and cummings vows to release the full transcripts if issa won't. that same day issa changes his tune saying he won't release any transcripts. attacks cummings as reckless. yesterday cummings called issa's actions hypocritical giving him a monday deadline, this coming monday to review the transcripts before the release. on the heels of the cummings letter, reu techlt rreuters rep issa is widening his probe in addition to the interviews he has done, his committee identifies 20 more officials for future interviews. he keeps interviewing. it's a fishing expedition. has he got any hope or is he just playing for time here? >> at this point it looks like he's playing for time. the important thing is what cummings wants to release is the interview in cincinnati with an irs official who is a self-described conservative republican who says i'm the one who started this. so cummings -- >> i'm the one who said target the tea party and the patriot groups. >> let's give these guys -- if that's true, then the scandal couldn't have originated in washington or the w

but first there's the burning question in washington about what's in darrell issa's gut. >> what does your cut tell you now? what does your gut tell you now? what does your gut tell you now. >> new month, same controversies. >> a lot of attacking in washington these days. >> we never tried to tie things to the president. >> who is leading the attack on the president? >> darrell issa is ratcheting up the rhetoric. >> their paid liar. >> press secretary jay carney. >> making up things. >> calling jay carney a paid liar. >> this is a problem that was coordinated right out of washington. >> new month, same old controversies. >> the administration is trying to say there's a few rogue agents. >> issa didn't offer any definitive proof of collusion. >> they don't seem to have evidence. >> what does your gut tell you now. >> might have a gut feeling. >> this is a problem coordinated right out of washington. >> there's no factual evidence. >> my gut tells me too many people knew. >> why does he overreach and make things up. >> my gut tells me too many people knew. >> why does he as a prosecutor

. >>> coming up, darrell issa flip flops on the investigation, that means darrell issa is in the rewriteht. [ whirring ] [ dog barks ] i want to treat more dogs. ♪ our business needs more cases. [ male announcer ] where do you want to take your business? i need help selling art. [ male announcer ] from broadband to web hosting to mobile apps, small business solutions from at&t have the security you need to get you there. call us. we can show you how at&t solutions can help you do what you do... even better. ♪ [ susan ] i hate that the reason we're always stopping is because i have to go to the bathroom. and when we're sitting in traffic, i worry i'll have an accident. be right back. so today, i'm finally going to talk to my doctor about overactive bladder symptoms. [ female announcer ] know that gotta go feeling? ask your doctor about prescription toviaz. one toviaz pill a day significantly reduces sudden urges and accidents for 24 hours. if you have certain stomach problems or glaucoma, or cannot empty your bladder, you should not take toviaz. get emergency medical help right away if yo

as david said, darrell issa and others. it's not just darrell issa. there are lots of other committees. there's lots of other subpoena power in the house. by the way, there are senate committees where the democrats still control things where they're going to look at these things, too. but the republicans have no positive organizing principle right now. if you look at the new report that the young college republicans did about their own plight -- >> we're going to do that in the next segment, by the way. >> they're also saying, where's the positive message? they want one, too. the young republicans want one. >> the decency factor. let's talk about this attack by issa. he calls jay carney, who everybody knows is a pretty good guy. in fact, a pretty good journalist over the years. he calls him a liar. a paid liar. i always dislike that word. i don't use it. i always think once you say that, you're kicking the table over in terms of any decent political relationship. what are you going to say next? well, i know you're a liar, but. it does seem to be a gam

now rope a doping darrell issa is not really all that hard, because darrell issa really is kind of ahe one who said on tv he would release the transcripts at the very same time that he called the white house press secretary a paid liar. two facts about noting, darrell issa is paid, congressman cummings is paid, too, and this letter which is available on our website proves that congressman elijah cummings is earning every penny of that salary. and just give them the basics, you know. i got this. [thinking] is it that time? the son picks up the check? [thinking] i'm still working. he's retired. i hope he's saving. i hope he saved enough. who matters most to you says the most about you. at massmutual we're owned by our policyowners, and they matter most to us. whether you're just starting your 401(k) or you are ready for retirement, we'll help you get there. [ engine revving ] [ electricity crackling ] ♪ ed markey is ahead of his opponent by 12 points, and joining me next, on chris christie's problems with his party. this is my favorite one. it's upside down. oh, sorry. (woman vo) it ta

