present it i agree i agree i don't they have different shades they don't even agree on the single platfor

however, the islamist members of the opposition have said that they will not accept the new prime minister and they have pledged to continue with their gatherings, their protests, the next of which is scheduled to happen here on wednesday afternoon. it has to be stressed, the protests here are nothing like on the scale of what we are seeing in egypt. the demonstrations at their maximum have numbered several thousand. although there is the potential for them to grow in number and that's because there's a large number of impoverished people in this country who are getting increasingly concerned about their dier economic state -- dire economic state and the islamist movement could be swelled, if you like, by some of those people. it's a general fear amongst some, i was speaking also a few hours ago to a member of the inner circle of the late king hussein and he said it was possible that those protests could get bigger because of. that but he doesn't believe that jordan is going to go in the same way as egypt. he doesn't believe that the king will be overthrown. in fact, the opposition has mad

the islamists are a limited band of fanatic neil this ready to kill widely and indiscriminately for the per jury of murdering and ready to sacrifice their lives because my daughters go to the university. early presidential primaries every four years and because i, may god forgive me, and one or more sam adams after work. he would be at most a lethal innocents and not the national security threat posed today to a lesser or greater degree by enron, the saudis, islamic imperialism and the sunni islamist movement inspired by osama bin laden. this view is unfortunately endemic in both u.s. political parties. much of the u.s. and western media and perhaps most damaging, much of the academy, especially at our most prestigious universities. it is in my judgment that this view is almost entirely without substantiation. as it continues to be washington's working assumption america will slowly but surely be defeated through the loss of prestige, blood, financial solvency, and domestic political cohesion. we will lose not because any of these threats are stronger than we are, that certainly is not

if you look at the islamists, a statement today trying to sort of jump on the bandwagon or somehow create an identity with the protesters just as the iranan regime did, claim as a follow-on to the 1979 revolution. both of them are wrong. you see that in the streets. you know what is behind this and it has nothing to do with 1979. they were caught offguard as well. that is something that the u.s. can leverage. this is a huge defeat for the islamists. mubarak was in their targets for years. they go nowhere. in a couple of weeks' time, a bunch of young people empowered by technology and anger and a sense of hope arising from tunisia and other countries have done what we nor they can do. >> the wave and the administration trying to shape it. iran, they are trying to get a lot of the water to go on ahmadinejad's head. how did they try to do this week, after egypt kind of using egypt and was it successful? >> at the beginning of the week, if you asked any administration spokesman to talk about any unrest anywhere in the middle east, iran. look at iran. look at how bad they are. they ought to be

the first is the perennial question will islamists take over the state? and i think it's unhelpful because, first of all political islamist parties don't do very well at the polls. they get at most 10% to 15% of the vote. second, they don't have very much capacity to govern a bureaucratic state. and i was living in peshawar when the mma islamist alliance was trying to govern the northwest frontier province. and it was -- it was sad, and comical, and only every once in awhile hopeful to see the islamist parties try to actually do education, and water delivery and all the things that governments have to do. third, i think that even when people talk about no longer hypothetical cases of taliban 60 miles from islamabad, and advancing on the capital, one has to ask the very serious question, what on earth are they going to do when they get there? and this is a very real question, within a state that has a very large army, has proven to be quite resilient, what are some taliban from balacan going to do when they walk down the central streets of islamabad? i thin

there is race, young educated secular tribe, and the islamists muslim brotherhood and other rulers. >> walid, who is behind it, today the mahmoud ahmadenijad is behind all this. who do you say is responsible? >> of course the iranian regime has its own view of the ever world. they do believe in their oend of times tcollapse of all these regimes. and the ideaologist spreading. the youth, basically are behind this. they have seen before, the first one in beirut in 2005 and green revolution in 2009 and first arab sunni society in tunisia and we see it across the map. >> when you talk about youth, are you talking about individuals who aspire to create a western democratic style of govr innocence or these folk that is have islam through their veins and want an islamic system of jurisprudence? >> this is a unique revolution, you have both, those that want democracy, they launched it on facebook, they want a more democratic one. at the same time, you have those who are taking advantage of it the muslim brotherhood who are competing, they can speed up the process, hold the elections earlier a

