this is after a phone call with georgia secretary of state brad raffensperger after the election. >>1,000, 780 11,780 votes. >> reporter: when that call was made, willis had been in office for one day. >> we have been investigating this for two and a half years. we're ready to go. >> reporter: ready to go and in the process ruffling donald trump's feathers. >> this woman is not a capable woman. she's a racist. this is a person that wants to indict me. >> reporter: the accusations of racism unfound the. donald trump also included her in this ad called the mud squad. >> it is rick list ridiculous. but i support his right to his first amendment rights. >> i've never been called the n word so much in my life. >> reporter: willis was voted fulton county first female district attorney after ousting a six personal primary. she was the leading prosecute in the georgia cheating school scandal. she went after gangs like drug rich. and she handed down racketeer and influence indictments to popular rappers including young thug. willis cited the rapper's song lick lyrics in the case. she was born

i want to go back to caroline polisi and you have heard that brad raffensperger has been subpoenaed, much is that is going to have an influence on all 19 people charged in georgia? >> it is an interesting development, because while the evidentiary hearing on monday specifically only pertains to this one question of removal, it is the question of the chicken or the egg, in that you will be getting a preview to the defense of the underlying merits of the whole case in general and we remember that infamous call to brad raffensperger where president trump asked him to find 11,789 votes, and the issue here is that meadows was intricately involved in the call. and fani willis previewed that, and we knew that brad raffensperger would be called, but now it is official word, and now previewed in the argument that not only was it is not, you know conduct engaged in as the purpose of the president's chief of staff, official duty, but it was actually outside of the per v purview of the realm of politics to influence the election results in the state of georgia. >> the president can ask you to do

brad raffensperger made a very clear, he thought it was inappropriate for somebody like mark meadows to be actually calling cam to get involved in this. he thought that, you know what, i'm not going to bother to respond, but he did that call and said very clearly during the call to donald trump as well as mark meadows and donald trump's lawyers, look, i cannot help you. there's nothing i can be able to do. so, brad raffensperger testified on behalf of the state of georgia today, and it was consistent with the testimony he's given to the 16 committee and two other investigations. >> katie phang, stick where you are. i know you had a long day. but we want to hear more from you. i did want to bring in a couple other legals to join you. court service chief of criminal division for -- and washington d. c.. she's also co-host of the excellent podcast, the prosecuting donald trump i, listen to it every week. shang who is a former federal prosecutor who served as counsel to attorney general janet reno will join me now. mary, let me start with you because i think we're all trying to understan

brad raffensperger is on the receiving end of the infamous phone call where trump asks him to find votes. mark meadows is on that call. this georgia state investigator, frances watson, who is another person who mark meadows directly sort of dealt with, interacted with, texted with about trying to look for new votes and to take another look at the election in georgia. so it's really going to be sort of a preview of, i think, the determinative issue at trial tomorrow. >> carrie, meadows is not the only defendant to ask for their case to be moved to federal court. david schaefer and kathy latham, who served as a fake elector, both filed similar notices. they claim they were just acting at trump's direction. do any of these defendants have a chance, and what do we make of what's going to happen with this case with all of these defendants ping-ponging in different directions, wanting different things. it sounds like it could be chaotic. >> there certainly are a lot of different moving parts because so many different defendants and defendants who are coming at this from very different perspect

attorney -- lawrence of trump's call to brad raffensperger through media accounts.e investigators that it was clear trump was ignoring doj reports, on the lack of election fraud. trump uses about firing at an oval office meeting, the same day calling him a never trumper. it on january 4th, he resigns. and then there is of course january 6th. trump mentions georgia 20 times at that infamous rally near the white house. he cites conspiracies about alleged irregularities, and says election officials should find those votes needed to overturn biden's victory. an angry mob then storms the capitol, and as we know, despite the attack, joe biden's 2020 victory is eventually certified by congress. but six of georgia's eight house republicans, well, they vote to invalidate election results in other states. and the next day, kathy lincoln, the republican party chair in coffee county, georgia, brings the bill bondsman, scott graham hall, to the county elections office to breach election equipment. latham, hall, sydney powell, and misty hinted, the county's elections director, th

amy: willis opened the probe after trump pressured georgia's republican secretary of state brad raffensperger in january 2021 to "find 11,780 votes" -- that was the margin trump would have needed to defeat joe biden in georgia. part of the charges also stem from a breach of voting machines in coffee county about 200 miles from atlanta. the indictment alleges the criminal enterprise operated in other states, including michigan, arizona, pennsylvania, nevada, and new mexico. fani willis has given trump and his co-defendants until august 25 to turn themselves in. this all comes as trump is the republican frontrunner in the 2024 race. we'll have more on the story after headlines. in hawaii, the death toll from the maui fires has reached 99 and is expected to climb significantly as 1300 people remain unaccounted for. crews have searched for bodies in only about 25% of the devastated area. it is already the deadliest wildfire in the united states in over a century. hawaii governor josh green spoke monday. >> as i shared earlier, that field of destruction is incredible. also you know we are well ove

