he is committed to nato. 0f durable peace. he is committed to nato.se, he expects the european nato partners in canada to spend more and to mmp canada to spend more and to ramp up defence production and he is right there. so he is exactly on the spot when it comes to ukraine, nato, and we really need to work together on all of this. really need to work together on all of thia— all of this. but is he right when he _ all of this. but is he right when he tells _ all of this. but is he right when he tells that - all of this. but is he right when he tells that then l all of this. but is he right i when he tells that then ski that zelensky is gambling with world war iii? that zelensky is gambling with world war m?— world war iii? listen, let me lease world war iii? listen, let me please not — world war iii? listen, let me please not react _ world war iii? listen, let me please not react to _ world war iii? listen, let me please not react to every - please not react to every sentence yesterday uttered in the oval office. but more generally, of course, it is

he is committed to nato., he expects nato partners to spend more and mmp nato partners to spend more and ramp up defence production and he is right there. he's actually on the spot when it comes to ukraine, when it comes to nato, and we really need to work together. but to nato, and we really need to work together.— work together. but is he right when his tales _ work together. but is he right when his tales is _ work together. but is he right when his tales is a _ work together. but is he right when his tales is a landscape | when his tales is a landscape that zelensky is gambling with world war iii? that zelensky is gambling with world war m?— world war iii? listen, let me, lease, world war iii? listen, let me, please. not — world war iii? listen, let me, please. not to _ world war iii? listen, let me, please, not to be _ world war iii? listen, let me, please, not to be out - world war iii? listen, let me, please, not to be out to - world war iii? listen, let me, please, not to be out to everyi please, not

i wonder what are nato member states and their leaders? america's treaty allies thinking tonight after this display in the oval office? >> yeah. >> let's start. >> actually, in moscow, where. >> they're not. >> popping champagne because they're under sanctions from france. >> but they're breaking out the best bottles. >> of vodka. >> everybody is very, very happy in moscow. and you see that across russian television. now let's shift to brussels, where the greatest pool of allies, partners and friends the united states could possibly have in the world. our fellow democracies across this transatlantic bridge. there is despair. there is deep, deep concern and sadness over the way vladimir zelenskyy was treated in the oval office. the way he was. um, simply, i think, ambushed by the president and the vice president in a display that really does shame to the oval office of the united states. i think the question now, jim, is what happens in europe? let's face it, the spotlight will now go to europe. donald trump has made it clear he wants no pa

he can't rely on nato. nato does not have to wear with all they do not have the weapons stores. they do not have what is necessary to keep cropping up the ukrainian government. if the united states pulls out and it, it looks very much that the united states is in the process. now pulling out the conflict is over. it's done. and this is something that zalinski either does not understand yet was not willing to accept us. but this is today's reality, and it was laid out in the oval office this afternoon for all to see. all right, you have on lindsey graham, who has been shared support or of, of ukraine throughout the war has come out on the side of trump. best buy the speaker, listen. president trump was in a very good mood. last night. somebody asked me, am i embarrassed about trump? i have never been more proud of the present. i was very proud of j. d, but standing up for our culture, we want to be helpful. what i saw in the oval office was disrespectful, and i don't know if we can ever do business with zelinski again. doors say, now though, i'll ask the question now, is you crea

the nato doesn't have much more weapons to send and we see the front lines are collapsing. and this is why it's important to recognize realities on the ground as press to a piece. so, but again, for the russians, they see this one dilemma one, they can go for the territories. that is said, for example, let's say that the native continues to threaten to expand if they have the option between the best in nato or the site in russia. and they will, they will, the next a, this region says, well, have to have the option of a deal which trump to pursue it presents, then they're willing to accept a neutral, a desk with a new crime. now, i think that the russians would be, who would prefer a diplomatic agreement if they can, the result what we never were able to resolve after the cold war. and that is a mutual acceptable post cold war settlement, where the rest of the force piece of stability isn't for nato in this military infrastructure to continuously expand upon towards the russian border. so of course, i do think that there had been better leave because i think many were worrie