and this movement was not lead by the islamists t was lead by seculars. >> brown: what do you think about the role of the army at this point, has enough changed. or has that status quo that hishem is talking about still in place? >> well, i think the egyptian people have around five and a half,000 years of running urban society. they now how to do this. know know about civil society, about legal systems, they know about farming and trade and commerce and foreign relations. they know this better than anybody else in the entire world, virtually. so i have enormous faith in the ability of the ode egyptian people to come together and make this transig. they haven't had a chance to do this in 50 or 60 years. but so i think, but it's there it's a chrome sownally in them and you have hundreds of thousands of egyptians from around the world, nobel prize winners, scientists, university presidents, the most unbelievably talented people who will come back to egypt now. and i don't think there is going stock any problem. the critical element as my two colleagues and friends have said, the critical el

. >> ...illustrating to the world the true face of moderate islamists. this is our message to the american people. >> reporter: they are obsessed by their treatment in the western media. >> the media coverage in the united states are trying to say that the-- the islamists have the same face. they... they... doesn't separate between al-qaeda, or muslim brotherhood or even hezbollah. what-- what we are trying to say in ikhwanophobia, that the muslim brotherhood are different. >> reporter: but the negative image of the brotherhood has been carefully controlled by the mubarak regime. >> reporter: on january 28, mubarak alluded to those fears in his first television address of the crisis. >> reporter: throughout the protests, the brotherhood was fearful that the regime would succeed in portraying the revolution as a muslim brotherhood conspiracy. we saw this sensitivity play out when this man approached our camera holding up his pocket koran. mohammed abbas took him aside and told him to put it away. >> reporter: abbas then explained to me what was going on. >

makeshift explosive device now but in iraq our allies in the world little north caucasus police says the islamist terrorists operating in the region could be behind the latest attacks some experts say the way they were carried out heat in several locations at the same time follows the pattern used by islamists operating internationally. and is growing in the u.s. over these super sized tax burden for the middle clause this quickly come to a head as thousands have been protesting and one more than state over plans to cut public sector workers collective benefits well this recall to your people in new york how they feel when they're required to make sacrifices and not the super rich . people across the us are protesting proposed legislation intended to slash benefits for the middle class are they really protesting the fact that everyday people are being asked to make sacrifices while wall streeters continue to profit even more this week let's talk about bad i'm a member of this week's middle class and we say. evening we work for the all those and first same friday we work for ourselves but think th

for many in the jewish state, and egypt potentially governed by islamists is a nightmare scenario. concern is growing because many extremists have been able to escape prison as the unrest has swept the country. but the leader of the muslim brotherhood has continued to present himself as a moderate, saying that violence must be condemned. reformers say they one day several state built on islamic fundamentalists. but the movement is not religious in nature, with some seven days -- 70 offshoots. the organization enjoys strong support among many egyptians, not least because of its social welfare activities. some experts say that 30% of the people support the moslem brotherhood. it is well organized and will likely play an important role in ]ny transition of power in the country. >> for analysis of the situation, i am joined by an analyst. a figurehead has emerged for a wide range of groups. do you think he and the muslim brotherhood will be able to work together to bring democracy to egypt? >> they have to, at least for a transitional time. at the same time, the army is saying they want