trump calling the secretary of state of georgia, again a very conservative republican named brad raffensperger, after the election and this is what he suggests that raffensperger do. >> i just want to find 11,780 votes, which is one more than we have, because we won the state. >> i mean, that is just a reminder. >> you asked the question earlier why georgia? that phone calls one of the big answers to that question. another one, and also relevant to lindsey graham, is that fani willis in 2001 opens this investigation and starts -- >> 2021. >> that's right, 2021. looks into rumors of meddling in georgia and she doesn't get to cooperation, principally from the federal officials who she reaches out to four interviews. people like lindsey graham. and that is what compels her to the special grand jury. it is the only grand jury that has investigative capability and the state of jarreau georgia, and that grand jury really turbochargers her investigation into this malfeasance that of course result in the recommendation to pursue an indictment, which is why we have the conclusion of the regular grand m

others in brad raffensperger office were also on that call.ion in that phone call, which the indictment calls criminal conduct by mark meadows. >> so, mister president, if i might be able to jump in, and i'll give greater chance. mister secretary, obviously there is, there are allegations where we believe that not every vote or fair vote and legal vote was counted, and that's at odds with the representation from the secretary of state's office. what i'm hopeful for is, is there some way that we can find some kind of agreement to look at this a little bit more fully? you know, the president mentioned fulton county. but in some of these areas where there seems to be a difference of where the facts seem to lead, and so, mister secretary, i was hopeful that, you know, in the spirit of cooperation and compromise, is there something that we can at least have a discussion to look at some of these allegations to find a path forward that less litigious? >> well, i listened to what president has just said. president trump, we've had several lawsuits, an

s office is lining up witnesses including the secretary of state brad raffensperger. raffensperger has been subpoenaed to appear at that hearing along with three others who would have been privy to that phone call that donald trump made to the state of georgia asking them to find votes after the election that could flip the state in his favor though he had lost it. it's important at this phase because meadows is trying to argue he was acting as a government official. the d.a.'s office is saying this wasn't part of his job at all as a government official. here's one of the things that meadows was saying on that call to raffensperger. >> what i'm hopeful for is there is some way that we can find some kind of agreement to -- to look at this a little bit more fully. you know, the president mentioned fulton county. but in some of these areas where there seems to be a difference of where the facts seem to lead. so mr. secretary, i was hopeful that in the spirit of cooperation and compromise is there something that we can at least have a discussion to look at some of these a

and then, if it was really true, why is he threatening brad raffensperger with criminal prosecution? i mean, that, to me, is the best part of this. it's like the combination of saying i need you to find just the number that will let me when, and if you don't do it you understand i am the president of united states and you are playing with fire. i just think that constellation could make it really hard for a defense lawyer to mount a defense. >> we're gonna have to squeeze in a commercial break right here, and what i want to come back to when we come back is the conflict on this very point, the donald trump now has with mark meadows. mark meadows's lawyer in his first filing in this case to try to remove it to federal court, has said something that was also revealed in jack smith's indictment, that mark meadows testimony is going to be, i went down to georgia, i was not allowed to illegally enter the room during the audit, which i try to do. they kept me out. but i went back to the white house and i told donald trump the audit is operating flawlessly. they are counting every vote flaw

he said something similarly when asked about setting up the call between donald trump and brad raffensperger, that that was part of his job as white house chief of staff, even though raffensperger testified that the federal government doesn't play a role in certifying the results at this state level. to give you a sense of how broadly the meadows' team is viewing his responsibilities, here's part of what played out. the judge asked meadows' attorney at one point, could he be acting under federal authority if trump wasn't acting under federal authority. and meadows' attorney says the answer is definitely yes. so, again, meadows was on the stand for about 3 1/2 hours in a hearing that lasted all day long. the judge did not rule from the bench, but he said he will do so quickly. so we're expecting a ruling on paper. and he acknowledged that arraignments in this case are now scheduled in the state court on september 6th. >> and so the clock begins ticking. evan perez is in washington tonight. evan, you watched this doj hearing very closely today when the judge set the trial date for march 4, 202