and that this was provoked by nato. and i would add him and deliberately provoked, and it's of course, a huge deal and a big step forward towards achieving a piece. because only wants to acknowledge that the other side is not motivated by rational, crazy impulses, but actually has actual concerns that need to be addressed. the create an environment where you can sit down around the table and try to address the concerns of all sides. so this is definitely a big deal, but i think, well, a lot of people on underestimate is that this is only to fast towards achieving a piece. i mean, the road to piece remains very long and tortures that i think. people are on the estimated just how difficult this will be because region pc ukraine is about much more to just acknowledging russian control over the next territories. something to trump even seems willing to concede, and it's not even just about stopping nato expansion. but from russia's perspective, it's about much more of this is about deeply reform in the international system.

c is very different from nato. a. nato is your security comes through the us military alliance. o. s. c, e is your security, comes through collective security that we can't be safe if the other side is on safe. so let's work together on assurances on the militarization on a neutral spaces on other ways to protect everybody's security. we are at a stage now where europe and russia really need to sit down in a serious way because there are serious issues on security, on both sides. and they need to be discussed by serious people on both sides. and it wasn't the work just a couple of months ago, a few months ago cuz on beautiful cultural city of cars on had the enormous bricks summit. many people calling it like literally the most important brick stomach to date. when the western political, the media establishment shows rather as being isolated on the world stage pollutants got no friends. here we have this amazing show of unity in cars on covered members of bricks, hotness, states joining and so many waiting in the wings. tom says brooks is dead, trusting and almost tyrus for countri

c is very different from nato. a. nato is your security comes through the us military alliance. o. s. c, e is your security, comes through collective security that we can't be safe if the other side is on safe. so let's work together on assurances on the militarization on a neutral spaces on other ways to protect everybody's security. we are at a stage now where europe and russia really need to sit down in a serious way because there are serious issues on security, on both sides. and they need to be discussed by serious people on both sides. and it wasn't the work just a couple of months ago, a few months ago cuz on the beautiful cultural city of cars on had the enormous bricks summit. many people calling it like literally the most important brick stomach to date. when the western political, the media establishment shows rosters being isolated on the world stage pollutants got no friends. here we have this amazing show of unity in cars on covered members of bricks, hotness, states joining and so many waiting in the wings. trump says briggs is dead, trusting and almost tyrus for cou

so if he understands why the expansion of nato is etc, yet since you entered results, this is a big, big good. what is it going to jump on? and it goes jumping zones off. and this is what is happening in this bottle, not in so far as europe is concerned. now you still have to actually now we draw support uh from uh the little ski or begin to withdraw simple to get. so you must do that if x media that's totally fine as it is a feeling that the public this has actually been found that the best because once medic, by then and united states before getting them to a lot of people following enough trump wants to push them away from lot and now they have 4 things. sometimes they have to have it, they have their own capability to all do on public opinion and towards their own. what do they go to careers? so they've gone simply back off and they don't want being died. and this is all of you communion. this does to collapse my at this moment when he's come under such pressure from the united states to also withdraw support from him. well they want to keep building is more dogs, etc. so that wo

loss, as nato loss and a huge investment in the american taxpayers is going to be wasted. they have to get past this. >> i mean, look, if you are putin, to your point, if you're putin right now, you're sitting there thinking they don't really care about ukraine. so let's just take the whole thing. i mean, how do you not conclude that after what you just saw there, trump spent more time saying that he has gone through so much, so many hard times with putin, right? right. and and that they understand each other because they endured things together. if you're putin, you're like, okay, why are we even playing games about a deal? we can just take the thing. >> i don't care how putin feels about this. i care about what happened on that television screen. and it was zelenskyy. i do believe that zelenskyy should be grateful. and do you know who also thought that zelenskyy. >> should be grateful? said things.? >> you know, who also thought it? joe biden, you know who also thought it it was blinken they've had. this isn't the first time that zelenskyy has seemed to kind of shake ame

