the driving force of the ryan plan is reforming medicare and medicaid, which many believe are the biggest debt drivers. reforming medicare, beginning in 2022, roughly 10 years from now, medicare would pay a portion of the premium for private health insurance plans, chosen by seniors themselves. the operative word is private health insurance plan. reforming medicaid, making a bloc grant to the states. projected savings, chairman ryan claims that over 10 years his plan will cut nearly $800 billion. president obama, eight date laser, april 13th, delivered his counter-plan for long-term debt reduction. that plan is titled shared prosperity and shared fiscal responsibility. >> i will not tell families with children with disabilities they have to fends for themselves. >> here are the obama reforms on medicare and medicaid. reforming medicare beginning in 2018, roughly seven years from now, there will be a hard cap on coverage costs. reforming medicaid, a single rate for all states. projected savings, president obama claims that over 12 years his program will nearly $500 billion. >> let's look a

medicare and medicaid at all? ome measures were included in the health reform law. paul ryan did include some of that in the proposal he released. giving vouchers for medicare is essentially transferring thousands of dollars from the most normal people -- that is not who we are in this country. there is enough if we take a different course and increase taxes on those that can afford to pay. host: the latest poll numbers are seven points below where they were in the most recent other poll, nearly matching the worst level of his presidency, have fisher message appeal to independents, which president obama needs to win the election? guest: they are hungry for something that speaks to the crisis they see in the country. we had the worst financial crisis in the country in 70 years. nobody went to jail. we had a regulatory reform package that was not tough enough. foreclosures and unemployment continue to increase. what is the other path? a robust alternative, investing in jobs in this country, that would be the winning

revamping medicare, medicaid. how is that going to happen when you can't get an agreement? >> that's a good question. i find it ironic the week we're trying to engage the president, the democrats and the country with an honest debate about the budget, with real solutions to fix this country's problem and prevent the crisis, the president is launching the re-election campaign. these are tough times for america. we don't need a good politician. we need a strong leader. we need to engage this country on the inces issue -- on the issues necessary to create prosperity and get the debt paid off and get the economy growing. we know we're giving the children and grandchildren a lower -- >> chris: but we. >> we don't need good politics or empty promises. we need tone gauge and fix the problems. >> chris: my question, though, isn't your plan dead on arrival if they can't agree on $3 billion, how are they going to agree on $4 trillion? >> i don't know the answer to that. but i want to look my kids in the face and sleep soundly and put out a plan to try to fix the country's problems. w

medicare and medicaid are not islands into themselves. they are part of the entire health-care system. if you want to reduce costs in medicare and medicaid, yes, there are things you can do, but you also benefit if you bring down costs in the whole system in fact, if you look at the rate of increase in health-care costs, they have been pretty similar. the medicaid growth of health care cost is lower than the national average. the private market skyrocketed between 2000 and 2008. industry profits quadrupled. we believe that you have to continue to work through the changes that were made as part of the fair and affordable care act. the republican proposal eliminates that process. at the same time, it eliminates a process designed to contain costs. it shifts those costs onto our seniors and others who rely on both medicare and medicaid. it does it in a very clear way. it says we will get rid of the medicare program. seniors will now be required, forced to go into private insurance market. they will be given a voucher of premium support or wha

medicare? support -- 21%. opposed -- 70%, strongly opposed, 65%. cutting spending on medicaid -- 30% oppose that, total oppose, 69%, strongly opposed 52%. cutting military spending -- 42% support that while 56% oppose it. raising taxes on all by a small percentage and making small reductions to medicare and social security -- 45% support, 53% oppose. raising taxes on incomes over $250,000 -- 72% support, 27% oppose. cutting entitlements to cut the deficit -- what do you think? we have divided it by age. we will start here. buck, how old are you? caller: 80 years old. host: what do you think? caller: i do not think you should cut the entitlements on medicare because you are a people who bought into the medicare system, social security, and the only have to pay a certain amount. i was in the military course some years. i worked in civilian life until i turned 78 years old. i have paid into this all my life, ever since i have been doing. you have people buying into this. it is not right. i do not think cutting entitlements on medicare -- host: buck, you happy with the way medicar

