-india relations. during my recent trip to india with undersecretary burns where we were preparing for the secretary's trip later in july, we heard from indian interlocutors that the sky is the lament to it the u.s. india relationship. and actually with our growing space cooperation we have to extend that particular boundary of cooperation. in this stage is bare for sat and the curtain is rising on a u.s. india 3.0. our governments and our peoples together will help shape the course of the 21st century. so thank you very much again for this kind invitation and i will be happy to take a few questions. [applause] >> we will just abide by the rules, everybody knows what they are. raise your hand, wait for the microphone, identify yourself. what we take some in the back for a change and make sure to keep your question brief. >> please no questions about down terrorists. [laughter] >> rebecca cooper from the nuclear nobel monitor -- i wanted to ask about the prospects for the second part of the 123 agreemen

and india. onerous terms and conditions, the offset requirements, the differing concepts of liability, the role of consultants and the policy issues with respect to monitoring in the communication information security, memorandum of agreement otherwise known as sismo and taas. these are all areas that the u.s. and the government of india need to collaborate in order to improve defense relationships going forward. u.s. industry is committing substantial resources nonetheless in pursuit of programs to a large degree in faith. faith that the india and u.s. relations will continue and improve and these agreements will fall into place. one very large competition that has gotten the world stage is the multimission role combat aircraft that both two firms from the united states are in competition with other worlda worldary -- aeronautic issues. although it takes more policy issues i think there are two or three priorities that i would like to leave you with today that perhaps could be the focus for def

india relationship.ndia has whether the global downturn, better than most and is projected to grow at an enviable 6% this year. although the size of the indian economy is still small relative to that of the united states, its continued growth at a time when other countries are stagnating will help the global recovery. one area of immediate promise for u.s. firms is civil nuclear cooperation. out in may the indian government said carter agreement with the international atomic energy agency entered into force and india subsequently signed its additional protocol. india was still file a declaration of safeguard facilities with the iaea in order to complete the steps necessary for nuclear regulatory commission licensing. we hope that the government of india will soon be in a position to announce to nuclear reactor park sites that will be designated for u.s. firms. and we also hope and will approve liability protections for u.s. companies by adhering to the convention on supplementary compensation for nuclear

-- india? >> i think that it is interesting to look at the evolution of india's ftas as claude was outlining, and the rubber is really hitting the road in the negotiations, india's negotiations with the e.u. because interestingly in india they can launch negotiations very quickly quite in contrast to what happens in the united states where we have to deal with fast track and congressional approval. i often looked with envy at how fast they can get things started. the question is what are they getting started, and what are they ending up with? with most of the negotiations to date they're very, very limited in scope and even with tariffs that wouldn't pass muster in the wto and certainly wouldn't be of the scale, anywhere of the scale we would be interested in. but what i hope is that we will build confidence and build building blocks for a much more ambitious relationship with india, and that is why we have really advocated starting with an investment agreement where progress can be made becaus

-india civil nuclear agreement. there is, therefore, a case for optimism for some progress on trade, but there is this optimism really must be tempered by realism. i would like to highlight a couple of aspects of the election results that i believe there favorably on the potential for movement on trade and economic co-op or asian. first, is the relative strength of the vote for congress. as you all know, congress itself won 206 seats, the best result by any party since 1991. but more importantly, is the strength of the congress party within the coalition where most of the coalition partners and the third parties outside the coalition did not do as well as what was expected. this combined with the fact that the congress party's no longer shackled by the communist party gives congress much for your rain on economic and trade issues. further, today we have a new commerce minister who is from the ruling party and also close to sonya gandhi and the leadership. by contrast, when prime minister would return to power in 199

india cooperation. but we must do more to harness the brainpower of our scientific and research communities and their private-sector counterparts to improve energy efficiency, to find low-cost health care solutions, and enhance and food security. agriculture is a very high priority for prime minister saying in an area where we also hope to expand cooperation. to quote him again, the hold of middleman has blocked the the rise of open networks, special interests have blocked reforms. the prime minister and his team are well aware of these challenges and the united states is ready to help with technology, research and by sharing best practices in the cost of farm to fork supply food chain. ladies and gentlemen, president obama neely capture the scope and breadth of our relations when he said, our rapidly growing in deepening friendship with india offers benefits to the world citizens as our scientists all environmental challenges together, our doctors discover new medicines, our engineers advance our socie