on november 20th, brad raffensperger certifies biden as the winner.republican party, who is also indicted, sends an email -- that very same day -- seeking assistance for scott graham hall, an atlanta area bail bondsmen who is looking into election fraud on behalf of donald trump. luis alleges this guy, schaffer, like the others, knew there was no such fraud. and over 25th, sydney powell files a lawsuit in georgia alleging a massive anti trump conspiracy involving rigged voting machines. and then you've got to fast forward to december 3rd. attorneys for trump make the first of three appearances before state lawmakers making what prosecutors say are false claims about election fraud in an effort to persuade them to reject the states duly elected qualified presidential electors that were going to joe biden. on december 5th, trump calls georgia governor brian kemp, and urges him to order a special legislative session to overturn biden's victory. georgia's governor, brian kemp, rejects that. on december 6th, trump calls individual legislators hoping to, qu

before we pivot gears, blayne was talking about the testimony of brad raffensperger. how rural is that testimony, and do you think this is almost going to be a preview of a trial, what we can learn about fani willis' case. >> i think blayne is right as usual. this is a preview. we could be hearing from brad raffensperger and three others who were also subpoenaed including two other people on that infamous phone call. thaif might not end up being called to testify, but it would be very notable if we could actually hear them in public in open court laying out their view of that phone call which, of course, we've heard so many times over the last few years. this is one of the most consequential pretrial motions that we're going to see, because some legal experts say, if this succeeds, if meadows emotion succeeds, it could mean all the defendants' cases get moved to federal court. why does that matter? for one thing, it means there will be a broader jury pool, from ten counties in metro atlanta than fulton county which is a democratic stronghold that joe biden captured wi

brad raffensperger testified he thought it was a campaign call. he didn't feel it was appropriate. how much do you think the judge will take that into account? >> oh, that's going to be the central issue. and that's why the judge asked those follow-up questions today. that is really what the judge has to consider. we know that the chief of staff's role is not just an administrative role, where you're just making phone calls or arranging meetings. so, the key question here is beyond those things, were you doing something to violate the law, violate federal law, violate georgia state law? and that is why the judge honed in on that today because that really is the central point of this investigation and the central issue before the judge in federal court. >> andrew, hit on this a little bit more about whether his actions were political or if they were administrative for the government. because this wasn't about the government in 2020. this was about who would be the next president in 2021. >> sure. there's no doubt in my mind, john, that from his perspective, as any number of a millio

that includes georgis secretary of state brad raffensperger who trump pressured to find enough votes thstate. >> so, look, all i want to do is this. i just want to find 11,780 votes, which is one more than we have. because we won the state. >> a federal judge will also hear arguments from mark meadows, a codefendant and former trump's white house chief of staff. cnn's katelyn polantz has the latest. >> reporter: there are other people what mark meadows is trying to do in this case, move the case from state court to federal court. donald trump has that ability to make that ask, too, at some point, he hasn't done that yet. and the reason that meadows is doing this is because he's trying to claim he has some sort of protection because he was a federal officer at the time of the actions he was taking that he's charged with here in georgia. so the questions could go many hours, as far as hearings go, it could be a long one. it's that were the things that mark meadows was doing which is setting up calls, being on calls with trump reaching out to state legislators, reaching out to people in

sarah, brad raffensperger testified to this point. the issue is whether or not his actions were as a federal employee, as chief of staff to the president of the united states, if he was acting on that behalf, or if it was a political action. a campaign action. brad raffensperger testified he thought it was a campaign call. he didn't feel it was appropriate. how much do you think the judge will take that into account? >> that is going to be the central issue. that is why the judge asked the follow-up questions today. that is really what the judge has to consider. we know that the chief of staff's role is not to be an administrative role, we are making phone, calls me arranging meetings. so, the key question here, beyond those things, were you doing something to violate the law? violate the federal. violate georgia state law. and that is why the judge honed in on that today. that is really the central point of this investigation. the central issue before the judge in federal court. >> and, your head on this a little bit more. whether or

brad raffensperger is supposed to testify at this hearing tomorrow.n that now infamous call where trump asked the secretary to find more votes to help him win in georgia. we've all heard that, and let's play it one more time. fed owes was on that call and we played this earlier and let's play a clip now. >> what i'm hopeful for is there are some way that we can -- that we can find some kind of an agreement to -- to look at this a little bit more fully. the president mentioned cufulto county and in some of the areas where there seems to be the facts seem to lead and so mr. secretary, i was hopeful that in the spirit of cooperation and compromise, is there something that we can at least have a discussion to look at some of these allegations to find a path forward that's less litigious? >> carrie, it's remarkable that that took place four days before january 6th, but the other thing is that fulton district attorney fani willis, she'll be pointing to this call and what mark meadows was doing on that call and saying that's not very chief of staffish. >> ri