. >> here are the obama reforms on medicare and medicaid. reforming medicare beginning in 2018, roughly seven years from now, there will be a hard cap on coverage costs. reforming medicaid, a single rate for all states. projected savings, president obama claims that over 12 years his program will nearly $500 billion. >> let's look at these real clear metrics. taxes obama plan, raises tax $1trillion. by 2023 ryan's plan cuts taxes but 2.3 trillion.

it will call for reduced spending in medicare, medicaid and higher taxes.leton of the weather. >> james: the north bay would get the biggest foes of the drizzle. live picture at of walnut creek, it is a dry start, a little cool. 47 in concord. for 60 to the expected high you are a good two-four degrees cooler this afternoon and yesterday. it is all part of the system coming through here. storm tracker 4 not showing any rain at the moment it's still to our north. as that cold front slowly makes its way most of the rain is to our north. we have high-pressure keeping the ball at raf the we will get some drizzle primarily in the north bay. 11:00 we will see the rain over the heart of the day that some expect to see the heaviest rainfall. even by 3:00 once the system is ever area these are were expecting 4 storm totals, hundreds of an inch. it is a late start to say the least. here's where we are temperature wise, 48 degrees in san francisco, 47 concord. after 40-low 50s. here is a look at your 7 day around the bay. once we get past the drizzle and shower we see

and while he wants to slash medicare and medicaid by $500 billion, obama proposes no changes in social security. >> susie: president obama's speech at george washington university was tough and forceful, and as darren gersh reports, it laid out a very different view than the republican proposal offered last week. >> reporter: the president today tried to regain the offensive on the budget, offering what he called a "strong" critique of house republican plans to lower taxes on upper-income americans while cutting spending on popular programs like medicare. >> they want to give people like me a $200,000 tax cut that's paid for by asking 33 seniors to each pay $6,000 more in health costs? that's not right, and it's not going to happen as long as i'm president. >> reporter: the new spending cuts are a modest increase over what the president offered in january. the big change is how mr. obama hopes to reach a budget agreement. the president called on congressional leaders from both parties to begin holding regular meetings with the vice president, producing a deficit reduction plan by the e

consequences for this nation and for each and every candidate in 2012, reining in the twin behemoth, medicare and medicaidrepublicans threw down the gaunt let this week. it promises to be a good battle. we'll get more when we return. between btwin behemoth, medicare and medicaid. it promises to be a good battle. we'll get more when we return. you could get arrested for that you know. it's not what you think. look. there was a time when a company like that would envy us. little outfit. it's almost quaint. all these years we had something they could never have. something only the biggest operations could ever afford. it was our strategic advantage. now they have it. what exactly is "it" that they have? logistics. a level playing field. it's not fair. [ male announcer ] from advances in medical imaging that help doctors detect diseases earlier. to innovations in renewable power that bring america closer to energy independence. to investments that help businesses grow and create jobs. ♪ at ge, we're using imagination at work... ecomagination... healthymagination... and capital... to create advanced technology

the bigger problem is medicare and medicaid. cial security, medicare, and medicaid together are the real drivers of the growth in deficits and the debt going forward. i think a figure that illustrates this and that is based on current projections, by 2023, social security, medicare, and medicaid and payments on the debt will take up. the up. it will consume all the revenues. that is because those of the fast-going programs. that is why there is so much interest in finding a way to curb the growth of those programs. host: kent conrad was on "meet the press" and he said despite the negative poll numbers, he thinks that they would agree to it. >> we have to decide as a nation, are we going to do some things that we would prefer not to have to do, or to we wait for the roof to cave in. of course they don't want to cut social security. do you want to make social security solvent? yes, they do. will they support tax reform to get additional revenue to reduce the deficit? i think the answer is yes. host: what is the political reality? t