/india relations? many people believe there is no other way but confrontation with iran to continue. >> i am happy to say -- i think is the bottom protected? that is a great question. mainly for the first reason, if or when there is another attack in india, there will be a natural tendency to say the u.s. is pakistan's patron. partly because you asked, in the at held back in a remarkable display of self retrained which was in indiana's interest. often states do things for political reasons that may not be in their interest, but it was the smart thing to do. but it becomes a convenient and very understandable politically to blame somebody else that you have been counting on if something like this happens. on the indian side, that could cause a problem. i don't think the iran issue will be a problem for reason that we may be heading towards a confrontation with iran. the stakes that would be more important are russia and china, the u.s. will be more angry at them, the expectations of india are relatively

in india, come to work virtually all of them go back to work for tata in india. i understand the importance of ensuring that there are no abuses of any decent program. but there must be a process by which india and american companies can serve as clients and freely travel between our two countries for legitimate business purposes. thank you. >> thank you, david. arvind? >> thanks for the invitation. a great pleasure to be here again. and speaking on trade. let me just begin first by a bit of, a brief statement about india and then i will talk about u.s.-india. this is a rapidly growing economy now. the last six years has grown eight and a half%. if you calculate in real dollars, it is even higher. it has opened up quite dramatically from something like less than 15% of trade ratio in the early 1990s. the economy is now about 45, 47% so it's three times that. remember, we are talking about the trade ratio of the gdp itself has grown, then growing over that long period between six and 7%. so it's very rapidly growing. very rapidly opening up. and on the investment

-- india?>> i think that it is interesting to look at the evolution of india's ftas as claude was outlining, and the rubber is really hitting the road in the negotiations, india's negotiations with the e.u. because interestingly in india they can

india. india has become a little bit of a after-thought and we have talked to afpa, which but at least in my mind it's highly regrettable. now, before we talk about some of the national security challenges. i just wonder on this hyphenated question how you feel we can sort of get past that, whether it's a perception in india as well and perhaps, you know, as you think about it, last week the -- last week the senate passed a kerry-lugar bill that has $1.5 billion in assistance per annum with very few restrictions to pakistan. i don't think that it's necessary for you to make a criticism of that or a comment on it, but i think it's interesting to see how the -- how it reflects american priorities. think a little bit about that for us. >> certainly, i think the india-u.s. relationship in the last few years has developed largely and it is a very important relationship for india, certainly. which we feel is essential for meeting our development aspirations as well as for enhancing global peace an

china and india will not. they recognize that enacting these caps is like jumping off an economic cliff. a yes vote means more american manufacturing jobs moved to china and india. fewer americans have jobs. there is no reduction in global greenhouse gases. because this bill was rushed to the floor, because the american people were not given a chance to review it, because their representatives were not given a chance to review it, this bill contains numerous flaws. the message of the committee has not reviewed are an area open for our trading partners to retaliate against our good and against our workers. how does this help our economy? how does this help families? how this is how our environment? it does not. promises have been made that your constituents will not be harmed. it contains plenty of consumer protection. what are those protections? who is going to get them? not the middle class. not the people the president promised to protect, families making less than to wonder if the thousand dollars a year. s

and i traveled from lahore to india. >> host: did you see the fancy semidey? >> guest: salles fancies their money with the goose-stepping. >> host: the last british legacy. >> guest: exactly. once you leave your not even leaving you're just coming in and everyone is gruff and stamping your visa and flipping through very judiciously and then you get to india and everyone is all smiles and it's like how do you sort of explain that geography? how do you explain a matter of 10 feet the border guards temperament? i never quite got to that but there is something distinctly different about the culture and sense of civic responsibility. >> host: leader in the show i would like to come back to the complexity of islam and pakistan but first i want to get to your book because apart from all the readers learn about the reality of everyday life in pakistan and the complexity behind it, they are great stories. i mean, you went there and it's an object of book. it's very honest. yet you were driven out of pakistan almost literally by the intelligence services in a fit of par