there was a call to an investigator in brad raffensperger's office where he asked him to work duringhe would be a hero if he found errors. >> a parade of alleged co-conspirators were arrested, former chief of staff, mark meadows and several lawyers who worked to overturn the election, john eastman, sydney powell, jenna ellis and rudy giuliani, who himself made prosecuting rico cases popular. >> i am very, very honored to be involved in this case because this case is a fight for a way of life. this indictment is a travesty. >> they've all been booked and are out on bond. >> most of the defendants who have been charged along with former president trump have turned themselves in here at the fulton county jail, all of them finger printed and photographed, and all, but one, released on bond. >> nicknamed rice street after its address is known for its noxious reputation. >> the fulton county jail is notorious for its deplorable conditions. ever since it was opened, there's everything wrong with the jail from the sewage backing up in the toilets in the cells, people sleeping on the floor be

so, gene, the georgia secretary of state brad raffensperger testified today as well. he was on that infamous call, trump looking for his 11,000 votes, what do you think his testimony will mean for mark meadows overall arguments? he basically said the call was political, and to what trump was asking him was inappropriate. >> he the thing he did the hurt as cases he said he was acting on behalf of donald trump. you can complain about how a blanket ambush your money, but you can't rob it. so, with trump did is he devised a scheme to affect the electoral votes and he brought mark meadows in to help him execute the scheme. the other thing mark meadows did that came out of that hearing is he violated the hatch dock and you cannot under any circumstances claim color of law if you're violating the hatch jack. so he, shot himself in the foot. >> he saying everything i edward waters university did, broadly speaking was part of my responsibility because as the president of the united states anything that he wants goes. >> well, it has limitations. the hatch had says you can only

extremely powerful in terms of dealing with elections. >> the focus for our office -- >> in georgia brad raffenspergeressman jody hice. that was not enough for hice to win the may primary. raffensperger will be the candidate for secretary of state in november. in arizona mark finchem wants the job which is being vacated by a democrat. >> arizona state representative mark finchem is with us tonight and what a job he's done. >> he's already received the endorsement of donald trump. he has said over and over again this was a fraudulent election. he's called for decertification. he's got a decent chance to win this primary. if we had people like that in these key positions moving forward, i think we are in danger. >> in pennsylvania the governor apoints the secretary of state, and this is the republican nominee for governor, doug mastriano who was protesting outside the capitol on january 6th. >> as governor i get to decertify any or all machines in the state, and obviously i have my eye on several counties who had machines i believe are compromised. >> six of the ten house republicans who voted to impeac

again you have brad raffensperger. and engineer by trade before he became secretary of state.s about how never see is about even taken this call. he thought it was a campaign call because they were campaign attorneys on the phone. he thought that the shipment beyond this at all. that it went beyond the bounds of what he hearda softball question. it was this really a settlement call? does not bode well from mr. meadows. >> and barbara mcquade there seems to be credibility questions for mark meadows in this. we know from the summary reported in some of the newspapers that he claimed that he went to georgia when he visited the caught county vote audit that was going on there. and was turned away. he said he was there. he was in town because he was visiting one of his children. he wasn't there because of the election. it just happened to decide to go to atlanta that day. to visit one of his children. and then decided to just stop by the spot. where their auditing votes to see if he could illegally get in the room where the votes were being audited. this is one of those things wher

they are extremely powerful dealing with elections. >> the focus -- >> in georgia, brad raffenspergervember. in arizona, a state representative wants the job which is being vacated by a democrat. >> arizona state representative mark fincham is with us tonight. what a job he's done. >> he's already received the endorsement of donald trump. he has said over and over again, that this was a fraudulent election. he's called for decertification. he's got a decent chance to win this primary. if we had people like that in these key positions moving forward, i think we are in danger. >> in pennsylvania, the governor appoints the secretary of state. and this is the republican nominee for governor. doug mastriano who was protesting outside the capitol on january 6th. >> as governor, i get to decertify any or all machine in the state. i believe the machines are compromised. >> six of the ten house republicans who voted to impeach donald trump are facing primary challenges this year from republicans endorsed by trump or energized by him. one has already lost. another appears to have eeked out a vi

that will include the secretary of state brad raffensperger, we believe. ere are three other people who have also been subpoenaed, one who received an additional call from trump that was a georgia investigator, two others on that raffensperger call and then here's just a glimpse of one of the things we're likely to hear in court today. there is some sound from that audio call that trump made to brad raffensperger. let's take a listen to it for a section. it starts with a lawyer from the state of georgia speaking and then meadows' response. >> i'm happy to, you know, sit down or have our lawyer sit down with the lawyers on that side and explain to him, hey, based on what we've looked at so far here's how we know this is wrong, this is wrong, this is wrong. >> so, what you're saying, ryan, so what you're saying you really don't want to give access to the data, you just want to make another case on why the lawsuit is wrong? >> i don't think we can give access to data that's protected by law, but we can sit down with him and say -- >> but you're allowed to have