i have a problem with people comparing medicare and medicaid. medicare is paid for by the individual. medicaid is being misused in many cases. there are so many people collecting this for children they do not have custody of, food stamps for family members they do not have, custody of their children. i know that you have some computers that can check on these things. people are deliberately having children just to get a tax break. this is happening all over the country. if we had more inspections on the expenditures, we would have less expense for the government's. host: really getting to the heart of waste, fraud. guest: you remember when they were advocating obamacare, they said a significant portion of that would be funded through waste, fraud, and abuse in medicare. that is something that we have to focus on with harsh penalties so that we have a harsh penalty -- focus on those who are doing this and give them a harsh penalty. we will continue to work with leadership and to reach across the aisle to compromise which will allow government to k

as my friends to my left know, medicare and medicaid will collapse with if we continue business as usual this budget saves those systems by putting them on a sound financial foundation. it reverses the trend of doctors refusing to treat medicare patients and assures future seniors a wider choice of physicians and plans than is available today. this budget brings federal spending back under control and it places our nation on a path so that when my children retire, their retirement systems will be safe and secure and their nation will be debt-free and prosperous. i yield back. the speaker pro tempore: thele tissue the chair: the gentleman yields back. the gentleman from wisconsin reserves. the gentleman from maryland is recognized. mr. van hollen: i remind the gentleman that what we're saying is that the top 2% income earners should go back to the rates they were paying in the clinton administration, a period of time when the economy was roaring and 20 million jobs were created. when we moved to the current raters in folks at the very top, we saw at the end of eight years, 2000 to 2008, a

some build on the affordable care act, and adjust the payment mechanisms in medicare and medicaid butdo describe them. it's a different approach than saying we're going to take the medicare system and completely change it to a premium-support system or the medicaid system and say we're going to block grant it to the states and let beneficiary benefit goes way down if that's what-- where the funding goes. i think that there is a very serious set of policies, but it's a different set of policies than the premium support or the medicaid block grant. and that's a battle of ideas. and it should be, it should be. >> rose: but the republicans are saying let's join the battle of ideas. >> yeah. now, i would hope even if we can't agree on some of the long-term changes-- the president made it clear today he was not going to agree to ending medicare as we know it-- that we could still agree on the sensible steps we could take to control the way we pay for things in medicare. i mean, if we're paying for pharmaceuticals more than we need to, that we can reform the system and use our purchasing pow

but this is a budget and what they're planning to do on medicare and medicaid should scare every senior in this country. and every american who someday they hope will be a senior. so within 10 years, we will not recognize medicare or medicaid. seniors will essentially be on their own. to find health insurance in an individual private marketplace that has failed most americans in this country. so this budget, as they have put forward, and seniors know this, understand that they are praoistizing medicare. 69% of seniors oppose privatization. the republicans are not listening. seniors know that dismantling medicare and replacing it with a voucher program means that they no longer will have access to a guaranteed set of health benefits. there will be no guaranteed health benefits under medicare. they know that the value of a limited voucher, one that's capped, will not enable them to meet the rising costs of health care. they will know that they will have to pay more out-of-pocket and more in premiums. unfortunately, the republicans are proud of this. and they are telling their seniors that

it saves our medicare and medicaid programs. it fulfills the mission of healthy retirement security for all americans by guaranteeing that people who have retired or about to retire keep what they have, and then reforms these programs so that they are solvent and sustainable for the next generation. number three, it repairs our social safety net so that it works and number four, pays off our debt. that's what we do. i yield back the balance of my time. not the balance of our time, excuse me. i yield back my time. the chair: the gentleman reserves. mr. ryan: reserve. the chair: the gentleman from maryland. mr. van hollen: thank you, mr. chairman. the fiscal commission said of the republican plan it was an unbalanced approach. our approach is a balanced approach. secretary gates' comments were directed to the fiscal commission's recommendations. our proposals are in line with what the president outlined just the other day and i would point out that governor haley barbour said if we republicans don't propose some savings of money o