transcripts that directly contradict issa's assertions.ase the full transcripts if issa won't. that same dais sa says he won't release any transcripts and attacks cummings as reckless. yesterday cummings called issa's actions hypocritical giving him a monday deadline.top review the transcripts before they're released. on the heels of the cummings letter, issa is widening his probe in addition to the 1 interviews he's done, his committee identifies 20 more officials for future interviews. he keeps interviewing. it's a fishing expedition. has he got any hope or is he just playing for time here? >> at this point it looks like he's playing for time. the important thing is what cummings wants to release is the interview in cincinnati with an irs official who is a self-described conservative republican who says i'm the one who started this. socum mings. >> i'm the one who said target the tea party and the patriot groups. >> let's give these guys -- if that's true, then the scandal couldn't have originated in washington or the white house. that's

now rope a doping darrell issa is not really all that hard, because darrell issa really is kind of a is the one who said on tv he would release the transcripts at the very same time that he called the white house press secretary a paid liar. two facts about noting, darrell issa is paid, congressman cummings is paid, too, and this letter which is available on our website proves that congressman elijah cummings is earning every penny of that salary. [ male announcer ] frequent heartburn? the choice is yours. chalky... not chalky. temporary... 24 hour. lots of tablets... one pill. you decide. prevent acid with prevacid 24hr. you decide. capella university understands bright students are getting lost in the shuffle. need. and administration's work gets more complex every year. when you look at these issues, do you see problems or opportunities? with an advanced degree in education from capella university, you'll have the knowledge to meet these challenges and make a difference in the lives of students. let's get started at capella.edu. i want peacocks. peacocks? walking the grounds. in t

so then what has issa and them been talking about, joy reid? >> the fact as we know them are that darrell issa perpetrated a hoax. now whether it was deliberate hoax, or whether it was because he simply wanted to believe there was some political target in the tea party and back filled and tried to find evidence after he had already put out his theory, remains to be seen. but what we do know is darrell issa was in possession of the exact same transcripts that congressman elijah cummings. he knew at a tern certain point that the facts and the evidence did not back up his theory. at no time did darrell issa say you know what? maybe i had it wrong. this is the evidence in the transcript that we had that may mean that my theory was wrong. no, instead he continued to perpetrator the hoax and refused to release the transcripts that were evidence that what he was saying was false. i think somebody might need to investigate darryl issa. >> and congresswoman, the investigation, many people, including me are very concern candidate about the irs being used

, issa -- it's funny that the five distanced themselves from darrell issa -- >> the five on fox news.or them, it's amazing because the rest of the time it wouldn't. >> yeah i mean -- i don't know if that's because dana used to be the white house spokesperson and she doesn't like the idea of calling whoever has that tough job a liar every day, folks on the five don't think anything is out of balance, but the whole darrell issa -- the press is being used by darrell issa where he cherry picks these transcripts, and he claims he has the smoking gun, and if you look at it it's like well you don't. there's two degrees of separation that is missing between your claim that obama picked up the phone and said go get them. >> he has a half printed liberator. that just kind of ma ma and ran out of plastic. >> yeah. that was sunday, but the next day, the "new york times," darrell issa is turning up the heat, you know without pointing out the 20-second paragraph, oh by the way he doesn't have any proof, so the press plays along with the hearing charade, we saw the same charade, the build up to the

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darrell maserati issa. mr. issa wasted no time attacking the president and ms.st moments ago. >> you know, susan rice claims that she reads the classified dailies. obviously if she had read the classified dailies, she couldn't have been so wrong on benghazi, it's unfortunate the president is rewarding somebody for reading talking points that simply weren't true. >> mr. maserati issa there pumped up for tomorrow's hearings. every time, though, issa offers unsubstantiated attacks on the president or calls someone a liar, do a shot. of espresso, of course. >>> let's get to our guest. elijah cummings, is congressman elijah cummings, a democrat of maryland. good afternoon, sir. >> good afternoon, martin. >> i wonder if you could give us your response to the president's appointment of a known liar, susan rice, as his national security adviser, because that's how she has been repeatedly described by your colleague on the house oversight committee, mr. darrell issa. >> first of all, i think it's unfortunate that chairman issa would use such words for a, an awesome lady.