one of the witnesses that fani willis has called is brad raffensperger who of course was pressured by donald trump to find the votes needed for trump to win the 2020 election in georgia which he of course lost. we've seen similar moves by jeffrey clark and latham. would sear looking for signals what the judge might have to say more broadly about the pool of defendants, wolf. >> as you know, sarah, one defendant is already asked for a speedy trial. how fast could this move to trial? >> that is right. ken cheesebro working with the former president in the aftermath of the 2020 election was quick out of the gate in saying and he has right to do this in georgia, he wanted a speedy trial and the judge said okay, we could get the ball rolling. we could move ahead in october 2023. one of the things that the judge said in this order, though, is at this time, these deadlines do not apply to any co-defendant. making clear that he's going to set this trial date, but for ken cheesebro only. now within the last hour or two, we also saw sidney powell, another one of the attorneys who was working wi

sara mentioned that infamous phone call with donald trump and brad raffensperger, that's what got this started, but there was so much more. donald trump got on the phone with the governor of georgia brian kemp trying to pressure him into meddling with the vote count, changing the totals. e phone with the attorney general of georgia and wanted to keep him away from a lawsuit that was trying to overturn the results. he sent allies like rudy giuliani and mark meadows to go to georgia. rudy giuliani presented bogus claims of fraud to the state senate and the state house. that has been a part of this investigation as well. mark meadows was on the ground in cobb county in atlanta where they were doing signature matching and sending updates back to the white house. there are other parts of this that were not directly tied to the white house and donald trump, but were allies of the former president who were trying to help his cause, people that were involved in the briefing of a voting system in a rural county trying to basically break in and find fraud on those machines. of course, the fraud

as brad raffensperger said, this was a slice and dice video that they portrayed as being the alpha andga of the smoking gun proof that fraud had happened, that they had pulled out suitcases a ballots underneath a desk in state farm arena and then copied them 18,000 times, running through to jack up biden's victory. except the hand recount and the machine recount denied that. because if you have the ballots, then you don't have 18,000 additional votes. and the targeting of ruby freeman, by saying that she is a hustler, she is a dope dealer, hustler, hustler, linking blackness with criminality. it was a way to then try to solidify that charge of fraud. and by -- when the minister goes to ruby freeman's house and he knocks on her door and she won't answer and then he calls the black man to say, oh, she is afraid of talking to me because i am white -- again, playing the race card there. then you have blacks for trump then bringing in kanye west's publicist to try to convince her to live, to say that she did something that she did not do, putting enormous pressure on this woman. putting eno

you have obviously brad raffensperger who was the secretary of state, who got the phone call, hey, i need you to help me find 1100 votes. you also have former lieutenant governor geoff duncan. he's very interesting because not only is he sort of involved in the case, but he's also someone it appears as those this investigation may have derailed his political career. he decided i don't want to run for re-election. how have people who were sort of involved in this who were elected officials, how has this affected them on the ground? are there other people should this indictment come down, they'll be stepping away from or leaning into state politics? what might the results be at the state capitol level there in atlanta? >> yeah, jason, i'm glad you brought up the former lieutenant governor because he just left the courthouse behind me after testimony before the grand jury. he wouldn't say exactly what he told the grand jurors but he did say the nation is at a pivot point, a turning point, and he said republicans should move on from donald trump. this is something we in georgia have hear

brad raffensperger did resist some of what mr trump had to say. here are some further extracts.he most pointed exchanges, mr trump spelled out how many votes he needed. well, it won't come as any surprise that a couple of hours after the latest charges were made public in georgia donald trump took to his truth social network. he denied and condemned the allegations. he said the witch hunt against him continued and appeared to suggest the charges were politically motivated. he posted... "why didn t they indict 2.5 years ago? because they wanted to do it right in the middle of my political campaign. witch hunt!" another person charged was mr trump's former lawyer rudy giuliani. here's his reaction. in a statement to cbs news the former new york mayor called the charges an "affront to american democracy". he went on to say the indictment "does permanent, irrevocable harm" to the justice system, describing it as "just the next chapter in a book of lies" to frame mr trump. he added... "the real criminals here are the people who have brought this case forward both directly and indirec