we believe the reforms we propose to strengthen medicare and medicaid will enable us to keep these commitments to our citizens while saving as $500 billion by 20203 and an additional $1 trillion in the decade after that. if we are wrong and medicare costs rise faster than we expect, this approach will give the independent commission the authority to make additional savings by further improving medicare. let me be absolutely clear -- i will preserve these health care programs as a promise we make to each other in this society. i will not allow medicare to become a voucher program that leads seniors at the mercies of the insurance companies with a shrinking benefit to pay for rising costs. i will not tell families with children who have disabilities that they have to fend for themselves. we will reform these programs but we will not abandon the fundamental commitment this country has kept for generations. that includes our commitment to social security. social security is not the cause of our deficit, it faces real long-term challenges in a country that is growing older. both parties should work

specifically on medicare and medicaid. >> on the 2012 budget, that's $1 trillion of debt reduction in the next decade. lowest level of domestic spending since dwight eisenhower. he said it in the "state of the union." that was a start. we have to do more. as i said, on healthcare, over $1 trillion. actually, the congressional republican plan actually preserves the medicare spending. the president says we have to do more. on social security, there wasn't anything really in the congressional plan on that. what the president is going to say, he did not think social security is a chief contributor to the deficit situation in the short-term. but as we are having the debates. as we look at the federal budget in the program, if there is a way to preserve social security, we should really strive to do that. i think there is going to be discussions about the social security in a way that doesn't slash benefit. >> chris: specifically on the entitlement he will address medicare and medicaid? >> yes. >> chris: what about taxes? is he going to raise taxes? >> his budget for this year says for uppe

medicare reform. and deal substantively with what ryan has put on the table, like medicaid. you just cannot sit back and denounce them -- >> and that is what they're doing, what the democrats are doing, undeniable. >> i agree, and it is irresponsible. >> where will 9/11 attackers be tried? not in civilian courts. >> khalid sheik mohammed, ramzi bin-alshid. >> that is attorney general eric holder. there will be tried by military commissions and gitmo. sti -- holder said he still wants to try them in new york but congress forces and. > -- forced his hand. >> i always thought that with these guys, a military commission was at a reasonable thing to do. when you have to do is make sure that they are fair enough to pass constitutional muster. the last time the president tried to do it, he did it on his own without congress and they were to rfare and president bush -- >> the military knows how to do this. >> they do it and they should be able to do it. these people were involved in the biggest attack on the united states shores ever by a foreign power. i don't know why that isn't w

to take a guess at where those four trillion are coming from medicare medicaid social security that's right republican chairman of the house budget committee paul ryan takes the republicans were put in power last of ever to sell medicare off to for profit health insurance companies to hand over social security to billionaire hedge fund managers who need more casino chips to gamble with and it's help poor people who can't afford health insurance just suck it up but when it comes to cutting spending on the backs of oil tycoons ryan wasn't so eager to do away with tens of billions of dollars in oil subsidies to go to some of the most profitable corporations in the history of the world check out ryan's take on this yesterday on fox news sunday. do you eliminate tax breaks do you bring in new revenue by eliminating first those tax breaks for oil companies we don't have a tax problem for the total not eliminate tax breaks for big oil and gas those are the kinds of details that you'll come out later with that the way to come back to cut back on the services for the sick the elderly and the p

in settlement programs like medicare, medicaid are no longer untouchable. ideologically different approaches on how to handle the program. with any solution likely to cause some pain to some portion of the public. sandra, cnn washington. >>brian: the low clouds and the fog moving into the bay for tonight. here is san francisco city hall, you could see some of the fog obscured in the view. some drizzle falling in san francisco right now. he may need to hit the wipers a couple times if you're out there on the roadways. temperatures in the '50s currently. san francisco 53, concord 58, 56 san jose and just to the north for tonights some rain is coming down. some fairly significant rain here want to get far enough to the north. the system is moving southbound, by the time it does arrive though it's going to be nothing left of the system. there's the rain, free light on 101 north of ukiah. it will take several hours for to reached the north bay. maybe not until 6:00 a.m.. all you can find here a couple spotty showers, the lips of the scream, they will begin to in