-- to the one area of india that have never stopped polio. this area -- over here is in the area of the country which every other virus that we found sins of the year 2000 is genetically linked said that has been a key reservoir three never stopped polio. we developed the vaccines and put in place tactical shifts and as you can see the beginning of 2008 by then we had gone a full 12 months without polio in that area. but it got real infected and are still trying to clear out but the research generated the solutions to it very late in the game is often the problem. three other big lessons we learned along the way. the six is probably the need to have money to reach the kids and the last when a person in particular but what might not be as obvious is the need for sophisticated fund-raising advocacy it around this not just lists some supporters but riposte diverse funding streams. if we look at the police programs this shows you a breakdown of where the $7 billion have come from a beer you can see 40% from g8 and a multilateral sector about 12 o

the china and india nations are out there competing. we want to compete against them because we have better technology. we have to make the investment here and not in saudi arabia, and libya, and russia, and venezuela. that is where it must end today. >> the gentleman's time is expired. >> i yield one minute to the distinguished gentleman from california. >> not only is this legislation not the right thing, it is one of the most overreaching, damaging pieces of legislation that has ever come before this house of representatives. this national energy tax is a job killer and will cost american families over $3,000 per year while doing very little to affect global measures. rural america, low-income families, farmers will suffer the most under this new tax. we all want to protect our environment. we can accomplish that through innovation and investment, not by government micromanagement that undercuts americans' ability to compete globally. i urge all members to protect the american economy and livelihoods of many of american families and

working together to engage china and india on global climate change. the g20 bringing together key asian and european partners to address the global financial crisis. north korea -- i don't have to say much about the. security developments in the pacific such as the development of long-range ballistic missiles impact the debate on missiles in europe. i think this link has been apparent since the u.s. entered world war ii in europe after the attack in the pacific so, admiral, the atlantic council will continue to float its boat as well in the pacific. i now want to turn the podium over to the honorable walt slocombe the vice chair of the atlantic council and former undersecretary of defense for policy. he's going to#9 introduce our speaker and will later moderate the q & a session. walt, who's now with kaplan and drysdale is -- and this is not an overuse of the word, a pillar of the atlantic council. he provides me and the rest of our leadership strategic advice as well as sound legal advice. i am still free walking around and have not yet been incarcer

you are looking at this part of india on tv. and is also as you can see is where polio viruses are right along this area when you map a fairly. when you look at what was in place there to serve these people to manage the program, there was one primary health care center within the flood zone area, if i were never correctly, an area of about a hundred kilometers long, 20 miles, kilometers wide. and i think a million people during the flooding period. so you need to be able to put in place, if you want to deliver, to reach these children, you have to help put in place the infrastructure to do it. this is what our team in india did. they were right on top of that, those viruses. they lay down very, very quickly a whole infrastructure to deliver, not just a polio vaccine, routine vaccinations, other basic interventions. did you have to put that infrastructure in place. the third thing and i was so glad that actually you were speaking to the memory of beth waters and her work is you have got to establish a robust capacity for all asp

using locally appropriate mechanisms with community dialogues in northern india to achieve that. this brings me to one of the 4 big lessons we learned, this is the lesson in terms of advocacy. we are getting extremely good in the world of international health at national advocacy, the advocacy of rock stars and heads of state. but the reality is that will raise awareness of we're trying to do and raise resources for we are trying to do but will not necessarily get the children vaccinated. in the federal republic's where we are working, federated republics, we need to be operating at the sub national level and this is an area we are not very good at. if you look at where polio exists in india, 2 northern states, there are 2 achieve ministers who between them head what would be the sixth biggest country in the world if it was an independent country, a population of three hundred fifty million people. to engage with people like this, to affect change, you have got to advocate at a sub national level. we engage in the national level, rock stars worked at the national, international l