they are not nato members, and we are not going to give them nato protection.ent of the united states cannot give them that kind of protection, because that's a treaty agreement. we don't have a treaty agreement with ukraine, and we're not going to have one. i don't think this goes anywhere except worse unless president zelenskyy either completely changes, which i don't think he will, or he steps down and we get a new leader in ukraine who is willing to have a peace agreement. rachel: kt, this kind of goes back to the beginning of of the war, this idea of making ukraine part of nato. he was enticed by the prior administration that he might be able to be part of that, and he wanted that and said, and they said, yeah, you should be, you should be part of nato. and that sort of really ticked off putin. and so what donald trump, i guess, essentially is saying is, no, you're not going to do that, and that's a way to bring about peace. why would volodymyr zelenskyy, when he sees, when he sees how many people are died in this war on his side and the other side and the

secondly, i can exchange it for nato if there is such an opportunity. >> now, taking the nato position off the table there, because i don't think that as they've expressed, the white house has any interest in, in ushering in or supporting ukrainian membership of nato. but is there a path forward with these three players still at the table? putin, trump and zelenskyy? i mean, there may be something between the u.s., russia and ukraine, but do you think that because it's so personal that that deal can happen with with zelenskyy? >> no, i don't actually lindsey graham came out and said that zelenskyy has to either send somebody else to be principal on the negotiations, which of course has been a core putin demand, or he needs to resign. and lindsey graham has been one of the only independent voices on foreign policy, uh, that's willing to stand up to trump on things like gaza, on things like usaid. so the fact that that's his position means that, you know, pretty much everyone around trump believes that zelenskyy's relationship with trump at this point is irrevocably broken. i think that'

we are part of the few where we are part of the european union and of nato. and we want to, uh, bring our contribution to the future of these alliances. also been speaking to some of the people who made it out to the streets of progress. some people, some 100 kilometers, wait in boston because they felt this was such unimportant, a democratic rights of bags because they feel the essentially knowing why the system many people telling me that i mean, you can say we're here because we're fed up with them. we have nothing, everything was stolen. they the government stole billions. where's the money? no jobs. the pensions are very low. they cut the salaries. there are bigger taxes. nurses have been kicked out from hospitals. food is very expensive. we don't want to sell our country anymore. we have to love our country and kick those guys out. we want george ask you to be president. we want everyone to be happy and healthy. the we are here for our freedom. and because the votes of 9000000 people were canceled because they have been deceiving us for decades, we want

of this time they attacked nato and europe's commercial interest in russia. once again, this is not the 1st time while zalinski was read at the white house by donald trump, m. j. the vance on friday is admitted since attempted to attack the infrastructure of the russian compressor station in trust of the region which supplies gas through the search bar pipelines to european countries. kind of the key regime use the aircraft type drones to attack the facility. and according to the russian defense ministry, all 3 ukrainian, you a, these, or shot down at a safe distance from the compressor station, which at the moment continues to run a separation in a regular modes. despite that said terrorist attack, margie was not ukraine's the 1st attempt to just from the gas supplies to the european countries. back in january, the key of regime deployed 9 aircraft type drones to attack that same compressor station in the v across the region. now rushes air defense intercepted all you avi's at that time as well. also the executed to get another terrorist attack last month ag

>> right. >> he wants to break us relationships with europe and nato. he's doing that successfully because trump vance don't understand the consequences of their actions. there was a clear break yesterday. we will see evolve and become manifest over the course of the next days. we'll see something come out of this meeting between zelensky and starmer, the prime minister. >> that's happening. >> now, that's happening now. it's going to roll forward. the us will be cut out of our security relationships. europeans are going to go it alone. we had this brief moment in which the us was really the sole superpower. yes. and we could do that because we were supported by nato, the european atlantic, euro-atlantic alliance, with the europeans choosing to go it alone because they know that the us won't be there. we'll have this break towards what our adversaries want. multi-polarity slightly smaller states having influence over their regions, and then that kind of more lopsided advantage that they have, that it's the europeans against russia, not as much of a mism