while i think issa is doing a great disservice in some regards.drawing a conclusion prior to an investigation taking place, i think the obama folks are in danger if they want get that glib. >> katty, the big picture is bad for both parties. if there is something bad for the administration on this, and let's assume the road ends where it does now, the argument for government i think is greatly undermined by these, these sort of controversies, which is government is bloated and wasteful and mismanaged and nobody has their hand on the captain's wheel. likewise, the republican party has been so completely fixated on this. you read the report from the college republican congress, the party is a mess, there's no actual agenda there. this is effectively a smoke skrooen while they figure out perhaps if they're aiming to figure out what they want to do. >> i think if you are a republican partisan, you buy into darrell issa's comments that somebody must have been lying. there must have been something nefarious going on there must have been a cover-up. i thi

he knows very well that darrell issa was -- there were no charges ever applied to darrell issa on allose things that came up 20, 30 years ago, all of the charges were dropped. for him to do that is amazing. there was a tweet that came after that and i can't remember who it was, but they put up a picture, and visualize this. picture of president obama in college and smoking some weed and it was a picture of that that said while the charges were being dropped on darrell issa for those things, here is what president obama was doing. there is no disputing that because president obama admitted to doing it. this is a peeing match, we call it that, going back and forth. let's just get to the truth. >> you don't have a problem with what i said? >> he could have used a hatchet or a scalpel. >> it was a disgraceful comment on his part. he started it, and the response was bad as well. if we can just get this thing -- for the chairman to take on some serious investigation to call people paid liars diminishes his own role in this thing and for him to come back and say that is bad too. it is gettin

issa's ilk. >> the question is, is that all congress is going to do? we just going to be obsessed with scandals and trying to score political points? the american people can not be screaming any more loudly. worry about us. work on the economy. >> indeed. i'm sure it's hard to hear those cries over the roar of the scandal mongering crowd. joining us now from capitol hill is congresswoman eleanor holmes-norton, democrat representing the district of columbia. good afternoon, ma'am. >> good afternoon. >> the senate is expected to start debating an immigration bill. we have student loans set to double in a few weeks unless congress acts. the president wants to close guantanamo bay. the sequester is damaging the lives of millions of people from meals on wheels for the elderly, to vulnerable children losing their places on the head start program. but congress' car thief in chief, darrell issa, wants us all to stay focused on the irs. could you please explain to our audience why that is? >> what you're seeing is a most amazing sight. we have enough work in th

now you have the issa committee releasing the transcripts. they talked to two employees, one current and one recently departed from that office who placed the blame squarely on washington. where does that get us? it gets to the boomerang. and those rogue agents and people were ignorant of the law or acting in bad faith. in the agency of 100,000 people and field of bureaucrats, how can we know? those folks over whom the bus has been back say wait a minute, before you get too carried away mr. grayhound driver. don't do this. it looks political. go a head. washington wants these done. and they want it done, send them on their way. >> look at a couple of them, this is the question. early 2010, was there a time when you were aware of applications that referenced tea party and other reference groups? >> in march 2010 i was aware. question, was there a point when your super visor asked to you do a search. keep going. we'll get to it. and did they give you any idea of the search context? >> he told me that washington d.c. wanted some cases. >> keep g

representative issa is a fierce critic of this administration. he believes the irs controversy runs much deeper, that based on interviews the trail comes right back here to washington and even took a swipe at white house spokesman jay carney. >> reporter: for the first time we're hearing what irs workers in cincinnati are telling congressional investigators about why they targeted conservative groups. republican darrell issa in an exclusive interview on cnn's "state of the union". >> as late as last week the administration still trying to say there's a few rogue agents in cincinnati when, in fact, the indication was they were directly being ordered from washington. >> reporter: issa released just partial transcripts, citing an ongoing investigation, so the full context isn't clear. in one excerpt, one worker quotes a supervisor, he told me that washington, d.c., wanted some cases and when asked about targeting tea party applications and whether those directions emanated from washington, the worker replies, quote, i believe so. >> i believe so. it