neither will china and india. they reckon acting these caps is like -- they recognize enacting these caps is like jumping off a cliff. more manufacturing jobs will move to china and india. fewer americans have jobs and there is no reduction in global greenhouse gases. and because this bill was rushed to the floor, because the american people were not given a chance to review it, because their representatives were not given a chance to improve it through the committee process, this bill contains numerous flaws. the border measures, which the committee on ways and means has not reviewed are an area open for our trading partners to retaliate against our goods and against our workers. how does this help our economy? how does this help families? how does this help our environment? it doesn't. now, i know promises have been made, that your constituents won't be harmed by this bill, that it contains plenty of consumer protections. what are those protections? who's going to get them? not the middle class, not the people t

india, once upon a time, prior to my work with walter, i was the flag lt. to then admiral william j. chorale in the mid- 1980s. for year and a half, i carried my bad shots, so there's hope for all of us who are younger. but those caring the admirals' bags around. we made a visit to india. he was pretty high expectations, and there were largely unfulfilled. the reception we got was a little chilly. the engagement on a policy level were not very forthcoming. the hospitality was cordial but not overflowing, and the old man left less happy than we would have liked him to be. we just went in for the second time a couple weeks ago, much different from a much different country. we got there on the last of their elections. it is an amazing process. some of you may have had the good fortune of watching india's national elections. folks were flocking to their televisions in manner and numbers that were somewhat unusual to us, glued to the big screen televisions the other government today is more willing to talk about engagement and a partnership with the united state

and india relations in the obama era.this program was conceptualize to examine relations at a very important crossroads. both countries have freshly elected or reelected governments. president obama took office just over five months ago, and the prime minister was elected by a wide margin last month. the world's oldest and world's largest democracies have many interests to the security and economic areas. the strategic partnership will require close attention by both parties to remain strong. to look at these issues today, i want to give a warm welcome to the ambassador who is here with us this morning. following their ambassador's remarks, a discussion on economic cooperation. we will conclude our program by ambassador blake. let me hand over the program to the vice president for foreign studies in india. >> thank you. we don't often do this kind of a format, and i think you will have to let us know how it works. is recent joined us in washington. you have her full bioin your folder and online but prior to coming here sh

china and india are not going to go forward. any meaningful effort to achieve long-term sustainable reductions in greenhouse gas emissions depend on the development and deployment of new energy technologies. that includes clean coal technologies, carbon capture, and the advanced nuclear power generations. my amendment was designed on this respect. the rapid developments of widespread deployment of such technologies are a pair mons, my colleagues, of importance in any effective effort to address co2 reductions. the massive new regulatory burdens imposed by this cap and trade scheme will invariably cut the growth and innovation in this country. we will lose jobs. let's foster new technology and not pass this bill. >> the gentleman from california. >> we reserve the balance of our time. >> what is the time on each side remaining right now? >> the gentleman from texas has 37 and 3/4, and the gentleman from california has 21 and one half. >> i yield to mr. kantor from virginia. >> i think the gentlemen. madam speaker, there is one th

we made a visit to india. he was pretty high expectations, he was pretty high expectations, and there the reception we got was chilly. we left less happy than we would have liked. we came here for the second time a couple of weeks ago. much different. much different country. we got there on the last day of their elections. it was an amazing process. some of you may have had the good fortune of watching the elections. people were flocking to the televisions in numbers that were somewhat unusual to us, glued to the big screen tvs. they were willing to talk about engagement in partnership with the panetta states. they were exercising with us on a much more robust basis. we just concluded a trilateral exercise which was unthinkable in the 1980's. it was high end technical exercise where we were using division tactics and exercising weapons, techniques, and proced. that are pretty high in. two years ago, india participated in a five-way it says including u.s., japan, singapore, and australia. unthinkable in the mid