now, we believe the reforms we've proposed to strengthen medicare and medicaid will enable us to keep these commitments to our citizens while saving us $500 billion by 2023, and an additional one trillion dollars in the decade after that. and if we're wrong, and medicare costs rise faster than we expect, this approach will give the independent commission the authority to make additional savings by further improving medicare. but let me be absolutely clear: i will preserve these health care programs as a promise we make to each other in this society. i will not allow medicare to become a voucher program that leaves seniors at the mercy of the insurance industry, with a shrinking benefit to pay for rising costs. i will not tell families with children who have disabilities that they have to fend for themselves. we will reform these programs, but we will not abandon the fundamental commitment this country has kept for generations. that includes, by the way, our commitment to social security. while social security is not the cause of our deficit, it faces real long-term challenges in a cou

this will do terrible damage to medicare and medicaid and everybody who has paid into the medicare system and relies on the system for their supports, and all of us know it was not that long ago that republican members of congress surely thought the establishment of medicare, the establishment of social security, and certainly we are not going to stand by while they undermine the fundamental integrity's of those important supports for seniors and others in our society, which all of those seniors had paid into that system. with that, i'm going to turn it over to congressman john yarmouth, a great member of the committee from kentucky, who is got to talk about the republican approach to tax cuts for the wealthy. >> thank you very much, crossbhris. i ran for congress in times during difficult circumstances for americans, and fighting two wars, and the notion we should cut taxes for the wealthy was offensive and demonstrated the wrong values, and that was at a time when the social safety net was much better than it will be under the republican budget. mr. ryan calls this budget the path to pr

on entitlements, house republicans project savings by transforming medicaid into block grants to the states and revamping medicare into a voucher-like program. the president says medicaid can save billions by becoming more flexible and efficient. and he wants to pare medicare spending by reducing excessive outlays on drugs, among other things. the house votes tomorrow on the republican budget. >> brown: coming up, a debate on how best to deal with the deficit with douglas holtz eakin and paul krugman. plus, changes for air traffic controllers; health care reforms in china; a moderate view from pakistan and a movie about the assassination of president lincoln. but first, the other news of the day. here's hari sreenivasan. >> sreenivasan: more americans applied for unemployment benefits last week for the first time in three weeks. and wholesale prices shot higher, fueled by the rising cost of gasoline. on wall street, the economic data held stocks in check. the dow jones industrial average gained 14 points to close at 12,285. the nasdaq fell one point to close at 2,760. japanese police in protective suits searched

has given the politically he's given the democrats a great gift because his comments about medicare and medicaid are simply too good to not demonize. >> who spoke first, heritage foundation or -- ryan? >> i think the heritage foundation. heritage had the 2.8 number in there but the idea that anyone can project with what the unemployment rate will be in 2015 is ridiculous. so ryan would have been better to just leave that all to the side. but what we have here, job, is we have set up a conflict of visions obviously, we have an unsustainable fiscal situation in the country. there were two ways to go. one is ever higher taxes and price controls on health care to control the costs of health care, which is basically the democratic plan. but they're too cowardly to be explicit about it. or we can get spending under control, take first steps to getting the entitlements under control with no tax increases and price controls and that's the ryan plan which will become the lowest common denominator to for republican presidential candidates in 2012. >> so it's going to be president. >> not every candidate w

it makes dramatic changes to medicare and medicaid while aiming to cut $6 trillion in spending over next decade. >> the country wants growth. they want a debt-free nation. they want government to begin living within its means and stop spending money we don't have. >> the house is expected to vote on congressman ryan's budget late this week. it has no chance of making it through the democratic senate. still, republicans hope they can shape the debate moving forward. russ? >> whit johnson on capitol hill, thank you very much. and still ahead on tonight's "cbs evening news," african leaders on a peacekeeping mission to see libyan leader mommar qaddafi. >> mitchell: in the battle for libya, nato air strikes today helped the rebels recapture the gateway the behghazi, the biggest of the rebels' eastern strongholds. mommar qaddafi's forces control the western half of the country. in tripoli, a high-ranking delegation says tonight that qaddafi has accepted his ceasefire plan. the delegation is traveling east to present it to the rebels. elizabeth palmer has more. >> reporter: in libya, welcoming