what darrell issa is serving darrell issa in the republican party.s is a consistent theme throughout the right wing. they always give you part of the evidence and tell a story. they think the story is more important than the evidence. fortunately, the american people have gotten pretty smart about this, which is why the so-called irs scandal is not going anywhere. because they strongly suspect that the republicans are going to do this again and again and again. and it gives them less and less credibility. >> "the new york times"/cbs did a poll today where it asked the public to simply guess, just guess what happened at the irs. and those guesses apparently are newsworthy. and the guesses are that 68% said that the irs did this for political reasons. 19% said they did it because it was the right policy. and 14% honest respondents said they simply did not know. but richard wolffe, so this is now newsworthy, what the public guesses about an investigation that isn't even actually complete. >> right. it's not very enlightening. and look, the irs, we all k

why is david plouffe going after darrell issa?well, i think he is trying to offer a distraction. i mean, this is -- they've done this before. if you remember during the campaign they actually insinuated the president's campaign that mitt romney was a fel felon. whenever they have a problem with the facts, what they do is demonize and go after the character of their opponent. i think it's a mistake. i think it's a bigger distraction from the issues and i would hope now that chairman issa and other house republicans don't chase those distractions, they don't be the squirrels after that nut. instead, keep the focus back on the white house and asking the tough questions because that's what the american people want. they don't want the name-calling. >> ruth, does david plouffe have a point that the credibility of the accusers is relevant? >> no. but more to the -- but more to the point, it's a stupid tactic. i thought chairman issa who had been doing a pretty good job of holding himself in check and presenting some reasonable hearings

issa's crumbling credibility.ortions that omit key details from the accounts witnesses provided to the committee, chairman issa has now drawn condemnation even from house republicans. said the ranking democrat. sadly, mr. issa has chosen not to do the honorable thing. but this is no surprise. because he chose to do exactly the same thing when it came to the hearings on benghazi. you'll remember that the co-chairs of the independent review of september's deadly attack wrote to the mr. issa volunteering to give open testimony. the public deserves to hear your answers and our questions, wrote the ambassador thomas pickering and mike mullen. unfortunately, darrell issa declined preferring to hold secret meetings that he can leak at his own convenience. mr. issa himself must know the dangers of selective information. after all, he was connected to two allegations of car theft. he increased his company's fire insurance from $100,000 to $400,000 just three weeks before his warehouse burned down. suspicious circumstances.

a few times issa got wrapped up -- this is issa's way of explaining it -- in what his brother was doing. so there are basically three incidents where he was accused of stealing someone's car. one was when he was in the military, another was accused of a scheme with his brother where his brother allegedly stole issa's car, sold it and they were accused of an insurance scheme, and there was another incident where he was pulled over and he had a concealed weapon in the glove compartment and he was arrested for that. that all happened in the '70s. fast-forward to '82. he's now a budding businessman out in cleveland, suburbs of cleveland. and his factory burns down under very mysterious circumstances, and the insurance company investigates it, and they think that it is arson and investigate him and the company pretty thoroughly and wonder about some strange things that happened. >> but they got an out-of court settlement. >> in the end he went back to them -- in the end he won $25,000 from the insurance company so that's where what plouffe threw out there the other day, that's where this is

issa has driven a lot of stories effectively. when he says jay carney is a liar, he makes the story about him. he has to keep on the straight and narrow, keep it straight to the facts and not make this about him. >> especially when you call somebody a liar which i'm very careful about. when you call somebody a liar, you're saying i know for a fact this person lied. i know he knew or she knew the truth and told me something else when even in these tricky cases, certainly about the benghazi thing, we don't know what information was given to susan rice. we don't know what she asked for, what she ended up with or thinking at the time. people start using words like perjury and things like that, they have to be real careful. your thoughts, steve? >> john summarized it perfectly correctly. he's more like burton than the responsible subcommittee chairman john was describing. the problem for the republicans, the reason they smacked him down, this is how brands are made. the republican party is trying to run a campaign in 2014, and if they

but let's remember, it is not just little old darrell issa on his own.ad dave kemp, the head of the republican chairman ways and means committee, saying we know this didn't start in cincinnati. oops, you had rogers, the head of the appropriation committee, the head of the republican division, these guys are making rick perry look smart. they have been out there for weeks and months, trying to generate a scandal that doesn't exist. and it is not just their eyes, that is going to owe president obama and jay carney an apology. they owe the american public for wasting their time on this. it was a real issue, what happened in cincinnati was wrong and mistakes were made in the classic phrase, but they were mistakes made at a pretty low level, don't track back to the white house. they deserve responsible oversight, not the circus or the clown show that darrell issa has presided over. >> and that is the essential point. it is not just that there is no information at all. inconsistent with what the republicans have said, that there is any trace whatsoever to the