not to be able to fight india. not to be able to engage in nuclear proliferation, but to help us fight against the forces of violent extremism. pakistan is a valued ally. this will enable us to give them the resources so that we can count on that ally to do the right thing. and continue the same blank check policy which has made matters worse rather than better, i think is a terrible mistake. i urge defeat of the amendment. the speaker pro tempore: the gentleman's time has expired. the gentlewoman from florida. ms. ros-lehtinen: thank you. mr. speaker, i'd like to yield five minutes to the gentleman from michigan, mr. hoekstra, the ranking member on the house permanent select committee. the speaker pro tempore: the gentleman from michigan is recognized for five minutes. mr. hoekstra: i'd like to thank my colleague for yielding the time. pakistan, afghanistan is a very difficult part of the world. as we develop the strategies, i think many of us all have the same goals and objectives in mind. but we need to take a l

. >> one country you have not mentioned is india. could you tell us what you think where they will be? >> nds problem is not one country it is a group of countries driven together buy the british with a central government but with the tremendous power still bested in the states and state your rockers days and the states have unique ideologies, some of which are very open and some violently oppose. doing business in india is extraordinarily difficult part of the bureaucracy is not an efficient it is set up and various states to limit investment and so on. we don't see the forces inside of india that will change the basic dynamic so we see where the chinese central committee in 1975 put in motion a set of national decisions as to what was going to happen, there is no central authority in india to do that and therefore while superficially given the size and everything else one would say the chinese should be replicated by indians they have self limiting factors that will prevent that. that is not to say they are not to growing however t

they're worried about the threat of india. there's only one element in the pakistani national security establishment whose matter concern is state collapse and extremist takeover and that's the pakistani police and the pakistani police have actually done some very, very good work in community policing, stabilizing the environment and counter-radicalization and most of the good counterinsurgency work that's happened in pakistan has been done by the police. and yet we've underresourced our assistance to the police dramatically. we've given large amounts of resources to the military which have often been diverted to platforms that address india instead of focusing on the local civilian administrators, judges, the rule of law, police, all those sorts of things that bring about stability to the people. so i would suggest those two lines of operation. the political line to do with improving the throw-weight of

>> it's at a crossroads, china, india and, brazil, russia, most of asia, are all following us. affluence has made more me build which is wonderful and the way it has been sold to them has been, you know, gm going to china, and saying, buy cars. so, we are at that crossroads where it could be conventional or really could be different. and that is a lot of what the book is about. >> you say there is about 1 billion motor vehicles on the world's roads today. >> right. >> the titled of your new book, coauthored by daniel spurling says "two billion cars." >> over the last 100 years we have invented the car, and fueled it with oil and we have risen now to a billion. in the next 15 years, we expect to double that to two billion. and that is the road we're on and it issen creditably fast. >> why? >> for the sake of affluence, and mobility and right now, the only technology we have for mobility is a motor vehicle. >> where is the growth, though. >> the growth is in china, number one, india, number 2, brazil and russia, also, indonesia, really, throughout asia. largely throughout asia, a

india is very ecclectic and very -- it is enchanting, but i went india to actually vacation. >> host: not enough trouble for now? >> guest: i feel very comfort enable muslim countries. i was in minneapolis and there's a large somali community, and inside some of thermals, there are no windows, very close, very much like a traditional suc, and the call to prayer is coming off and it struck a chord. there's something that is very comfortable about that culture for me. so we will seem i did spend time in bangladesh, which is the culturally, religiously, very much like pakistan. >> host: which had been part of pakistan at partition in 1947. >> guest: right. >> host: it spun off after the civil war in 1971 and now is one of the poorest, most vibrant countries in the world. >> guest: exactly right. socially it couldn't be more different than pakistan in that -- >> host: how. >> guest: you can good -- the conspiracy hawking, the notion that there's a central intelligence agency plot behind every development in bangladesh is not there. so i didn't have to dress in local clothes. before i went

