i'm here with sunny hostin and harry houck.here has been a different discussion, i think, in this country for the last year than beforehand. >> i think the discussion is starting. i don't think that it is complete. i don't think that it is an intensive discussion and i don't think that it's a collective, joint discussion about the collective hurt that is being felt in communities of color. i mean, i can tell you after one of my segments today with wolf blitzer, i got an e-mail on my website that said, why are you so unhappy? he's been charged with first-degree murder. your people need to just be happy with that. and so that is just one viewer watching, giving voice to, i think, this real divide, quite frankly, that we are seeing in our country and i think to charles' point, which is a really poignant one, which is, this is a human issue. this should be a collective issue. this is not just an issue for people of color, for black people. this should be a collective human issue. and i just have to say this -- and i just have to ca

joining me now retired nypd detective and cnn law enforcement analyst harry houck also with us, sunnyostin, harry, i want to start with you. the attorney for van dyke said the officer felt threatened somehow. he had heard what had been transpiring beforehand, knew that this guy had a knife, laquan macdonald had a knife, but when you look at the video, seeing the video know, was there any moment that laquan macdonald was threatening the officer or threatening anyone else? >> i took a close look at that to see if maybe that mr. macdonald came towards the officer, and he didn't. he just kept on walking the same way he was going. and it looked like he was going away a little bit at the time when the officer came out and fired those shots. it's really interesting also is the fact that you could see a great job that chicago p.d. is doing in keeping this man surrounded. you know, keeping traffic away, keeping people away from the incident. and, you know, just listen to the last reporter talking about, you know, what the police exactly did and being able to give me more of a view or focus on

i'm joined onset by jonathan gilliam, harry houck, law enforcement analyst as well.e are being moved hopefully they're doing okay. active shooter situation, police exchanging fire inside the planned parenthood. >> right. and we don't know in these pictures right here where exactly that is. as harry and i were talking a moment ago, when you start to see ambulances move in, you're going to know the threat has been eliminated. until then those ambulances will not move in. if this is a long gun such as an ar-15 or an ak-47, 600 yards is not a far distance. >> and, harry, one other thing we know is there are shots being exchanged inside the planned parenthood officers engaging. we also know whoever was in there was shooting out because we know officers were injured on the street. >> the targets inside the location weren't enough and said he was going to shoot at some people shopping in that area. so it just shows you how dangerous this person is. and we're starting to see a lot of movement here. i'm hoping with all the movement we're seeing here that maybe the situation i

joining me is sunny hostin and former nypd detective harry houck.n't use excessive force, do you agree? >> to an extent. when they got to the hospital and tried to breakthrough the glass, the force was adequate at that time. i wouldn't have use tw used two on the guy, one point looked like three. once they got his legs shackled, it should have stopped. they made the mistake, they were at the hospital and all they had to do, i done this many a times is tell the hospital to come out with a gurney, put that man on a gurney and strap him to the gurney and take him in. it's very clear this man was having some kind of psychological event. he's not a typical perp who is resisting arrest because he's trying to get away from the police. this man has a psychological problem and it's very clear they should have took that man into the hospital and never brought him back to the jail. >> sunny, as you watch this, you know, obviously, you watch him in the black of a police car getting tased repeatedly and hands and legs are bound. what do you make of what you see?

joining us harry houck and joey jackson.you say, hard droushgs you want to make a case against a use of force today and let joey defend it or stick with the constitution? >> well, let me tell you one thing, as far as the police officers' actions up until they get him shackled at the feet. i'm fine with it okay. >> why? >> because everything they did at that time was legal. here he jumps out of the car, tries to run into the building. >> he does run into the building. >> right. he runs into the building. >> it was part of the building. he falls down. >> falls down. he's not cooperating. they tase him. and finally get him shackled at the feet. i'm fine with that. >> you're fine with them tasing him initially. >> right. >> are you okay with them tacing him initially? >> i think initially, certainly, the argument could be made that police do not know what his intentions were with regard to running into the building. did he pose a danger with medical personnel or others, therefore, the art could be made up to that point, the tasi

we want to bring in harry houck and cnn political commentator marc lamont hill.n of even whether to release this video, i have to ask, given the fact that it's thanksgiving this week, there's going to be a lot of people offwork and away from home. mark, do you think it's a smart move to release it this week? >> well, i think the people have a right to know and the people need to know -- >> fair enough, but timing? >> i mean, i'm not sure if there's ever a good timing for this. >> fair. >> last year we were in ferguson before thanksgiving. and people said, let's do it before thanksgiving. people said, let's do it in the night, not in the morning. every month, there was a reason to do it and not to do it. ultimately, you have to release it and brace yourself for the fallout of something that could be very volatile. >> brace yourself, indeed. we know people are obviously upset about the death of a 17-year-old. i want to play some sound, harry, for a lawyer from the officer involved in this, officer jason van dyke. let me read it to you. i can't speak to why the othe