. >> what he means is egypt will be lost to the islamists. at the largest and oldest opposition party here is the muslim brotherhood. on the streets of cairo today, it was suddenly become much more islamic crowd. the muslim brotherhood appears to be mobilizing. president mubarak and his supporters say if you get rid of him, the alternative will be the muslim brotherhood. but the violence done to supporters has driven the middle class protestors to the streets. what is left is much more hardline and much more islamic. this did not start as an islamic uprising, but the actions of the mubarak regime could still make it into one. bbc news. >> the muslim brotherhood is a key player in all of this. one of the opposition movements here. we're joined by one of its chief spokesman, issam al-aryan. the vice -- the vice-president said that he made an offer for dialogue. you have been hesitating. what have you decided? >> as for dialogue, we are ready. but the climate, the atmosphere when me start dialogue must be clear. under pressure, under threatening

. >> the aim of the islamists is to tighten noose around israel's neck. if they are seeing a great opportunity in egypt, a strong supporter of the peace with israel. if egypt falls, jordan and hezbollah and lebanon in the north and a real noose on israel. chris mitchell was in cairo and they know they are at a cross roads. >> they are saying tht a tipping point in egypt's spiritual and natural history. it is important people are praying and fasting for 2 nation of egypt not back to islam but it turns more to freedom, more democracy, so the gospel, these prayer movements, these people coming to faith in jesus can change egypt, but the middle east and eventually the world. >> john waage cbn news. >> joining us now is joel rosenberg, the founder of the joshua fund, ministry to help christians, jews and muslims in the middle east. joel, pleasure to have you on the broadcast. for those that are watching around the world, christians, why should we care about what is going on in egypt? >> obvious reasons, instability there, largest country, 80 million mostly musl

i am particularly glad that you emphasized the constructive role the moderate islamist are likely to play. i am not particularly a fan. i teach israeli studies at the university of maryland, but i think they absolutely have to be part and it has to be accepted by the u.s. and the west. my question is, do you think this perception is gaining any ground in this country and europe given the demonization of all islamists in the last 10 and more years? if we attempt to keep the brotherhood out of the process, it will do ourselves and egypt a lot of damage. briefly, do you think omar suleiman will be allowed and it is he able to play a role like gorbachev in reining in a repressive regime? >> i think the mood in this country is getting more sophisticated. it is not there, yet. i think people can distinguish between good muslims and that muslims, if you will. i think there has been a lot of work done by the administration to highlight that. not everybody is osama bin laden just because they have an islamic faith. i think most people in this country now understand that. i do not see die-hard

country completely disintegrates that's at least was the example of algeria for example where the islamists won the election the army was willing to kill enough people to prevent them actually taking power. just finally do you think that it's possible i knew mubarak could be elected after september the elections. no i didn't think so not not yet. i think it i mean somebody could be elected to could but ultimately become a new mubarak but i think for the moment. probably we're going to the population will demand something more democratic and popular and a military dictator would only come to power again if the military saw. the population believed that all this would lead to to chaos and disintegration. and actually in a sense there was a popular demand for another dictator i think for the moment we will see something like quasi democracy though as i say probably heavily managed by the army as far as they can right live from london leavin a british author journalist and policy analyst thanks for being with us. two astronauts from the mars five hundred program have carried out their second wa

try to wave the flag and say they have to do something to save mubarak otherwise we would get the islamist fundamentalists in egypt -- it is not going to happen. look at the way the military is handling this. it is threading a very careful path. it has been out around the crowd. it has not suppressed the demonstrations. it has retained its rigidity in the overall complexion of what will come next. it has taken enough of a position so that the crowd welcomes it still. they do not grow by lead. they do not throw stones at them. the symbol of the military, the field marshal who is the millet -- the minister of defense, waited into the crowd yesterday and was welcomed by the crowd. i think the military is very clearly part of the solution to the problem for the egyptians. i am quite sure that omar suleiman does not want to be president. in all my contacts with them, it does not seem to be his style. he is quite happy to be in the background to be a loyal participant in running the state, but not a leader. he is not try to take the position on for himself. he is a wonderful man and a lot of fun