how about india? >> well, i think it is less in the picture to a certain extent, but i think they have a very good industrial policy because if you look at where economic activity develops in india it is much less in basic sectors of the economy in coming chinese economy still very much oriented toward the of that kind of basic industrial activity or as, for example, in india you have a lot of development in software and information technology, medical equipment. india has become after the united states the second producer of medical equipment so i think there are developing their economy more clever and less dependent on the competitive situation because what is a problem for china is that countries like bangladesh, vietnam, even pakistan and become competitive because the wage costs their competitors visavie china because labor costs are much lower than they are china. india is less dependent on the kind of cost competitiveness and much more clever industrial policy and i don't think china, of cours

india, one special reason to visit india is this advertisement. incredible india, any time is a good time to visit the land of taj, but there is no time like now. not unusual to see this. it's not just india. arrived, looking for an experience to remember? departed with an adventure you'll never forget? australia. come to australia. if you're an overseas traveler deciding where to visit, be sure to come to australia. go where ireland takes you. pretty straightforward. makes you want to go to ireland. great britain, italy, spain, france, australia, india, ireland, they say, come here, come to our country. travel to our country. see what our country's about. we're not doing that. and, as a result, let me show you the chart again. as a result in the last eight years we've seen a 3% decrease in foreign travel -- foreign visitors to the united states while the rest of the world is at a 40% increase in travelers destined to those other areas. it makes a big difference. and it's very negative in terms of our country's economic opportunity that comes from

incredible india." well, india is very interested, very promotional saying, come to india. but it's not just india. here's ireland. a big promotional campaign, "go where ireland takes you." a beautiful photograph of the majesty of ireland. an example of australia. "looking for an experience to remember. arrived, departed with an adventure we'll never forget. go find yourself in australia." and all over the world we have exaifncampaigns now, very aggree campaigns saying, come to italy, vacation in italy. come to great britain. come to spain. see the wonders of spain. now why are -- why are countries doing that? well, it's interesting. the average international traveler spends about $4,500 on an overseas trip. when they go to a country, they spend money. and it creates jobs. and so countries are aware of that, and they're very active in trying to encourage travelers to come to their country. not so with our country so much since 9/11/2001. in fact it's interesting that in 2008 we had 633,000 fewer people come to this country from overseas than we had in 2000. let me say that

neither will china or india. they recognize that this is equal to jumping off an economic cliff. what does a yes vote mean? it means that more jobs moved to china and india and fewer americans have jobs and there is no reduction in global greenhouse gases. because this bill was rushed to the floor and because the american people were not given a chance to review it, because their representatives were not given a chance to improve it, this bill contains numerous flaws. of the border measures are an area open to our trading partners to retaliate against our goods and our workers. how does this help our economy? how does this help families? how does this help our environment? it does not. i know that promises have been made that your constituents will not be harmed by this bill and that it contains consumer protections. two -- what are those protections? who is protected? not families. somewhere, someone made the decision to eliminate the tax credits designed to help families pay for these high energy prices. here is the plain and simple facts. under the national image attacks, they

and you didn't -- india didn't capture you? >> guest: to some extent in this is very eclectic and jerry -- is in chanting but we went to india as a vacation. >> host: not enough trouble for you? >> guest: there was something i don't know i feel comfortable. i've in minneapolis a couple weeks ago and there's a large community in minneapolis and inside some of these somali in malls there are no windows, they are just very close, very much like a traditional and the call to prayer is going off. >> host: a bizarre marketplace. >> guest: exactly. it struck a chord and i thought this is familiar. there's something comfortable about the culture for me. we will see. but i did spend time in bangladesh which is culturally, religiously very much like pakistan. >> host: which had been part pakistan petition in 1947. >> guest: right. >> host: it spun off after the civil war and now as one of the poorest most vibrant countries in the world. >> guest: that's exactly right. and socially, it couldn't be more different in pakistan and that -- >>