chairman issa could send a signal to someone on the pr preficice of coming gourd. among my limitations, i can't read chairman issa's mind, but i have the benefit of seeing those men talk privately and much less fighting and consternation and bitterness going on when the cameras are off that there. they get along well when nobody is around. >> how high does this go? i realizith early. >> i would beg your pardon on whether or not it's early. i think we've had plenty of time to be farther along than we are now. the fact that we doan -- it's not isolated to cincinnati, comes out of d.c. we don't know how high up. more evidence that we need to have more depositions, keeping in mind you don't like the leaks, but more depositions and less committee hearings. >> and this has been going on several years, agree. bad -- >> i didn't mean to correct you. >> i actual al grow with the correction. congressman, nice to see you. >> you too. >>> from targeting conservatives to waist wasting your money on line dancing. should the irs be abolishes. who will ultimately take the fall for

darrell issa.can house oversight chairman has repeatedly attempted to link the white house to the irs targeting controversy. but his conspiracy theories are nothing more than that have been debunked by an ag report, and two transcripts from his own interviews and three, an internal report by the new irs chief. with seemingly no evidence on his side, issa went on cnn yesterday in what first looked like an effort of damage control. here he is in full backtrack mode talking to cnn's dana bash. >> i've never said it came out of the office of the president or his campaign. what i've said is it comes out of washington. >> and now more from the blunderbuss bs he's so good at. saying what he's trying to say here doesn't have to require any evidence. here he is with more in that same interview, pushing the old story. >> for years, the president bashed the tea party groups. he was very public against these groups. and on his behalf, perhaps not on his request, on his behalf, the irs executed a delaying tacti

i think we found darryl issa's mission. >> that's it. originated in the white house. originated. chris bosh is not to blame. thanks to ron, maggie, bill and hugo. i'll see you back here tomorrow at noon eastern when alex is joined by guests. catch alex tonight at 10:00 p.m. eastern. "andrea mitchell reports" is up next. [ male announcer ] erica had a rough day. good thing she's got the citi simplicity card. it doesn't charge late fees or a penalty rate, ever. because she's got other things to stress about. ♪ go to citi.com/simplicity to apply. >>> all free men, wherever they may live, are citizens of berlin and therefore as a freeman i take pride in the words ish bin ide. >> if anybody asked if president kennedy's words ring true today, let them come to berlin for here they will find a people who merged from the wounds of war to reap the blessings of peace. >> right now on "andrea mitchell reports", an historic stage. five years ago candidate obama delivered his message of hope and change to a crowd of 200 thousand germans. today president obama was back. this time on

and republicans, particularly congressman issa, chairman issa, was eager to have this scandal fit intorfar right, is this overbearing overarching form of government. >> one of the point that cummings made is that actually this gentleman in cincinnati was trying to do his job better. he was trying to figure out a bet are way to select and he asked for guidance from a tech technical person in washington, which has nothing to do with the white house, actually. >> nothing at all. in the clip you showed, darrell issa saying, we have it from washington. now is that the head quarts or white house? you and i wouldn't think the white house. but folks at home in the middle of the country and in communities here, even in the metro area who aren't paying attention to politics the way we do, when they hear washington, they think president. they think white house. >> so of course, our friend dick cheney even decided to get in the game. he kept up the charges this morning. i think we have some sound to listen to. >> i have trouble believing two guys in cincinnati dreamed this scheme up. i just don't

issa is also going after irs spending, saying the agency wasted $50,000 on training videos like thisnewly released cuban love shuffle. >> i'm receiving incoming reports from the landing party. >> reporter: and on an already notorious "star trek" spoof. the video's shown at 205 irs conferences between 2005 and 2012, costing $50 million, including $17,000 for a speaker on leadership through art at a 2010 conference in anaheim where issa says one high-ranking irs worker stayed in the hilton anaheim's two-bedroom presidential suite that normally runs $1,500 a night. the man the president has chosen to fix the irs, acting commissioner danny werfel, faces his first congressional grilling this morning, one of three irs hearings this week on a controversy that shows no signs of letting up. dan lothian, cnn, washington. >> our thanks to dan for that report. >>> so, this sounds like the title of a dr. seuss book, but there really was a llama on the loose in leon county, florida, saturday morning. he wasn't any too pleased when sheriff's deputies corralled him and tried to cram him into the bac