a plan that would slash medicare, medicaid, and education, to pay for tax cuts for the wealthy. >> that's not right. that's not going to happen as long as i'm president. >> reporter: turning to his own vision on reigning in deficits, he promised $4 trillion in deficit reduction over 12 years. that includes $750 billion in domestic spending. $400billion from defense, and $480 billion in medicare, and medicaid cuts. he gave little in the way of details, and those cuts are long term. in the short term he said government needs to keep spending to keep the economic recovery on track. >> we will invest in medical research. we will invest in clean energy technology. we will invest in new roads and airports and broadband access. >> reporter: in another shot at republicans, he defiantly insisted that the bush tax cuts for top incomes will expire next year. >> we can't afford them. >> reporter: paul ryan says the president's speech was nothing but a political broad cider from the campaigner in chief. >> what we got was a speak that was excessively partisan, and hopelessly inadequate to address our

and he's calling for spending cuts, including at the pentagon and cost-cutting reforms for medicare and medicaid. republicans are demanding steep spending cuts, no tax hikes and a massive restructuring of medicare and medicaid that would fundamentally transform two pillars of the american safety net. the plans are a world apart and the clock is ticking. in a month, the united states will reach its borrowing limit, in order to borrow more money to meet obligations, congress must vote to raise the debt ceiling and getting republicans on board may not be that easy. i spoke with treasury secretary, tim geithner, about the showdown and the stakes. >> secretary geithner, thank you for joining us. >> nice to see you. >> the debt ceiling is going to be the next big battle. it is the next big battle. can you spell out for plain english for our viewers what is the impact if it's not raised for the average american? and for the united states? >> i want to make it perfectly clear, congress will raise the debt ceiling. >> are you sure about that? >> absolutely. they recognize that. they told the president we

we will talk more about medicare and medicaid. ssing the health law saves and improves the fiscal stability of the medicare trust fund for 12 years. we really do want to work together to find common ground, but what we are not willing to do is just, where we cut into the bone -- where our obligations to our seniors, medicare -- our obligations to the future -- we think there are investments we need to make. affordability of college is something we think is important if america is going to grow the economy in the global marketplace. host: let's go back to the issue of medicare. that will come up to date. there are a couple of questions in today's 0: the new york times." guest: i will say that under the republicans' plan and medicare, they will end medicare as we know it. there will no longer be guaranteed benefits for future seniors. that would end completely. the question there is there would be no more guaranteed benefits. what will happen is that future seniors will get a limited voucher to go and buy health insurance in the priv

tonight, an even bigger battle is about to begin with medicare and medicaid on the block. >>> front lines. nato airstrikes in libya drive gadhafi forces away from an important rebel-held town. and we're there. >>> the hunt for a serial killer and the intriguing new twist that has now emerged. >>> and royal invite. guess who's coming to the wedding of prince william and kate middleton? captions paid for by nbc-universal television >>> from nbc news world headquarters in new york, this is "nbc nightly news with lester holt." >>> good evening. this threatens to be a sleepless and maybe dangerous night for a lot of folks in the upper midwest. on the heels of a massive tornado that flattened part of mapleton, iowa, last evening, tonight parts of at least four .tates from iowa to upper michigan are under severe weather watches or warnings and forecasters say conditions may be ripe for more tornadoes into monday. right to the weather channel's chris warren in the wisconsin dells who's watching it all for us this evening. chris? >> reporter: lester, where i am right now might seem okay for now. b

includes $750 billion in domestic spending, $400 billion from defense, and $480 billion in medicare and medicaidcuts but he gave little in the way of details and those cuts are long- term. in the short term, he said government needs to keep spending to keep the economic recovery on track. >> we will invest in medical research. we will invest in clean energy technology. we will invest in new roads and airports and broadband access. >> reporter: in another shot at republicans, he defiantly insisted that the bush tax cuts for upper incomes will expire next year. >> we can't afford it. and i refuse to renew them again. >> i'm very disappointed in the president. >> reporter: congressman paul ryan, who authored the house republican plan, says the president's speech was nothing but a political broadside from the campaigner in chief. >> what we got was a speech that was excessively partisan, dramatically inaccurate, and hopelessly inadequate to addressing our country's pressing fiscal challenges. >> reporter: ryan said instead of billion bridges today, the president was poisoning wells. so anyone who th