the far left there you have the director general of w.h.o., not meeting with the prime minister of indiabecause that wasn't the key to eradication but the chief minister, traveling out to where she was based, understand what were the challenges, how do we help. similarly in the bottom picture on the border of pakistan, with the leadership of that key province. this is the picture of mr. gates's trip to nigeria earlier this year. he went up north, met with the leaders of the traditional leadership, the sultan of socoto and then met with the nigerian governors, not with the president, but the governors who held the true levers to so not just advocacy we talk about advocacy but at a level where it will make a difference to get kids vaccinated you have to get at the some national level we are not a good at mapping that politically, not a good at planning how you can advocate with those players effectively to engage in international/national goals. but you can make a very big difference. one of the major milestones recently is when the governor who you will remember stopped pullback scenes in

we cannot export airplane, and i'm not talking of india but other countries. we build things that the customers want, but we build things as a national strategy, the idea that we're trying to strengthen up our partners. >> we're going to move straight into our next panel which is on in the u.s. economic cooperation. -- which is on indian u.s. economic cooperation. i would like you to give our panelists around applause. they have done a great job. [applause] >> coming up in 15 minutes, remarks from admiral timothy keating. he is expected to talk about north korea's missile testing. that is live at 5:30 p.m. eastern. earlier today, the supreme court released its opinion which involves the promotion exam for new haven fire fighters which was rejected because very few minorities would receive promotions. the world abandoning the exam and really would not give them promotions. this overruled a lower court ruling. tonight, at 8:00 p.m. eastern you can hear a portion of the oral argument from the case before the second circuit court of appeals that took place in 2007

if india and china don't participate, it is for naught. even the young federal -- even our own federal government estimates at best over a course of 100 years this may impact global temperatures .2 of one degree. frankly that variance occurs naturally every single year. think about the severe job loss, millions and millions of jobs lost due to the competitive disadvante we have. there are smarter ways to deal with global warming, but we hear nothing clean coal from the other side. we hear nothing about nuclear from the other side. think about the huge loss of national wealth that could have been used to cure cancer, send a generation to college, help launch millions of small businesses. madam speaker, some call it cap and trade. it will cap american opportunity, it will trade away american jobs. it's time to reject the new national energy tax. i yield back. the speaker pro tempore: the gentleman's time has expired.

with china and india not likely to go along. this will have no environmental benefits at all. the trade measures are so rigid, they undermine our ability to reach an international agreement on carbon emissions, which is the best way to protect american jobs here. it is written so poorly, it will be difficult to defend the measure. and i should point that the w.t.o. report referenced earlier today doesn't even deal with the border measures that are under consideration in this bill. instead of rushing this 1,200 page bill through congress with no time to read it, a better solution is both parties to get serious about cleaning burning fuel. the speaker pro tempore: the gentleman's time has expired. mr. rangel: the gentleman from, ohio, a member of the committee, i would like to yield one minute to him. the speaker pro tempore: the gentleman is recognized for one minute. mr. ryan: i thank the chairman and we hear a lot from the other side that if we pass this bill, all these jobs are going to go to china. if we pass this bill, gas is going to go up higher. the jobs already went to

the main argument from republicans is we are shipping jobs overseas to china and india. i think the democrats would counter that argument by saying that will be creating some in the new jobs and the transition this to happen. it might as well happen now. host: 8 your rights when it comes to the passing of a bill, the issue of lobbying comes up. americans can see that lobbying is making it -- playing a major role in critic -- in stopping this legislation. is the rule of law being changed? guest: it has continued to grow and become a major problem. the lobbyists are trying to influence both democrats and republicans. they have been trying to persuade members of the republican and democratic parties to a boat -- oppose obama's agenda. this is true also on tap and trade. a lot of the energy and coal lobbyists as well as others are fighting vigorously to oppose measures pushed by of them -- democrats. that is the main obstacle. host: st. louis on our democrats line. caller: that argument is the most painful thing i've ever heard. he is a journalist and he as a journalist ques