s office, only to have secretary of state brad raffensperger then, a republican, immediately contradict testimony. joining me now, blayne alexander in atlanta, and catherine christian, former manhattan assistant district attorney. blayne, bring us up to speed on the testimony of raffensperger. there was a clear division on how he and mark meadows described the phone call from donald trump. meadows was on the call looking for more votes. >> reporter: they described it completely differently. what we heard from mark meadows during his nearly four hours on the stand, he laid out his duties as the chief of staff and said it was customary to set up phone calls between the former president and anybody else. he said he thought it was basically his way of kind of trying to settle some outstanding legal issues in the least litigious way possible. that was mark meadows. when we heard from raffensperger, he believed he thought it was a campaign phone call because of the presence of campaign lawyers on that call. he said that he is used to outreach from the white house, but what he saw to that exte

, she joked she wished brad raffensperger didn't live in fulton county, but he does. this is her territory. they have interviewed 75 witnesses for the special grand jury investigation, and compiled who knows how many documents and reams of information, so she's ready, and i think we saw that when she basically called chesebro's bluff, and said you know what, i'm ready for trial october 23rd if it comes to that. we don't know if it will come to that, chesebro's defense attorneys have not seen discovery. they don't know what kind of case prosecutors have lined up. they could retract the request for a speedy trial. fani willis has demonstrated she's ready for anything that comes at her. >> i wonder, the test, laura, of the criminal justice system, it's been tested on the federal level, on the state level. is it ready? >> i don't think it knows yet, and i think part of the challenge is figuring out how to treat somebody fairly who obviously occupies a position like nobody else, right, so even just going -- >> and uses his position like nobody else. >> right, we have talke

let's start with brad raffensperger being ordered him to testify against meadows. infamous call in which trump begged raffensperger to find 11,780 votes. what do you think the d.a. is -- what is behind the d.a.'s request to have him testify? >> it is interesting because on that call, brad raffensperger is standing his ground based on the law, based on principle, based on the facts that he had available to him that there was no fraud under minding the results of the georgia election. yet there's not only donald trump who is pressuring brad raffensperger to just find 7000, 11,780 votes that did not exist, but you hear mark meadows chime in as well. he is supporting, and bolstering, and trying to reinforce donald trump's corrupt ask, that there is a lot of fraud here that we have become aware of and of course, those claims seem to have ultimately been debunked. they were untrue and mark meadows was sort of playing a big role in the pressure being applied to it will become difficult for mark meadows to say that it was in the scope of his official duties as chief of staf

again, you have brad raffensperger who is an engineer by trade before he became secretary of state.s about even taking this call. he thought it was a campaign call because they were campaign attorneys on the phone. he thought that he shouldn't have been on the side, all that it wouldn't be on the bounce of what he had done before. and for the judge to ask mr. raffensperger which seems to be a softball question, is this really a settlement call? does not bode well for mr. meadows. >> barb mcquade, there seems to be credibility questions from mark meadows in this. we know from this summer he reported in some of the newspapers that he claimed that he went to georgia when he visited the cop county for the vote audit that was going on out there and it was turned away. he said he was there, he was in town because was visiting one of his children. he wasn't there because of the election, just happen to decide to go to atlanta that day to visit one of his children and then decided to turn to the spot to audit votes and see if he could illegally get in the room where the votes were being aud

georgia secretary of state brad raffensperger. he was the one trump asked to find those votes, just enough, by one vote extra, to overturn the state. have a listen. this is key. >> so look, all i want to do is this. i just want to find 11,780 votes, which is one more than we have, because we won the state. >> one more vote than necessary to overturn the results. regardless of the president's demand, the former president's demand, raffensperger certified biden's win in the state of georgia, recertified the results after trump's team requested a recount that didn't change the results. he also testified before the special grand jury last year. also key, rudy giuliani. remember him? former mayor of new york. also former personal attorney for donald trump. he oversaw trump's post-election strategy including pursuing many of the false claims of fraud. he led efforts to challenge vote-counting efforts in a number of states, not just georgia, and he presented those bogus fraud claims to lawmakers, state officials, et cetera. he's very muc

then of course, the next day, he goes out and publicly it says, basically, i asked brad raffenspergerse questions and he didn't have answers, which the recording proves that he had very competent answers to every one of those points. >> what is really stunning is that they have these conversations, and raffensperger goes no, no, no, and then the next day, donald trump is out there saying yes. yeah, that is what -- and he didn't know, obviously, because he was being taped. sometimes he doesn't know when he's being taped, and still disagrees with what he said. >> that is really key, because it goes to this broader issue of he knew, he was willfully lying, and that instance, willfully lying about the phone call that he had had with raffensperger. so it really shows trump's lies to be knowing and willful. >> and anybody who wants to look at it at home, the georgia section on the indictment is starting on page 12. and it goes into quite some detail. you know, it is interesting, one of the individuals who's on the ground in georgia and texts donald trump to tell him that the georgia electio