explosive device now but as you know kyra lies in the well a trial north caucasus police says the islamist terrorist operation in the region could be behind the latest attacks some experts say the way they were carried out heat in several locations at the same time follows the pattern used by islamists operating internationally. let's now have a look at some other major headlines from around the world the toll from the quake struck new zealand on tuesday has risen to one hundred forty five with another two hundred still missing because wouldn't be chances of finding any more survivors under the rubble in cars churches and that was the focus of the trying to restore power and be off the mark with my b.b. country's worst ever disaster meter also high alert with the pope of nations. winnings there maybe more tremors to come. one of them is most prominent tribal chiefs has resigned from the ruling party and joined the opposition in demanding u.s. backed president ali abdullah saleh stands down the death toll has now reached at least twenty four since daily antigovernment protests started over

it ended up hijacked by the islamists. that is the threat in egypt today. the mother wants the institution of the sharia law on its -- the brotherhood wants the institution of the sharia law. on its website they say that no woman can be president of egypt. testimony given about how benign and secular an organization it is -- it wants a sharia law. our job is to strengthen the democrats, of which there are many in egypt, but need help and assistance. it is to create democracy that is going to live and not the one-man, one-vote, one time. >> you do not allow them. you compete and defeat if you think it is the wrong idea and wrong policies, just as in western europe, the communists were engaged and defeated at the ballot box. >> no one is advocating outlawing them. >> we are broke, and we are borrowing 41 cents for every dollar that we spend. this spending binge was hurting job creation by eroding confidence, draining funds from private investment, spreading uncertainty among employers were big and small. >> house speaker john boehner of chilly proposed $100 b

>> the protestors, the people in the streets and the leaders of the opposition movement-- both islamist and secular-- have made it clear they don't even want to negotiate about the formation of a new government while he's still in power. we're used to, in the united states, hing a president who slides into a slot in a government that was there before him and there after him. but that's not how it works there. this government is hosni mubarak. so to say, you know, that we're going to negotiate about change but i'm still going to be president is hard for people to swallow because this has been a one man; one party strait for so long. so... >> rose: and he said no to that for so long. >> and he said no to that for so long. he said no to changing that. and so they don't have a lot of trust. i mean, elections here are kind of an eye-rolling thing. they have them every once in a whilement for years there were really just referendums in. the parliamentary election last fall fraud was unbelievably rampant. they really made no effort whatsoever to hide what they were doing and so now to come aro

world has always been that you need to keep the systems closed because opening them up would bring the islamists in. you have seen two examples in tunisia and egypt where the muslim brotherhood actually did not play a large role in these uprisings. that does not mean that they're not a force and that does not mean that they will not, of course, attempt and justifiably to be part of whatever arrangements are done in the future but i think that this argument that... this scare tactic that governments have used for a long time that you need to keep the systems closed in order for the islamists not to come in as only produced vacuums for other sort of movements and we are now finding movements in tunisia and in egypt with no leaders basically because governments have not created or not allowed the political space for such leaders to emerge. >> charlie, i just find it impossible to imagine that the people around mubarak will want any time soon to see a transition to a muslim brotherhood led influenced, controlled government. for them, the word "transition" means transition from mubarak to something e

in an attempt to diffuse the violence, the vice-president is offering talks with the man from the islamist muslim brotherhood. >> i have invited them, but they have been hesitant to enter into dialogue, but i believe it is in their interests. >> a very warm welcome to "bbc world news," broadcast on pbs in america and around the globe. tens of thousands of temenis tape to the streets demanding an end to their presidents rule -- tens of thousands of yemenis take to the streets demanding an end to their president's rule. >>> hello. in his first interview since protests began more than a week ago, egyptian president hosni mubarak said he would step down now, he is fed up, but fears chaos if he does so. he told abc news that he would stand aside when his term in office is up. >> welcome to the egyptian capital, cairo, 11:00, almost an end to a tense day of rage. the anchor has boiled over on both sides, running battles between pro-mubarak supporters and the anti-government protesters who have bothered -- who have gathered in central cairo, voicing their demands that president mubarak must go. s