and said we are only allowed to be in india as spiritual refugees said to make mischief in india would be like me coming to stay at your house tonight and then propagating terrorist attacks around washington whereby you as a generous host fallen to the line of fire. >> i wonder how those relations are. when i was there in the 1990's there was tension in the area right where the dalai lama lives between these indians who see and you describe this in your book, you know, these indian shop keepers, these men seeing these tibetans who have had a wife raise this, this appeal with the young women backpackers they want to get to know tibetan culture, let's say. [laughter] >> hands on, yes. -- there's a bit in the n.v. and jealousy, then read exiles have more charisma than the indians. i don't know how recently you have been back. how does that stand now. are things rather tense or have they are things out? >> i think you are right, there always will be tension. there have been fistfights and small disruptions, and yes, i think that there is no way around that and i can understand that tibetan

i don't know how much india is involved? do you know? does anybody know about india being involved? all right. anyway, i agree with you. >> we cannot let you get out of here without commenting on the peace process. >> which one? >> the other one. if you could comment on the link to the extent that it exists between engagement with iran and arab-israeli diplomacy? >> i think the debate of which comes first is futile. each affects the other. if there is no progress on the israel-palestinian front and the issued thereby becomes more intractable, it's not going to help in our dealings with iran, because it directly hamas and hezbollah and others are involved. if we don't have any serious movement with iran, not necessarily movement with agreement, but movement on a set of negotiations in which some issues might move forward more rapidly than others, that is also going to create a more negative atmosphere in the middle east. i would say the two have interactive roles. it is an interactive process, both issues. a poisoned atmosphere, both issues are potentially dangerous and damaging. >>

we are not only losing jobs but we are shipping and overseas to china and india. i think the democrats would counter that argument by saying we will actually be creating so many new jobs and the transition needs to happen that it might as well happen now. host: when it comes to the passage of a critical bill, the issue of lobbying springs up. many are taught to believe that lobbying is not helping. americans can see that lobbying is playing a major role in blocking these legislations being discussed. what is your view on this? has the role of law being changed since the bush administration? guest: it has not changed, it has continued to grow. it is not obama vs republican, is obama vs. lobbyists. they are trying to influence republicans and democrats. on health care, the health insurers are largely against that are they have been trying to persuade members of the republican and democratic party to oppose president obama's agenda because the threat of a public auction is something they are afraid of. this is true uncap and trade. -- this is true on a cap and trade.

let's not go down the path of moving millions of jobs to china, india, and other countries around the world. let's trust the american people. let's give them our all-of-the -above energy act and allow america to flourish, jobs to flourish, and most importantly to allow freedom to flourish. i yield back. the speaker pro tempore: the gentleman's time has expired. the gentleman from california. mr. waxman: madam speaker, the gentleman -- point of order. there is no order in the house. the speaker pro tempore: the house will be in order. the house will be in order. the gentleman from california. mr. waxman: madam speaker, the gentleman, the minority leader, was yielded 2 1/2 minutes. could you tell us how much time he consumed? the speaker pro tempore: the gentleman used the customary amount of time yielded to the minority leader. mr. waxman: madam speaker, the 2 1/2 minutes was extended to over an hour. and this is from the same party that had a 15-minute roll call extended into three hours while they tried to twist arms of their own people. madam speaker, i would like order in the house

those countries would be the united states of america and india. every other country is going to see their population decrease because their birth rate is below the replacement rate and their populations are going to get older and they are going to get smaller. our birth rate is below replacement levels, but the reason we will continue growing is because of our emigration rate. the american population will continue to grow. the indian population will continue to grow the cause of their birth rate. everyone else will shrink. this demographic trends suggest that we are going to need energy in america and and and -- and india perhaps more than any other place. you have talked about the availability and cost of energy. as i say, i think we have to say -- we have to have continued access to cheap energy. while we have been focusing much of our conversation on nuclear, with each of you or any of you have comments as to this whole question about the american economy needing continued access to cheap energy and where you think that cheap energy should come