so in georgia, for example, we know that there was trump's call with brad raffensperger, false slatesf lectors, activity with tampering with voting machines in kauffman county. this would allow fani willis to bring under one case all those. >> in the indictment that came out now, jack smith listed seven state where there were attempts to overturn the election, he says. why is georgia so important? why does it seem to be the one where it's getting so much attention? what makes this case different? >> i don't know. each state has different facts and different laws, but i imagine one of the reasons in georgia is because we have the very best evidence in georgia of any other place because it's the only place i'm aware of where there is a recording of donald trump pressuring an election official to throw the election. that call where he demands brad raffensperger find him 11,780 votes that's the clip we hear but the entire call lasts for about an hour. he is repeatedly pushing brad raffensperger, if you don't do this there could be criminal consequences for you. raffensperger constantly pu

including his call to georgia secretary of state brad raffensperger. >> i just want to find 11,780 voteswhich is one more than we have. because we won the state. >> reporter: to the fake electors to convened to cast illegitimate votes for trump. the investigation also accuses multiple defendants of harassment of election workers and a voting system's breach in rural coffee county. >> i want to try him and be respectful for our sovereign states. >> reporter: and while fulton county district attorney fani willis says she intends to try the 19 defendants together, it's up to the judge on when the trial will proceed. >> we do want to move this case along and so, we will be asking for a proposed order that occurs, trial date within the next six months. >> reporter: the former president is facing a flurry of legal filings and legal issues. for some it's hard to keep up. but this is more than just about his so-called perfect phone call with georgia secretary of state. this according to fani willis is about an orchestrated and organized effort to pressure georgia lawmakers in fulton county elect

he explicitly exhorted his followers to vote against brad raffensperger. brad raffensperger.d in office. so did the georgia governor, who trump also campaigned against and ran against, won his primary , stayed against, won his primary, stayed in office. this is not a great environment for him to be in. >> what donald trump might say is that these are rhinos, these are republicans only. are republicans in name only. and actually, this tape and actually, what this tape shows nothing of the sort in shows is nothing of the sort in terms of him trying to invent ballots. he genuinely believes that he won that state and he was saying you need to look in every nook and cranny to find where votes might where these votes that might have mysteriously disappeared. so yeah, argument about so yeah, so his argument about that comment, the that particular comment, the 11,780, that was an 11,780, is that that was an aspirational statement and not actually urging somebody to do something criminal. >> but the problem is when you look crimes that are look at the crimes that are being alleged, on

we heard that tape, we heard the former president, then president speaking to brad raffensperger for example. you know all of these details quite well, of course, and having handled the impeachment trials. but i wonder, the fact that that is on tape, the fact that it is there and we can play it for a second to remind the audience what it sounded like. i want you to listen to it and try to tell me what you do with that because a defense council. listen to this. >> i just want to find 11,780 votes, which is one more than we have, because we won the state. >> now, of course, as you rightly pointed out and as fani willis pointed out, the brimson of innocence is certainly here. this is an indictment about probable cause. but, prospective jurors have likely heard this as well. you'd be hard to find jurors who are completely ostriches who have never heard any of this and have had their head in the stand, the ban went goals of the world. how do you defend against what is on tape? >> it's a great question. tapes are very powerful. i think in this case, though, the clear answer is especially p

sparked by an infamous phone call between the former president and georgia's secretary of state, brad raffensperger a little of what mr trump said during the call. now, aside from the phone call with mr raffensperger, mr trump is also accused of pressuring lawmakers. mr trump's team told them they had the power to decertify the state's electoral college results. he also allegedly coordinated a scheme to have fake members of the electoral college cast their votes for mrtrump in georgia, rather thanjoe biden, who won the state. and, mr trump's campaign lawyers also reportedly worked with a data firm to copy sensitive data from election systems in a georgian county. the most serious charge — violating the racketeer influenced and corrupt organizations act — is punishable by a maximum of 20 years in prison. the act is designed to help take down organised criminal syndicates like the mafia. former president trump denies all charges and has taken to the social media site truth social stating "the witch hunt continues" and claiming election interference. here's the bbc�*s north america correspondent sean