ambassador to nato.ay evening, president delivers an address before a joint session of congress. wednesday, the mayors of boston, chicago, denver and new york city testified before the house oversight committee on the policies of sanctuary cities. c-span continues our confirmation -- our coverage of confirmation hearings. on wednesday, dr. jay as the director of the national institute of health. and then martin makary. also, head over to c-span.org for scheduling information. or, to watch live or on-demand any time. c-span, democracy unfiltered. >> washington journal continues. host: welcome back. we are in open forum the next 20 minutes or so. we will start with jeff from little rock, arkansas on the line for democrats. good morning. caller: good morning. how are you? host: doing well. i wanted to mention -- caller: doing well. i wanted to mention it is a sad day. i have never seen such a tagteam bullying. god bless america. host: let's hear from larry in texas, line for republicans. hi, larry. caller:

there is some presence of western european nato troops allowed in ukraine. and of course, a lever of the foreign minister said no. so what will happen to the soldiers if they turn up their, i mean, right now they're in my 6, they're in british special forces in ukraine. what will happen to these troops if they turn up the well, you're free, help them to come up.

we're committed to nato. nato has to step up and the europeans have to step up more than they have. they are in farless than we're in. and they should be at least equal. why is the united states -- we have an ocean in between -- why is the united states in for so much more money and other things as europe? with that being said -- and as you said they've been very helpful. but we have put in far more than they have. and i think they should equalize. >> mr. president -- president trump: what changed between the first time that the secretary gave zelensky the agreement and today? president trump: we made a deal. i'm just -- i'm a business person. we made a deal, that's what changed. i didn't think we were going to make a deal. and we ended up making the deal. so that changed. >> how do you envision a trilateral -- >> well, they don't like each other, i can tell you that. they do not like each other. this is not a love match. it's unfortunate. the united states should not have allowed this to happen, ok? the united states run by a man that didn't know much. i'm going to be very nice. ru

not forget, since harry truman assigned in 1949 that agreement, that essentially the attack a what nato ally would be an attack on all. and they would come to the defense. there was now a big question as to whether that european secure to come and be guaranteed by the americans for the future because essentially compass things. you know what guys, you don't want peace, i want nothing more to do for you. so really a lot of thing does not, it may have come out in support of landscape over the night, but they will be scratching the head. i'm desperately trying to look at. i would ship them off the key. they can put this to rest once in full because the reality is without the us is back in europe, is kind of in a c on its own drifting away from. i take us through, i mean, what was clearly a shouting match in the office. i mean, some people quoting it of some kind of w, w e, smack down event. he all off to that will win so terribly wrong for that. and he went out for an interview with fox news, take us through the country. that is how well that was basically a continuation of the, let's see,

the head of nato basically said that it the head of nato basically said thatitis the head of nato basicallyzelensky repairs that re| their behalf. and i also on their behalf. and i also think that we should find the right mediator, somebody who both sides can trust, who can mediate between

we ought to get out of nato, too, which of course would collapse nato. who would that most benefit? who for whom would that be? really, really good news. donald trump says, let's let russia back into the g7. donald trump is reportedly preparing right now for his own big in-person summit with vladimir putin. donald trump already started high level meetings between the russian and us governments, including an inexplicable 3.5 hour meeting specifically between the president's real estate friend and vladimir putin himself. steve witkoff came back from that meeting. and how'd that go? went pretty well for someone headline parroting putin and trump. witkoff says russia was provoked into invading ukraine. headline trump envoy can't name a single concession russia will make in peace deal. what does it seem like is going on here? imagine if a foreign adversary. imagine if the putin government somehow could just do a thought experiment. imagine they could somehow exert control or influence over the government of the united states. what do you think the putin government would have the us gover

we are committed to nato. but nato has to step up in the europeans have to step up more than they have and i want to see them equalize because they are in it for far less than we are in and it should be at least equal. we have an ocean in between. why is the united states in for so much money and other things as europe? as you said, they have also been very helpful, but we have put in far more than they have and i think they should equalize. >> what changed between the first time secretary bessent gave president zelenskyy and the signing? pres. trump: we made a deal. that is what changed. i did not think we were going to make a deal and we ended up making a deal. >> how do you envision a trilateral summit with president zelenskyy? pres. trump: they don't like each other. i can tell you that. this is not a love match. and it's unfortunate. this is why you are in this situation. the united states should not have allowed this to happen. the united states, run by a man that didn't know much -- i'm going to be very