medicare and medicaid at all? guest: some measures were included in the health reform law. paul ryan did include some of that in the proposal he released. giving vouchers for medicare is essentially transferring thousands of dollars from the most normal people -- that is not who we are in this country. there is enough if we take a different course and increase taxes on those that can afford to pay. host: the latest poll numbers are seven points below where they were in the most recent other poll, nearly matching the worst level of his presidency, have fisher message appeal to independents, which president obama needs to win the election? guest: they are hungry for something that speaks to the crisis they see in the country. we had the worst financial crisis in the country in 70 years. nobody went to jail. we had a regulatory reform package that was not tough enough. foreclosures and unemployment continue to increase. what is the other path? a robust alternative, investing in jobs in this country, that would be the

the five they get in trouble with programs in the federal budget that would be social security medicare medicaid unemployment and welfare primarily food stamps and section eight housing that in total adds up to the entire revenue base all of the taxes that the federal government collects so if you say we're going to cut spending in discretionary programs if we're going to cut defense spending for example you're not going to make a difference noticed what has been left out there not only things like defense but we haven't even interest yet so yes there is an issue and we need to solve the revenue side of the fence at the same time that we solve the spending but in the united states the federal government has never managed to collect more than twenty percent of g.d.p. in taxes that would put us at about two point eight trillion dollars in tax revenues but we were four trillion dollar budget so even if we were to increase taxes we would not be able to make this work but what about the big corporations but essentially rake in billions in profits and get away scot free what happens i mean if you go b

i think there's agreement from both parties that we have to look at medicare and medicaid, these health entitlements. but instead of privatizing it, which is what paul ryan has proposed-- when you privatize, you're saying basically... you give the insurance companies a lump sum of money and they go do what they want. what history has shown that rates continues to go up and costs go up, but benefits go down. we're looking at keeping the benefits but making the delivery systems more efficient. that would be done in the health care bill and will continue. it's a much different proposal. it's not leaving it up to the insurance companies. what i'm saying, jeff, is this, we will both agree that we have a deficit problem and have to bring it down. our belief is... >> that's what a change. >> shared sacrifice across the board. yours is just saying that middle class people. >> i deny that, that it's aimed only at middle class people. but what is changing here is the president's budget did none of that. the president's 2,000 pages he sent to us just a few weeks ago proposed no changes in medicare

both medicare and medicaid are broke programs that are going to be bankrupt. social security, the folks would face a 22% cut across the board, and doing nothing is unacceptable. you thought of thoughtful proposals that don't just cut these programs, they reform them so they can provide the services, which these beneficiaries deserve, and for the next generation. >> susie: dean, what do you think the chances are there will be a budget deal by friday? >> i think we will at least see a short-term shutdown by the government, but i suspect we'll have a deal not too long after that. people that go to washington to go to the smithsonian are going to be upset. >> susie: dean, you're a democrat, and doug, you are a republican. if you were to give one piece of advice so we can get a deal why friday, what do you think it would be. doug, you're first. >> i think he has waited too long. on budget, he has shown no presidentship in three years. >> susie: dean, in just a few words, what would you tell the president? >> start talking about boosting the economy. it's unacceptab

medicare and medicaid spending grows every year under this budget. what we're trying to do is save medicare and medicaid so they're sustainable. but also, the safety net is tearing apart at the seams. >> i want to break that down a little more, but let me stop you on the tax issue. do taxes at some point have to be raised if you're really going to get into the realm of asking something of the american people, shared sacrifice, not just helping upper earners? >> shared sacrifice, meaning sort of indiscriminate cuts across the board is what you do in a debt crisis. we're trying to preempt a debt crisis. so we're keeping the eye on the ball on spending cuts and growth. the president just raised taxes $800 billion, is calling for another $1.85 trillion in tax increases. you slow down economic growth. we want job creation, economic growth. that's why if you go down the tax increase path, you're sacrificing the economy. and especially when the fact that the problem we have is spending, not taxes, spending's the root cause of our deficit and debts, every tim