. >> they will consign 82 million egyptian to the darkness of the islamist rule. d don't make any mistake about it, let's not be naive. >> really bad guys over there? >> they are the bad guys. and i'll tell you -- [everyone talking at once] >> the bad guys ararnow the good guys. >> i don't think they're the good guys. hosni mubarak -- >> the army controls the string of power. this issue will turn on what the army does. mubarak was sitting next to anwar sadat when the brother assassinated him, one of great people of that country. it was the muslim brotherhood who assassinated him. he killed him. [everyone talking at once] >> if their democracy comes one man, one vote in egypt, let me tell you, the muslim brotherhood will initially get 25 to 33% of the vote, and the arab streets -- will be reflected. >> the u.s. approval in egypt is 12%. president n

but the islamist brotherhood opposition says it looks like there might have been a military coup. ill of course be keeping you up-to-date on the evidence as they unfold throughout the evening. stay with us here at dw-tv. >> welcome back. we return now to egypt, where there are increasing signs that egyptian president hosni mubarak may be relinquishing power in the hours that this evening the egyptian military has made a televised announcement, saying that it would of a good start taking necessary measures to protect the nation in support the legitimate demands of the egyptian people." that statement made on state television came as pressure mounts on, 82 years old, to end his 30-year old rule. yes rejoined now from cairo by our correspondent. can you tell us, what is president mubarak likely to do in the next few hours? can you fill us in at all? there's a lot of confusion. >> there is a lot of confusion and a lot of rumors. first of all, he is supposed to appear on state television to give his third speech in the last two weeks. there rumors already about that. is it a pre-recorde

the changes in egypt in washington there are concerns that islamists might take over the israelis are very nervous because of the peace treaty and the consequences of this the egyptian opposition and people have their own this period of a democratic and free state so all these parties need to agree on the formula for room for manage transition and i think the egyptian opposition presented principles even before they ask mubarak to step down that is a power sharing between the military and the civilians for a transition for a period of transition that could prepare the country for reform so there are too many and washington was walking on thin ice because on the one hand it cannot stand against the will of the egyptian people that surprise the administration here on the other hand they have other allies in the region not only mubarak and that would send the wrong signal to other autocratic rulers if they don't they will need quickly i think that's a really good point i'm glad you brought up the below what is the message now and that's a really good point because i was thinking last nig

civil war between the government and the islamists. i went to these massacres were babies were having their heads chopped off. i don't think people in algeria... it's not the same country. they've got mountain there is which is a complete different form of guerrilla warfare. everyone's got guns. they'll use weapons. there this will not be a soft revolution of people. and the algerian police, 35,000 today against... it's not going to be the same. it will be much worse. >> rose: from you therefore saying that's what's different than what we just saw was the reality of the army and the ineffectiveness of the secret police? >> i think there were four reasons. andrew and i were in tunisia at the time and we thought okay, when are we going to egypt? >> rose: you were sure this was going to explode in egypt? >> we didn't think it would go ease easily. >> we thought something. one because it was the tunisia model inspiring, incredible, it showed that they could do it. the poverty here. egypt has always been a poor country but the gaps between t

first, muslim voices other than those of the islamists have been silenced. secondly, religious and ethnic minorities are persecuted. women are subjugated. the society tends to be less free than it was before, not that any of these societies were marvelous before hand. the all suffer widespread violence and most of them have engaged in war. finally, the regimes have not moderated while in power. i believe this should give us great caution. we fear about what might happen within egypt and outside of it, if the brotherhood has real power. one of our goals should therefore be as much as we can, which is probably not necessarily that much, to ensure that the future power of the muslim brotherhood is limited. it would help if in our conversations about egypt or anywhere else we talked about free and open societies rather than democracies. democracy has many meanings. one of them is you respect rights and freedoms and stuff like that. in many other uses, it just means that one is able to vote for a government. what we are concerned about is societies which are democ