we understand that now brad raffensperger, election investigator frances watson, have been subpoenaed of the federal court hearing on charges against mark meadows. as you know, jose, mark meadows, former president trump's chief of staff, has been trying to get the charges in georgia moved to federal court. there is a hearing on monday to discuss whether to do that and now we understand brad raffensperger, at the center of all these georgia charges that notorious phone call that former president trump made to georgia officials back on december of 2020, december, january, 2020, brad raffensperger being subpoenaed to appear at this hearing on monday, along with the election investigator frances watts. that breaking news just within the past few moments. we can tell you that mark meadows still expected to surrender here in atlanta by noon tomorrow or face arrest according to fani willis. this is -- he's still trying as this whole process plays out to move these georgia charges to federal court and that hearing on monday and now two georgia election officials have been subpoenaed to appear

well statement made to state officials, for example, donald trump sent a letter to brad raffensperger at one point saying, basically, there has been massive fraud and you need to do something about it. the fake electors scheme is number three. number four, really interesting to me, harassment of election workers. miss freeman and miss, moss they are named in this indictment as victims of one of the racketeering acts. and then solicitation of the justice department. we saw that in jacks mitt's indictment. we attempt to sort of weaponize the doj to give some credence to these bogus claims of election fraud. next solicitation of the vice president, mike pence, to violate his duties. and then the last two are breach of the voting machines. which we just reported, i think exclusively here on cnn, had a or two ago, that is now one of the bases for these racketeering charge. and, finally a fairly broad range of obstruction of justice, allegations. so that is the centerpiece of this indictment, that is what is going to drive this case here, and that is count one of his indictment. >> so when

one is brad raffensperger, and also his chief investigator, frances watson. watson was one of the people that physically prevented mark meadows from entering the space where the cobb county audit was being performed, i think on december 22nd, when he traveled to georgia. and meadows personally arranged the call between trump and watson. again, frances watson, brad raffensperger's chief investigator, who, where trump told watson she would be praised if he prevailed in the election. she seems like an incredibly damaging witness as mark meadows is trying to say, everything i was doing down there was under the color of my work for the federal government. barbara, you talk about the evidence presented in the hearing, that's damaging also because it could be used in a criminal trial, can't it? >> it can, especially when meadows himself tries to testify. but i think his lawyers must be smart enough to preclude him from doing that. but if he is to testify, and frankly, he has the burden of proving that this case should be removed to federal court. it's hard to imagin

fa fani willis has subpoenaed the secretary of state, brad raffensperger, to come and testify. what does that tell you about what monday is going to look like? and what does it mean if trump follows through? >> i think monday is going to be interesting for a couple of reasons. we've heard so little from mark meadows in any of these criminal cases. the fact his legal team is first out of the gate to make this challenge and show up in court -- and there are going to be live witnesses, not just brad raffensperger, but a couple of other attorneys that were on this infamous call between donald trump and brad raffensperger where he's asking raffensperger to find the votes. this is an opportunity for willis to try to make the case that what was happening on this call was not a part of mark meadows' official duties as the white house chief of staff, that this was political activity, that this was, in her view, illegal activity, and that this should be a case that's -- i'm also curious, i mean, are we going to hear from mark meadows underoath? >> i think we're in store for a full fledge

on the call with brad raffensperger.his, i rarely give our viewers homework. but i remember i listened to it, saying i can't believe i'm telling you this, but please listen to the whole thing. i mean, it is trump's hands on the steering wheel of trying to cheat his way into the presidency, trying to deny the will of georgia voters. and to your point the first time we got to talk to you, tim, all that's come out since has made the evidence against trump stronger, has made it more clear how concerted the effort was, how wide it was and how deep it was. what is your sense in terms of what fani willis has developed and what may be imminent in georgia? >> look, i think what fani willis has developed is much what we laid out, nicolle, in our report. what we laid out in our hearings. some of it's included in the special counsel's indictment. the facts here have been relatively plain for a while. and they are shocking. you're exactly right. the call itself, the january 2nd call between the former president and secretary raffensp

brad raffensperger did push back in his call with president trump — here's a series of further extractsplicit part of the call — trump spelled out how many voters he needed. stephen loosley — an analyst in us politics at the united states studies centre in sydney — laid out the legal dilemmas mr trump now faces. it's a very serious indictment for a number of reasons. firstly, it is racketeering charge under georgia state law and racketeering legislation is modelled on the originalfederal legislation is modelled on the original federal legislation that was designed to bring down the mafia. the problem that donald trump faces is generally a conviction under legislation in georgia leads to a prison sentence, it is not certain that is the probability. secondly, mark meadows, the former chief of staff in the trump white house is amongst the 18 other people who have been indicted. he is a very senior official from who have been indicted. he is a very senior officialfrom the who have been indicted. he is a very senior official from the trump administration, and that is different. and you have