joining me now michael denzel smith, best-selling author of "invisible man," the upcoming stakes is high after the american dream. you know, i have had heated discussions with people around me about what do you do if you abolish the police because murder doesn't go away, rape doesn't go away, roche doesn't go away, speeding doesn't go away. what does abolish the police really mean? >> well, so i think you have to start with the idea that, one, those forms of violence that you are talking about that people are so concerned with like what do we do about that if the police aren't there, well, the police only do -- they only try to solve the problem after it's occurred, right. they only solve the murder after it's happened. they only try in very few cases try to solve the rape after it's happened. there are mechanisms for trying to prevent that, trying to lower rates of violence that don't have anything to do with policing. so that's the first thing, is that if we keep investing on the back end with police and thinking that there is a measure of state violence that will deter these other for