they were not going to be in nato. they were not going to be militarily able to recapture crimea and donbas. the only two issues were how far could donald trump force putin back to his 2022 point borders, and how would he be deter it? and he came up with this idea of making a commercial corridor to get prosperity. and also it was a tripwire. so there would be westerners there that putin would not want to dare, you know, bother. i think, you know, just to finish on, he should take a notebook from benjamin netanyahu. the biden administration was very hostile to him. they ordered him to have a cease fire. they ordered him to have a wartime cabinet. they warned him about collateral damage. they didn't do any of that to zelensky. and yet when netanyahu came over there, he knew there was a hostile administration. he was gracious. he understood that he was a client. and talking to a patron as a guest, to a host, and he was able to weather that and deal with the biden administration and all good things happened. but he didn't

turkey is a nato ally. they are also an example of a backsliding democracy that was never able to reverse course. so the ominous example, erdogan is a poor role model in my view for president trump. not quite as bad as mr. ormonde in hungary, the principal exemplary. we know hungary, also a nato member, part of the eu and very complex set of relationships. we know countries like turkey, sensible allies, turkey has been a good ally in some ways in nato historically. as well as countries that have a more intense or even hostile relationship with the u.s., and even friendly countries. every foreign national that you deal with is an intelligence risk. their nations all want something from the united states. so in that environment, to have enforcement action where we are trying to cut off in the adams prosecution, establish accountability for an american official. in my judgment, the evidence was quite strong. to see this unraveling where you have ended quid pro quo that are alleged. not only that adams did favo

um, i mean from as being saying off and on its possible there is some presence of western european nato troops allowed in ukraine. and the 2nd level of the foreign minister said no. so what will happen to the soldiers if they turn up their, i mean, right now they're in my 6, they're in british special forces in ukraine. what will happen to these troops if they turn up the well, if they happen to come without rushes approval, which is not forthcoming, as, as we see, they may become targets for russian strikes. and that would involve of those countries into a direct and immediate military conflict where the russian federation, i hope that the rulers of european country is a consider that seriously before. busy it's too long before it's too late. but you've been saying what's been coming out of the mouths of these a european deletes, increasingly on popular with their own populations in recent weeks, they clearly see rusher as the enemy. they believe russia has designs on london and paris, and they seem to think that the by, even separating from the united states, they can take on russia a

a real with russia was a band to ensure your p, a nato allies, a choice. the prism trump certainly would want to avoid. so yeah, clearly there is talk of withdrawal of us troops occupying troops from western europe, but trump is wielding a degree of leverage against something economic leverage against east west and european countries. for other reasons. russia though, and we've been covering on this program over the past 3 years, was paying zalinski for the rent of the pipeline usage for gas into western europe and is supplying energy still to west and europe have. when is rest, you're going to sanction the countries of west in europe? well, i don't, so i wouldn't, i wouldn't bet on that of europe may eventually sanction russia and they're completely cut off those that never stay. so here it is union that are still getting gas from russia that would be a risky move in terms of the integrity and unit, sorry to interrupt that he was really advise that off the black market. that because it needs the energy con, supply of old united states can supply all of it

they are at just over 2% as far as defense spending in nato. i talked to the u.k.inister, they want to do more they will do peacekeepers there at about 2.5%. these are numbers where they are low as far as what they are contributing individually not only to nato but into ukraine. now is europe, they put in about $140 billion. that said, it is not enough if the u.s. steps aside. if the weapons stock, if the u.s. stops its support. you are right. europe probably cannot do it alone, despite their encouraging words that they tweeted out today. that is why today was so detrimental to the entire picture. all of the leaders acknowledge that this would not happen without president trump. he is the only person with this catalyst to change the paradigm that may be there could be peace. that's why it was so screwed up what happened in the oval office. >> sean: and you gave him every opportunity, i thought, to fix it. and you're right. you kept throwing him a lifeline, you may want to go here to make sure that he understood that was a fascinating interview on what was on incred