>> yes. >> the issa politeness, the thank you very much, mr. president for this wonderful new director? >> we sat at this table a week ago. i think it was a week ago, two weeks ago. and i said, there is no -- there is not the fire -- there are not enough, like, logs in the fire to keep this burning for very long. >> no page 2. >> there's not a page 2. and they have -- now, let's be clear. they have tried to, like, turn it over to, like, star trek videos and offsite conferences and stuff. >> for which we thank them. >> for which us in cable news like star trek videos, which is why they have been successful. but this specific issue has burned itself out. >> darrell issa is not going to stop. he, darrell issa, accused the irs of malicious self indulgence. let's unpack that. darrell issa accused someone else of malicious self indulgence. i'm dropping my mic on that. >> he was a little kind of pot and kettle thing. >> maybe, just perhaps. >> so here is the -- what they want to turn it into at minimum, even if it leaves center stage of washington hea

even by those standards, issa has been extraordinary.ring blanks for weeks now. i would say a couple years. the congressman can correct me but i think he's at 10, 11, 12 major investigations into this administration. fast and furious, wikileaks, benghazi, solyndra, fannie mae. it goes on. of in each case he makes an outlandish suggestion this goes into the white house or the president's going after political enemies. he couched it with some sort of weasel word and then nothing comes of it. the problem is, he's in the congressman cummings should be delighted because chairman issa sacrificed his credibility. people in the press when they hear these allegations have to discount that. >> you've been pushing him to put all he's got, show your cards in a poker game. shows us the transcripts. is he going to do it? >> i don't know what he's going to do. but i can say one thing, chris. you asked how did this get out of hand with all these other people repeating what the chairman has said? i think they thought, they just assumed when he said thing

issa and hi brother was charged with still stealing a car in the 70 s and a fire at issa's business was deemed arson but no charges were filed. it looks like his boss hit a nerve and hoped the president follows plow on twit sore he can see what is going on at therser is. >> let's bring in the associated did for from the newspaper "the hill." this is something, isn't it? >> yes, it got a lot worse, shep. the irs scandal broke weeks ago but this weekend with the revelation they spend $49 million on conferences and in addition to this interview that a former irs employee gave to congressional investigators indicating that there was heavy handedness from the d.c. office, that person was no longer comfortable with. really has raised the stakes and the administrationed a this point has only fired one person. lois lerner is on leave and the former director of the irs is gone. but there has not been an effort besides comments from jay carney and other administration officials to say the white house has nothing to do with it to really indicate that they think this is a real outrage and needs to

and that's what issa said. he refused to release the full transcripts for a very good reason which he also refused to release. but on on tuesday, congressman elijah cummings released the full transcript to the press. and it proved conclusively that issa was right. to not want the transcript released. jim? >> a cincinatti-based i.r.s. manager who describes himself as a conservative republican told congressional investigators there was no evidence that the white house was involved in targeting conservative groups. >> stephen: god damn it. so this scandal is not connected to obama. i don't want to hear that. i want to hear tonight's word. [ cheers and applause ] truthinews. nation, listen. i don't know about you, but i do not watch the news to see what i don't want to hear. and i shouldn't have to. these days there's a news channel for everyone: conservatives have fox. liberals have msnbc, and the elderly who lost the remote in 1988 have headline news. now, cable networks have one cardinal rule. that rule is to te

issa earned almost $60 million last year.t pushed his total net work the to more than $355 million. so congratulations to mr. issa who continues as one of the wealthiest members of congress. but unfortunately, though he enjoys cash, his credibility is now bankrupt. as you know, mr. issa has been leading the charge against the irs. for targeting conservative groups for special scrutiny. he's made it clear that this was orchestrated by the very white house. >> the administration is still their paid liar, their spokesperson picture behind. he's still making up things about what happens and calling this local rogue. this is a problem that be was coordinated in all likelihood right out of washington headquarters. >> unfortunately, all the evidence has shown that this had absolutely nothing to do whatsoever to do with the president or his administration. indeed mr. issa deliberately withheld certain transcripts because he knew that the person responsible was an employee of the irs who happened to be a republican. but now, matters h